From todd at xnewbie.com Fri Oct 1 02:42:06 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line Message-ID: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Fri Oct 1 09:11:53 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line In-Reply-To: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> References: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <67f3084a04100107117d4e8e2@mail.gmail.com> What distro are you using? CUPS is fairly universal now, but I typically use lprng for my Slackware systems. ----- Original Message ----- From: Todd Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 02:42:06 -0500 Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org So I'm wondering what's the best way to print from the command line and what needs to be setup so that you can print from the command line. Any help is greatly appreciated. Todd _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Fri Oct 1 09:31:00 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line References: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> <67f3084a04100107117d4e8e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <012801c4a7c3$47c59950$0300a8c0@baker5> redhat 7.0 also here is my printcap I'm not sure if that will help or not # /etc/printcap # # DO NOT EDIT! MANUAL CHANGES WILL BE LOST! # This file is autogenerated by printconf-backend during lpd init. # # Hand edited changes can be put in /etc/printcap.local, and will be included. E210:\ :ml#0:\ :mx#0:\ :sd=/var/spool/lpd/E210:\ :af=/var/spool/lpd/E210/E210.acct:\ :sh:\ :rm=192.168.0.10:\ :rp=ps-57e7c3-p1:\ :lpd_bounce=true:\ :if=/usr/share/printconf/util/mf_wrapper: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shawn Fertch" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] printing from the command line > What distro are you using? CUPS is fairly universal now, but I > typically use lprng for my Slackware systems. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Todd > Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 02:42:06 -0500 > Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line > To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > > So I'm wondering what's the best way to print from the command line > and what needs to be setup so that you can print from the command > line. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > Todd > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From chewie at wookimus.net Fri Oct 1 10:02:36 2004 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] printing from the command line In-Reply-To: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> References: <011e01c4a78a$288de5d0$0300a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <20041001150236.GB762@wookimus.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Fri Oct 1 10:27:52 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] newbies and distros In-Reply-To: <415CAB70.2020504@b-o-b.homelinux.com> References: <415CAB70.2020504@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <4a0cafe20410010827770ef467@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 19:57:20 -0500, Robert D. De Mars wrote: > I don't want to start a flame war or anything like that, but > I wouldn't be doing my duty if I didn't say "Why not try > Slackware?" It's easy, solid, and just works. Simply follow > the instructions & you should be up & running in no time. > Ok, I feel better now. ;-P > Have fun with you Deb. Install... > > Adios, > Robert De Mars .....same with Gentoo...... and the Gentoo docs are really helpful for linux in general, not just Gentoo. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ben_b at ppdonline.com Fri Oct 1 11:23:49 2004 From: ben_b at ppdonline.com (Ben Bargabus) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ISDN Card Message-ID: <39D7605E.3040105@ppdonline.com> Hi, Does anyone know of an ISDN card with Linux drivers available for it? Anyone have one they want to part with cheap? Thanks, Ben. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Fri Oct 1 11:45:03 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ISDN Card In-Reply-To: <39D7605E.3040105@ppdonline.com> References: <39D7605E.3040105@ppdonline.com> Message-ID: <1812.192.168.100.2.1096649103.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Maybe these can help... http://www.muc.de/~hm/linux/linux-isdn.html http://www-ti.informatik.uni-tuebingen.de/~hippm/isdn.html http://www.hollenback.net/index.php/EiconIsdnCard > Hi, > Does anyone know of an ISDN card with Linux drivers available for it? > Anyone have one they want to part with cheap? > Thanks, > Ben. > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Oct 1 12:07:36 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] newbies and distros In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 10:27:52 -0500 > From: Josh Close > On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 19:57:20 -0500, Robert D. De Mars > wrote: > > I don't want to start a flame war or anything like that, but > > I wouldn't be doing my duty if I didn't say "Why not try > > Slackware?" It's easy, solid, and just works. Simply follow > > the instructions & you should be up & running in no time. > > Ok, I feel better now. ;-P > > Have fun with you Deb. Install... > > > > Adios, > > Robert De Mars > > .....same with Gentoo...... and the Gentoo docs are really helpful for > linux in general, not just Gentoo. > > -Josh I was considering Debian because of its philosophy. It seemed like it would be the best for using the computer to get things done rather than playing with the OS. Just looked at Slackware: Ease of Use and Stability. Nice goals. I may consider it. I've tried Gentoo. I don't like it. I don't want to compile everything. Neither do I want to get packages that are an afterthought to the compile-everything attitude. Not for me, thanks. Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Fri Oct 1 13:12:50 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] newbies and distros In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4a0cafe20410011112720c346e@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 12:07:36 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann wrote: > I've tried Gentoo. I don't like it. I don't want to compile everything. > Neither do I want to get packages that are an afterthought to the > compile-everything attitude. Not for me, thanks. > > Chris Schumann Sorry to hear that. I've used redhat in the past and found myself compiling everything by hand. So I find gentoo quite useful in that sense. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at ryanorourke.org Fri Oct 1 14:11:42 2004 From: tclug at ryanorourke.org (Ryan O'Rourke) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] greetings In-Reply-To: <4530.192.168.100.2.1096567449.squirrel@192.168.100.2> References: <415AD50C.1080802@ryanorourke.org> <4530.192.168.100.2.1096567449.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: <415DABEE.1050006@ryanorourke.org> A small town near Council Bluffs originally, Ames as of recent years. Are you from Iowa? -- Ryan Garrett Krueger wrote: > Where in Iowa? > > >>Hello, >> >>I'd like to introduce myself since I'm new to the list. >>I recently relocated to Minneapolis from Iowa where I had been working >>for a small company as their net/sys admin. That company was formerly >>...snipped... >>-- Ryan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 1 14:23:00 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? Message-ID: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Hi, I'm switching from business class Road Runner with 5 static IP addresses to the Residential service with a single IP address. My current configuration is: [Internet] <-> [Cable Modem] <-> [Debian Firewall] <-> [Internal Net] eth0 on the Debian box is configured with the 5 static IP addys I've been given. It firewalls and then routes to eth1 which has address 192.168.0.1. I have an eth2 interface but am not using it. (Maybe a DMZ someday...) What I'm wondering is how do I configure eth0 if I replace the Cable Modem and the IP address is dynamic? The cable modem is pretty generic, I'm not sure if it has any interface I can log into to configure (not that I'd know what to do anyway). I'm using DynDNS (the best) for dynamic DNS services and they have a client program (ddclient) which I expect to run on the Debian box to tell DynDNS when my IP address changes, not sure how that well that will work though if the IP changes and suddenly eth0 has the wrong IP address? I also thought about throwing my RT314 (which no one bought from my Classified ad for shame) between the Cable Modem and the Firewall and have it NAT everything to say 192.168.1.1 and set that as the address for eth0. The RT314 has built in DynDNS support, but if I don't need to put in another connection point that'd be preferable. And if I do NAT there, does that hose up my firewall rules? Sorry for babbling. I've reached the stage of networking where I'm more dangerous than knowledgable. :) Any suggestions? Thanks, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 1 14:28:00 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ISDN Card In-Reply-To: <39D7605E.3040105@ppdonline.com> References: <39D7605E.3040105@ppdonline.com> Message-ID: <20041001142800.00000c03@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 09:03:42 -0700 "Ben Bargabus" wrote: Might want to check your clock settings: Sun, 01 Oct 2000 09:03:42 -0700 Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Fri Oct 1 14:38:57 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > What I'm wondering is how do I configure eth0 if I replace the Cable > Modem and the IP address is dynamic? The cable modem is pretty generic, > I'm not sure if it has any interface I can log into to configure (not > that I'd know what to do anyway). I'm using DynDNS (the best) for > dynamic DNS services and they have a client program (ddclient) which I > expect to run on the Debian box to tell DynDNS when my IP address > changes, not sure how that well that will work though if the IP changes > and suddenly eth0 has the wrong IP address? Easy. Install the 'dhcp3-client' package, and set up your interface like: auto eth0 iface eth0 inet dhcp Then, see /usr/share/doc/ddclient/README.ddclient, and look for the 'USING DDCLIENT WITH dhclient' section on how to set that up. Instead of copying the file to /etc/dhclient-enter-hooks, though, you can copy it to /etc/dhcp3/dhclient-enter-hooks.d/ddclient. > I also thought about throwing my RT314 (which no one bought from my > Classified ad for shame) between the Cable Modem and the Firewall and > have it NAT everything to say 192.168.1.1 and set that as the address > for eth0. Nooo! Last thing you want to do! :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 1 14:48:33 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <20041001144833.00000ea1@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 14:38:57 -0500 (CDT) Nate Carlson wrote: > Easy. Install the 'dhcp3-client' package, and set up your interface > like: > > auto eth0 > iface eth0 inet dhcp > > Then, see /usr/share/doc/ddclient/README.ddclient, and look for the > 'USING DDCLIENT WITH dhclient' section on how to set that up. > Instead of copying the file to /etc/dhclient-enter-hooks, though, > you can copy it to/etc/dhcp3/dhclient-enter-hooks.d/ddclient. Ah, after being on a static network for so long I forgot all about dhcp. :) > > I also thought about throwing my RT314 (which no one bought from > > my Classified ad for shame) between the Cable Modem and the > > Firewall and have it NAT everything to say 192.168.1.1 and set > > that as the address for eth0. > > Nooo! Last thing you want to do! :) Actually the LAST thing I want to do is throw an IIS box in front of my firewall. I had thought of the above solution as a last resort if I couldn't connect Cable Modem to Debian box. Are you saying "Nooo!" just because it's a useless extra hop, or is it the NAT that so disturbs you. :) Thanks for the tip, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Fri Oct 1 14:59:01 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <20041001144833.00000ea1@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> <20041001144833.00000ea1@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > Ah, after being on a static network for so long I forgot all about dhcp. > :) Heh! Lucky guy. > Actually the LAST thing I want to do is throw an IIS box in front of my > firewall. Well, true enough. > I had thought of the above solution as a last resort if I couldn't > connect Cable Modem to Debian box. Are you saying "Nooo!" just because > it's a useless extra hop, or is it the NAT that so disturbs you. :) Extra NAT in front of the Linux box. Means that protocols that aren't NAT friendly won't work nicely, and you may run into weird little connectivity problems. A lot of times those boxes will only forward TCP, ICMP, and UDP traffic - "huh, there are other protocols?" I don't mind NAT, I just like being in control of the box doing the NAT. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Fri Oct 1 15:57:54 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT - greetings In-Reply-To: <415DABEE.1050006@ryanorourke.org> References: <415AD50C.1080802@ryanorourke.org> <4530.192.168.100.2.1096567449.squirrel@192.168.100.2> <415DABEE.1050006@ryanorourke.org> Message-ID: <2413.192.168.100.2.1096664274.squirrel@192.168.100.2> My maternal grandmother was from Iowa (Indianola, Winterset, Des Moines), however, my daughter is a gymnast and we participate in meets in Ames several times throughout the year. I know part of Iowa pretty well -- other parts not so well :) Garrett > A small town near Council Bluffs originally, Ames as of recent years. > Are you from Iowa? > > -- Ryan > > Garrett Krueger wrote: >> Where in Iowa? >> >> >>>Hello, >>> >>>I'd like to introduce myself since I'm new to the list. >>>I recently relocated to Minneapolis from Iowa where I had been working >>>for a small company as their net/sys admin. That company was formerly >>>...snipped... >>>-- Ryan > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From slushpupie at gmail.com Fri Oct 1 15:41:39 2004 From: slushpupie at gmail.com (slushpupie@gmail.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Passwd In-Reply-To: <415C1543.5020200@joshwelch.com> References: <415C1543.5020200@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 09:16:35 -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > So I've got a database server at work that the users have never had to > change passwords on. Now I need to make users change their passwords on > this system, but when a user invokes passwd they get this error: > passwd: Authentication token manipulation error Ive seen this error when the shadow file is not set up correctly. Make sure there are no weird lines in there, and they all have the correct number of fields. Also, check /etc/pam.d/passwd and make sure that looks sane -- Jay Kline http://www.slushpupie.com/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 1 15:41:17 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:01 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> <20041001144833.00000ea1@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <20041001154117.000004a1@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 14:59:01 -0500 (CDT) Nate Carlson wrote: > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > Ah, after being on a static network for so long I forgot all about > > dhcp. :) > > Heh! Lucky guy. My checkbook wasn't so lucky. > Extra NAT in front of the Linux box. Means that protocols that > aren't NAT friendly won't work nicely, and you may run into weird > little connectivity problems. A lot of times those boxes will only > forward TCP, ICMP, and UDP traffic - "huh, there are other > protocols?" > > I don't mind NAT, I just like being in control of the box doing the > NAT. :) Agreed, just like I like being in complete control of the firewalling as well, hardware solutions don't appeal as much. Hopefully I'll have this setup tomorrow, thanks again. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Fri Oct 1 16:23:15 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <415DCAC3.4010903@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Josh Trutwin wrote: I'm using DynDNS > (the best) for dynamic DNS services and they have a client program > (ddclient) which I expect to run on the Debian box to tell DynDNS when > my IP address changes, not sure how that well that will work though if > the IP changes and suddenly eth0 has the wrong IP address? > > Josh > Well, if your IP changes & the Dyndns client does not work all that will happen is ET will not be able to phone home until you manually update your dyndns account. No worries though. I have had RR Cable for 2 1/2 years now since I moved here. My IP has only changed once (super long power outage). For prob the past 1 1/2 year I have had the same IP # which is cool. I also use DynDNS, and got sick of their monthly manditory update, so I just changed my account to the static option. If my IP would happen to change, I'll just go in their & update my account (since it almost never happens). Once you receive you IP from RR I would recommend just using the Static IP option on DynDNS instead of their dynamic option. It will be less hassel, and you'll stop receiving the monthly warning - manditory update/refresh alerts. I used to live & LA prior to this & had DSL. That IP changed all the time, so I used a similar setup like you are talking about to update the DynDNS. But really, for RR Cable it is very rare that your IP will change. Have Fun, Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Fri Oct 1 20:09:02 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations Message-ID: Hey, I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I think. -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Fri Oct 1 21:55:34 2004 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <415E18A6.9020803@visi.com> Anything less then a PII is not viable as a donation for most places. Sam. Yaron wrote: > Hey, > > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I > think. > > > -Yaron > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Fri Oct 1 22:07:09 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <20041001205902.00007e88@schubert> References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> <20041001205902.00007e88@schubert> Message-ID: On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > Nate, thanks for your help, I think it's working. :) Glad to hear it! I run a similar setup, just using a nsupdate script to update my Bind9 DNS server instead of DynDNS. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From baz at winternet.com Fri Oct 1 22:11:44 2004 From: baz at winternet.com (Bryan Zimmer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations References: Message-ID: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her motherboard was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain parts (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no CD-ROM drive to boot from. I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees me as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was that the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was starting to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of which were done as a favor to a friend. If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would appreciate it. Even not as a donation, I am willing to pay for one. BAZ ------- Bryan Zimmer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Yaron" To: "TCLUG" Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 8:09 PM Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations > Hey, > > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I > think. > > > -Yaron > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From baz at winternet.com Fri Oct 1 22:11:44 2004 From: baz at winternet.com (Bryan Zimmer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations References: Message-ID: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her motherboard was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain parts (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no CD-ROM drive to boot from. I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees me as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was that the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was starting to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of which were done as a favor to a friend. If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would appreciate it. Even not as a donation, I am willing to pay for one. BAZ ------- Bryan Zimmer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Yaron" To: "TCLUG" Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 8:09 PM Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations > Hey, > > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I > think. > > > -Yaron > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jack at jacku.com Fri Oct 1 23:45:34 2004 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:02 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <415E18A6.9020803@visi.com> References: <415E18A6.9020803@visi.com> Message-ID: <200410012345.35223.jack@jacku.com> On Friday 01 October 2004 09:55 pm, Sam MacDonald wrote: > Anything less then a PII is not viable as a donation for most places. > > Sam. > Agreed. TCPC has group called CompuDonors[1] and they won't take anything less than a PII at this point. > Yaron wrote: > > Hey, > > > > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. > > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I > > think. > > > > > > -Yaron That said, how many systems are we talking about. Might be an interesting LUG project to create a LTSP "computer center" at a Community Center in neighborhood that could benefit from such a thing. The center would need to have Internet access etc. Just a thought... [1] - http://www.tcpc.com/compudonors.htm -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From leif.t.johnson at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 00:25:12 2004 From: leif.t.johnson at gmail.com (Leif Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: I've got an Athlon 2800 system that I put together with 512mb ram something like a 120 gig hard drive, nvidia GeForce video card (I forget the specs but it has 4's in the name) and a DVD drive (no burner on this) that I put together last year and am not using. I'd be willing to part with it for a reasonable price. leif On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 22:11:44 -0500, Bryan Zimmer wrote: > I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her motherboard > was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain parts > (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no CD-ROM > drive to boot from. > > I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees me > as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't > resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working > computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was that > the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was starting > to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of which > were done as a favor to a friend. > > If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or > possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would appreciate > it. > > Even not as a donation, I am willing to pay for one. > > BAZ > ------- > Bryan Zimmer > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Yaron" > To: "TCLUG" > Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 8:09 PM > Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations > > > Hey, > > > > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. > > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I > > think. > > > > > > -Yaron > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sat Oct 2 00:44:21 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com>; from baz@winternet.com on Fri, Oct 01, 2004 at 10:11:44PM -0500 References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> Bryan Zimmer wrote: > I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her motherboard > was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain parts > (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no CD-ROM > drive to boot from. > > I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees me > as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't > resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working > computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was that > the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was starting > to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of which > were done as a favor to a friend. > > If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or > possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would appreciate > it. What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a word doc or check email? -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From baz at winternet.com Sat Oct 2 05:48:11 2004 From: baz at winternet.com (Bryan Zimmer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: <001001c4a86d$52d74dc0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> I guess we could negotiate a reasonable price...sounds like a pretty good system and probably beyond my means. But it may be worth checking out anyway. BAZ ------- Bryan Zimmer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Leif Johnson" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:25 AM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations > I've got an Athlon 2800 system that I put together with 512mb ram > something like a 120 gig hard drive, nvidia GeForce video card (I > forget the specs but it has 4's in the name) and a DVD drive (no > burner on this) that I put together last year and am not using. I'd > be willing to part with it for a reasonable price. > > leif > > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 22:11:44 -0500, Bryan Zimmer wrote: >> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her >> motherboard >> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain >> parts >> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no >> CD-ROM >> drive to boot from. >> >> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees >> me >> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't >> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working >> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was >> that >> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was >> starting >> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of >> which >> were done as a favor to a friend. >> >> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or >> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would >> appreciate >> it. >> >> Even not as a donation, I am willing to pay for one. >> >> BAZ >> ------- >> Bryan Zimmer >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Yaron" >> To: "TCLUG" >> Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 8:09 PM >> Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations >> >> > Hey, >> > >> > I've got a friend who has some old hardware she wants to get rid of. >> > Anyone know any charities who might want 'em? These are 486s and up. I >> > think. >> > >> > >> > -Yaron >> > >> > -- >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> > tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 09:15:13 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question Message-ID: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> Hello! My name is Patrick Hawkins and I just joined the mailing list last week. I'm a relative n00b; a friend set me up with Red Hat 9 almost a year ago and then Fedora Core 1, but I have not been active in updating my machine. I'm thinking of switching distros, and was wondering if anyone who has run Gentoo for a while might mention some pros and cons of running it as compared to, say, Debian. (Those are the two I'm considering). I don't want to start a distro-flame-war, just some bullet point pros and cons. I've Googled some reviews, but I was hoping for some insight from someone who had run both distros for a while. If you've run these on laptops, that insight would be extra-appreciated. Thanks! -Patrick p.s. For all you Slackware heads: I totally respect your distro, but I want a more modern package-management system. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From baz at winternet.com Sat Oct 2 10:49:22 2004 From: baz at winternet.com (Bryan Zimmer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Unfortunately people are not rational about computers. They are like members of the family. As a result, people bang the around, put food near them, curse them out, love them to death, care for them poorly but innocently. No wonder there is so much work for those of us who make a living from these types of people! My friend, I don"t want to give her real name, which is Cindy, so I will call her Samantha. Anyhow, Sam had a relationship going with her computer that was wholesome and innocent in most ways that I could tell, except the other family members would burn questionable CDs and in general treat it according to somewhat lower standards than did Samantha. Samantha's computer was an XP, probably with a Pentium III, 265 Megs RAM, and a hard drive that must have been 60 megabytes. I didn't study the ROM-BIOS setup screen that closely, but you get the idea, a machine about 3 years old, maybe a little more. It was used so well, or should I say so frequently that eventually it started breaking down, and in the end, lost its operating system at a very crucial moment. Microsoft now DESTROYS any machine that doesn't have a pre-purchased license. I wouldn't dream of putting an untested OS on my equipment, but they have the policy, and they won. Until I sue them. Anyway, sorry to bore you with this, my main reason for writing was that I am looking for a similar machine for about $300 dollars. Not more, hopefully less. Hers would have brought considerably less at Computer Renaissance, the CD drive had stopped working. OK,. now after all hat, is it even conceivable to buy a PIII computer for $300? I have the RAM, I have a few components, only the tower is necessary. And if the CD drive works, I bet that would be worth a little more than 300. I don't know if I'm fooling myself, but recently I bought as Pentium IV with 1 GIG memory and a 160 G hard drive, plus a few extras. For about $800. After rebates. For real. So let me know if there are any nibbles of interest out there. I have an open mind and a very slim wallet. The prices I reluctantly listed above are regrettably all I have to work with. If it's not enough, maybe we could buy parts of your working system. Who knows. She is clear on wanting XP home edition. Like I said, she could probably be converted to Linux if Linux runs AOL. I know Netscape has made something of a comeback on Linux boxes. Not Mesilla, but commercial Netscape 7.2, probably complete with AIM. Let me know, BAZ baz at winternet dot com BAZ ------- Bryan Zimmer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scot Jenkins" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:44 AM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations > Bryan Zimmer wrote: >> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her >> motherboard >> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain >> parts >> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no >> CD-ROM >> drive to boot from. >> >> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees >> me >> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't >> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working >> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was >> that >> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was >> starting >> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of >> which >> were done as a favor to a friend. >> >> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or >> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would >> appreciate >> it. > > What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using > the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional > MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. > > I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was > pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same > hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under > Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is > just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. > > My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for > little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. > Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz > processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a > word doc or check email? > -- > scot > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Sat Oct 2 11:08:33 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: References: <20041001142300.00006bb4@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <20041002110833.000054b1@schubert> On Fri, 1 Oct 2004 14:38:57 -0500 (CDT) Nate Carlson wrote: > Easy. Install the 'dhcp3-client' package, and set up your interface > like: > > auto eth0 > iface eth0 inet dhcp > > Then, see /usr/share/doc/ddclient/README.ddclient, and look for the > 'USING DDCLIENT WITH dhclient' section on how to set that up. > Instead of copying the file to /etc/dhclient-enter-hooks, though, > you can copy it to/etc/dhcp3/dhclient-enter-hooks.d/ddclient. Thanks Nate, this all worked great. I also have to copy dhclient-script to /etc/dhcp3 (is was installed directly into /etc) Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 11:42:41 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Ok, I will bite. In my personal experience I have always enjoyed the straight forward approach of Slackware. In the past what has always happened to me when running Red Hat/Mandrake or even Debian was I would inevitably install a package from source and gum up the whole package system. Which, after several hours or even days of head banging, would result in a system wipe in favor of Slackware again. More recently I have moved on to Gentoo and have not looked back since. It has the straightforward simplicity of Slack and the ease of a package managed system (without a lot of the headaches of RPMs and such). Most problems with conflicting packages are easily resolved simply by setting a USE flag. Sure it takes a while to compile a new package but at least you know that it will automagically compile in support for your existing apps and leave out the incompatible stuff. There is also the fact that since you are compiling everything from source, you can build it with optimizations for your processor (though since gcc is not a great optimizing compiler YMMV). My favorite thing about Gentoo, though, is the community support. forums.gentoo.org has solved every problem I ever had with Gentoo. One stop shop for instant answers. Of course, I think most people on this list will recommend Debian which is a kick-ass distro, just not my cup of tea. I would just recommend not running Redhate based distros, I just think they break way too easily. On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 09:15:13 -0500, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > Hello! My name is Patrick Hawkins and I just joined the mailing list > last week. I'm a relative n00b; a friend set me up with Red Hat 9 > almost a year ago and then Fedora Core 1, but I have not been active > in updating my machine. I'm thinking of switching distros, and was > wondering if anyone who has run Gentoo for a while might mention some > pros and cons of running it as compared to, say, Debian. (Those are > the two I'm considering). I don't want to start a distro-flame-war, > just some bullet point pros and cons. I've Googled some reviews, but I > was hoping for some insight from someone who had run both distros for > a while. If you've run these on laptops, that insight would be > extra-appreciated. Thanks! > > -Patrick > > p.s. For all you Slackware heads: I totally respect your distro, but I > want a more modern package-management system. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 11:51:17 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: Well, if all you need is a mobo, proc and tower then you should be able to find a pretty damned decent system for $300 or less. Hell, my tower was only $15 and it looks great (if a bit flimsy) with a nice window in the side, lighted clear fans and a blue backlit display on the front for temp. I think I paid about $70 for my Abit KV7 and around $100 for my Athlon XP 2600 Mobile proc . So there you go $185 for a more than decent rig with money to spare for more RAM, HD, whatever. Anyway, www.newegg.com is the only place to shop for computer stuff IMO. On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 10:49:22 -0500, Bryan Zimmer wrote: > Unfortunately people are not rational about computers. They are like members > of the family. As a result, people bang the around, put food near them, > curse them out, love them to death, care for them poorly but innocently. No > wonder there is so much work for those of us who make a living from these > types of people! > > My friend, I don"t want to give her real name, which is Cindy, so I will > call her Samantha. Anyhow, Sam had a relationship going with her computer > that was wholesome and innocent in most ways that I could tell, except the > other family members would burn questionable CDs and in general treat it > according to somewhat lower standards than did Samantha. > > Samantha's computer was an XP, probably with a Pentium III, 265 Megs RAM, > and a hard drive that must have been 60 megabytes. I didn't study the > ROM-BIOS setup screen that closely, but you get the idea, a machine about 3 > years old, maybe a little more. > > It was used so well, or should I say so frequently that eventually it > started breaking down, and in the end, lost its operating system at a very > crucial moment. Microsoft now DESTROYS any machine that doesn't have a > pre-purchased license. I wouldn't dream of putting an untested OS on my > equipment, but they have the policy, and they won. Until I sue them. > > Anyway, sorry to bore you with this, my main reason for writing was that I > am looking for a similar machine for about $300 dollars. Not more, hopefully > less. Hers would have brought considerably less at Computer Renaissance, the > CD drive had stopped working. > > OK,. now after all hat, is it even conceivable to buy a PIII computer for > $300? I have the RAM, I have a few components, only the tower is necessary. > And if the CD drive works, I bet that would be worth a little more than 300. > I don't know if I'm fooling myself, but recently I bought as Pentium IV with > 1 GIG memory and a 160 G hard drive, plus a few extras. For about $800. > After rebates. For real. > > So let me know if there are any nibbles of interest out there. I have an > open mind and a very slim wallet. The prices I reluctantly listed above are > regrettably all I have to work with. If it's not enough, maybe we could buy > parts of your working system. Who knows. She is clear on wanting XP home > edition. Like I said, she could probably be converted to Linux if Linux runs > AOL. I know Netscape has made something of a comeback on Linux boxes. Not > Mesilla, but commercial Netscape 7.2, probably complete with AIM. > > Let me know, > > BAZ > baz at winternet dot com > > BAZ > ------- > Bryan Zimmer > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scot Jenkins" > To: "TCLUG Mailing List" > Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:44 AM > Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations > > > Bryan Zimmer wrote: > >> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her > >> motherboard > >> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain > >> parts > >> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no > >> CD-ROM > >> drive to boot from. > >> > >> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees > >> me > >> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't > >> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working > >> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was > >> that > >> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was > >> starting > >> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of > >> which > >> were done as a favor to a friend. > >> > >> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or > >> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would > >> appreciate > >> it. > > > > What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using > > the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional > > MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. > > > > I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was > > pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same > > hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under > > Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is > > just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. > > > > My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for > > little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. > > Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz > > processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a > > word doc or check email? > > -- > > scot > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 11:52:04 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc0410020952668789a0@mail.gmail.com> I HATE WALLMART with a passion, but they have a bare bones for $238: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=3212101&cat=3951&type=19&dept=3944&path=0%3A3944%3A3951%3A41937%3A86796%3A86798 I bet you could find similar at a nicer retailer. On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 10:49:22 -0500, Bryan Zimmer wrote: > Unfortunately people are not rational about computers. They are like members > of the family. As a result, people bang the around, put food near them, > curse them out, love them to death, care for them poorly but innocently. No > wonder there is so much work for those of us who make a living from these > types of people! > > My friend, I don"t want to give her real name, which is Cindy, so I will > call her Samantha. Anyhow, Sam had a relationship going with her computer > that was wholesome and innocent in most ways that I could tell, except the > other family members would burn questionable CDs and in general treat it > according to somewhat lower standards than did Samantha. > > Samantha's computer was an XP, probably with a Pentium III, 265 Megs RAM, > and a hard drive that must have been 60 megabytes. I didn't study the > ROM-BIOS setup screen that closely, but you get the idea, a machine about 3 > years old, maybe a little more. > > It was used so well, or should I say so frequently that eventually it > started breaking down, and in the end, lost its operating system at a very > crucial moment. Microsoft now DESTROYS any machine that doesn't have a > pre-purchased license. I wouldn't dream of putting an untested OS on my > equipment, but they have the policy, and they won. Until I sue them. > > Anyway, sorry to bore you with this, my main reason for writing was that I > am looking for a similar machine for about $300 dollars. Not more, hopefully > less. Hers would have brought considerably less at Computer Renaissance, the > CD drive had stopped working. > > OK,. now after all hat, is it even conceivable to buy a PIII computer for > $300? I have the RAM, I have a few components, only the tower is necessary. > And if the CD drive works, I bet that would be worth a little more than 300. > I don't know if I'm fooling myself, but recently I bought as Pentium IV with > 1 GIG memory and a 160 G hard drive, plus a few extras. For about $800. > After rebates. For real. > > So let me know if there are any nibbles of interest out there. I have an > open mind and a very slim wallet. The prices I reluctantly listed above are > regrettably all I have to work with. If it's not enough, maybe we could buy > parts of your working system. Who knows. She is clear on wanting XP home > edition. Like I said, she could probably be converted to Linux if Linux runs > AOL. I know Netscape has made something of a comeback on Linux boxes. Not > Mesilla, but commercial Netscape 7.2, probably complete with AIM. > > Let me know, > > BAZ > baz at winternet dot com > > BAZ > ------- > Bryan Zimmer > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scot Jenkins" > To: "TCLUG Mailing List" > Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:44 AM > Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations > > > Bryan Zimmer wrote: > >> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her > >> motherboard > >> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain > >> parts > >> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no > >> CD-ROM > >> drive to boot from. > >> > >> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but sees > >> me > >> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't > >> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working > >> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was > >> that > >> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was > >> starting > >> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of > >> which > >> were done as a favor to a friend. > >> > >> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or > >> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would > >> appreciate > >> it. > > > > What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using > > the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional > > MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. > > > > I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was > > pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same > > hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under > > Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is > > just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. > > > > My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for > > little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. > > Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz > > processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a > > word doc or check email? > > -- > > scot > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 13:56:20 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:03 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0410020952668789a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <65293fcc0410020952668789a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a0410021156eefb2f5@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 11:52:04 -0500, John Meier wrote: > I HATE WALLMART with a passion, but they have a bare bones for $238: > http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=3212101&cat=3951&type=19&dept=3944&path=0%3A3944%3A3951%3A41937%3A86796%3A86798 > > I bet you could find similar at a nicer retailer. Occasionally, Dell has some phenominal deals on systems for about $300. Dig around their website to see if you can come up with something. Othewise, just buy board and CPU and leave some extra $$ in case another component happens to of gone south. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Sat Oct 2 15:39:11 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041002203911.GB19647@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 15:57:38 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <20041002203911.GB19647@iucha.net> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <20041002203911.GB19647@iucha.net> Message-ID: Yeah, I admit to being a Linux retard most of the time, but that said, I have never managed to fubar Gentoo. I think that says a lot :) On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 15:39:11 -0500, Florin Iucha wrote: > On Sat, Oct 02, 2004 at 11:42:41AM -0500, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > > In the past what has always happened to me when running Red > > Hat/Mandrake or even Debian was I would inevitably install a package > > from source and gum up the whole package system. > > I gave up installing packages from source since I converted to Debian > four years ago. If I really-really need stuff that Debian does not > package, I take care to install it in /usr/local (which does not mess > up the package system). > > florin > > -- > > Don't question authority: they don't know either! > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rick at eworld3.net Sat Oct 2 17:47:21 2004 From: rick at eworld3.net (Rick Meyerhoff) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> Message-ID: <415F2FF9.9080307@eworld3.net> You have not really described what steps that you have taken to diagnose the problems of the machine. You said that it does not boot from CD. Have you opened it up and blown out the dust? I resurrected a "dead" machine this way and was a hero/genius. Have you installed a good CD drive and tried to boot? Have you re-seated: cables, CPU, RAM? If you really want to save money then IMHO find out exactly what is wrong and just fix that. Maybe you've already done that but just not posted your investigation. Bryan Zimmer wrote: > Unfortunately people are not rational about computers. They are like > members of the family. As a result, people bang the around, put food > near them, curse them out, love them to death, care for them poorly but > innocently. No wonder there is so much work for those of us who make a > living from these types of people! > > My friend, I don"t want to give her real name, which is Cindy, so I will > call her Samantha. Anyhow, Sam had a relationship going with her > computer that was wholesome and innocent in most ways that I could tell, > except the other family members would burn questionable CDs and in > general treat it according to somewhat lower standards than did Samantha. > > Samantha's computer was an XP, probably with a Pentium III, 265 Megs > RAM, and a hard drive that must have been 60 megabytes. I didn't study > the ROM-BIOS setup screen that closely, but you get the idea, a machine > about 3 years old, maybe a little more. > > It was used so well, or should I say so frequently that eventually it > started breaking down, and in the end, lost its operating system at a > very crucial moment. Microsoft now DESTROYS any machine that doesn't > have a pre-purchased license. I wouldn't dream of putting an untested OS > on my equipment, but they have the policy, and they won. Until I sue them. > > Anyway, sorry to bore you with this, my main reason for writing was that > I am looking for a similar machine for about $300 dollars. Not more, > hopefully less. Hers would have brought considerably less at Computer > Renaissance, the CD drive had stopped working. > > OK,. now after all hat, is it even conceivable to buy a PIII computer > for $300? I have the RAM, I have a few components, only the tower is > necessary. And if the CD drive works, I bet that would be worth a little > more than 300. I don't know if I'm fooling myself, but recently I bought > as Pentium IV with 1 GIG memory and a 160 G hard drive, plus a few > extras. For about $800. After rebates. For real. > > So let me know if there are any nibbles of interest out there. I have an > open mind and a very slim wallet. The prices I reluctantly listed above > are regrettably all I have to work with. If it's not enough, maybe we > could buy parts of your working system. Who knows. She is clear on > wanting XP home edition. Like I said, she could probably be converted to > Linux if Linux runs AOL. I know Netscape has made something of a > comeback on Linux boxes. Not Mesilla, but commercial Netscape 7.2, > probably complete with AIM. > > Let me know, > > BAZ > baz at winternet dot com > > > > > BAZ > ------- > Bryan Zimmer > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scot Jenkins" > To: "TCLUG Mailing List" > Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:44 AM > Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations > > >> Bryan Zimmer wrote: >> >>> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her >>> motherboard >>> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for certain >>> parts >>> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has no >>> CD-ROM >>> drive to boot from. >>> >>> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend but >>> sees me >>> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't >>> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working >>> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact was >>> that >>> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was >>> starting >>> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many of >>> which >>> were done as a favor to a friend. >>> >>> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or >>> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would >>> appreciate >>> it. >> >> >> What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using >> the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional >> MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. >> >> I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was >> pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same >> hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under >> Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is >> just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. >> >> My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for >> little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. >> Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz >> processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a >> word doc or check email? >> -- >> scot >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -- Eric (Rick) Meyerhoff _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kfuchs at winternet.com Sat Oct 2 18:45:44 2004 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> (message from Scot Jenkins on Sat, 2 Oct 2004 00:44:21 -0500) References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <200410022345.i92Njih20495@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Scot Jenkins wrote: >I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I was >pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same >hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under >Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is >just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. Concerning MS Internet Explorer vs. Mozilla on old oldware using MS Windows: Try FireFox. FireFox _seems_ many times faster than Mozilla on the relatively fast hardware I use. It may be an improvement on slower hardware as well. Sincerely, Ken Fuchs _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Sat Oct 2 20:47:40 2004 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <415F2FF9.9080307@eworld3.net> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <415F2FF9.9080307@eworld3.net> Message-ID: <415F5A3C.7050002@visi.com> I've fixed several machines with a simple can of air, everything form overheating to dead CD ROMS. Sam. Rick Meyerhoff wrote: > You have not really described what steps that you have taken to > diagnose the problems of the machine. You said that it does not boot > from CD. Have you opened it up and blown out the dust? I resurrected a > "dead" machine this way and was a hero/genius. Have you installed a > good CD drive and tried to boot? Have you re-seated: cables, CPU, RAM? > > If you really want to save money then IMHO find out exactly what is > wrong and just fix that. Maybe you've already done that but just not > posted your investigation. > > Bryan Zimmer wrote: > >> Unfortunately people are not rational about computers. They are like >> members of the family. As a result, people bang the around, put food >> near them, curse them out, love them to death, care for them poorly >> but innocently. No wonder there is so much work for those of us who >> make a living from these types of people! >> >> My friend, I don"t want to give her real name, which is Cindy, so I >> will call her Samantha. Anyhow, Sam had a relationship going with her >> computer that was wholesome and innocent in most ways that I could >> tell, except the other family members would burn questionable CDs and >> in general treat it according to somewhat lower standards than did >> Samantha. >> >> Samantha's computer was an XP, probably with a Pentium III, 265 Megs >> RAM, and a hard drive that must have been 60 megabytes. I didn't >> study the ROM-BIOS setup screen that closely, but you get the idea, a >> machine about 3 years old, maybe a little more. >> >> It was used so well, or should I say so frequently that eventually it >> started breaking down, and in the end, lost its operating system at a >> very crucial moment. Microsoft now DESTROYS any machine that doesn't >> have a pre-purchased license. I wouldn't dream of putting an untested >> OS on my equipment, but they have the policy, and they won. Until I >> sue them. >> >> Anyway, sorry to bore you with this, my main reason for writing was >> that I am looking for a similar machine for about $300 dollars. Not >> more, hopefully less. Hers would have brought considerably less at >> Computer Renaissance, the CD drive had stopped working. >> >> OK,. now after all hat, is it even conceivable to buy a PIII computer >> for $300? I have the RAM, I have a few components, only the tower is >> necessary. And if the CD drive works, I bet that would be worth a >> little more than 300. I don't know if I'm fooling myself, but >> recently I bought as Pentium IV with 1 GIG memory and a 160 G hard >> drive, plus a few extras. For about $800. After rebates. For real. >> >> So let me know if there are any nibbles of interest out there. I have >> an open mind and a very slim wallet. The prices I reluctantly listed >> above are regrettably all I have to work with. If it's not enough, >> maybe we could buy parts of your working system. Who knows. She is >> clear on wanting XP home edition. Like I said, she could probably be >> converted to Linux if Linux runs AOL. I know Netscape has made >> something of a comeback on Linux boxes. Not Mesilla, but commercial >> Netscape 7.2, probably complete with AIM. >> >> Let me know, >> >> BAZ >> baz at winternet dot com >> >> >> >> >> BAZ >> ------- >> Bryan Zimmer >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scot Jenkins" >> To: "TCLUG Mailing List" >> Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 12:44 AM >> Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Computer donations >> >> >>> Bryan Zimmer wrote: >>> >>>> I know of at least one person who is in need of a computer. Her >>>> motherboard >>>> was fried and now the computer is of no use at all except for >>>> certain parts >>>> (memory, hard drive, the sort of thing). It does not boot and has >>>> no CD-ROM >>>> drive to boot from. >>>> >>>> I truly need to find something for her. She is not only a friend >>>> but sees me >>>> as being able to "fix" most computer problems. I told her I couldn't >>>> resurrect from the dead, but she still thinks I can produce a working >>>> computer. I considered putting in a new motherboard, but the fact >>>> was that >>>> the computer was beginning to enter its "twilight months". It was >>>> starting >>>> to be one thing after another. Not worth the cost of repairs, many >>>> of which >>>> were done as a favor to a friend. >>>> >>>> If anyone has, or know of a computer capable of running Windows XP (or >>>> possibly she will resort to Linux...can Linux run AOL?), I would >>>> appreciate >>>> it. >>> >>> >>> >>> What exactly does your friend do with a computer? If she's just using >>> the internet over dialup (email, web browsing), and the occassional >>> MSWord doc, she can probably get by with lower end hardware. >>> >>> I have an older P166 with 128 MB RAM that runs win2k respectibly. I >>> was >>> pretty surprised. I don't want to start a flame war, but on this same >>> hardware IE6 is much faster for surfing then the latest Mozilla under >>> Linux. Don't get me wrong, Linux as an OS is faster, but Mozilla is >>> just a slow pig compared to IE on this old dog. >>> >>> My point is that there's plenty of old hardware (usually available for >>> little or no cost), that still has plenty of usable life left in it. >>> Why not put it to good use? Do most people really need a 2 or 3 Ghz >>> processor with 128 or 256 MB of RAM on their video card just to write a >>> word doc or check email? >>> -- >>> scot >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>> Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >>> Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >>> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>> https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From electrum at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 19:46:22 2004 From: electrum at gmail.com (David Phillips) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <200410022345.i92Njih20495@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <200410022345.i92Njih20495@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <853e1ecc0410021746c3cc2fd@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 18:45:44 -0500, Ken Fuchs wrote: > Try FireFox. FireFox _seems_ many times faster than Mozilla on the > relatively fast hardware I use. It may be an improvement on slower > hardware as well. If you want a fast browser on a slow computer that doesn't have much memory, go with Opera. It's much faster and less resource intensive than IE and Gecko based browsers. -- David Phillips http://david.acz.org/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Sat Oct 2 22:13:05 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 09:15:13 -0500, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > was wondering if anyone who has run Gentoo for a while might mention some > pros and cons of running it as compared to, say, Debian. I have had great luck with Gentoo. I haven't found anything I dont't like about it yet. I haven't used Debian much, but as far as I know, it's real "similar" to Redhat. With Gentoo you can optimize your system very easily. The community is great. The docs are great. There are versions of packages you can download, so you can use a stable version, and older version, or a bleeding edge version. I found myself compiling everything by hand until I used Gentoo. It's just great! -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Sat Oct 2 23:13:08 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Nate Carlson wrote: > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > Nate, thanks for your help, I think it's working. :) > > Glad to hear it! I run a similar setup, just using a nsupdate script to > update my Bind9 DNS server instead of DynDNS. :) Ditto, thanks to your vague instructions a few years ago. Although I've also set up a CGI script with Net::DNS on a web server to perform the same function without the overhead of nsupdate on each host; `wget` or a bookmark in a web browser will do the job, which makes it more usable. Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Sun Oct 3 09:31:58 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041003093158.0000273c@schubert> On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 23:13:08 -0500 (CDT) Jima wrote: > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Nate Carlson wrote: > > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > > Nate, thanks for your help, I think it's working. :) > > > > Glad to hear it! I run a similar setup, just using a nsupdate > > script to update my Bind9 DNS server instead of DynDNS. :) I seemed to have glitched things for a little while and missed this message. > Ditto, thanks to your vague instructions a few years ago. Although > I've > also set up a CGI script with Net::DNS on a web server to perform > the same function without the overhead of nsupdate on each host; > `wget` or a bookmark in a web browser will do the job, which makes > it more usable. I was thinking I'd write a little perl program, or hack ddclient to open a socket when the IP changed to notify my other static server which is now serving DNS (djbdns) for the 4-5 personal sites I left on my home net. DynDNS's CustomDNS which lets you choose whatever DNS name you want and run it under dynamic DNS is a wee pricy at $30.00 a year to essentially do what I just described. Thx, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Sun Oct 3 09:57:37 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Computer donations In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410021156eefb2f5@mail.gmail.com> References: <01d501c4a82d$8f8f62b0$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <20041002004421.A8262@thinkunix.net> <009601c4a897$6678b010$dfc5fea9@baztech.com> <65293fcc0410020952668789a0@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a0410021156eefb2f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <914f813c04100307577abe2366@mail.gmail.com> www.bensbargains.net is a great place to look for deals like this, as well as memory, drives, cd/dvd rebates, etc. On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 13:56:20 -0500, Shawn Fertch wrote: > On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 11:52:04 -0500, John Meier wrote: > > I HATE WALLMART with a passion, but they have a bare bones for $238: > > http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=3212101&cat=3951&type=19&dept=3944&path=0%3A3944%3A3951%3A41937%3A86796%3A86798 > > > > I bet you could find similar at a nicer retailer. > > > Occasionally, Dell has some phenominal deals on systems for about > $300. Dig around their website to see if you can come up with > something. > > Othewise, just buy board and CPU and leave some extra $$ in case > another component happens to of gone south. > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- John T. Hoffoss _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Sun Oct 3 10:07:08 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <20041003093158.0000273c@schubert> References: <20041003093158.0000273c@schubert> Message-ID: <914f813c04100308077c4fcb13@mail.gmail.com> I've plugged it before, and I'll plug it again: everydns.net is free, has a perl and win32 exe update client, that you just have to cron/schedule, allows you to control all your domains, and include records for all of them. Of course ,if you have a reason to run a full DNS server at home, great. But for me, one alias points home, another to a hosted server, another to a friend's server. The only drawback: all of your dynamic names/domains point to the single allowed update client. So if I wanted a second dynamic domain pointing somewhere other than home, I would have to set up a second everydns account for it. On Sun, 3 Oct 2004 09:31:58 -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 23:13:08 -0500 (CDT) > Jima wrote: > > > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Nate Carlson wrote: > > > On Fri, 1 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > > > Nate, thanks for your help, I think it's working. :) > > > > > > Glad to hear it! I run a similar setup, just using a nsupdate > > > script to update my Bind9 DNS server instead of DynDNS. :) > > I seemed to have glitched things for a little while and missed this message. > > > Ditto, thanks to your vague instructions a few years ago. Although > > I've > > also set up a CGI script with Net::DNS on a web server to perform > > the same function without the overhead of nsupdate on each host; > > `wget` or a bookmark in a web browser will do the job, which makes > > it more usable. > > I was thinking I'd write a little perl program, or hack ddclient to open a socket when the IP changed to notify my other static server which is now serving DNS (djbdns) for the 4-5 personal sites I left on my home net. DynDNS's CustomDNS which lets you choose whatever DNS name you want and run it under dynamic DNS is a wee pricy at $30.00 a year to essentially do what I just described. > > Thx, > > Josh > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- John T. Hoffoss _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Mon Oct 4 01:25:18 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:04 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? Message-ID: Hey there, So, I'm putting together a new machine, and all the components are here except the harddrive, which for some reason hadn't shipped until everything else was alreayd here... So I figured, I'll try booting it diskless, just for fun. I'm pretty close! I got to the point where the thinbg will boot from the network (using pxeboot on my tftp/dhcp server). It boots a kernel I built specifically for the new machine, with support for it's hardware, and no modules. But it won't mount the root filesystem off NFS. It says it's getting an "error 101" which I think is "Network is unreachable". Now, the kernel has support for VIA Rhine cards, which is what is builtin on this MBoard. I /think/ it's DHCPing an address for itself, but I'm not 100% sure (the logs aren't clear - there IS a DHCP request and reply right after it boots the kernel, but it scrolls by too fast). There are no NFS errors on the server. Course, the client panics so I can't scroll back, and of course it leaves no logs.... Anyone have any suggestions? -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Mon Oct 4 03:23:07 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: ; from jethro@freakzilla.com on Mon, Oct 04, 2004 at 01:25:18AM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20041004032306.B24601@thinkunix.net> Yaron wrote: > Hey there, > > So, I'm putting together a new machine, and all the components are here > except the harddrive, which for some reason hadn't shipped until > everything else was alreayd here... > > So I figured, I'll try booting it diskless, just for fun. > > I'm pretty close! > > I got to the point where the thinbg will boot from the network (using > pxeboot on my tftp/dhcp server). It boots a kernel I built specifically > for the new machine, with support for it's hardware, and no modules. > > But it won't mount the root filesystem off NFS. > > It says it's getting an "error 101" which I think is "Network is > unreachable". > > Now, the kernel has support for VIA Rhine cards, which is what is builtin > on this MBoard. I /think/ it's DHCPing an address for itself, but I'm not > 100% sure (the logs aren't clear - there IS a DHCP request and reply right > after it boots the kernel, but it scrolls by too fast). There are no NFS > errors on the server. Check your DHCP server's logs to confirm it's getting an address. You could have your DHCP statically assign a given IP for the new box's nic based on it's mac address to be sure which box is making the request in the event you have a busy network. hitting CTRL+S or the "scroll lock" key should stop the display, CTRL+Q or the "scroll lock" key again will let it continue. I've never tried mounting / off NFS but verify it's exported rw to the root account from the host system. Check /etc/fstab. > Course, the client panics so I can't scroll back, and of course it leaves > no logs.... -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 4 07:57:16 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041004125716.GC4365@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Mon Oct 4 11:01:34 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: <20041004032306.B24601@thinkunix.net> References: <20041004032306.B24601@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: Hey, On Mon, 4 Oct 2004, Scot Jenkins wrote: > Check your DHCP server's logs to confirm it's getting an address. You > could have your DHCP statically assign a given IP for the new box's nic > based on it's mac address to be sure which box is making the request in > the event you have a busy network. That's how my network is setup - machines get a static address off the DHCP server. The thing I'm not sure about is... Ok. There's a DHCP request when the machine starts the netboot. The next request is REALLY close behind that, and I can't tell if it's the netboot looking for the boot image, or the kernel self-configuring. You need kernel support for DHCP (or bootp or arp) in order to be able to nfsmount /... > hitting CTRL+S or the "scroll lock" key should stop the display, > CTRL+Q or the "scroll lock" key again will let it continue. Tried that... it's not far enough into the kernel load to accept keyboard input. > I've never tried mounting / off NFS but verify it's exported rw to the > root account from the host system. Check /etc/fstab. It is exported. And it's not an /etc/fstab thing, because this machine doesn't get far enough to see it's /etc/fstab (: Like I said, it's getting a "Network is unreachable" error, and there are no denies from the nfs daemons. -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From peter.chase at epredix.com Mon Oct 4 11:32:27 2004 From: peter.chase at epredix.com (Peter Chase) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ndiswrapper for wireless drivers Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Mon Oct 4 12:07:38 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 4 Oct 2004, Yaron wrote: > I got to the point where the thinbg will boot from the network (using > pxeboot on my tftp/dhcp server). It boots a kernel I built specifically > for the new machine, with support for it's hardware, and no modules. > > But it won't mount the root filesystem off NFS. > > It says it's getting an "error 101" which I think is "Network is > unreachable". I've had relatively low success rates using the NFS root support in the kernel itself, and much better success rates doing a LTSP-style initrd that loads the network card modules, mounts the NFS root filesystem, and then pivot_roots into it. One big advantage of the LTSP initrd image is that it doesn't require a special kernel, too. -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at askewview.net Mon Oct 4 13:59:54 2004 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ndiswrapper for wireless drivers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4403.134.29.178.254.1096916394.squirrel@134.29.178.254> Pete, You'll most likely have to compile a custom kernel disabling the 4k stacks option as ndiswapper will not work correctly with it enabled. I had to do this on my gentoo system in order to get it to work correctly. Adam > Hi all, > > I'm fairly new to the list and relatively new to Linux so please bear > with me. > > I've recently installed FC2 on my laptop and I want to get my D-Link > DWL-G630 to work > and unfortunately there are no native drivers for Linux. I've been > doing some reading on > ndiswrapper and it looks like it should work for my particular card, > however I wanted to > see if anyone has had any experience with it. Is there anything I > should be aware of > before I give it a try? > > Thanks. > > -Pete > > > ______________________________ > > Peter Chase > > Infrastructure Engineer > > ePredix, Inc. > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Mon Oct 4 14:11:39 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I've never used Gentoo myself, everything I know about it is basically what I've picked up from tclug, so please corrent me if I'm wrong. >From my understanding, when you emerge packagename (or whatever the syntax is in Gentoo) the portage system actually compiles the source code to make the binary, where Debian, RedHat, and others offer you binary packages that you can just install and confgire, thus skipping the compile time. I personally run Linux on a AMD Athlon 700. Even if I had a faster system, I don't see the security, performance, and other advantages of building the source locally as an acceptable tradeoff. I'm perfectly happy and comfortable with apt-get install package, and installing a precompiled binary on my system. It takes much less time, and to my point of view, the results are the same. Even if I'm wrong about Gentoo, choosing a Linux distro comes down to comfort level, personal preferences, and the coolness and Wow factor. Gentoo definitly has the Wow factor, but I perfer to only compile software when I have to. To me, being able to recompile all software on my system is just a "wow that sure is neat...but why would I ever need to do such a thing?" What you need to consider Patrick is where is your perferred balance of ease of use vs functionality. Distributions like RedHat/Fedora include lots of tools that are specific to Red Hat and Fedora for easing the most common task such as configurint hardware, your Xserver, printers, etc...where as Debian and Gentoo tend to lean more tward the expectation that the user knows how to do some configuration on their own, thus they tend to just provide some resonable defaults for software and not work too heavly on nice GUI based configuration tools. IMHO, there are some issues that deserve huge flame wars. Linux distributions aren't one of those isses. :) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Mon Oct 4 14:34:30 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Connecting my Linux Firewall/Router to a Dynamic IP Address? In-Reply-To: <914f813c04100308077c4fcb13@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041003093158.0000273c@schubert> <914f813c04100308077c4fcb13@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I update my DynDNS.org IP from my Linux box which knows nothing about the external IP address and it works just fine. I use the packed version of ddclient in debian. In /etc/ddclient.conf, all you need to do is add a line like: use=web, web=checkip.dyndns.org instead of the default. The checkip server is similar to whatismyip.com...it returns the IP it is getting a connection from. The debconf configuration doesn't quite get the config file correct when you use the web interface thing, so edit the conf file yourself. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Mon Oct 4 15:05:29 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:05 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <68a256c04100413055d90b2e@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 14:11:39 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > What you need to consider Patrick is where is your perferred balance > of ease of use vs functionality. Distributions like RedHat/Fedora > include lots of tools that are specific to Red Hat and Fedora for > easing the most common task such as configurint hardware, your > Xserver, printers, etc...where as Debian and Gentoo tend to lean more > tward the expectation that the user knows how to do some configuration > on their own, thus they tend to just provide some resonable defaults > for software and not work too heavly on nice GUI based configuration > tools. > > IMHO, there are some issues that deserve huge flame wars. Linux > distributions aren't one of those isses. :) Thanks for the "big picture", Andy. I'm leaning toward either Debian or Gentoo because of the raw power of the distros (massively big if you want and eminently configurable) and the fact that I want to learn Linux more and better. I wasn't hoping for or even expecting a flame war, given the type of users on this list, but I did want more information before I choose a new distro. And so far, every response has given me just that. -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Mon Oct 4 18:03:35 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:06 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a04100416032af3707@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 2 Oct 2004 09:15:13 -0500, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > > p.s. For all you Slackware heads: I totally respect your distro, but I > want a more modern package-management system. > [sarcasm] If you haven't been updating your system for over a year, then how do you know what a package managament system really is like? [/sarcasm] Okay, now that that is out of the way, you're free to try what ever you want. But, I'll say that even at this point in time with the number of servers I administer I prefer to do it by hand. I want to know what's going onto my systems, and what the dependancies are. BTW, it looks like they pulled it from the Slack 10 cd's but there was a package management tool called swaret that some people really liked. I never used it personally. I agree with Zibbies, though. Chose what you want to run in regards to what you're after and comfortable with. I prefer Slackware, even though I administer Red Hat Enterprise v3 boxes at work. Not trying to start a flameware, just offering up another perspective. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dutchman_mn at charter.net Mon Oct 4 20:30:42 2004 From: dutchman_mn at charter.net (Perry Hoekstra) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:06 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Top over Time Message-ID: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net> Greetings all: I am running some performance tests on both Linux and Solaris boxes. I can capture response time, errors, etc from the performance tool but I would also like the server resource consumption over that period of time, essentially top over time. How would I capture top metrics for a given hour? Thank you, Perry Hoekstra _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Mon Oct 4 20:56:07 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > I've had relatively low success rates using the NFS root support in the > kernel itself, and much better success rates doing a LTSP-style initrd The ltsp website seems to be kinda dead right now... got any useful docs? (: -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Mon Oct 4 21:21:51 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Top over Time In-Reply-To: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net>; from dutchman_mn@charter.net on Mon, Oct 04, 2004 at 08:30:42PM -0500 References: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net> Message-ID: <20041004212151.A24899@thinkunix.net> Perry Hoekstra wrote: > I am running some performance tests on both Linux and Solaris boxes. I > can capture response time, errors, etc from the performance tool but I > would also like the server resource consumption over that period of > time, essentially top over time. How would I capture top metrics for a > given hour? Use sar, part of the sysstat package -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at joshwelch.com Mon Oct 4 21:32:23 2004 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Top over Time In-Reply-To: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net> References: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net> Message-ID: <416207B7.4030705@joshwelch.com> Perry Hoekstra wrote: > Greetings all: > > I am running some performance tests on both Linux and Solaris boxes. I > can capture response time, errors, etc from the performance tool but I > would also like the server resource consumption over that period of > time, essentially top over time. How would I capture top metrics for a > given hour? > > Thank you, > > Perry Hoekstra > You can use sar or atsar to gather performance data over time. They grab system stats on a regulr basis, 5 minutes on my boxes, and you can generate reports from those stats. I think that on redhat it is part of the sysstat package, on debian it's the atsar package. Not sure where it is on other distros. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phillipsmith1949 at earthlink.net Tue Oct 5 06:27:43 2004 From: phillipsmith1949 at earthlink.net (Phil & Kate Smith) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome Message-ID: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. any experiences with: Qwest Sound Internet others? Thanks _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jpschewe at mtu.net Tue Oct 5 06:36:18 2004 From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Top over Time In-Reply-To: <416207B7.4030705@joshwelch.com> References: <4161F942.7000006@charter.net> <416207B7.4030705@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <1096976178.22260.16.camel@workstation.mn.mtu.net> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Tue Oct 5 07:46:31 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > any experiences with: > Qwest *shudders* Can you get consumer-grade DSL out of them anymore? I thought they'd (forcibly) switched "regular users" over to MSN and only handled business customers now. Maybe they changed their game plan; I don't know. I do recall that was what they wanted to do (much to the irritation of many customers). Perhaps the backlash put them in their place; customers tend to dislike being traded like baseball cards (or players, I suppose). > Sound Internet Not me, but I've heard some good things. Maybe I can beat a review out of someone. > others? Obligatory plug: Real Time Enterprises, which hosts the TCLUG mailing list, offers DSL. Reliable. Competent, Linux-friendly tech support. They're my favorite, at any rate. (No, I don't work for them, but I'm a happy customer.) http://www.real-time.com I also hear VISI is good for DSL. Everyone I've talked to who've used them has seemed pretty satisfied. http://www.visi.com Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dutchman_mn at charter.net Tue Oct 5 07:53:03 2004 From: dutchman_mn at charter.net (dutchman_mn@charter.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Top over Time Message-ID: <3ds8t6$93t3tl@mxip20a.cluster1.charter.net> > You can also use top -batch I took a look at it but was confused by the -n option which sets number of iterations/frames. How does that equate to milliseconds/seconds? Perry Hoekstra _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jkjones at tcq.net Tue Oct 5 03:02:20 2004 From: jkjones at tcq.net (Kraig Jones) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4162550C.5070208@tcq.net> Phil & Kate Smith wrote: >I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. >any experiences with: >Qwest >Sound Internet >others? > >Thanks > > I've had TCQ (tcq.net) as my ISP for about 4-5 months. They're about the lowest-cost local ISP that I could find. I've never had any problems with their service. I just use their basic net access, so I have no experience with them and web hosting, servers etc. I get my DSL and phone line from Qwest, just because they're the only choice. Otherwise, I'm not too happy with them, after they talked me into switching to their long-distance service, then added a new fixed monthly charge after I'd switched. Kraig _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Tue Oct 5 08:20:48 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1096982448.41629fb029db9@my.visi.com> Visi is the best! The customer service is the Bomb! Sam. Quoting Phil & Kate Smith : > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > any experiences with: > Qwest > Sound Internet > others? > > Thanks > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Tue Oct 5 08:48:07 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200410050848.07173.barnabas@knicknack.net> On Tuesday 05 October 2004 07:46, Jima wrote: > On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > > any experiences with: > > Qwest > > > Sound Internet > > Not me, but I've heard some good things. Maybe I can beat a review out > of someone. > I don't use Sound Internet at home (I have cable) but I have done quite a bit of volunteer work for a non-profit organization. At least two of their offices (maybe 3) have had Sound Internet for at more than 2-1/2 years and, as far as I know, we've never had a problem with them. I certainly would recommend them. Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From random at argle.org Tue Oct 5 09:09:45 2004 From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > any experiences with: > Qwest Qwest has passed 3 strikes with me. I minimize the amount of business I do with them now. > Sound Internet > others? Visi and RealTime are good, but I've gone with Speakeasy because they use Covad DSL service. I'm running 6Mbs now for only $100/mo, with turnup and service quality that I have never gotten from even the best Qwest-dependent provider. Sorry guys, Qwest is a liability for you. -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Tue Oct 5 09:24:52 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <67f3084a04100416032af3707@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <67f3084a04100416032af3707@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4162AEB4.2000906@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Shawn Fertch wrote: > BTW, it looks like they pulled it from the Slack 10 cd's but there was > a package management tool called swaret that some people really liked. > I never used it personally. There is also another package management for Slack called "Slapt-get" these days too. It is similar to the Deb "agt-get". I like it. That's All. Take Care People, Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cdf123 at cdf123.net Tue Oct 5 09:33:37 2004 From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:07 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4162B0C1.5060604@cdf123.net> Daniel Taylor wrote: > On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > > >>I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. >>any experiences with: >>Qwest > > Qwest has passed 3 strikes with me. > I minimize the amount of business I do with them now. > > >>Sound Internet >>others? > > Visi and RealTime are good, but I've gone with Speakeasy > because they use Covad DSL service. I'm running 6Mbs now > for only $100/mo, with turnup and service quality that > I have never gotten from even the best Qwest-dependent provider. > > Sorry guys, Qwest is a liability for you. > I'll second that. Visi is good, but you're still running on top of Qwest, so if Qwest drops a node or whatever it will still hit you. Although if you had to choose between running with a provider that runs off Qwest hardware or going fully with Qwest, I'd go with the other provider every time. We use Visi at work, and the quality of the customer service is so far above anything we've gotten from Qwest, it's not even funny. I've used Speakeasy at home before and they were great. If I remember right, they even use Linux for their internal business programs and will even offer support for it. It's nice not having to explain to tech support that you use Kmail/Evolution/Mozilla for email instead of Outlook. My $0.02 Chris Frederick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at ryanorourke.org Tue Oct 5 10:11:45 2004 From: tclug at ryanorourke.org (Ryan O'Rourke) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4162B9B1.6010109@ryanorourke.org> Daniel Taylor wrote: > Visi and RealTime are good, but I've gone with Speakeasy > because they use Covad DSL service. I'm running 6Mbs now > for only $100/mo What's your upload speed? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From chrisc at chris.org Tue Oct 5 10:38:34 2004 From: chrisc at chris.org (Chris Cox, N0UK) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: I have been very satisfied with Real-Time Enterprises. They also happen to be the host of this mailman list, however, that is neither nere nor there. I have been a DSL customer of there's for several years and have seen consistently very high availability and reliability. Chris On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > any experiences with: > Qwest > Sound Internet > others? -- 73 Chris Cox N0UK, G4JEC, ex-AB0CN, ex-G8PTC RNARS #1157 EN34jv33 chrisc@Chris.Org Ping Jockey's do it until they HEAR the burn... WWW Home Page: http://WWW.Chris.Org/ http://www.pingjockey.net Cultural observation: Europeans think 100 miles is a long way; Americans think 100 years is a long time! Keep your off-road vehicle off the road. http://www.mini2.com/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From random at argle.org Tue Oct 5 11:00:20 2004 From: random at argle.org (Daniel Taylor) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <4162B9B1.6010109@ryanorourke.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Ryan O'Rourke wrote: > Daniel Taylor wrote: > > > Visi and RealTime are good, but I've gone with Speakeasy > > because they use Covad DSL service. I'm running 6Mbs now > > for only $100/mo > > What's your upload speed? > 768k. Good enough for my purposes. -- Daniel Taylor random@argle.org Forget diamonds, Copyright is forever. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy at rosengren.org Tue Oct 5 11:24:19 2004 From: jeremy at rosengren.org (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4162CAB3.7010003@rosengren.org> Yaron wrote: >> I've had relatively low success rates using the NFS root support in the >> kernel itself, and much better success rates doing a LTSP-style initrd > > > The ltsp website seems to be kinda dead right now... got any useful > docs? (: http://www.ltsp.org/ works just fine for me. -- jeremy _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Tue Oct 5 11:43:19 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: <4162CAB3.7010003@rosengren.org> References: <4162CAB3.7010003@rosengren.org> Message-ID: > http://www.ltsp.org/ works just fine for me. It was dead yesterday (especially faqs.ltsp.org!) When I did finally get it... well, I didn't like it that much, not for what I'm trying to do. It's well over-complicated. Also, the harddrive for this machine has arrived, so... -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jreynolds at geeksquad.com Wed Oct 6 05:58:58 2004 From: jreynolds at geeksquad.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200410060558.58987.jreynolds@geeksquad.com> I have just finished loading Gentoo for the first time. I have used suse, mandrake, freebsd (for a few days, couldn't get sound working), redhat, and knoppix. This is the first time the volume and mute button on my laptop have worked. I am very impressed so far. Jason Reynolds _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Tue Oct 5 12:55:17 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: <4162B9B1.6010109@ryanorourke.org> Message-ID: <32fd453704100510556ca47834@mail.gmail.com> Thanks guys....I've been starting to look as well (moving in January to Oakdale, for college) Now I don't have to ask the list myself :) Speakeasy's sounding *really* nice. Sound Internet has a monthly limit...heh....*thinks not suitable for him* Thanks for the input everyone! _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Tue Oct 5 13:07:47 2004 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome Message-ID: I have nothing but good things to say about Speakeasy. Good service, and good options (static ips and the like) at good prices. >>> Keith Bachman 10/05/04 12:55PM >>> Speakeasy's sounding *really* nice. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From poptix at poptix.net Tue Oct 5 12:36:33 2004 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041005173633.GB2829@momentum.poptix.net> On Mon, Oct 04, 2004 at 12:07:38PM -0500, Nate Carlson wrote: > > I've had relatively low success rates using the NFS root support in the > kernel itself, and much better success rates doing a LTSP-style initrd > that loads the network card modules, mounts the NFS root filesystem, and > then pivot_roots into it. One big advantage of the LTSP initrd image is > that it doesn't require a special kernel, too. IIRC, a standard redhat/fedora kernel will netboot. Drop the kernel and initrd on your tftp server, set the appropriate options in DHCP then set the syslinux parameters for an nfs root. Simple enough, took me 15 minutes the last time I did it (few weeks ago) for a Compaq desktop with a broken IDE controller that we wanted to use as a thin client =) -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Tue Oct 5 13:38:58 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <16738.59970.187723.888218@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "jima" == jima writes: jima> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: >> I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. >> any experiences with: >> Qwest >> others? jima> Obligatory plug: Real Time Enterprises, which hosts the TCLUG mailing jima> list, offers DSL. Reliable. Competent, Linux-friendly tech jima> support. They're my favorite, at any rate. (No, I don't jima> work for them, but I'm a happy customer.) jima> http://www.real-time.com I second jima. In fact, Real Time Enterprises is the only reason I *have* DSL. Qwest is so awful (they give the wire into the house) that I would long ago have changed to cable, except for the fact that I would have to use the cable company as my ISP. With DSL I get to have Real Time. R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at nomeaning.net Tue Oct 5 14:41:46 2004 From: tclug at nomeaning.net (Eric Lambart) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1097005306.3308.12.camel@thinky> On Tue, 2004-10-05 at 06:27 -0500, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. Being pretty new in town, I can't speak for local providers, but I use Speakeasy here, and have used them in two other cities, and they are top-notch. And as others have said, if you tell them you're running linux, they won't tell you "we don't support that." P.S. They have a "slashdot" program (linked from slashdot.org's front page) going that gets you, among other things, a 6 month subscription to sourceforge.net when you sign up: http://www.speakeasy.net/ostg/?al=slashdot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jethro at freakzilla.com Tue Oct 5 15:41:35 2004 From: jethro at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? Message-ID: Hey all. I'm wondering if any of you monitor your CPU temp. What's normal? What are the ranges? etc. And what kind of cooling solution are you using (Fan that came with the CPU, kickass fan, water, helium)? I just got an AMD64, and I'm using the fan/heatsink it came with. The CPU temp is normally around 105 degrees, but when I actually make it work (it's been encoding OGGs for the past hour or so) it goes up to 120. As soon as encoding is done, it drops back down. My previous CPU was way hotter... till I accidentally disconnected the fan's temp sensor, so it was always on High. I'm curious about other peoples' setup now (: -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cdf123 at cdf123.net Tue Oct 5 16:12:01 2004 From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41630E21.3040600@cdf123.net> Yaron wrote: > Hey all. > > I'm wondering if any of you monitor your CPU temp. What's normal? What > are the ranges? etc. And what kind of cooling solution are you using > (Fan that came with the CPU, kickass fan, water, helium)? > > I just got an AMD64, and I'm using the fan/heatsink it came with. The > CPU temp is normally around 105 degrees, but when I actually make it > work (it's been encoding OGGs for the past hour or so) it goes up to > 120. As soon as encoding is done, it drops back down. > > My previous CPU was way hotter... till I accidentally disconnected the > fan's temp sensor, so it was always on High. > > I'm curious about other peoples' setup now (: > > > -Yaron > I run a dual Xeon at home that I'm trying to get acpi support working on, but currently it's unstable at best and I need stability above all else. If I get it running anytime soon I'll post the info. I also have a laptop that runs a P3 1.13Ghz, and that runs anywhere between high 40's C up to the high 80's C. I don't think I've ever hit 90C yet. But average for that system is about 65-70C. I also do development on a dockapp called wmacpi_temp in my spare time. "http://freshmeat.net/projects/wmacpi_temp/" From what I know, different models of cpus will have different heat ranges that are acceptable. But any clockspeed of that model will mostly stay in the same heat range. Anything outside of that range is usually signs of faulty hardware or simply a bad setup. I remember the first computer I ever built, I didn't bother to add a cpu fan on an AMD k62 333Mhz. Trying to get windows loaded and working on that was really fun. :) I would try to do a google search and see what the accepted heat range for an AMD64 cpu is before getting too worried though. Chris Frederick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rclark at lakesplus.com Tue Oct 5 16:27:42 2004 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:08 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? References: Message-ID: <001e01c4ab22$28645bc0$0201a8c0@office> On basic systems I usually see my systems run between 105oF (~40oC) and 122 oF (50oC). If I see it get much past the 122oF range I start to wonder what to do next. The limit for the solder in the area is on the order of 80-85oC ... now that is a rough guess and depends on the type of solder, etc. I would say you are in the right range and do not need to be worried a whole lot. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Yaron" To: "TCLUG" Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 3:41 PM Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? > Hey all. > > I'm wondering if any of you monitor your CPU temp. What's normal? What are > the ranges? etc. And what kind of cooling solution are you using (Fan that > came with the CPU, kickass fan, water, helium)? > > I just got an AMD64, and I'm using the fan/heatsink it came with. The CPU > temp is normally around 105 degrees, but when I actually make it work > (it's been encoding OGGs for the past hour or so) it goes up to 120. As > soon as encoding is done, it drops back down. > > My previous CPU was way hotter... till I accidentally disconnected the > fan's temp sensor, so it was always on High. > > I'm curious about other peoples' setup now (: > > > -Yaron > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dan at dandrake.org Tue Oct 5 16:20:00 2004 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan Drake) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041005211959.GA3426@aleph-one> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Tue Oct 5 16:55:08 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <200410060558.58987.jreynolds@geeksquad.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <4a0cafe2041002201317a65831@mail.gmail.com> <200410060558.58987.jreynolds@geeksquad.com> Message-ID: <4163183C.6030507@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Jason Reynolds wrote: > I have just finished loading Gentoo for the first time. I have used suse, > mandrake, freebsd (for a few days, couldn't get sound working), redhat, and > knoppix. This is the first time the volume and mute button on my laptop have > worked. I am very impressed so far. > > Jason Reynolds Glad you having fun with your new install. Just wanted to let you know to check you clock/date settings. Adios, Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Tue Oct 5 17:25:49 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Debugging diskless boot? In-Reply-To: References: <4162CAB3.7010003@rosengren.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 5 Oct 2004, Yaron wrote: > It was dead yesterday (especially faqs.ltsp.org!) > > When I did finally get it... well, I didn't like it that much, not for > what I'm trying to do. It's well over-complicated. > > Also, the harddrive for this machine has arrived, so... I don't actually use LTSP itself - just the initrd kit. :) http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/ltsp/ltsp_initrd_kit-3.0.15-i386.tgz?download -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Scott_J_Julian at comcast.net Tue Oct 5 18:16:45 2004 From: Scott_J_Julian at comcast.net (Scott J Julian) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: XP2100 with an Antec Reference HSF spinning @ 6500rpm, Vantec Nexus 4ch fan controller, 2 80mm Vantec Tornado exhaust fans, 1 80mm Chieftec intake fan and I average 30-33C idle and 44C tops when playing Doom3, Sims2, UT2K4, etc. -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Yaron Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 3:42 PM To: TCLUG Subject: [TCLUG] How Hot does your CPU get? Hey all. I'm wondering if any of you monitor your CPU temp. What's normal? What are the ranges? etc. And what kind of cooling solution are you using (Fan that came with the CPU, kickass fan, water, helium)? I just got an AMD64, and I'm using the fan/heatsink it came with. The CPU temp is normally around 105 degrees, but when I actually make it work (it's been encoding OGGs for the past hour or so) it goes up to 120. As soon as encoding is done, it drops back down. My previous CPU was way hotter... till I accidentally disconnected the fan's temp sensor, so it was always on High. I'm curious about other peoples' setup now (: -Yaron -- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com Tue Oct 5 18:30:04 2004 From: jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Distro question In-Reply-To: <4163183C.6030507@b-o-b.homelinux.com> References: <68a256c041002071514b2c04b@mail.gmail.com> <200410060558.58987.jreynolds@geeksquad.com> <4163183C.6030507@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <200410051830.04463.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> On Tuesday 05 October 2004 04:55 pm, Robert D. De Mars wrote: > Jason Reynolds wrote: > > I have just finished loading Gentoo for the first time. I have used suse, > > mandrake, freebsd (for a few days, couldn't get sound working), redhat, > > and knoppix. This is the first time the volume and mute button on my > > laptop have worked. I am very impressed so far. > > > > Jason Reynolds > > Glad you having fun with your new install. Just wanted to > let you know to check you clock/date settings. > > Adios, > > Robert De Mars Thanks. :) I had already sent out a few before i noticed that. Fixed it thou _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kevin.lombardo at gmail.com Tue Oct 5 19:44:45 2004 From: kevin.lombardo at gmail.com (Kevin Lombardo) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: local training Message-ID: Hello- I requested to attend a SANS training course in San Francisco this November, but due to budget constraints, my manager has asked me to consider equivalent training locally. Does anyone know of anyplace in the metro that has similar courses? I wanted to take the "Hacker Techniques,Exploits, and Incident Handling", but I would be open to anything involving securing Linux/Unix/Windows, computer forensics, etc. thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Oct 5 21:04:41 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: local training In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2c6699da041005190447b41357@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004 19:44:45 -0500, Kevin Lombardo writes: > I requested to attend a SANS training course in San Francisco this > November, but due to budget constraints, my manager has asked me to > consider equivalent training locally. I've always used Benchmark (now Benchmark/New Horizons) for my training needs. They are offering an ethical hacking course in Nov: http://www.newhorizonsmn.com/CourseDetail.aspx?CrsNum=BEEthHackOver While mostly a M$ training partner, they seem to be pretty cross platform in their training. -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ntraxler at usfamily.net Wed Oct 6 00:05:00 2004 From: ntraxler at usfamily.net (Nick Traxler) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ndiswrapper for wireless drivers In-Reply-To: <4403.134.29.178.254.1096916394.squirrel@134.29.178.254> References: <4403.134.29.178.254.1096916394.squirrel@134.29.178.254> Message-ID: <41637CFC.3050708@usfamily.net> I just installed ndiswrapper on Debian Sarge a week or two ago and didn't have to do anything special in the kernel. The 4k stacks option in the kernel config is turned off. (I have kernel 2.6.7) It actually went very smoothly; I built debs for the ndiswrapper stuff and grabbed the driver out of my windows directory on the XP partition. The little blue button to disable the antenna even works in linux. :) Now if only my stupid Qwest DSL modem would give me the right nameservers in the DHCP reply. :( Nick Adam wrote: > Pete, > > You'll most likely have to compile a custom kernel disabling the 4k stacks > option as ndiswapper will not work correctly with it enabled. I had to do > this on my gentoo system in order to get it to work correctly. > > Adam ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 01:43:52 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] MYSQL syncronization? Message-ID: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> Got a question for you mysql experts/gurus/whatevers out there. I'm looking at using dotproject (www.dotproject.net) for a task management system, and plan on running it on my laptop (under Windows XP Pro, I know) in WAMP, for when I'm on the road, no net access. However, I also want it on my site for when I don't have my laptop (or so others can have access) but I don't own the server my site sits on (hosting company) The question is this: Is it possible for me to (maybe using transaction logs? I don't know, haven't used mysql, just sql) replicate the data between two mysql servers, that aren't always able to talk to each other? And for bonus brownie points, is it easily scriptable? Thanks in advance, Keith Bachman _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 05:17:19 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:09 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: <1097005306.3308.12.camel@thinky> References: <1773392.1096975664145.JavaMail.root@waldorf.psp.pas.earthlink.net> <1097005306.3308.12.camel@thinky> Message-ID: USFamily.net also provides DSL services through Qwest. Their tech support is ok if you can get the right person on the phone. On Tue, 05 Oct 2004 14:41:46 -0500, Eric Lambart wrote: > On Tue, 2004-10-05 at 06:27 -0500, Phil & Kate Smith wrote: > > I/m Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome. > > Being pretty new in town, I can't speak for local providers, but I use > Speakeasy here, and have used them in two other cities, and they are > top-notch. And as others have said, if you tell them you're running > linux, they won't tell you "we don't support that." > > P.S. They have a "slashdot" program (linked from slashdot.org's front > page) going that gets you, among other things, a 6 month subscription to > sourceforge.net when you sign up: > http://www.speakeasy.net/ostg/?al=slashdot > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jpschewe at mtu.net Wed Oct 6 05:36:42 2004 From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Top over Time In-Reply-To: <3ds8t6$93t3tl@mxip20a.cluster1.charter.net> References: <3ds8t6$93t3tl@mxip20a.cluster1.charter.net> Message-ID: <1097059002.31080.5.camel@workstation.mn.mtu.net> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From peter.chase at epredix.com Wed Oct 6 08:13:05 2004 From: peter.chase at epredix.com (Peter Chase) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ndiswrapper for wireless drivers Message-ID: I did the install yesterday and everything went well. I did get a kernel that had the 16k stack (version 2.6.8). It took a while to figure out some of the configuration, but it works like a champ. -Pete -----Original Message----- I just installed ndiswrapper on Debian Sarge a week or two ago and didn't have to do anything special in the kernel. The 4k stacks option in the kernel config is turned off. (I have kernel 2.6.7) It actually went very smoothly; I built debs for the ndiswrapper stuff and grabbed the driver out of my windows directory on the XP partition. The little blue button to disable the antenna even works in linux. :) Now if only my stupid Qwest DSL modem would give me the right nameservers in the DHCP reply. :( Nick Adam wrote: > Pete, > > You'll most likely have to compile a custom kernel disabling the 4k > stacks option as ndiswapper will not work correctly with it enabled. I > had to do this on my gentoo system in order to get it to work correctly. > > Adam ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Wed Oct 6 08:17:42 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Looking for a good TC DSL ISP...any comments welcome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4163F076.9070305@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 6 09:04:27 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] MYSQL syncronization? In-Reply-To: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4163FB6B.8080906@visi.com> The only database I've seen that could handle synchronizing disconnected databases is Oracle - a number can do replication which is a bit simpler. Its not hard if you have a very simple, or single, table structure; after all, that's what all the PDA synch stuff does. But when you get into more complex data models you have to deal with all sorts of potential referential integrity issues. For example, someone deletes a parent record on the server which invalidates an edited child record on your laptop version. Even the PDA synch run into problems when one person changes part of an integral record, say a meeting description, and another person changes the another part, say the time. Which record do you take, or do you try to merge the two? If the data structure is simple enough, and you are the only one making changes, you can probably use table triggers to write SQL statements to a log table. Then you apply the statements to the database you want to synch, but even then there are a bunch of gotchas and I don't recall if MySQL supports triggers in the current version. Good luck. --rick Keith Bachman wrote: >Got a question for you mysql experts/gurus/whatevers out there. > >I'm looking at using dotproject (www.dotproject.net) for a task >management system, and plan on running it on my laptop (under Windows >XP Pro, I know) in WAMP, for when I'm on the road, no net access. >However, I also want it on my site for when I don't have my laptop (or >so others can have access) but I don't own the server my site sits on >(hosting company) > >The question is this: > >Is it possible for me to (maybe using transaction logs? I don't know, >haven't used mysql, just sql) replicate the data between two mysql >servers, that aren't always able to talk to each other? > >And for bonus brownie points, is it easily scriptable? > >Thanks in advance, > >Keith Bachman > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 09:27:10 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: local training In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <914f813c04100607277142c4ca@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004 19:44:45 -0500, Kevin Lombardo wrote: > Hello- > > I requested to attend a SANS training course in San Francisco this > November, but due to budget constraints, my manager has asked me to > consider equivalent training locally. > > Does anyone know of anyplace in the metro that has similar courses? > > I wanted to take the "Hacker Techniques,Exploits, and Incident > Handling", but I would be open to anything involving securing > Linux/Unix/Windows, computer forensics, etc. I took this course when they offered it here in Minneapolis in June, and while not a bad course (Ed Skoudis is great) a copy of Hacking Exposed, combined with a few practice penetration tests done from home will teach you almost as much. In that vein, just following Bugtraq or the SecurityFocus pen-test list can teach you quite a bit. Of course, neither technique provides letters to add to a business card, so if that's [part of] what you're looking for... You can also do SANS@Home, which, if you register at the right time, can get you an iPod for "free" (i.e. your employer paid for it by paying SANS). SANS also does a fair amount of instructor-led online training and local-mentor courses. One of these may be just right, and I know one was set up to start soon (if it hasn't already) in the area. (Thank you, SANS SPAM for educating me, and thus TCLUG!) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 09:32:20 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script Message-ID: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> I'm looking for a system information script similar to the sys_check script for Tru64, or HP has one as well but I forget it's name that the moment. If you're not familiar with these, it's a system information script that collects everything from users, filesystem usage, kernel parameters, installed software, etc and can put it to an html file if need be. I'd rather not reinvent the wheel if I don't have to. I did a Google search, and found that sys_check had been ported to Linux, but I'm not finding a place where I can get it. One of the requirements is that it is able to be used on various distros. Thanks. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Wed Oct 6 09:35:24 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] WTB 6-20 GB hard drive and misc X20 parts In-Reply-To: <20041006100101.0590A222E9@parabel.matrix.de> Message-ID: I bought a beater ThinkPad X20 and need a hard drive for it. Anything at all will do for a while, but I'm especially looking for something in the 10-20GB size, and preferably at least new enough to have fluid drive bearings. A 20GB IBM 40GNX would be perfect, but again, anything over 6GB or so will get the job done for now. If you're itching to be rid of one of your spares, send me your specs. If you've got an X20 caddy, or hard drive cover, or battery, or AC adapter to sell, let me know about that, too. Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Wed Oct 6 09:57:07 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling Message-ID: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From electrum at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 10:15:42 2004 From: electrum at gmail.com (David Phillips) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:10 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] MYSQL syncronization? In-Reply-To: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <853e1ecc0410060815451d81c3@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 01:43:52 -0500, Keith Bachman wrote: > Is it possible for me to (maybe using transaction logs? I don't know, > haven't used mysql, just sql) replicate the data between two mysql > servers, that aren't always able to talk to each other? No. Doing that in a general way would be very, very hard, if not impossible. You could do it yourself. Add a column to each table that tracks the row's state. It would have these states: none, inserted, modified and deleted. Where it gets tricky is if you are using auto incrementing ID numbers. Every time you insert, update or delete a row, set the state column to the appropriate value. When you are synchronizing inserted rows, you need to change the ID numbers of those rows both in the row record and in every record that references that row. You might be able to do some of this automatically if you use a database with triggers and use a program to generate your schema. Where you run into problems is where the same row has been modified in both places. How to handle this is up to your application. I recommend using SQLite instead of MySQL. You don't need the multiuser performance of MySQL. SQLite has triggers and doesn't require a database server to be running since the SQLite library is the database "server". http://www.sqlite.org/ I wrote a nice program to automatically generate a database schema and documentation. It would be interesting to modify it to generate synchronization triggers and see if my theory works. Contact me off list if you are interested. -- David Phillips http://david.acz.org/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Wed Oct 6 10:26:57 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling In-Reply-To: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <41640EC1.3080308@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Todd wrote: > Hi Everyone, ok why is it when I down load a package and I try and > install it by using ./configure I get an : bad interpreter: No such file > or directory error? I'm kind of new to Linux so any help is great. > Thanks Todd Are you actually downloading a distro specific package(ie: .rpm, .tgz, etc...), or you you downloading the actual source tarball (.tar.gz, .tar.bz2, etc.)?? Also, what distro are you using?? Adios, Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Wed Oct 6 10:41:32 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> <41640EC1.3080308@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <004801c4abba$f6236cc0$0300a8c0@baker5> I'm downloading the tar.gz file ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert D. De Mars" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 10:26 AM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] trouble compiling > Todd wrote: > > Hi Everyone, ok why is it when I down load a package and I try and > > install it by using ./configure I get an : bad interpreter: No such file > > or directory error? I'm kind of new to Linux so any help is great. > > Thanks Todd > > Are you actually downloading a distro specific package(ie: > .rpm, .tgz, etc...), or you you downloading the actual > source tarball (.tar.gz, .tar.bz2, etc.)?? > > Also, what distro are you using?? > > Adios, > > Robert De Mars > -- > Lat. 45:09n > Long. 93:18w > http://b-o-b.homelinux.com > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From pjcrump at bitstream.net Wed Oct 6 11:02:54 2004 From: pjcrump at bitstream.net (pjcrump@bitstream.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] MYSQL syncronization? In-Reply-To: <853e1ecc0410060815451d81c3@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> <853e1ecc0410060815451d81c3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42325.198.74.20.73.1097078574.squirrel@198.74.20.73> Take a look at Mysql Replication. I think you could configure the Laptop as the master DB and then setup the replication - the slave would constantly try to get data from the master. When the master is gone - it would get nothing and then when the master is available it (theoretically) would sync up. I have used mysql replication in the past so I know that it would work - it's just the issue of sometimes the slave may not be able to pull data from the master for a long period of time that concerns me.. Either way, it's worth a look. > On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 01:43:52 -0500, Keith Bachman wrote: >> Is it possible for me to (maybe using transaction logs? I don't know, >> haven't used mysql, just sql) replicate the data between two mysql >> servers, that aren't always able to talk to each other? > > No. Doing that in a general way would be very, very hard, if not > impossible. > > You could do it yourself. Add a column to each table that tracks the > row's state. It would have these states: none, inserted, modified and > deleted. Where it gets tricky is if you are using auto incrementing > ID numbers. Every time you insert, update or delete a row, set the > state column to the appropriate value. > > When you are synchronizing inserted rows, you need to change the ID > numbers of those rows both in the row record and in every record that > references that row. You might be able to do some of this > automatically if you use a database with triggers and use a program to > generate your schema. > > Where you run into problems is where the same row has been modified in > both places. How to handle this is up to your application. > > I recommend using SQLite instead of MySQL. You don't need the > multiuser performance of MySQL. SQLite has triggers and doesn't > require a database server to be running since the SQLite library is > the database "server". > > http://www.sqlite.org/ > > I wrote a nice program to automatically generate a database schema and > documentation. It would be interesting to modify it to generate > synchronization triggers and see if my theory works. Contact me off > list if you are interested. > > -- > David Phillips > http://david.acz.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Wed Oct 6 11:44:17 2004 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling In-Reply-To: <41640EC1.3080308@b-o-b.homelinux.com> References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> <41640EC1.3080308@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <20041006114417.A25342@baker.space.umn.edu> Todd wrote: >Hi Everyone, ok why is it when I down load a package and I try and >install it by using ./configure I get an : bad interpreter: No such file >or directory error? I'm kind of new to Linux so any help is great. That means that the correct shell isn't installed or script got garbled. http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/history/213617 -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Wed Oct 6 13:27:17 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com>; from sfertch@gmail.com on Wed, Oct 06, 2004 at 09:32:20AM -0500 References: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> Shawn Fertch wrote: > I'm looking for a system information script similar to the sys_check > script for Tru64, or HP has one as well but I forget it's name that > the moment. If you're not familiar with these, it's a system > information script that collects everything from users, filesystem > usage, kernel parameters, installed software, etc and can put it to an > html file if need be. > > I'd rather not reinvent the wheel if I don't have to. I did a Google > search, and found that sys_check had been ported to Linux, but I'm not > finding a place where I can get it. > > One of the requirements is that it is able to be used on various distros. maybe not detailed enough, but would phpsysinfo work? http://phpsysinfo.sourceforge.net/phpsysinfo/?template=classic -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Wed Oct 6 13:42:42 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling In-Reply-To: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <41643CA2.2070706@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Wed Oct 6 13:38:11 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling In-Reply-To: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <41643B93.70705@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Wed Oct 6 13:50:05 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling In-Reply-To: <41643CA2.2070706@veldy.net> References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5> <41643CA2.2070706@veldy.net> Message-ID: <41643E5D.6040705@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Wed Oct 6 14:03:00 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:11 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script In-Reply-To: <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> References: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <67f3084a0410061203779299e2@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 13:27:17 -0500, Scot Jenkins wrote: > maybe not detailed enough, but would phpsysinfo work? > http://phpsysinfo.sourceforge.net/phpsysinfo/?template=classic Thanks, Scot. But, I'm already running it on a majority of my systems. What I'm looking for is a script that generates a flatfile of the system settings and information that include (but not limited to): cpu memory disks disk usage partition info fstab users groups services netstat packages dmesg kernel parameters loaded modules I have a fairly decent start on it, but it's far from inclusive. I'm more than certain there's a lot of things I'm overlooking as well. The idea of putting it to a flat file is so that it can be stored for an undetermined amount of time for disaster recovery, upgrading of the server, etc. An html file would be ideal so that it can be viewed easily. Here's the manpage for sys_check: http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V50A_HTML/MAN/MAN8/0346____.HTM I'm sure there's already something out there, but I'm not having much luck googling. I've been looking for an example sys_check file in html format, but don't seem to be finding any either. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Wed Oct 6 14:15:45 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] trouble compiling References: <004001c4abb4$c1bae310$0300a8c0@baker5><41643CA2.2070706@veldy.net> <41643E5D.6040705@veldy.net> Message-ID: <006c01c4abd8$e3990b00$0300a8c0@baker5> cool, works great thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thomas T. Veldhouse" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] trouble compiling > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Ryan at ccconsulting.biz Wed Oct 6 21:08:06 2004 From: Ryan at ccconsulting.biz (Ryan@ccconsulting.biz) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Next installfest Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Wed Oct 6 22:53:49 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410070353.i973rne18461@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: IBM Netfinity 5000 I have an IBM Netfinity 5000 that I don't use anymore. Type 8659-4RY Dual PII 500 2 gig ram Dual power supplies IBM Array controller 3 hot swap 18 gb scsi drives Intergrated NIC DDS2 DAT tape drive CD and floppy Rack Mount case $300 Currently it has Suse 9.1 installed. Seller Email address: jimstreit at northlans dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Thu Oct 7 08:18:54 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410061203779299e2@mail.gmail.com>; from sfertch@gmail.com on Wed, Oct 06, 2004 at 02:03:00PM -0500 References: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> <67f3084a0410061203779299e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041007081854.A1176@thinkunix.net> Shawn Fertch wrote: > On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 13:27:17 -0500, Scot Jenkins wrote: > > maybe not detailed enough, but would phpsysinfo work? > > http://phpsysinfo.sourceforge.net/phpsysinfo/?template=classic > > Thanks, Scot. But, I'm already running it on a majority of my systems. > > What I'm looking for is a script that generates a flatfile of the > system settings and information that include (but not limited to): > > cpu > memory > disks > disk usage > partition info > fstab > users > groups > services > netstat > packages > dmesg > kernel parameters > loaded modules > > I have a fairly decent start on it, but it's far from inclusive. I'm > more than certain there's a lot of things I'm overlooking as well. > > The idea of putting it to a flat file is so that it can be stored for > an undetermined amount of time for disaster recovery, upgrading of the > server, etc. An html file would be ideal so that it can be viewed > easily. > > Here's the manpage for sys_check: > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V50A_HTML/MAN/MAN8/0346____.HTM Shawn, I think you're on your own for this one. I totally understand wanting a flat file for disaster recovery. I have some a script I wrote a long time ago that basically just cat(1)'s stuff from /proc and important files (/etc/fstab, /etc/passwd, etc) into a log file. Again, far from finished. The problem seems to be when you have multiple distros and/or other UNIX hosts (FreeBSD, Solaris, etc) that name files differently (eg, Linux:/etc/fstab, Solaris:/etc/vfstab), or are in other ways different (eg, kernel configs/parameters), and you're trying to have just one script run everywhere. I guess, just code up what works for you and you can always add to it over time. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Thu Oct 7 08:20:19 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Next installfest In-Reply-To: ; from Ryan@ccconsulting.biz on Wed, Oct 06, 2004 at 09:08:06PM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20041007082019.B1176@thinkunix.net> Ryan@ccconsulting.biz wrote: > Greetings, > > I'm a vary new Linux user, and I just got a hold of a Small RS/6000 and I > would like to make it a nice linux server, I don't know how to install > Linux on this type of a server I was hoping there would be a installfest > soon so I could bring it along. Anyone have any idea when the next > installfest might be? I'm trying to get some space for the event yet this month. Keep an eye on this list for an announcement. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Oct 7 08:36:09 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410071336.i97Da9R24392@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 2 U Rack Mount PC 2U Rackmount Case Intel 440GX Motherboard (Dual CPU) Integrated Adaptec 7XXX 68 Pin SCSI 18.2 7200 RPM SCSI 128 MB RAM Integrated Video CD-ROM 350-500 mhz Pentium III (Can't remember exactly) $60 Seller Email address: b at spam dot neigebauer dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 09:50:13 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal Message-ID: At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these for recycling? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From hoyosa at msoe.edu Thu Oct 7 10:00:54 2004 From: hoyosa at msoe.edu (Andrew J. Hoyos) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script In-Reply-To: <20041007081854.A1176@thinkunix.net> References: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> <67f3084a0410061203779299e2@mail.gmail.com> <20041007081854.A1176@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <20041007150054.GB1600@aurora.hoyos.org> Check out ibackup. I think it's a debian package, but I believe it can do all the things you want. On 10/07/04 08:18, Scot Jenkins wrote: > Shawn Fertch wrote: > > On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 13:27:17 -0500, Scot Jenkins wrote: > > > maybe not detailed enough, but would phpsysinfo work? > > > http://phpsysinfo.sourceforge.net/phpsysinfo/?template=classic > > > > Thanks, Scot. But, I'm already running it on a majority of my systems. > > > > What I'm looking for is a script that generates a flatfile of the > > system settings and information that include (but not limited to): > > > > cpu > > memory > > disks > > disk usage > > partition info > > fstab > > users > > groups > > services > > netstat > > packages > > dmesg > > kernel parameters > > loaded modules > > > > I have a fairly decent start on it, but it's far from inclusive. I'm > > more than certain there's a lot of things I'm overlooking as well. > > > > The idea of putting it to a flat file is so that it can be stored for > > an undetermined amount of time for disaster recovery, upgrading of the > > server, etc. An html file would be ideal so that it can be viewed > > easily. > > > > Here's the manpage for sys_check: > > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/docs/base_doc/DOCUMENTATION/V50A_HTML/MAN/MAN8/0346____.HTM > > Shawn, > I think you're on your own for this one. I totally understand wanting a > flat file for disaster recovery. I have some a script I wrote a long > time ago that basically just cat(1)'s stuff from /proc and important > files (/etc/fstab, /etc/passwd, etc) into a log file. > Again, far from finished. The problem seems to be when you have > multiple distros and/or other UNIX hosts (FreeBSD, Solaris, etc) that > name files differently (eg, Linux:/etc/fstab, Solaris:/etc/vfstab), > or are in other ways different (eg, kernel configs/parameters), and > you're trying to have just one script run everywhere. > > I guess, just code up what works for you and you can always add to it > over time. > -- > scot > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Andrew J. Hoyos Milwaukee School of Engineering 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 +1(414)277-2414 email: hoyosa@msoe.edu _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Thu Oct 7 10:07:16 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041007150716.GA360@mail.el-swifto.com> On Thu, Oct 07, 2004 at 09:50:13AM -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone > know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these > for recycling? There's always Materials Processing, in Eagan. http://www.materialsprocessing.com/ Otherwise you might search the Hennepin County web site. -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Thu Oct 7 09:56:14 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 2004, Erik Anderson wrote: > At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone > know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these > for recycling? Get yourself a white ford clubwagon with no windows, two or three buddies, and some black face masks. One guy drives around alleys and side streets, the other two get in the back and, with the sliding side door open, toss the monitors into dumpsters as they pass at speed. I've found that, with two guys in the back, one should handle the lifting and hand it off to the other, who should only concern himself with tossing. Just remember to peel off all of the post-it notes with passwords on them, for security. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rick at eworld3.net Thu Oct 7 10:17:23 2004 From: rick at eworld3.net (Rick Meyerhoff) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Next installfest In-Reply-To: <20041007082019.B1176@thinkunix.net> References: <20041007082019.B1176@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <41655E03.60405@eworld3.net> I'll take this opportunity for shameless self promotion: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Installfest-HOWTO/ Scot Jenkins wrote: > Ryan@ccconsulting.biz wrote: > >>Greetings, >> >>I'm a vary new Linux user, and I just got a hold of a Small RS/6000 and I >>would like to make it a nice linux server, I don't know how to install >>Linux on this type of a server I was hoping there would be a installfest >>soon so I could bring it along. Anyone have any idea when the next >>installfest might be? > > > I'm trying to get some space for the event yet this month. Keep an > eye on this list for an announcement. -- Eric (Rick) Meyerhoff _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 10:22:44 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:50:13 -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone > know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these > for recycling? I just located one place...called Electronics Recovery. They're at 124 12th Ave South in Minneapolis. They charge 30 cents/pound if anyone is interested. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 10:19:13 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:12 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:56:14 -0500 (CDT), Adam Maloney wrote: > Get yourself a white ford clubwagon Haha - sounds like fun. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Thu Oct 7 10:42:26 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2991.192.168.100.2.1097163746.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Good to know... thanks! > On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:50:13 -0500, Erik Anderson > wrote: >> At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone >> know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these >> for recycling? > > I just located one place...called Electronics Recovery. They're at > 124 12th Ave South in Minneapolis. They charge 30 cents/pound if > anyone is interested. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From larry.pint at ntuminc.com Thu Oct 7 10:32:02 2004 From: larry.pint at ntuminc.com (Larry Pint) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41656172.1050308@ntuminc.com> The Twin Cities PC Users group has a program for refurbishing computers to be donated to users. If your monitors are working, they might be interested in them. I believe that most recycling places charge for each monitor that you want to dispose of. Larry Pint Erik Anderson wrote: >At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone >know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these >for recycling? > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From lclemens at mn.rr.com Thu Oct 7 10:28:24 2004 From: lclemens at mn.rr.com (Lawrence Clemens) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal References: Message-ID: <001601c4ac82$49900e00$24fea8c0@selfp6xu3g1ng9> If these are dying or dead monitors they are likely hazardous scrap and you will pay a fee to scrap them. If they are working monitors without any serious defects, a non-profit (like the St. Vincent dePaul Society that I volunteer for) may take them. Can you supply more details if they are functional - 15 in., 17 in., year of manufacture? Larry Clemens ----- Original Message ----- From: "Erik Anderson" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 9:50 AM Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal > At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone > know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these > for recycling? > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 12:18:41 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] System information script In-Reply-To: <20041007150054.GB1600@aurora.hoyos.org> References: <67f3084a0410060732365f32e6@mail.gmail.com> <20041006132717.A5245@thinkunix.net> <67f3084a0410061203779299e2@mail.gmail.com> <20041007081854.A1176@thinkunix.net> <20041007150054.GB1600@aurora.hoyos.org> Message-ID: <67f3084a041007101850479dcb@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 10:00:54 -0500, Andrew J. Hoyos wrote: > Check out ibackup. I think it's a debian package, but I believe it can > do all the things you want. I may check that out, but I was looking for a flat script. Not a backup client ( again, I havne't looked into it). Basically, the whole premise is that if you have to do a bare metal DR, do you know what your filesystem sizes were? How about the services running, or even a snapshot of your system from time to time? Scot, thanks for the info. That's what I'm doing is slowly adding to it, and would like to expand it out to cover the aspect of all *nixes including the various distros. The biggest problem is how to determine what OS/distro a particular system is running or if it's a LFS box. The big UNIX's are pretty easy, but still... -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tommyj27 at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 12:56:36 2004 From: tommyj27 at gmail.com (Thomas Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> I had heard that Minneapolis residents can leave out electronics to recycled with their trash. I don't know how much truth there is to it. On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 09:50:13 -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > At work, I have ~15 monitors that need to be disposed of. Does anyone > know of a place in or around Minneapolis to which I could bring these > for recycling? > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Thu Oct 7 13:08:46 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> References: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4165862E.1030004@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Thomas Johnson wrote: > I had heard that Minneapolis residents can leave out electronics to > recycled with their trash. I don't know how much truth there is to it. > > I live in North East Minneapolis, and it seems to be true. A couple weeks ago I put a 14" out on recycling day. They didn't take it. A couple days latter I noticed the city put an orange sticker on it saying that it would be picked up at a latter date. It's still out there, but I figure if they would not take it they probably would have put a different sticker on it. Something like "We don't take this kinda crap" or something to that effect. So, although it's still there it looks like the city will take it. Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Thu Oct 7 13:11:06 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] Message-ID: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> UPDATE. 10 seconds after I sent this message, I stepped outside for a cig. The 14" monitor is now gone :) Thomas Johnson wrote: > I had heard that Minneapolis residents can leave out electronics to > recycled with their trash. I don't know how much truth there is to it. > > I live in North East Minneapolis, and it seems to be true. A couple weeks ago I put a 14" out on recycling day. They didn't take it. A couple days latter I noticed the city put an orange sticker on it saying that it would be picked up at a latter date. It's still out there, but I figure if they would not take it they probably would have put a different sticker on it. Something like "We don't take this kinda crap" or something to that effect. So, although it's still there it looks like the city will take it. Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 13:08:05 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> References: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 12:56:36 -0500, Thomas Johnson wrote: > I had heard that Minneapolis residents can leave out electronics to > recycled with their trash. I don't know how much truth there is to it. That seems to be true for residential electronics...not so, though for businesses. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Thu Oct 7 13:18:07 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com>; from tommyj27@gmail.com on Thu, Oct 07, 2004 at 12:56:36PM -0500 References: <1469cda2041007105647852172@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041007131807.A1623@thinkunix.net> Thomas Johnson wrote: > I had heard that Minneapolis residents can leave out electronics to > recycled with their trash. I don't know how much truth there is to it. The city will generally take small amounts of items. I put out 2 monitors (separately) in the past couple months and they disappeared from my alley. I don't know if you put 15 out at once if they'd take them or not. Check with the city: http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/ -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Thu Oct 7 13:37:54 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com>; from tclug@b-o-b.homelinux.com on Thu, Oct 07, 2004 at 01:11:06PM -0500 References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> Robert D. De Mars wrote: > UPDATE. 10 seconds after I sent this message, I stepped > outside for a cig. The 14" monitor is now gone :) yeah, either the city took it or a "alley driver". You'd be surprised what you can put out and how fast it disappears. I put an old gas stove out once and it was gone in 2 or 3 days. People kept driving by and taking parts of it. Eventually it was all gone. amazing... -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Thu Oct 7 14:26:15 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> On Thursday 07 October 2004 13:37, Scot Jenkins wrote: > Robert D. De Mars wrote: > > UPDATE. 10 seconds after I sent this message, I stepped > > outside for a cig. The 14" monitor is now gone :) > > yeah, either the city took it or a "alley driver". You'd be surprised > what you can put out and how fast it disappears. I put an old gas stove > out once and it was gone in 2 or 3 days. People kept driving by and > taking parts of it. Eventually it was all gone. amazing... Reminds me of a story a friend told me. He had an old bicycle he wanted to get rid of and decided to give it a way. He leaned it up against a telephone pole near his house and put a sign on the pole that said, "Free." It sat there for days. He finally took down the sign and wrapped a chain around the bike and the pole, but didn't lock it. The bike was gone within hours. Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From obelin23 at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 14:25:38 2004 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <72278d104100712257fc2baca@mail.gmail.com> This is the 'Alley God' - the Alley God giveth, and the Alley God taketh away. Several years ago I put out an old electric typewriter. It disappeared in about a day. A week later they brought it back. Charlie O On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 13:37:54 -0500, Scot Jenkins wrote: > Robert D. De Mars wrote: > > UPDATE. 10 seconds after I sent this message, I stepped > > outside for a cig. The 14" monitor is now gone :) > > yeah, either the city took it or a "alley driver". You'd be surprised > what you can put out and how fast it disappears. I put an old gas stove > out once and it was gone in 2 or 3 days. People kept driving by and > taking parts of it. Eventually it was all gone. amazing... > -- > scot > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Thu Oct 7 15:05:48 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:13 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4165A19C.90508@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Thu Oct 7 14:58:48 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: (now OT) Re: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> Message-ID: > Reminds me of a story a friend told me. He had an old bicycle he wanted to get > rid of and decided to give it a way. He leaned it up against a telephone > pole near his house and put a sign on the pole that said, "Free." It sat > there for days. He finally took down the sign and wrapped a chain around the > bike and the pole, but didn't lock it. The bike was gone within hours. > (I live in Frogtown, see http://www.ci.stpaul.mn.us/depts/police/prostitution_photos_current.html) List of things taken from my property since moving in April/2002 (no order): 2 35-gallon Walters garbage cans* 1 wooden fence post 1 wooden fence cross member (same incident) 1 K-Mart shopping cart** 5 incidents, my mail * Two seperate incidents, 2nd was recovered by Walters 3 blocks away ** This arrived in my yard one night and I noticed it as I left for work. When I got home it was gone. I welcome our robotic K-Mart cart overlords. after the fence post, I decided to do an experiment. I left these items out, unattended, in parts of my yard with various visibility. 1 dead cell phone, affixed with "Fscked" label (correctly spelled) 1 dead laptop, already gutted, with "Fscked" written outside and across the LCD (to weed out those that might try to pawn it) 1 can (sealed) of Dr. Pepper 1 can (sealed) of baked beans 1 small baggie filled with corn starch 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with "COCAINE" label (clearly moved, but not taken) 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with fake red "EVIDENCE" label 1 3-pack, prophylactics I'm thinking I should place one of the "cocaine" baggies to the overhead power lines, and leave my metal extension ladder nearby. Might help the crime rate by half a percentage point. In reality, of the things that were taken, I can't say for sure that a neighbor or cop wasn't responsible for taking/moving/tossing at least some of these items. And there is a bum that I see periodically going through everyone's trash, so he may have taken the beans... _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Thu Oct 7 15:34:57 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: <4165A871.1020201@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Thu Oct 7 15:57:55 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: (now OT) Re: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> Message-ID: <65293fcc04100713574f1fb669@mail.gmail.com> Here in bloomington you're able to drop off anything you don't want at the drop off center: http://www.hennepin.us/vgn/portal/internet/hcdetailmaster/0,2300,1273_83267_100205921,00.html household only I guess... I just brought in 3 monitors a one of my vials of mercury. they took it all with a smile - I didn't even have to get out of my truck! On Thu, 7 Oct 2004 14:58:48 -0500 (CDT), Adam Maloney wrote: > > Reminds me of a story a friend told me. He had an old bicycle he wanted to get > > rid of and decided to give it a way. He leaned it up against a telephone > > pole near his house and put a sign on the pole that said, "Free." It sat > > there for days. He finally took down the sign and wrapped a chain around the > > bike and the pole, but didn't lock it. The bike was gone within hours. > > > > (I live in Frogtown, see > http://www.ci.stpaul.mn.us/depts/police/prostitution_photos_current.html) > > List of things taken from my property since moving in April/2002 (no > order): > > 2 35-gallon Walters garbage cans* > 1 wooden fence post > 1 wooden fence cross member (same incident) > 1 K-Mart shopping cart** > 5 incidents, my mail > > * Two seperate incidents, 2nd was recovered by Walters 3 blocks away > > ** This arrived in my yard one night and I noticed it as I left for work. > When I got home it was gone. I welcome our robotic K-Mart cart > overlords. > > after the fence post, I decided to do an experiment. I left these items > out, unattended, in parts of my yard with various visibility. > > 1 dead cell phone, affixed with "Fscked" label (correctly spelled) > 1 dead laptop, already gutted, with "Fscked" written outside and across > the LCD (to weed out those that might try to pawn it) > 1 can (sealed) of Dr. Pepper > 1 can (sealed) of baked beans > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with "COCAINE" label > (clearly moved, but not taken) > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with fake red "EVIDENCE" > label > 1 3-pack, prophylactics > > I'm thinking I should place one of the "cocaine" baggies to the overhead > power lines, and leave my metal extension ladder nearby. Might help the > crime rate by half a percentage point. > > In reality, of the things that were taken, I can't say for sure that a > neighbor or cop wasn't responsible for taking/moving/tossing at least some > of these items. And there is a bum that I see periodically going through > everyone's trash, so he may have taken the beans... > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jreynolds at geeksquad.com Thu Oct 7 16:04:39 2004 From: jreynolds at geeksquad.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: (now OT) Re: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> Message-ID: <200410071604.39476.jreynolds@geeksquad.com> Best thread I've seen in a while. :) Reynolds On Thursday 07 October 2004 02:58 pm, Adam Maloney wrote: > > Reminds me of a story a friend told me. He had an old bicycle he wanted > > to get rid of and decided to give it a way. He leaned it up against a > > telephone pole near his house and put a sign on the pole that said, > > "Free." It sat there for days. He finally took down the sign and wrapped > > a chain around the bike and the pole, but didn't lock it. The bike was > > gone within hours. > > (I live in Frogtown, see > http://www.ci.stpaul.mn.us/depts/police/prostitution_photos_current.html) > > List of things taken from my property since moving in April/2002 (no > order): > > 2 35-gallon Walters garbage cans* > 1 wooden fence post > 1 wooden fence cross member (same incident) > 1 K-Mart shopping cart** > 5 incidents, my mail > > * Two seperate incidents, 2nd was recovered by Walters 3 blocks away > > ** This arrived in my yard one night and I noticed it as I left for work. > When I got home it was gone. I welcome our robotic K-Mart cart > overlords. > > after the fence post, I decided to do an experiment. I left these items > out, unattended, in parts of my yard with various visibility. > > 1 dead cell phone, affixed with "Fscked" label (correctly spelled) > 1 dead laptop, already gutted, with "Fscked" written outside and across > the LCD (to weed out those that might try to pawn it) > 1 can (sealed) of Dr. Pepper > 1 can (sealed) of baked beans > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with "COCAINE" label > (clearly moved, but not taken) > 1 small baggie filled with corn starch affixed with fake red "EVIDENCE" > label > 1 3-pack, prophylactics > > I'm thinking I should place one of the "cocaine" baggies to the overhead > power lines, and leave my metal extension ladder nearby. Might help the > crime rate by half a percentage point. > > In reality, of the things that were taken, I can't say for sure that a > neighbor or cop wasn't responsible for taking/moving/tossing at least some > of these items. And there is a bum that I see periodically going through > everyone's trash, so he may have taken the beans... > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Thu Oct 7 20:41:39 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <200409291151.05131.lists@gahlon.com> References: <16730.55730.792659.363616@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <200409291151.05131.lists@gahlon.com> Message-ID: <16741.61523.601285.277403@gargle.gargle.HOWL> A week or so ago, I asked for help with a USB drive that seemed miserably slow. I got a bunch of suggestions, and have tried some things out, but didn't make much progress. However, suffering through another ultra-slow backup session, I started poking around in my kernel logs. I found the following warning: Oct 7 17:48:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning (device sda1): ext2_fill_super: mounting ext3 filesystem as ext2 Oct 7 17:48:14 necronomicon kernel: Oct 7 17:48:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: mounting unchecked fs, running e2fsck is reco mmended Oct 7 17:50:52 necronomicon last message repeated 3 times ...after that we start to see things like Oct 7 18:07:08 necronomicon last message repeated 743 times I strongly suspect that this is contributing to the miserable throughput. And the following load data: 20:40:04 up 9 days, 22:41, 1 user, load average: 4.69, 5.36, 5.36 which is pretty miserable for a dual P3G that's doing nothing other than running rsync and this emacs session (and the emacs session is even in a console window, rather than on X!). Anyone have any suggestions about how to make it stop with these damn warnings and checks? Thanks! _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From david.blevins at visi.com Thu Oct 7 21:52:38 2004 From: david.blevins at visi.com (David Blevins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] aacraid driver and Fedora Core 2 Message-ID: <20041008025238.GA3060@isis.visi.com> I'm trying to upgrade and RH 9 machine to FC 2 and having troubles with my Adaptec 2410SA raid card. Looks like it's there, but I can't mount it. This chunk from dmesg shows that the system recognizes the card ... ---snip--- SCSI subsystem initialized Red Hat/Adaptec aacraid driver (1.1.2-lk2 Aug 16 2004) PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 0000:00:0d.0 PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 0000:00:02.7 PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 0000:00:13.2 spurious 8259A interrupt: IRQ7. AAC0: kernel 4.1.4 build 9955 AAC0: monitor 4.1.4 build 9955 AAC0: bios 4.1.0 build 6101 AAC0: serial b81895fafaf001 scsi0 : aacraid Vendor: ADAPTEC Model: AAR-2410SA RAID5 Rev: V1.0 Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02 SCSI device sda: 937493376 512-byte hdwr sectors (479997 MB) sda: Write Protect is off sda: Mode Sense: 03 00 00 00 SCSI device sda: drive cache: write through sda: sda1 sda2 sda3 Attached scsi removable disk sda at scsi0, channel 0, id 0, lun 0 Attached scsi generic sg0 at scsi0, channel 0, id 0, lun 0, type 0 kudzu: Using deprecated /dev/sg mechanism instead of SG_IO on the actual device inserting floppy driver for 2.6.8-1.521 Floppy drive(s): fd0 is 1.44M ---snip--- With the RH 9 machine, I was able to mount the raid with an entry like this in fstab. /dev/sda2 /raid ext3 defaults 1 1 Now when I try and mount /dev/sda2, I just get 'sda2 is not a valid block device' Since the controller shows up in dmesg, I get the feeling I'm just being brain-dead and don't know how to read the imput well enough to know what device to mount. Can anyone point me towards a clue? -David _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From poptix at poptix.net Thu Oct 7 23:59:53 2004 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16741.61523.601285.277403@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <16730.55730.792659.363616@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <200409291151.05131.lists@gahlon.com> <16741.61523.601285.277403@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <20041008045953.GL2829@momentum.poptix.net> On Thu, Oct 07, 2004 at 08:41:39PM -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > Oct 7 17:48:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: mounting > unchecked fs, running e2fsck is reco > mmended > Anyone have any suggestions about how to make it stop with these damn > warnings and checks? Do as it says, and run e2fsck on the partition? Seems like a good idea to me. -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jpschewe at mtu.net Fri Oct 8 06:42:44 2004 From: jpschewe at mtu.net (Jon Schewe) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1097235764.14122.13.camel@workstation.mn.mtu.net> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Fri Oct 8 11:03:35 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410081603.i98G3Za06825@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: IBM Thinkpad 385 IBM Thinkpad 385 (type:2635-3EU) P150MMX 80M 2G 12.1" TFT built-in floppy & cdrom includes: AC adapter, 2 Li-Ion batteries (hold some charge but no guarantees), 2 pcmcia cards (DFE650 100Mbps nic, 3CXM356 56k winmodem), owners manual, original media, has win95 factory image on it; easy upgrade to wireless via purchase of pcmcia card. Runs Win95/98/NT/2k, Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris7, OS/2; excellent condition. $300 cash/obo Seller Email address: scotjenkins at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mrj-tc-lin-ug at omega.org Fri Oct 8 12:38:50 2004 From: mrj-tc-lin-ug at omega.org (Matthew Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Belkin54g Message-ID: <1097257130.3315.206071897@webmail.messagingengine.com> Hello: Does anyone have any expeirence with the belkin54g wireless router? I'm tryting to set two of them up in a wireless bridge, but I haven't gotten it working. I have the thing in 'bridge mode' and 'access point mode' and 'NAT turned off.' I've set the IPs and netmasks to my network. It works fine daisy-chained with cat5, but no bridge over wireless. Kind Regards, -Matthew Johnson _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From hpenner at gmail.com Fri Oct 8 14:00:04 2004 From: hpenner at gmail.com (Harry Penner) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:14 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Belkin54g In-Reply-To: <1097257130.3315.206071897@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <1097257130.3315.206071897@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: <822221bb0410081200206bf5cc@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 08 Oct 2004 12:38:50 -0500, Matthew Johnson wrote: > Hello: > Does anyone have any expeirence with the belkin54g wireless router? I'm > tryting to set two of them up in a wireless bridge, but I haven't > gotten it working. I have the thing in 'bridge mode' and 'access point > mode' and 'NAT turned off.' I've set the IPs and netmasks to my > network. It works fine daisy-chained with cat5, but no bridge over > wireless. No experience specifically with Belkin's 54G, but you may want to try: 1. Make sure they're set to the same wireless channel (some WAPs will switch to an unused channel if there's an "auto" channel setting); 2. Try putting just one in AP mode (and have the other connect to it as a client if possible). Or you may just be screwed; some other WAPs have explicit point-to-point wireless bridge modes... Good luck! -Harry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Fri Oct 8 14:06:03 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: (now OT) Re: [Fwd: Re: [TCLUG] OT: CRT disposal] In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04100713574f1fb669@mail.gmail.com> References: <416586BA.1050802@b-o-b.homelinux.com> <20041007133754.C1623@thinkunix.net> <200410071426.16045.barnabas@knicknack.net> <65293fcc04100713574f1fb669@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4166E51B.8090409@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Fri Oct 8 16:45:11 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <20041008045953.GL2829@momentum.poptix.net> References: <16730.55730.792659.363616@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <200409291151.05131.lists@gahlon.com> <16741.61523.601285.277403@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041008045953.GL2829@momentum.poptix.net> Message-ID: <16743.2663.876808.468398@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Matthew" == Matthew S Hallacy writes: Matthew> On Thu, Oct 07, 2004 at 08:41:39PM -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: >> Oct 7 17:48:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: mounting >> unchecked fs, running e2fsck is reco >> mmended >> Anyone have any suggestions about how to make it stop with these damn >> warnings and checks? Matthew> Do as it says, and run e2fsck on the partition? Seems Matthew> like a good idea to me. Yup. Did that. Seems a lot happier now! In a way, my bad. In another, not so much. Stuffing these messages for a critical failure into an obscure place in /var/log doesn't seem like an obvious Good Thing. Yeah, yeah, I know. We're supposed to check the logs everyday. Right. I'm supposed to check my oil, transmission fluid, and tire pressure at the gas station, too.... A warning light would be nice... R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com Fri Oct 8 17:28:14 2004 From: jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16743.2663.876808.468398@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <16730.55730.792659.363616@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <200409291151.05131.lists@gahlon.com> <16741.61523.601285.277403@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041008045953.GL2829@momentum.poptix.net> <16743.2663.876808.468398@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: On Fri, 8 Oct 2004 16:45:11 -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > A warning light would be nice... Your warning light was the fact that your drive was miserably slow. :) -- jeremy _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Fri Oct 8 19:37:02 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> Message-ID: <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Argh. Well, as reported, I found out that the problem with my USB drive was that the kernel wanted to run e2fsck on it, because it had been mounted so many times w/o being checked. OK. So I *did* run e2fsck on it. It was fine. Then I started rsyncing to it again. Same dang message. Oct 8 17:36:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: maximal mount count reached, running e2fsck \ is recommended I ran e2fsck betweeen 6 and 7 o'clock, but: Oct 8 18:11:42 necronomicon last message repeated 588 times Oct 8 19:12:22 necronomicon last message repeated 251 times Oct 8 19:13:23 necronomicon last message repeated 2069 times Oct 8 19:14:24 necronomicon last message repeated 1925 times Seems like whatever mount count the kernel is using, it doesn't get cleared by e2fsck. I tried manually changing it to zero using tune2fs, and that seemed to reset it to zero, but the mount count immediately started zooming upward again. So what gives? Is there something about the USB protocol so that this dang thing is getting remounted a zillion times? Sadly, I smashed the mount counting (setting the maximal mount count to 0), using tune2fs. Now the annoying zillions of messages in /var/log/kernel/warnings are gone. But it's still pig slow. This seems not to be 100%, either. I rsynced to it last night, and it was fine. Tonight: slow. Thanks for any advice, R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Oct 8 20:34:33 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] MYSQL syncronization? In-Reply-To: <42325.198.74.20.73.1097078574.squirrel@198.74.20.73> References: <32fd453704100523437b61d12f@mail.gmail.com> <853e1ecc0410060815451d81c3@mail.gmail.com> <42325.198.74.20.73.1097078574.squirrel@198.74.20.73> Message-ID: How advanced are you thinking? In the simplist form, all you need to do is a mysqldump --add-drop-table myDatabase.sql > myDatabase.sql from your laptop, upload the .sql file, and mysql < myDatabase.sql...this assumes that the database on your website is limited to view only of course. ;) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com Fri Oct 8 21:32:31 2004 From: jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: Couple of things -- do have a way of verifying that the drive is working properly, ie, another machine? Also, did you mention what kernel version you were running? -- jeremy On Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:37:02 -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > Argh. Well, as reported, I found out that the problem with my USB > drive was that the kernel wanted to run e2fsck on it, because it had > been mounted so many times w/o being checked. > > OK. So I *did* run e2fsck on it. It was fine. Then I started > rsyncing to it again. > > Same dang message. > > Oct 8 17:36:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: maximal mount count reached, running e2fsck \ > is recommended > > I ran e2fsck betweeen 6 and 7 o'clock, but: > > Oct 8 18:11:42 necronomicon last message repeated 588 times > Oct 8 19:12:22 necronomicon last message repeated 251 times > Oct 8 19:13:23 necronomicon last message repeated 2069 times > Oct 8 19:14:24 necronomicon last message repeated 1925 times > > Seems like whatever mount count the kernel is using, it doesn't get > cleared by e2fsck. > > I tried manually changing it to zero using tune2fs, and that seemed to > reset it to zero, but the mount count immediately started zooming > upward again. So what gives? Is there something about the USB > protocol so that this dang thing is getting remounted a zillion times? > > Sadly, I smashed the mount counting (setting the maximal mount count > to 0), using tune2fs. Now the annoying zillions of messages in > /var/log/kernel/warnings are gone. But it's still pig slow. > > This seems not to be 100%, either. I rsynced to it last night, and > it was fine. Tonight: slow. > > Thanks for any advice, > > > R > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From poptix at poptix.net Fri Oct 8 22:40:14 2004 From: poptix at poptix.net (Matthew S. Hallacy) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> Are you unmounting the drive before disconnecting it? On Fri, Oct 08, 2004 at 07:37:02PM -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > Argh. Well, as reported, I found out that the problem with my USB > drive was that the kernel wanted to run e2fsck on it, because it had > been mounted so many times w/o being checked. > > OK. So I *did* run e2fsck on it. It was fine. Then I started > rsyncing to it again. > > Same dang message. > > Oct 8 17:36:14 necronomicon kernel: EXT2-fs warning: maximal mount count reached, running e2fsck \ > is recommended -- Matthew S. Hallacy FUBAR, LART, BOFH Certified http://www.poptix.net GPG public key 0x01938203 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Sat Oct 9 09:49:59 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <16743.64151.266435.922974@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Jeremy" == Jeremy Rosengren writes: Jeremy> Couple of things -- do have a way of verifying that the drive is Jeremy> working properly, ie, another machine? Also, did you mention what Jeremy> kernel version you were running? I used to have it in a removable hard drive drawer, where it worked fine. I'm inclined to think it would be a good idea to just reformat the dang thing and see if that helps (maybe just pulling it out of the hard drive drawer and putting it into the usb enclosure wasn't a great idea). But I was wondering if there was something about the USB interface that caused it to do this weird repeated incrementing of the mount count. Seemed like if it was repeatedly automounting the drive while doing rsync, that could easily account for a lot of slowdown! couldn't find anything about it on google (but then almost all i found with that error message and USB was various and sundry dmesg-like dumps). kernel 2.6.3-15mdk-p3-smp-64GB Thanks! R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Sat Oct 9 09:51:30 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Belkin54g In-Reply-To: <822221bb0410081200206bf5cc@mail.gmail.com> References: <1097257130.3315.206071897@webmail.messagingengine.com> <822221bb0410081200206bf5cc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16743.64242.88066.408970@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Harry" == Harry Penner writes: Harry> On Fri, 08 Oct 2004 12:38:50 -0500, Matthew Johnson Harry> wrote: >> Hello: >> Does anyone have any expeirence with the belkin54g wireless router? I'm >> tryting to set two of them up in a wireless bridge, but I haven't >> gotten it working. I have the thing in 'bridge mode' and 'access point >> mode' and 'NAT turned off.' I've set the IPs and netmasks to my >> network. It works fine daisy-chained with cat5, but no bridge over >> wireless. Harry> No experience specifically with Belkin's 54G, but you may want to try: Harry> 1. Make sure they're set to the same wireless channel (some WAPs will Harry> switch to an unused channel if there's an "auto" channel setting); Harry> 2. Try putting just one in AP mode (and have the other connect to it Harry> as a client if possible). Harry> Or you may just be screwed; some other WAPs have explicit Harry> point-to-point wireless bridge modes... I thought they had some specific instructions for doing this, and that they used some "belkin-only" protocol, so that you couldn't connect other brands. As an aside, I found that the Belkin I was lured into buying by a mondo rebate seems to have very, very bad signal strength. I've been wishing I had paid 20 more bucks and bought another linksys. :-( R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From clarson at iaxs.net Sat Oct 9 14:24:24 2004 From: clarson at iaxs.net (Chester Larson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora 1 Message-ID: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bradyh at bitstream.net Sat Oct 9 15:00:09 2004 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:15 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora 1 In-Reply-To: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> References: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> Message-ID: <1097352009.2640.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> Once X (windows) is disabled you can login then go to /etc/X11 and do a mv xorg.conf xorg_back.conf After that restarting should get you to the Xconfig and you can resetup X-windows. Brady PS: You do know that Fedora Core 2 is out and Fedora Core 3 is going to be released soon, right? > Hi All, > Am having trouble getting to my GUI . I up2dated to > 2.4.22-1.2115.ntpl on an i686 Microtel machine > Keep getting this message INIT: Id "x" respawning too fast: > disabled for 5 minutes > I have tryed starting with startx but no go. Can get to the > cli, but that is all. Please > point me in the right direction > TIA Chester > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Sat Oct 9 15:02:22 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora 1 In-Reply-To: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> References: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> Message-ID: <200410091502.22188.barnabas@knicknack.net> On Saturday 09 October 2004 14:24, Chester Larson wrote: > Hi All, > Am having trouble getting to my GUI . I up2dated to 2.4.22-1.2115.ntpl > on an i686 Microtel machine Keep getting this message INIT: Id "x" > respawning too fast: disabled for 5 minutes I have tryed starting with > startx but no go. Can get to the cli, but that is all. Please point me in > the right direction > TIA Chester Chester, What kind of video card are you using? Did you have to compile the drivers for it in the past? If so, you'll need to compile them again for this kernel. Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Sat Oct 9 18:35:43 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Voodoo 3500 (AGP) w/ TV-Out Message-ID: <416875CF.6050001@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Hello all. I was curious is anyone had any experience with the 3DFX - Voodoo 3500 with TV-Out. I have been using this video card with no problems, but have yet to figure out how to get the TV-Out option to work. I did some google searching, but didn't really find anything to helpful. If any one has, or has used this video card I'd really appreaciate any tips or if you could point me to some docs for trying to get the TV out feature working. Many Thanks, Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 9 19:00:39 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Voodoo 3500 (AGP) w/ TV-Out In-Reply-To: <416875CF.6050001@b-o-b.homelinux.com> References: <416875CF.6050001@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Message-ID: http://v3tv.sourceforge.net/index.php On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 18:35:43 -0500, Robert D. De Mars wrote: > Hello all. I was curious is anyone had any experience with > the 3DFX - Voodoo 3500 with TV-Out. I have been using this > video card with no problems, but have yet to figure out how > to get the TV-Out option to work. I did some google > searching, but didn't really find anything to helpful. > > If any one has, or has used this video card I'd really > appreaciate any tips or if you could point me to some docs > for trying to get the TV out feature working. > > Many Thanks, > > Robert De Mars > -- > Lat. 45:09n > Long. 93:18w > http://b-o-b.homelinux.com > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From electrum at gmail.com Sun Oct 10 10:19:03 2004 From: electrum at gmail.com (David Phillips) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora 1 In-Reply-To: <1097352009.2640.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> <1097352009.2640.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <853e1ecc04101008193d887ee@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 15:00:09 -0500, Brady Hegberg wrote: > X-windows. It is called the X Window System, not "X windows". -- David Phillips http://david.acz.org/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Daniel.Mark at bankofamerica.com Fri Oct 8 11:55:30 2004 From: Daniel.Mark at bankofamerica.com (Mark, Daniel) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] About JSPager Message-ID: Mr. Jay Austad, Saw you 2001 reply concerning virtual desktop. I have been using JSPager for years. Recently, I have a need to go back to the site to get new download for my new laptop but cannot get to the site. Would you have any information concerning this by any chance? Sorry to have bothered you. Cordially, Daniel Mark. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Sun Oct 10 14:18:34 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> Message-ID: <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Matthew" == Matthew S Hallacy writes: Matthew> Are you unmounting the drive before disconnecting it? Yup. It seems to somehow be unmounting and remounting itself, at least judging from what tune2fs reports. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com Sun Oct 10 14:37:27 2004 From: jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 14:18:34 -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > >>>>> "Matthew" == Matthew S Hallacy writes: > > Matthew> Are you unmounting the drive before disconnecting it? > > Yup. > > It seems to somehow be unmounting and remounting itself, at least > judging from what tune2fs reports. I still think you need to verify that the drive itself hasn't gone bad. Try running the hard drive manufacturer's diagnostic tools on the drive to see if any errors are generated. You probably need to start troubleshooting in order, otherwise you'll not have any idea what you're really testing at any given moment. Start with the drive and work backwards, verifying the drive itself, the external USB drive case, the USB cable, the USB port on your machine, and finally the OS. -- jeremy _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bradyh at bitstream.net Sun Oct 10 15:13:45 2004 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora 1 In-Reply-To: <853e1ecc04101008193d887ee@mail.gmail.com> References: <001001c4ae35$b8a77b20$548386d1@LapTopComputer> <1097352009.2640.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> <853e1ecc04101008193d887ee@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1097439225.3105.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> I prefer to call it the X Window Useless Piece of Crap myself. But it's finally getting better now that it's become x.org Brady > On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 15:00:09 -0500, Brady Hegberg wrote: > > X-windows. > > It is called the X Window System, not "X windows". > -- Brady Hegberg _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From danbsmith at comcast.net Sun Oct 10 16:53:47 2004 From: danbsmith at comcast.net (Dan Smith) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac Message-ID: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> Does anybody know how to upgrade Imac memory? Also does anyone know how much a first gen Imac can handle? Thanks, Dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cgriff at urgrue.org Sun Oct 10 17:44:52 2004 From: cgriff at urgrue.org (cgriff@urgrue.org) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> Message-ID: <0013BD5F-1B0E-11D9-874C-00039301F324@urgrue.org> On Oct 10, 2004, at 4:53 PM, Dan Smith wrote: > Does anybody know how to upgrade Imac memory? On a first-generation (1998) iMac, it's not fun. Later models had much easier access to the RAM slots. If you still have the original manuals that came with the iMac, one of them has section on how to install memory. If not, there seems to be an online copy here [scroll down to "iMac Install Instructions (original)"]: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=50015 MemoryX has their own instructions, along with video clips: http://www.memoryx.net/memin.html > Also does anyone know how much a first gen Imac can handle? 128MB, according to Apple's specs: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=43102 Chris Griffith _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Sun Oct 10 19:12:13 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> First gen's can handle at least 256 ('cause I've done it). There's a small pannel on the bottom that comes off turning the "lock" with a quarter (or coin or whatever). This area will have your original DIMM plus an extra slot. > Does anybody know how to upgrade Imac memory? Also does anyone know how > much a first gen Imac can handle? > > Thanks, > Dan > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sun Oct 10 20:39:36 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: The only time I have ever been injured working on a computer was adding RAM to a first generation iMac. Put a nice sized gash in my hand on some sharp piece of metal while trying to wriggle the CRT out of there (or something like that). On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 19:12:13 -0500 (CDT), Garrett Krueger wrote: > First gen's can handle at least 256 ('cause I've done it). There's a > small pannel on the bottom that comes off turning the "lock" with a > quarter (or coin or whatever). This area will have your original DIMM > plus an extra slot. > > > > > Does anybody know how to upgrade Imac memory? Also does anyone know how > > much a first gen Imac can handle? > > > > Thanks, > > Dan > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From danbsmith at comcast.net Sun Oct 10 22:33:16 2004 From: danbsmith at comcast.net (Dan Smith) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: <4169FEFC.1040208@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20041010/2f39d86b/attachment.html -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From danbsmith at comcast.net Sun Oct 10 22:33:34 2004 From: danbsmith at comcast.net (Dan Smith) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:16 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: <0013BD5F-1B0E-11D9-874C-00039301F324@urgrue.org> References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> <0013BD5F-1B0E-11D9-874C-00039301F324@urgrue.org> Message-ID: <4169FF0E.60709@comcast.net> cgriff@urgrue.org wrote: > > On Oct 10, 2004, at 4:53 PM, Dan Smith wrote: > >> Does anybody know how to upgrade Imac memory? > > > On a first-generation (1998) iMac, it's not fun. Later models had much > easier access to the RAM slots. > > If you still have the original manuals that came with the iMac, one of > them has section on how to install memory. If not, there seems to be > an online copy here [scroll down to "iMac Install Instructions > (original)"]: > http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=50015 > > MemoryX has their own instructions, along with video clips: > http://www.memoryx.net/memin.html > > >> Also does anyone know how much a first gen Imac can handle? > > > 128MB, according to Apple's specs: > http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=43102 > > Chris Griffith > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > ok, thanks for your help _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From danbsmith at comcast.net Sun Oct 10 22:33:24 2004 From: danbsmith at comcast.net (Dan Smith) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Imac In-Reply-To: <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> References: <4169AF6B.1050004@comcast.net> <4149.192.168.100.2.1097453533.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: <4169FF04.6030203@comcast.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20041010/a8ecd601/attachment.htm -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From auditodd at comcast.net Sun Oct 10 22:39:38 2004 From: auditodd at comcast.net (Todd Young) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] About JSPager In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <416A007A.5080600@comcast.net> I have version 2.5 of JSPager saved on my hard drive. I just checked the URL in the "readme.txt" file and the site appears to be down or gone. If anyone is interested in v2.5, email me and I can zip it and send it to you. NOTE: * Platforms: Win95/98/NT4/2000 * FREEWARE I have not used this with WinXP, so do not know if it is compatible. Mark, Daniel wrote: > Mr. Jay Austad, > > Saw you 2001 reply concerning virtual desktop. I have been using JSPager for years. Recently, I have a need to go back to the site to get new download for my new laptop but cannot get to the site. Would you have any information concerning this by any chance? > > Sorry to have bothered you. > -- Todd Young 7079 Dawn Ave. E. Inver Grove Heights, MN 55076 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Mon Oct 11 09:29:46 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fwd: Speak at TCLUG Meeting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <914f813c04101107297cf82518@mail.gmail.com> Folks, Here's a more in-depth overview from Paul Anderson [Wind River], the speaker I lined up for Nov. 6. Could anyone provide a decent estimate of how many people Paul can expect? John ------ >From Marketing: About Wind River Wind River is the market leader in device software optimization. Wind River enables companies to develop and run software faster, better, at a lower cost and more reliably. Wind River Platforms tightly integrate a rich set of market-leading operating systems, development tools and middleware with services to provide a complete foundation that meets the specific requirements of a vertical market. Wind River's products and professional services are used in multiple markets including aerospace and defense, automotive, digital consumer, industrial, and network infrastructure. Companies from around the world turn to Wind River to create the most reliable products and to accelerate their time to market. Founded in 1981, Wind River is headquartered in Alameda, California, with operations worldwide. To learn more, visit Wind River at http://www.windriver.com or call Wind River at 1-800-872-4977. A bit more technical description from me: Since 1981, Wind River Systems has been providing: - Embedded runtime software components: - VxWorks real time operating system - Embedded Linux products - Networking stacks and middleware - Compiliers, and software assist technology: - Standalone compiler technology (Diab and GNU compilers) - Integrated development environments (Tornado and Workbench) - Hardware assist technology: - In-circuit emulators (ICE and JTAG) - Reference boards - Complete market-specific development platform products for the following markets: - Networking and Telco Infrastructure - Consumer - Industrial - Automotive - Safety Critical applications - General Purpose Device Applications We are the largest single commercial provider of device development and runtime software in the market. We run on everything from the Apple Airport to the Mars Rover, and everything in between. We run on all major architectures (IA, PPC, MIPS, ARM/XSCALE), and have development tools running on most available operating systems. A description of my talk: Open Source, and the Future of Device Software ---------------------------------------------- Market forces, and disruptive technological change are creating a revolution in how we think about devices, and the software in them. Just as Personal Computers replaced the majority of Mainframes and Workstations, a similar trend is underway how embedded device design, development, and deployment occurs. We will explore the important elements of change, focusing specifically on how the Open Source movement is leading change, and an overview of how Wind River is responding to these changes. Come and learn about the opportunities ahead! -------------- I can also bring along a technical overview of the company's products, and/or talk specificially about the company's plans for Embedded Linux, if you think that would be a better topic for the meeting. And... I can get into serious "Geek Banter" too with the gang if they would like that. Just give me a white board and we'll be off to the races! ;-) Let me know what you think. Thanks, -pja Ps. How many people do you expect to attend? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Mon Oct 11 10:06:07 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fwd: Speak at TCLUG Meeting? In-Reply-To: <914f813c04101107297cf82518@mail.gmail.com>; from john.t.hoffoss@gmail.com on Mon, Oct 11, 2004 at 09:29:46AM -0500 References: <914f813c04101107297cf82518@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041011100607.A12297@thinkunix.net> John T. Hoffoss wrote: > Here's a more in-depth overview from Paul Anderson [Wind River], the > speaker I lined up for Nov. 6. Could anyone provide a decent estimate > of how many people Paul can expect? how about a poll on the tclug website (poll maintainer: wink wink, nudge) -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Mon Oct 11 14:39:17 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Spanish speaking ISP? Message-ID: <200410111439.17640.barnabas@knicknack.net> Anyone out there familiar with a dial-up ISP (especially a Linux friendly one) that has its website and customer support available in Spanish? I know AOL does, but that would not be my first choice. ;-) Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 07:39:39 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet Message-ID: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> I have a box set up with Ethereal. I need to monitor traffic on a network segement to find a chatty box (or several for all I know). As luck would have it, the entire segment is a series of switches, so Ethereal doesn't tell me much when I plug it in. I heard a rumor that I need to turn on something called "port replication" that steals all the traffic on a given segment and pumps it all to one port so Ethereal gives me some real stats. Anyone have a HOWTO or some basic tips for doing such a thing? Thanks! -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tommyj27 at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 07:54:50 2004 From: tommyj27 at gmail.com (Thomas Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1469cda204101205547b917e46@mail.gmail.com> if you're using cisco switches it's pretty simple to set up, although i don't have one in front of me so i can't give you steps. you just need to console into the switch and from there on it's pretty menu-driven. AFAIK unmanaged switches (read: cheap switches) don't support any kind of port replication although i have heard that you can overload the arp cache on some and get them to default into hub mode. On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 07:39:39 -0500, Brian Wall wrote: > I have a box set up with Ethereal. I need to monitor traffic on a > network segement to find a chatty box (or several for all I know). As > luck would have it, the entire segment is a series of switches, so > Ethereal doesn't tell me much when I plug it in. I heard a rumor that > I need to turn on something called "port replication" that steals all > the traffic on a given segment and pumps it all to one port so > Ethereal gives me some real stats. Anyone have a HOWTO or some basic > tips for doing such a thing? > > Thanks! > > -Brian > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 12 07:58:10 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, Brian Wall wrote: > I have a box set up with Ethereal. I need to monitor traffic on a > network segement to find a chatty box (or several for all I know). As > luck would have it, the entire segment is a series of switches, so > Ethereal doesn't tell me much when I plug it in. I heard a rumor that > I need to turn on something called "port replication" that steals all > the traffic on a given segment and pumps it all to one port so > Ethereal gives me some real stats. Anyone have a HOWTO or some basic > tips for doing such a thing? > Not all switches support this - typically only higher-end, managed switches (like Procurve and crisco). In the cisco world the command is "port-monitor ". I'm more than happy to help privately, if you have a cisco. This can get slightly more complicated if you have VLANs or trunked ports. If you just need to narrow down which machine is "chatty" - you might have more luck getting SNMP stats from the switches and graphing all of the ports with MRTG. If there's a router involved, and you suspect the "bad" traffic isn't all local, you can possibly get some info from the router. If the router is cisco, look into "ip accounting" and flow switching. Once you narrow it down to a particular machine, you can setup an appropriate access-list, and get some packet dumps. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sulrich at botwerks.org Tue Oct 12 08:10:01 2004 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041012131001.GA4080@botwerks.org> when last we saw our hero (Tuesday, Oct 12, 2004), Brian Wall was madly tapping out: > I have a box set up with Ethereal. I need to monitor traffic on a > network segement to find a chatty box (or several for all I know). > As luck would have it, the entire segment is a series of switches, > so Ethereal doesn't tell me much when I plug it in. I heard a rumor > that I need to turn on something called "port replication" that > steals all the traffic on a given segment and pumps it all to one > port so Ethereal gives me some real stats. Anyone have a HOWTO or > some basic tips for doing such a thing? > if you have managed switches you simply need to configure the port to mirror the traffic to the port that your sniffer is attached to. if you're running a cisco switch you use the 'port monitor ' command on the sniffer interface. e.g.: on a 6500 running native mode ! int g6/1 port monitor fa1/21 port monitor fa1/22 port monitor fa1/23 port monitor fa1/24 port monitor VLAN100 ! the syntax is different if you're running catos. you use the 'set span ' command. -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 09:29:22 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 07:39:39 -0500, Brian Wall wrote: > I have a box set up with Ethereal. I need to monitor traffic on a > network segement to find a chatty box (or several for all I know). As > luck would have it, the entire segment is a series of switches, so > Ethereal doesn't tell me much when I plug it in. I heard a rumor that > I need to turn on something called "port replication" that steals all > the traffic on a given segment and pumps it all to one port so > Ethereal gives me some real stats. Anyone have a HOWTO or some basic > tips for doing such a thing? If you find that you're not able to do port replication, another possibility is to use a program called ettercap. It uses arp poisoning to allow you to sniff traffic over switched networks. I've used it in the past for this purpose, and it works really well. You should find a place to test it first, though, as the arp poisoning can do some funky things to some networks. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 10:17:14 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2c6699da0410120817568f1020@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for all the help so far. I'll have to read up on my switch documentation. Most of the switches I have are managed 3Crap switches, which I belive have this capability. My current thought is to insert a hub between major switch links and start reading traffic. Our LAN is broken up between floors and routers, so inserting a hub in various places should give me the desired results. Thanks for all the help, you guys rock. -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From benj at thejordanproject.com Tue Oct 12 11:59:17 2004 From: benj at thejordanproject.com (Ben Jordan) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Enabled Rules Not generating Alerts Message-ID: <20041012165917.4606D207434@mail.intrcomm.net> I have installed and configured snort 2.1.0. I have successfully configured it to work with Postgres. I am collecting data, and can see that data in Postgres. I am getting plenty of http_inspect alerts generated, and they are succesfully showing up in the ACID reports. I have created scripts to download updated rule sets, unpack them, test them, and impliment them. Working great... However, I am not generating any alerts from any rule sets, only preprocessor alerts, such as the http_inspect as stated above. I have the default rules enabled, as it comes default in snort.conf in 2.1.0. I have read README.alert_order, and have read several posts on how to check your snort conf. I have included my snort.conf below. I have run Nessus, using all tests, on all ports, against the snort IP, and an IP on the internal net from an IP outside the network. Can anyone see why I am not getting any alerts generated? I am at a loss. I can include my snort.conf at request, but due to it's length have excluded it. Ben Jordan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cgriff at urgrue.org Tue Oct 12 15:06:51 2004 From: cgriff at urgrue.org (cgriff@urgrue.org) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:17 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sniffing switched ethernet In-Reply-To: References: <2c6699da041012053953bfcd85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4190B260-1C8A-11D9-A8A3-00039301F324@urgrue.org> For tracking down misbehaving/chatty devices on a network, I've found Neo (www.ktools.org) to be very useful. It can extract info and statistics from managed network devices, as well as disable ports or change settings on certain models. Some useful Neo commands: Show traffic rates on all ports: neo stats @[ switch-ip-address ] Show all MAC addresses on a particular port: neo port search [ portnumber ]@[ switch-ip-address ] Disable a port*: neo port disable [ portnumber ]@[ switch-ip-address ] * Only works after you have set the 'writecom' variable to match your switch's SNMP write community. Chris Griffith _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 15:32:31 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ssh cronjobs unattended Message-ID: <67f3084a0410121332551c4c26@mail.gmail.com> I need to do some ssh jobs from a group of servers that copy a couple of files to another server. I know how to setup for a basic unattended ssh job: $ssh-keygen -t dsa (if wanting no passwd hit enter key) $sftp username@server.domain sftp> mkdir .ssh sftp> cd .ssh sftp> put .ssh/id_dsa.pub authorized_keys2 sftp> exit (at this point can ssh/scp without password prompt. if typed in a password need to continue:) $eval `ssh-agent` $ssh-add (will prompt for password at this time) $ssh servername What I need to do is set it up so that when the id ssh's into the box it copies data to, it copies it to a specific directory and cannot do anything else. However, I still need to keep this id capable of logging in locally to the system and have shell access. I'm not sure of the right way to do this. I found some documentation, but it doesn't work properly. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I am running out of time to get this setup. Thanks! -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Oct 12 15:43:45 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410122043.i9CKhjD03467@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: MiniPC This is a mATX machine I built to use as an MP3/OGG player. But since all the other machines already DO that... Features: o Soyo mATX motherboard with integrated sound, video and LAN o 256MB of PC2100 RAM o 1.6GHz Duron o 40GB harddrive o CDRW (I forget the speed, but I'd say 'decent') o Round IDE cable! The sound and LAN work under Linux. The video card should work, but I've not done much testing. Other than two 80" fans I put in, everything is brand new. The case is pretty tiny, and the "SilverStone" logo lights up and changes colours (this CAN be disabled). I did nick the case a bit - you can kind of see it in the picture - but it is structurally sound. I'm asking $350 or b/o. Seller Email address: tclcl at freakzilla dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Tue Oct 12 15:44:57 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410122044.i9CKivb03788@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: HP DDS 4 backup drive HP 20/40GB SCSI DDS 4 DAT TAPE BACKUP DRIVE with external enclosure and scsi cable for sale. Used but in great shape. $450 OBO Seller Email address: headwound at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Tue Oct 12 16:19:13 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ssh cronjobs unattended In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410121332551c4c26@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0410121332551c4c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <416C4A51.1060102@joshwelch.com> Shawn Fertch wrote: > I need to do some ssh jobs from a group of servers that copy a couple > of files to another server. > > I know how to setup for a basic unattended ssh job: > > $ssh-keygen -t dsa (if wanting no passwd hit enter key) > $sftp username@server.domain > sftp> mkdir .ssh > sftp> cd .ssh > sftp> put .ssh/id_dsa.pub authorized_keys2 > sftp> exit > (at this point can ssh/scp without password prompt. if typed in a > password need to continue:) > $eval `ssh-agent` > $ssh-add (will prompt for password at this time) > $ssh servername > > > What I need to do is set it up so that when the id ssh's into the box > it copies data to, it copies it to a specific directory and cannot do > anything else. However, I still need to keep this id capable of > logging in locally to the system and have shell access. > > I'm not sure of the right way to do this. I found some documentation, > but it doesn't work properly. Any help on this would be appreciated, > as I am running out of time to get this setup. > > Thanks! > I don't know how you would prevent a user from doing things sometimes and allow it other times, unless you can strictly identify those times and do some sort of time based access control, but that seems unlikely. Is there a reason you can't create an account specifically for the batch jobs and give the appropriate restricted access to that account? We do that at my office, works well. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sraun at fireopal.org Tue Oct 12 16:44:19 2004 From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sharp Zaurus question Message-ID: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> Anyone using the Sharp Zaurus that runs Linux? I'm in search of experiences, recommendations for and against, etc. I'm contemplating trying to pick an older one up somewhere (looks like I can get a 5500 on e-bay for ~$150, maybe less than $100 if I'm willing to wait and can get lucky) just for playing with. I'd like to get one with an 802.11b card already installed if possible. -- Scott Raun sraun@fireopal.org _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rick at eworld3.net Tue Oct 12 18:24:39 2004 From: rick at eworld3.net (Rick Meyerhoff) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ssh cronjobs unattended In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410121332551c4c26@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0410121332551c4c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <416C67B7.5000200@eworld3.net> take a look at rsync Shawn Fertch wrote: > I need to do some ssh jobs from a group of servers that copy a couple > of files to another server. > > I know how to setup for a basic unattended ssh job: > > $ssh-keygen -t dsa (if wanting no passwd hit enter key) > $sftp username@server.domain > sftp> mkdir .ssh > sftp> cd .ssh > sftp> put .ssh/id_dsa.pub authorized_keys2 > sftp> exit > (at this point can ssh/scp without password prompt. if typed in a > password need to continue:) > $eval `ssh-agent` > $ssh-add (will prompt for password at this time) > $ssh servername > > > What I need to do is set it up so that when the id ssh's into the box > it copies data to, it copies it to a specific directory and cannot do > anything else. However, I still need to keep this id capable of > logging in locally to the system and have shell access. > > I'm not sure of the right way to do this. I found some documentation, > but it doesn't work properly. Any help on this would be appreciated, > as I am running out of time to get this setup. > > Thanks! > -- Eric (Rick) Meyerhoff _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at askewview.net Tue Oct 12 19:25:54 2004 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sharp Zaurus question In-Reply-To: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> References: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <416C7612.9080501@askewview.net> I had a 5500 and had good luck with it. I ended up selling it due to the fact that I didnt use it enough. I sold it on ebay and think it may have actually gone to a TCLUG member if memory serves me right. The wireless worked quite well for me. It was nice being able to ssh to machines just from my PDA :) Adam Scott Raun wrote: >Anyone using the Sharp Zaurus that runs Linux? > >I'm in search of experiences, recommendations for and against, etc. >I'm contemplating trying to pick an older one up somewhere (looks like >I can get a 5500 on e-bay for ~$150, maybe less than $100 if I'm >willing to wait and can get lucky) just for playing with. > >I'd like to get one with an 802.11b card already installed if possible. > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us Tue Oct 12 20:06:12 2004 From: mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us (Mike Tuller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network Message-ID: I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP server? Mike Tuller _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ntraxler at usfamily.net Tue Oct 12 21:39:23 2004 From: ntraxler at usfamily.net (Nick Traxler) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <416C955B.6000507@usfamily.net> Turn off DHCP on the server you know about and run dhclient on a machine on the network. Or leave Ethereal running on a machine and set the filters to only sniff DHCP traffic, and ignore everything from the valid server. Or nmap the whole network to see if any are responding on DHCP's port. Or look at the gateway information for a machine that's gotten an IP from the bogus server. This is just off the top of my head, but the first one and last one seem like the easiest solutions. Nick Mike Tuller wrote: > I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, > and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a > simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP > server? > > > Mike Tuller ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com Tue Oct 12 21:50:04 2004 From: jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Using Linux Full Time Message-ID: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> I have had linux running on my laptop for a few months now. I have has Suse 9.1 Professional, Mandrake 10.0 and now Gentoo. It seems that I always get myself into situations where I need to use a windows box to do something. An example is playing movie files that just don't seem to play, or visiting websites with a funny commercial on them. It always seems to be an effort. There are a few other people I know that are running Linux, and everyone had some minor problem playing a file. Am I the only one that has this problem? I really, really want to kiss Windows goodbye as much as I can, but it's hard when I keep having to use it as a crutch. It's also difficult to defent the "I don't use linux, because I don't want to use a hobby os" when I'm doing all this work to get things that just work in windows to function. Any tips or tricks or websites I may be missing. I just want Gentoo and KDE to do everything my heart desires. I really love using Linux and don't want to have to give it up again so I can be really productive again. Jason Reynolds _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Oct 12 21:59:07 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:06:12 -0500, Mike Tuller wrote: > I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, > and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a > simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP > server? I have a little windows utility called "DHCP find". I can't remember exactly where I found it...probably a bit of googling will turn it up. If you can't locate it, let me know and I can send you the file. It does exactly what you're looking for - sends out DHCP requests and tells you where the responses (if any) come from. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jack at jacku.com Tue Oct 12 22:42:53 2004 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sharp Zaurus question In-Reply-To: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> References: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <200410122242.53402.jack@jacku.com> On Tuesday 12 October 2004 04:44 pm, Scott Raun wrote: > Anyone using the Sharp Zaurus that runs Linux? > > I'm in search of experiences, recommendations for and against, etc. > I'm contemplating trying to pick an older one up somewhere (looks like > I can get a 5500 on e-bay for ~$150, maybe less than $100 if I'm > willing to wait and can get lucky) just for playing with. > > I'd like to get one with an 802.11b card already installed if possible. I have one that I keep saying "I've got to do more with this..." I like it when I've needed it, it has served me well. I picked up an Ambicom wireless card and have had no problems with it. -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bradyh at bitstream.net Tue Oct 12 22:25:46 2004 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Using Linux Full Time In-Reply-To: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> References: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> Message-ID: <1097637946.12568.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> Things are getting much closer to Just Working (TM) but they still have a little ways to go. The newest version of Firefox does a pretty good job of automatically installing Flash and I've never found a movie that Mplayer ( http://www.mplayerhq.hu/homepage/design7/info.html ) wouldn't play. Quicktime movies are a bit of a problem but you could install Cross-Over Office http://www.codeweavers.com/site/products/cxoffice/ and that might solve a number of the other problems as well. Brady > I have had linux running on my laptop for a few months now. I have has Suse > 9.1 Professional, Mandrake 10.0 and now Gentoo. It seems that I always get > myself into situations where I need to use a windows box to do something. An > example is playing movie files that just don't seem to play, or visiting > websites with a funny commercial on them. It always seems to be an effort. > There are a few other people I know that are running Linux, and everyone had > some minor problem playing a file. > > Am I the only one that has this problem? I really, really want to kiss Windows > goodbye as much as I can, but it's hard when I keep having to use it as a > crutch. It's also difficult to defent the "I don't use linux, because I don't > want to use a hobby os" when I'm doing all this work to get things that just > work in windows to function. > > Any tips or tricks or websites I may be missing. I just want Gentoo and KDE to > do everything my heart desires. I really love using Linux and don't want to > have to give it up again so I can be really productive again. > > Jason Reynolds > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Tue Oct 12 22:41:54 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <416CA402.2080100@joshwelch.com> Mike Tuller wrote: > I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, > and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a > simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP > server? > > > Mike Tuller > Try using nmap to look for a DHCP server? Try sniffing your network traffic for DHCP traffic from a machine other than the authorized DHCP server? Couple of thoughts off the top of my pointy head. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wilson at visi.com Wed Oct 13 00:00:32 2004 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:18 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] mod_proxy not enabled on Debian's apache 1.3 Message-ID: Hey everyone, I've got a server running apache 1.3.31 from Debian testing. I'm trying to do some rewriting and proxying, but it doesn't seem like mod_proxy is enabled. I've checked example.com/server-info and mod_proxy isn't there. I thought that was a standard package. It looks like I've got it enabled in the httpd.conf. Running "apache-modconf apache enable mod_proxy" has no effect. Anyone have any ideas? -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tsinks at isd.net Wed Oct 13 05:48:22 2004 From: tsinks at isd.net (Tim Sinks) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network References: Message-ID: <002501c4b112$2c7354a0$0300000a@net.tsinks> Be advised, I am not aware of anyone allowing a 'red' DHCP server on their systems. We have always stuck with gray, black, beige, or blue. I had thought we had gotten all those and the pinko servers out of the systems. Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Tuller" To: "TCLUG" Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 8:06 PM Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network > I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, > and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a > simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP > server? > > > Mike Tuller > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ben_b at ppdonline.com Wed Oct 13 08:45:41 2004 From: ben_b at ppdonline.com (Ben Bargabus) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Listserv? Message-ID: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> Hi, Can anyone recommend a good listserv package? I'd like something free or fairly cheap (this is for personal use and I don't want to dump much money on this little diversion). I'm running FreeBSD 4.x, SendMail, and Procmail. Thanks, Ben. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wilson at visi.com Wed Oct 13 08:38:08 2004 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Listserv? In-Reply-To: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> Message-ID: On 10/13/04 8:45 AM, "Ben Bargabus" wrote: > Can anyone recommend a good listserv package? I'd like something free > or fairly cheap (this is for personal use and I don't want to dump much > money on this little diversion). I'm running FreeBSD 4.x, SendMail, and > Procmail. Mailman (http://list.org/) is a good place to start. It powers the TCLUG list and runs on practically every platform. -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From strayf at freeshell.org Wed Oct 13 08:53:38 2004 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Listserv? In-Reply-To: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> References: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> Message-ID: <20041013135338.GA29862@crito> On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 08:45:41AM -0500, Ben Bargabus wrote: > Hi, > Can anyone recommend a good listserv package? Isn't Mailman the canonical free listserv package? (mailman.sourceforge.net) -Steve _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tommyj27 at gmail.com Wed Oct 13 08:53:52 2004 From: tommyj27 at gmail.com (Thomas Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] linux on xbox Message-ID: <1469cda204101306534242a3b1@mail.gmail.com> has anyone on the list played with linux on their xbox at all? i've been intrigued by it so i ordered one and once it gets here i'm going to give it a shot. specifically if anyone has done the "software" modification and/or has an original version of mechassault they might loan me, or is just interested seeing how this all goes down, i'd love to hear about it. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Wed Oct 13 08:51:19 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <914f813c041013065155dca37d@mail.gmail.com> nmap -sT -sU -P0 -p 67-68 -oN dhcp-scan-results On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:06:12 -0500, Mike Tuller wrote: > I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our network, > and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there a > simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a DHCP > server? > > Mike Tuller > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- John T. Hoffoss _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bruce.broecker at toro.com Wed Oct 13 09:07:07 2004 From: bruce.broecker at toro.com (Bruce Broecker) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] linux on xbox Message-ID: >>> Thomas Johnson 10/13/04 08:53AM >>> >has anyone on the list played with linux on their xbox at all? i've >been intrigued by it so i ordered one and once it gets here i'm going >to give it a shot. specifically if anyone has done the "software" >modification and/or has an original version of mechassault they might >loan me, or is just interested seeing how this all goes down, i'd love >to hear about it. Funny you should ask that. A co-worker just asked this morning if I would help him install linux on an xbox. I've never done it, but I'm the closest thing we've got to a linux expert here (which is scary if you know me). _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com Wed Oct 13 09:07:14 2004 From: jreynolds5 at mn.rr.com (Jason Reynolds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] linux on xbox In-Reply-To: <1469cda204101306534242a3b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <1469cda204101306534242a3b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200410130907.15082.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> For the original mechwarrior cd you might try your favorite game rental place. Just ask them to see the disc so you can verify if it's the version you need. On Wednesday 13 October 2004 08:53 am, Thomas Johnson wrote: > has anyone on the list played with linux on their xbox at all? i've > been intrigued by it so i ordered one and once it gets here i'm going > to give it a shot. specifically if anyone has done the "software" > modification and/or has an original version of mechassault they might > loan me, or is just interested seeing how this all goes down, i'd love > to hear about it. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From blj at umn.edu Wed Oct 13 09:43:40 2004 From: blj at umn.edu (Brian Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Using Linux Full Time In-Reply-To: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> References: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> Message-ID: <416D3F1C.5060602@umn.edu> There is always vlc for movie files, it has played everything i have thown at it Jason Reynolds wrote: >I have had linux running on my laptop for a few months now. I have has Suse >9.1 Professional, Mandrake 10.0 and now Gentoo. It seems that I always get >myself into situations where I need to use a windows box to do something. An >example is playing movie files that just don't seem to play, or visiting >websites with a funny commercial on them. It always seems to be an effort. >There are a few other people I know that are running Linux, and everyone had >some minor problem playing a file. > >Am I the only one that has this problem? I really, really want to kiss Windows >goodbye as much as I can, but it's hard when I keep having to use it as a >crutch. It's also difficult to defent the "I don't use linux, because I don't >want to use a hobby os" when I'm doing all this work to get things that just >work in windows to function. > >Any tips or tricks or websites I may be missing. I just want Gentoo and KDE to >do everything my heart desires. I really love using Linux and don't want to >have to give it up again so I can be really productive again. > >Jason Reynolds > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Wed Oct 13 10:29:04 2004 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ssh cronjobs unattended Message-ID: Shawn, I did this a while ago: http://www.jdmz.net/ssh/ Please let me know if it doesn't work as advertised. Troy >>> Shawn Fertch 10/12/04 03:32PM >>> I need to do some ssh jobs from a group of servers that copy a couple of files to another server. I know how to setup for a basic unattended ssh job: $ssh-keygen -t dsa (if wanting no passwd hit enter key) $sftp username@server.domain sftp> mkdir .ssh sftp> cd .ssh sftp> put .ssh/id_dsa.pub authorized_keys2 sftp> exit (at this point can ssh/scp without password prompt. if typed in a password need to continue:) $eval `ssh-agent` $ssh-add (will prompt for password at this time) $ssh servername What I need to do is set it up so that when the id ssh's into the box it copies data to, it copies it to a specific directory and cannot do anything else. However, I still need to keep this id capable of logging in locally to the system and have shell access. I'm not sure of the right way to do this. I found some documentation, but it doesn't work properly. Any help on this would be appreciated, as I am running out of time to get this setup. Thanks! -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sraun at fireopal.org Wed Oct 13 10:47:34 2004 From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Listserv? In-Reply-To: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> References: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> Message-ID: <20041013154733.GA14712@fireopal.org> On Wed, Oct 13, 2004 at 08:45:41AM -0500, Ben Bargabus wrote: > Can anyone recommend a good listserv package? I'd like something free > or fairly cheap (this is for personal use and I don't want to dump much > money on this little diversion). I'm running FreeBSD 4.x, SendMail, and > Procmail. I'm running mailman for several little lists, and am reasonably happy with it. I think I had an upgrade problem somewhere along the line - I get a couple of file-lock errors every day out of it, and all the monthly list info messages go out twice. I should try going through all my cron jobs and see what I can find. -- Scott Raun sraun@fireopal.org _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Wed Oct 13 11:09:58 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Using Linux Full Time In-Reply-To: <416D3F1C.5060602@umn.edu> References: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> <416D3F1C.5060602@umn.edu> Message-ID: <3979.192.168.100.2.1097683798.squirrel@192.168.100.2> The website portion you mention is not a function of Linux. Rather, this is a function of the browser, and you can certainly download/use a variety of different browsers under Linux until you find one with which you're comfortable. The thing to remember here is that many people program web pages to use Microsoft's Java Script support which IE supports more than anyone else (because it's Microsoft). There have always been the browser wars (this site best viewed using...[Netscape, IE]). I've run into precious few web pages that don't work under Mozilla. In fact, where I work uses an Exchange server with Outlook Web Access as a messaging system. I always pull up OWA using Mozilla -- no problems -- buy you'd think there would be :) (Yes, my company went backward a couple of years ago and removed the LINUX mail server only to replace it with an Exchange server. It took them a week "above and beyond" to get everything running alright.) > Jason Reynolds wrote: > >>I have had linux running on my laptop for a few months now. I have has >> Suse >>9.1 Professional, Mandrake 10.0 and now Gentoo. It seems that I always >> get >>myself into situations where I need to use a windows box to do something. >> An >>example is playing movie files that just don't seem to play, or visiting >>websites with a funny commercial on them. It always seems to be an >> effort. >>There are a few other people I know that are running Linux, and everyone >> had >>some minor problem playing a file. >> >>Am I the only one that has this problem? I really, really want to kiss >> Windows >>goodbye as much as I can, but it's hard when I keep having to use it as a >>crutch. It's also difficult to defent the "I don't use linux, because I >> don't >>want to use a hobby os" when I'm doing all this work to get things that >> just >>work in windows to function. >> >>Any tips or tricks or websites I may be missing. I just want Gentoo and >> KDE to >>do everything my heart desires. I really love using Linux and don't want >> to >>have to give it up again so I can be really productive again. >> >>Jason Reynolds >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >>Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From justin.kremer at gmail.com Wed Oct 13 11:22:19 2004 From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] linux on xbox In-Reply-To: <200410130907.15082.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> References: <1469cda204101306534242a3b1@mail.gmail.com> <200410130907.15082.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> Message-ID: <27e6356a041013092224ff576f@mail.gmail.com> I have an xbox running xebian, which i got from a friend already modded, and the price was definitely right. I love the thing, and I use it for a media center. Works great! He gave me the version of bond that is exploitable, but I don't have a memory cartridge or the save game that you need to exploit it. If you'd like to borrow the game, you're more than welcome to, just have to figure out a time/place to meet. Your best friend for the process is probably http://www.xbox-linux.org/ They're pretty concerned about keeping things completely legal, too. And if you want to upgrade to a bigger hdd or something like that, as long as you get a modchip that has cromwell, and not something with modified M$ code on it, it's perfectly legal (but voids your warranty, of course) -- Justin Kremer _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ben_b at ppdonline.com Wed Oct 13 12:34:31 2004 From: ben_b at ppdonline.com (Ben Bargabus) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Listserv? References: <416D3185.3ECF1343@ppdonline.com> <20041013154733.GA14712@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <416D6727.D26A0778@ppdonline.com> Those of you who recommended Mailman, thank you. I've already got it installed and running and have a few list members active. It was a piece of cake to install and configure. If it continues to perform as well as the setup I'm going to be very happy with it. Thanks, Ben. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From matt at omega.org Wed Oct 13 11:23:06 2004 From: matt at omega.org (Matthew Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:19 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: <914f813c041013065155dca37d@mail.gmail.com> References: <914f813c041013065155dca37d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <29FFC0DA-1D34-11D9-B149-000A95D92230@omega.org> My nmap doesn't work without an ip range (and a sudo ;) ). And then I only get the networks. It should answer 192.168.1.1 (linksys) and 192.168.0.1 (belkin) Mark:~$ sudo nmap -sT -sU -P0 -p 67-68 -oN dhcp-scan-results 192.168.0-3.* Starting nmap V. 3.00 ( www.insecure.org/nmap/ ) Interesting ports on (192.168.0.0): Port State Service 67/tcp filtered dhcpserver 67/udp open dhcpserver 68/tcp filtered dhcpclient 68/udp open dhcpclient Interesting ports on (192.168.0.1): Port State Service 67/tcp filtered dhcpserver 67/udp open dhcpserver 68/tcp filtered dhcpclient 68/udp open dhcpclient ... and so on with 2,3,4,5,6,7,8...19,20... Maybe I should let it go on? On Oct 13, 2004, at 8:51 AM, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > nmap -sT -sU -P0 -p 67-68 -oN dhcp-scan-results > > On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:06:12 -0500, Mike Tuller > wrote: >> I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our >> network, >> and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there >> a >> simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a >> DHCP >> server? >> >> Mike Tuller _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us Wed Oct 13 14:44:57 2004 From: mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us (Mike Tuller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:20 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Find a DHCP server on a network In-Reply-To: <29FFC0DA-1D34-11D9-B149-000A95D92230@omega.org> Message-ID: This is the problem I have too. It's because nmap looks at open ports on the systems. I have mostly OS X and Windows systems on the network, and all of the Windows 2000 and XP systems show that port 67 is open. Even though there is no DHCP server running on the system. Therefore, when I scan the network, more than half of the machines scanned return that they have a DHCP server, when most don't. On 10/13/04 11:23 AM, "Matthew Johnson" wrote: > > My nmap doesn't work without an ip range (and a sudo ;) ). > And then I only get the networks. It should answer 192.168.1.1 > (linksys) and 192.168.0.1 (belkin) > > Mark:~$ sudo nmap -sT -sU -P0 -p 67-68 -oN dhcp-scan-results > 192.168.0-3.* > > Starting nmap V. 3.00 ( www.insecure.org/nmap/ ) > Interesting ports on (192.168.0.0): > Port State Service > 67/tcp filtered dhcpserver > 67/udp open dhcpserver > 68/tcp filtered dhcpclient > 68/udp open dhcpclient > > Interesting ports on (192.168.0.1): > Port State Service > 67/tcp filtered dhcpserver > 67/udp open dhcpserver > 68/tcp filtered dhcpclient > 68/udp open dhcpclient > > ... and so on with 2,3,4,5,6,7,8...19,20... > > Maybe I should let it go on? > > > > On Oct 13, 2004, at 8:51 AM, John T. Hoffoss wrote: >> nmap -sT -sU -P0 -p 67-68 -oN dhcp-scan-results >> >> On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:06:12 -0500, Mike Tuller >> wrote: >>> I have a problem where there is a rouge DHCP server running on our >>> network, >>> and every once in a while, a system will grab an IP from it. Is there >>> a >>> simple way to search the network to see what servers are running as a >>> DHCP >>> server? >>> >>> Mike Tuller > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dtgm at comcast.net Wed Oct 13 15:10:07 2004 From: dtgm at comcast.net (Adam Shrode) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:20 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Using Linux Full Time In-Reply-To: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> References: <200410122150.04601.jreynolds5@mn.rr.com> Message-ID: <416D8B9F.8070707@comcast.net> Jason Reynolds wrote: >I have had linux running on my laptop for a few months now. I have has Suse >9.1 Professional, Mandrake 10.0 and now Gentoo. It seems that I always get >myself into situations where I need to use a windows box to do something. An >example is playing movie files that just don't seem to play, or visiting >websites with a funny commercial on them. It always seems to be an effort. >There are a few other people I know that are running Linux, and everyone had >some minor problem playing a file. > >Am I the only one that has this problem? I really, really want to kiss Windows >goodbye as much as I can, but it's hard when I keep having to use it as a >crutch. It's also difficult to defent the "I don't use linux, because I don't >want to use a hobby os" when I'm doing all this work to get things that just >work in windows to function. > >Any tips or tricks or websites I may be missing. I just want Gentoo and KDE to >do everything my heart desires. I really love using Linux and don't want to >have to give it up again so I can be really productive again. > >Jason Reynolds > Two years ago I had to install ogle, gxine, xine-ui, and mplayer to get video files to play. Out of those three one of them always worked. That was back with RH 7.3 I think. I'm on gentoo know and have been on it for over a year now. I use xine for watching dvds and for most of my video watching, and use mplayer for wmv which it plays perfect. I really like that it is able to play wmvs and most movs. A year ago I was studying biology and "needed" quicktime for 3d viewing and playing short movies on the net. For this I bought crossover and had as much problems with it working with embedded movie files as I did with gxine automatically recognizing and running the files externally. It has become a bit better, but still has its problems with embedded movs. Like I can't watch a lot of the movie trailers on quicktime.com. Flash was a hassle to install and uninstall when macromedia didn't offer a linux install. When they released their linux version it has pretty much always worked. And installing shockwave with crossover works real well. Otherwise you can get gplflash. With msoffice, I have to convert to .doc before I can print at the college which means I need to refine the formatting or wait about 10 minutes to download a ~60MiB file and install it on the campus computers. Even with all this I still need windows for one application I use. For this I use vmware which works really well with my AMD 1800+ and 512 MiB RAM. I only run vmware when I need it and the app is real small. I don't worry about defenting "I don't use linux, because I don't want to use a hobby os" because I do run a hobby OS. I compile all my own software as do you. I anticipate it not working. The theory of linux is we all give a bit of our time. Otherwise we are just leeching. I do recognize how you are perturbed about obvious things not working, hovever they aren't always as obvious as you think. Try emerge-webrsync emerge -p xine-ui emerge -p gxine emerge -p mplayer emerge -p mozilla-firefox emerge -p openoffice-bin emerge -p gplflash Use http://gentoo-portage.com and click "Browse portage" on the left side there. Other than that, search the forums at http://forums.gentoo.org/ and get involved by subscribing to a gentoo mailing list at http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/lists.xml Fire a quick question when you have a problem and there's usually a quick resolution. Adam Shrode _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tex at nerp.net Mon Oct 11 13:28:07 2004 From: tex at nerp.net (tex@nerp.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:22 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] Beer Meeting this Friday Evening Message-ID: <3103.65.27.99.20.1097519287.squirrel@webmail.nerp.net> Hello Everyone, This month, per suggestion, we will meet at Brit's Pub in Downtown Minneapolis. Please see details at http://beer.tclug.org Have a great week All! Thank you, Deborah Dotson I listen: tex@nerp.net _______________________________________________ Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota http://www.mn-linux.org tclug-announce mailing list tclug-announce@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Wed Oct 13 17:49:33 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410132249.i9DMnXg30589@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: dell precision i have the following for sale: dell precision 210 desktop, dual p3 500, 512mb mem, adaptec 2940u2, 9gb scsi asking $120 or b.o. Seller Email address: lombardo at evilcricket dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mike at fruitioninc.com Thu Oct 14 21:52:11 2004 From: mike at fruitioninc.com (Mike Bresnahan) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Open Source Licensing and Developer Tools Message-ID: I thought this might be of interest to some on the TCLUG list. Mike ----- Ann Williamson will be giving a talk on Open Source Licenses. Date: Tuesday, October 19 Time: 6:15 Free Pizza and Socializing 6:30 Presentation and Q/A Location: O'Shaughnessy Educational Center, Room 454 Directions: http://www.otug.org/location/oec.html Summary: Ann Williamson will provide an in-depth look at the risks and benefits of utilizing Open Source software from a licensing perspective. If you would like some pizza, please register soon at this location: http://www.otug.org/otcgi-bin/mail/rsvp20041019.pl The meeting web page is here: http://www.otug.org/meeting/20041019.html _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Fri Oct 15 01:33:45 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Open Source Licensing and Developer Tools In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <32fd45370410142333389551ff@mail.gmail.com> Damn...wish I could make it. Sadly, I work in the library at college >.<. If anyone goes, could they get a copy of whatever they can, for those of us who can't/don't make it? It would be much appreciated. Keith Bachman On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 21:52:11 -0500, Mike Bresnahan wrote: > I thought this might be of interest to some on the TCLUG list. > > Mike > ----- > Ann Williamson will be giving a talk on Open Source Licenses. > > Date: Tuesday, October 19 > Time: 6:15 Free Pizza and Socializing > 6:30 Presentation and Q/A > Location: O'Shaughnessy Educational Center, Room 454 > Directions: http://www.otug.org/location/oec.html > > Summary: Ann Williamson will provide an in-depth look at the risks and > benefits of utilizing Open Source software from a licensing > perspective. > > If you would like some pizza, please register soon at this location: > > http://www.otug.org/otcgi-bin/mail/rsvp20041019.pl > > The meeting web page is here: > > http://www.otug.org/meeting/20041019.html > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Fri Oct 15 08:36:22 2004 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Open Source Licensing and Developer Tools In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9d6c8253041015063645b05541@mail.gmail.com> Will this be funded by Microsoft to scare everybody into not using Open Source? Or will this be an open discussion about the benefits and concerns when using Open Source licensing? Jeff Rasmussen On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 21:52:11 -0500, Mike Bresnahan wrote: > I thought this might be of interest to some on the TCLUG list. > > Mike > ----- > Ann Williamson will be giving a talk on Open Source Licenses. > > Date: Tuesday, October 19 > Time: 6:15 Free Pizza and Socializing > 6:30 Presentation and Q/A > Location: O'Shaughnessy Educational Center, Room 454 > Directions: http://www.otug.org/location/oec.html > > Summary: Ann Williamson will provide an in-depth look at the risks and > benefits of utilizing Open Source software from a licensing > perspective. > > If you would like some pizza, please register soon at this location: > > http://www.otug.org/otcgi-bin/mail/rsvp20041019.pl > > The meeting web page is here: > > http://www.otug.org/meeting/20041019.html > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mglaser at umn.edu Fri Oct 15 09:54:34 2004 From: mglaser at umn.edu (Michael Glaser) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Need help with loading NIC module at boot Message-ID: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> I have a Dell OptiPlex GX200 with an integrated 3Com 3C920 NIC. I just added an Intel PRO/1000 card but I cannot get it to work upon boot because the kernel module will not load. After the system boots, I can manually load the module with insmod and then run the network startup scripts. Everything is fine then. How can I configure the system to load the module by itself? Here is what I have done so far... I am running Debian Sarge with the latest 2.6 kernel (2.6.8-1-686). I don't need to have the 3Com NIC running at all, so I went into /etc/modutils/aliases and replaced "alias eth0 3c59x" with "alias eth0 e1000". Next I ran "update-modutils" and verified that it correctly modified the /etc/modules.conf file. What else do I need to do to get this to work? I don't know if this matters or not, but the module for the 3Com and Intel NICs are in different locations (by default). Should this be handled automatically, or is there something else I need to do? /lib/modules/2.6.8-1-686/kernel/drivers/net/3c59x.ko /lib/modules/2.6.8-1-686/kernel/drivers/net/e1000/e1000.ko Thanks, Michael Glaser _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From natecars at real-time.com Fri Oct 15 10:12:24 2004 From: natecars at real-time.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Need help with loading NIC module at boot In-Reply-To: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> References: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> Message-ID: On Fri, 15 Oct 2004, Michael Glaser wrote: > I am running Debian Sarge with the latest 2.6 kernel (2.6.8-1-686). I > don't need to have the 3Com NIC running at all, so I went into > /etc/modutils/aliases and replaced "alias eth0 3c59x" with "alias eth0 > e1000". Next I ran "update-modutils" and verified that it correctly > modified the /etc/modules.conf file. What else do I need to do to get > this to work? Also check /etc/modules - whichever one is listed first there will get set up as eth0. Or is it not loading the 3c59x module at all now? If you have Hotplug installed, it may decide to automatically load the network modules for you, too - I hate those automatic loader thingies for servers. :) -- Nate Carlson | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com | Fax : (952)943-8500 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Fri Oct 15 15:02:30 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Need help with loading NIC module at boot In-Reply-To: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> References: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> Message-ID: <41702CD6.6020601@joshwelch.com> Michael Glaser wrote: > I have a Dell OptiPlex GX200 with an integrated 3Com 3C920 NIC. I just > added an Intel PRO/1000 card but I cannot get it to work upon boot > because the kernel module will not load. After the system boots, I can > manually load the module with insmod and then run the network startup > scripts. Everything is fine then. How can I configure the system to load > the module by itself? > > Here is what I have done so far... > > I am running Debian Sarge with the latest 2.6 kernel (2.6.8-1-686). I > don't need to have the 3Com NIC running at all, so I went into > /etc/modutils/aliases and replaced "alias eth0 3c59x" with "alias eth0 > e1000". Next I ran "update-modutils" and verified that it correctly > modified the /etc/modules.conf file. What else do I need to do to get > this to work? > > I don't know if this matters or not, but the module for the 3Com and > Intel NICs are in different locations (by default). Should this be > handled automatically, or is there something else I need to do? > > /lib/modules/2.6.8-1-686/kernel/drivers/net/3c59x.ko > /lib/modules/2.6.8-1-686/kernel/drivers/net/e1000/e1000.ko > > Thanks, > Michael Glaser > Wouldn't the Intel NIC still be eth1 even if you're not bringing up the 3COM NIC? Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Oct 15 16:19:37 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Need help with loading NIC module at boot In-Reply-To: References: <416FE4AA.3020407@umn.edu> Message-ID: As Nate said, easiest way is to just edit /etc/modules and add an "e1000" line. Debian goes through this file and does a modprobe for each line there. Works just fine for most stuff. If it turns out that hotplug is installing the modules, you can edit the hotplug configuration to not load specific modules. I don't recall the details, I think it's /etc/hotplug.conf...I remember it being mostly self explanitory though. :) Run depmod -a after update-modules. Check output of lsmod to see what modules are loaded after booting. The output of dmesg should be helpful as well. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 15 17:51:47 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] new to list and to TCLUG Message-ID: Hello TCLUG-- I just joined the TCLUG and this list a few minutes ago. I've lived in Minneapolis for three years, so I don't know what took me so long to join TCLUG! I moved here from Missouri and have been a member of a University of Missouri Linux Users Group for about 6 years and I still keep in touch via their e-mail lists. I've been using UNIX for almost 15 years (starting when I was a grad student at UW-Madison) and I have administered my own Solaris box for about 10 years (starting as a postdoc at Wash U in St. Louis). I am now trying to move everything to Linux and get off of Solaris altogether. I spend a lot of time crunching numbers on the MSI supercomputers (Linux, Solaris, AIX, Irix). That said, I am a scientist and not a computer expert, so my knowledge of computing is not very deep but I have picked up a lot of things over the years. Today I am an Assistant Professor in Epidemiology and Community Health at the U and I live in downtown Minneapolis (but I'll be moving soon to a house somewhere in the region). Sorry if that's too much information! Anyway, that's my story. I have some questions for you, but I'll put them in separate messages so that the threads don't get jumbled. I look forward to our discussions about Linux! Best, Mike http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Fri Oct 15 19:24:33 2004 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] new to list and to TCLUG In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41706A41.7070408@visi.com> Welcome to TCLUG! It's some what interesting that 3 or 4 people in the last few months have joined TCLUG. Does this mean Linux is now finding main stream acceptance. A beer meeting at Brits Pub is happening right now in down town Minneapolis if your interested. Sam. Mike Miller wrote: > Hello TCLUG-- > > I just joined the TCLUG and this list a few minutes ago. I've lived > in Minneapolis for three years, so I don't know what took me so long > to join TCLUG! I moved here from Missouri and have been a member of a > University of Missouri Linux Users Group for about 6 years and I still > keep in touch via their e-mail lists. I've been using UNIX for almost > 15 years (starting when I was a grad student at UW-Madison) and I have > administered my own Solaris box for about 10 years (starting as a > postdoc at Wash U in St. Louis). I am now trying to move everything > to Linux and get off of Solaris altogether. I spend a lot of time > crunching numbers on the MSI supercomputers (Linux, Solaris, AIX, > Irix). That said, I am a scientist and not a computer expert, so my > knowledge of computing is not very deep but I have picked up a lot of > things over the years. Today I am an Assistant Professor in > Epidemiology and Community Health at the U and I live in downtown > Minneapolis (but I'll be moving soon to a house somewhere in the > region). Sorry if that's too much information! > > Anyway, that's my story. I have some questions for you, but I'll put > them in separate messages so that the threads don't get jumbled. > > I look forward to our discussions about Linux! > > Best, > > Mike > > http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 15 18:40:20 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] local Linux consulting companies Message-ID: Are there any good companies in the twin cities area that can work on Linux systems, make recommendations, etc.? I think my goal is ultimately to have a cluster of dual-processor machines that serve many needs in our department including e-mail, file sharing, print sharing and statistical analysis. I would need help in the planning stages and later to maintain the system. We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they still prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). I might want to hire someone to do Linux sysadmin work. It would be part time, mostly at hours convenient for the worker, mostly remote work (SSH to machine instead of touching it). Part of the job would be teaching me to administer a Linux system. There are a lot of nice features in Linux systems for maintaining software and security that I don't know a lot about. I know that you have a jobs list, and I will write to that list once I've decided that I need to hire someone and I've figured out all the details like how much I'll pay, what they'll do, etc. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 15 18:48:27 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] new to list and to TCLUG In-Reply-To: <41706A41.7070408@visi.com> References: <41706A41.7070408@visi.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 15 Oct 2004, Sam MacDonald wrote: > It's some what interesting that 3 or 4 people in the last few months > have joined TCLUG. Does this mean Linux is now finding main stream > acceptance. I would say that it has found mainstream acceptance. It's hard to change people's minds. Linux was just a toy a few years ago. Now it is quite powerful and stable. People who are used to Solaris, say, are not going change immediately. With IBM, SGI, Sun and HP all offering Linux as an alternative to their in-house UNIX, it's become crystal clear that Linux is an excellent choice and the system most likely to prevail in the next decade. Certainly, BSD and others are good too, but Linux has the edge right now. That's one of the reasons I'm planning to go with Linux. I also think GPL licensing is giving Linux an edge on BSD. > A beer meeting at Brits Pub is happening right now in down town > Minneapolis if your interested. I wish I could. We have a meeting at 7:30 to make a decision about buying a house. If it weren't for that, I would definitely be there. I hope you do it often. Best, Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com Fri Oct 15 18:45:16 2004 From: tclug at b-o-b.homelinux.com (Robert D. De Mars) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] new to list and to TCLUG In-Reply-To: <41706A41.7070408@visi.com> References: <41706A41.7070408@visi.com> Message-ID: <4170610C.7090809@b-o-b.homelinux.com> Sam MacDonald wrote: > Welcome to TCLUG! > > It's some what interesting that 3 or 4 people in the last few months > have joined TCLUG. Does this mean Linux is now finding main stream > acceptance. A beer meeting at Brits Pub is happening right now in down > town Minneapolis if your interested. Damn!!! I forgot about that :( Robert De Mars -- Lat. 45:09n Long. 93:18w http://b-o-b.homelinux.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From lists at gahlon.com Sat Oct 16 00:01:08 2004 From: lists at gahlon.com (Christopher A. Gahlon) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:23 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] local Linux consulting companies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200410160001.08980.lists@gahlon.com> On Friday 15 October 2004 18:40, Mike Miller wrote: > Are there any good companies in the twin cities area that can work > on Linux systems, make recommendations, etc.? I think my goal is > ultimately to have a cluster of dual-processor machines that serve > many needs in our department including e-mail, file sharing, print > sharing and statistical analysis. I would need help in the > planning stages and later to maintain the system. We have IT staff > but they are just getting into Linux (they still prefer to run VMS, > believe it or not). http://www.google.com/search?q=twincities%20linux&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 Third hit points to a nice company that might be worth checking out: http://www.real-time.com/ BTW: Last I checked (hold on a sec... yep!) they still graciously host the TCLUG mailing list and website. Thanks Bob! -- Christopher A. Gahlon There are 10 kinds of people in the world, those that understand binary and those that don't. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 16 12:25:58 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: local Linux consulting companies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 15 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > Are there any good companies in the twin cities area that can work on > Linux systems, make recommendations, etc.? I just want to extend my thanks to those of you who have written to me both on and off of the list. Unfortunately, I don't have time right now to reply to some of your messages because I just made an offer on a house in Minneapolis, which was a lot of work, and I'm going to Madison for a long weekend. I'll try to get back to you soon. Your responses were very helpful, they are greatly appreciated, and I will reply to all of them within a week. Best, Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tanner at real-time.com Sat Oct 16 13:53:02 2004 From: tanner at real-time.com (Bob Tanner) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG awareness WAS new to list and to TCLUG In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200410161353.02699@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> On Friday 15 October 2004 05:51 pm, Mike Miller wrote: > Hello TCLUG-- > > I just joined the TCLUG and this list a few minutes ago. I've lived in > Minneapolis for three years, so I don't know what took me so long to join > TCLUG! Hmmm, in years past, didn't we post things at the UofM at the beginning of the school year to "catch the attention" of potential new linux users? Could we do something similar now (again) ? Any other ideas on how to make joe q. public more aware of tclug? -- Bob Tanner | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.mn-linux.org, Minnesota, Linux | Fax : (952)943-8500 Key fingerprint = AB15 0BDF BCDE 4369 5B42 1973 7CF1 A709 2CC1 B288 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sat Oct 16 14:59:59 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG awareness WAS new to list and to TCLUG In-Reply-To: <200410161353.02699@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> References: <200410161353.02699@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> Message-ID: <41717DBF.7070408@comcast.net> Bob Tanner wrote: >Hmmm, in years past, didn't we post things at the UofM at the beginning of the >school year to "catch the attention" of potential new linux users? > >Could we do something similar now (again) ? > >Any other ideas on how to make joe q. public more aware of tclug? > > There is a Hamfest next Saturday October 23, 2004 at the Wilkins Auditorium http://www.hamfestmn.org/ A lot of hams are also computer users. Not that far from the Install fest, maybe someone could drop off some info sheets at the Hamfest? Jerry K0HZI > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jmk at kaufman.eden-prairie.mn.us Sat Oct 16 16:15:47 2004 From: jmk at kaufman.eden-prairie.mn.us (James Kaufman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] local Linux consulting companies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041016211547.GA32132@jmksystem.kaufman.eden-prairie.mn.us> On Fri, Oct 15, 2004 at 06:40:20PM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > Are there any good companies in the twin cities area that can work on > Linux systems, make recommendations, etc.? I think my goal is ultimately > to have a cluster of dual-processor machines that serve many needs in our > department including e-mail, file sharing, print sharing and statistical > analysis. I would need help in the planning stages and later to maintain > the system. We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they > still prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). > > I might want to hire someone to do Linux sysadmin work. It would be part > time, mostly at hours convenient for the worker, mostly remote work (SSH > to machine instead of touching it). Part of the job would be teaching me > to administer a Linux system. There are a lot of nice features in Linux > systems for maintaining software and security that I don't know a lot > about. > > I know that you have a jobs list, and I will write to that list once I've > decided that I need to hire someone and I've figured out all the details > like how much I'll pay, what they'll do, etc. > > Mike > I don't know much about these guys, except an ex-coworker mentioned them to me the other day: http://ssm.net. I see that they do Linux consulting and also hosting services. I am available for Linux sysadmin work. Send me email if you are interested. -- Jim Kaufman Linux Evangelist public key 0x6D802619 --- The last thing one knows in constructing a work is what to put first. -- Blaise Pascal _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From clay at fandre.com Sun Oct 17 10:37:14 2004 From: clay at fandre.com (Clay Fandre) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sharp Zaurus question In-Reply-To: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> References: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <20041017153714.GD28161@clavin> I've got a 5500 with a D-link wireless running OZ 3.5.1 and I love it. My only complaint is the resolution. 320x240 doesn't quite cut it for mutt or firefox. But for general-purpose PDA stuff it rocks. I am thinking about getting one of the clamshell models that can do 640x480. Maybe I will sell my 5500... On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, Scott Raun wrote: > Anyone using the Sharp Zaurus that runs Linux? > > I'm in search of experiences, recommendations for and against, etc. > I'm contemplating trying to pick an older one up somewhere (looks like > I can get a 5500 on e-bay for ~$150, maybe less than $100 if I'm > willing to wait and can get lucky) just for playing with. > > I'd like to get one with an 802.11b card already installed if possible. > > -- > Scott Raun > sraun@fireopal.org > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From clay at fandre.com Sat Oct 16 11:57:29 2004 From: clay at fandre.com (Clay Fandre) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! Message-ID: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Next TCLUG Installfest When: Saturday, Oct 23rd, 2004 11:00 am - 5:00 pm Info: In return for the free use of the space and network folks who attend the installfest should purchase food/drink from the Cafe in the building. We need an approximate headcount of the number that plan on attending and that are interested in pizza. The Cafe will make the pizza. Sandwiches are also available. We would pay the Cafe for the food/drinks. A poster for the installfest can be found here: http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/installfest-poster-20041023.pdf Please help promote the installfest by printing it out and posting it where appropriate. Where: The Renaissance Box 509 Sibley Street Saint Paul, MN 55101 1st floor North http://www.renbox.com Directions: http://www.renbox.com/content.asp?id=26 Parking: There's a parking lot across the street from the building (North side of 10th St). It's $2/day on weekends. Otherwise there are meters around the side streets and you DO have to pay on Saturdays. There are several one-way streets around the building. If you get lost, go North on Jackson St to 10th St. Turn East (right) on 10th St. The parking lot will be on your left across from the building. You can't miss the building. There's a big sign on the top that says "Renaissance Box" on it. _______________________________________________ Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota http://www.mn-linux.org tclug-announce mailing list tclug-announce@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From clay at fandre.com Sat Oct 16 13:04:50 2004 From: clay at fandre.com (Clay Fandre) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: <20041016180450.GD21673@clavin> I forgot to mention, if you plan on attending the installfest, please register via the following webpage so we can get an idea on how many plan on attending. http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/registration.php On Sat, 16 Oct 2004, Clay Fandre wrote: > Next TCLUG Installfest > > When: > Saturday, Oct 23rd, 2004 11:00 am - 5:00 pm > > Info: > In return for the free use of the space and network folks who attend > the installfest should purchase food/drink from the Cafe in the > building. We need an approximate headcount of the number that plan on > attending and that are interested in pizza. The Cafe will make the > pizza. Sandwiches are also available. We would pay the Cafe for the > food/drinks. > > A poster for the installfest can be found here: > http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/installfest-poster-20041023.pdf > Please help promote the installfest by printing it out and posting it > where appropriate. > > Where: > The Renaissance Box > 509 Sibley Street > Saint Paul, MN 55101 > 1st floor North > http://www.renbox.com > > Directions: http://www.renbox.com/content.asp?id=26 > > Parking: > There's a parking lot across the street from the building (North side > of 10th St). It's $2/day on weekends. Otherwise there are meters > around the side streets and you DO have to pay on Saturdays. > > There are several one-way streets around the building. If you get > lost, go North on Jackson St to 10th St. Turn East (right) on 10th St. > The parking lot will be on your left across from the building. You > can't miss the building. There's a big sign on the top that says > "Renaissance Box" on it. > > _______________________________________________ > Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > http://www.mn-linux.org > tclug-announce mailing list > tclug-announce@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce -- Clay Fandre email: clay at fandre.com PGP Key ID: 0x50DBBB60 _______________________________________________ Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota http://www.mn-linux.org tclug-announce mailing list tclug-announce@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Oct 17 14:02:17 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410171902.i9HJ2HQ11744@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: Digital Venturis FP 5120 One Digital Venturs FP 5120 desktop computer. This was a Pentium 120 but has been upgraded using an Evergreen Technologies to an AMD K-6. I can't recall the speed. There is no memory or drives in this system (I have no idea what I did with the SIMMs, the drives were re-tasked). Free to good home. Located in East side of Saint Paul. Reach me at bruce.broecker@toro.com Seller Email address: bruce dot broecker at toro dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Sun Oct 17 23:45:31 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <20041016180450.GD21673@clavin> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <20041016180450.GD21673@clavin> Message-ID: <32fd453704101721453bcfc361@mail.gmail.com> *Prepares to print and post at college* I like the poster idea! We should do them more often. Barring something coming up, I'll be there. What all do we need to bring this time? (AKA what should I somehow manage to pack in my car, since I probably won't be borrowing the van this time) *just registered* Keith Bachman _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Mon Oct 18 01:19:29 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <32fd453704101721453bcfc361@mail.gmail.com>; from kcbnac@gmail.com on Sun, Oct 17, 2004 at 11:45:31PM -0500 References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <20041016180450.GD21673@clavin> <32fd453704101721453bcfc361@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041018011929.A31262@thinkunix.net> Keith Bachman wrote: > *Prepares to print and post at college* > I like the poster idea! We should do them more often. > > Barring something coming up, I'll be there. What all do we need to > bring this time? (AKA what should I somehow manage to pack in my car, > since I probably won't be borrowing the van this time) You should bring the "usual": - your computer/monitor/keyboard/mouse - power cords - power strips - network cables - switches (preferred) or hubs if you have them - cdr/cdrw media if you wish to burn isos - any Linux distros/software media you have to share I'll be there with my book-O-media... -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Mon Oct 18 07:34:42 2004 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> Anyone interested in installing Debian on a machine without a CDROM? I have the Floppy Diskettes to do an install that way. Might be there, have to clear it with Cindy (da boss). I'll post the flier at Dunn Brothers in Excelsior. And Caribou at 101 & 7 Sam Clay Fandre wrote: >Next TCLUG Installfest > >When: >Saturday, Oct 23rd, 2004 11:00 am - 5:00 pm > >Info: >In return for the free use of the space and network folks who attend >the installfest should purchase food/drink from the Cafe in the >building. We need an approximate headcount of the number that plan on >attending and that are interested in pizza. The Cafe will make the >pizza. Sandwiches are also available. We would pay the Cafe for the >food/drinks. > >A poster for the installfest can be found here: >http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/installfest-poster-20041023.pdf >Please help promote the installfest by printing it out and posting it >where appropriate. > >Where: >The Renaissance Box >509 Sibley Street >Saint Paul, MN 55101 >1st floor North >http://www.renbox.com > >Directions: http://www.renbox.com/content.asp?id=26 > >Parking: >There's a parking lot across the street from the building (North side >of 10th St). It's $2/day on weekends. Otherwise there are meters >around the side streets and you DO have to pay on Saturdays. > >There are several one-way streets around the building. If you get >lost, go North on Jackson St to 10th St. Turn East (right) on 10th St. >The parking lot will be on your left across from the building. You >can't miss the building. There's a big sign on the top that says >"Renaissance Box" on it. > >_______________________________________________ >Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >http://www.mn-linux.org >tclug-announce mailing list >tclug-announce@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 06:53:28 2004 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan Ware) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] local Linux consulting companies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 18:40:20 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > Are there any good companies in the twin cities area that can work on > Linux systems, make recommendations, etc.? I think my goal is ultimately > to have a cluster of dual-processor machines that serve many needs in our > department including e-mail, file sharing, print sharing and statistical > analysis. I would need help in the planning stages and later to maintain > the system. We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they > still prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). VMS is about a rock solid as you can get in both stability and security. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Mon Oct 18 07:56:12 2004 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:24 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> Message-ID: <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> On Mon, Oct 18, 2004 at 06:34:42AM -0600, Sam MacDonald wrote: > Anyone interested in installing Debian on a machine without a CDROM? > I have the Floppy Diskettes to do an install that way. Does it have a network card? If so you can install it with a minimal number of floppies? -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dave at math.umn.edu Mon Oct 18 09:43:14 2004 From: dave at math.umn.edu (Dave Carlson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sharp Zaurus question In-Reply-To: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> References: <20041012214419.GB1680@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <200410180943.14149.dave@math.umn.edu> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 12 October 2004 04:44 pm, Scott Raun wrote: > Anyone using the Sharp Zaurus that runs Linux? > > I'm in search of experiences, recommendations for and against, etc. > I'm contemplating trying to pick an older one up somewhere (looks like > I can get a 5500 on e-bay for ~$150, maybe less than $100 if I'm > willing to wait and can get lucky) just for playing with. > > I'd like to get one with an 802.11b card already installed if possible. > I'm getting a Zaurus 6000L (400MHz,64ROM+64RAM,802.11b) this week ($399 on Amazon) - I'll share my experiences. - -- - -dave Dave Carlson Systems Administrator School of Mathematics, University of Minnesota http://www.math.umn.edu 8 Vincent Hall Computer Support Requests: 612-625-4895 Cell Phone: 612-747-5415 (personal) E-mail Pager: 6127475415@mobile.att.net PGP/GPG Fingerprint: C3D0 9962 1E98 B742 132D 0E1A CE11 7C4B 5309 97A7 (visit http://www.gnupg.org for more information) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFBc9aCzhF8S1MJl6cRAivMAJsE9ACVQ36VyCM7GUgrcQ+geQ7q3wCdFJoT VS/6UcJOCiH/tL2Q7femQyQ= =dgKi -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Mon Oct 18 10:21:21 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] local Linux consulting companies In-Reply-To: <20041016211547.GA32132@jmksystem.kaufman.eden-prairie.mn.us> References: <20041016211547.GA32132@jmksystem.kaufman.eden-prairie.mn.us> Message-ID: <4173DF71.9060006@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Mon Oct 18 11:00:10 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> No, I'm just saying I have the 20 some floppies to install Debian. Sam. I do have an old 486 laptop (compaq) if anyone wants it LOL... Sam. Quoting Jim Crumley : > On Mon, Oct 18, 2004 at 06:34:42AM -0600, Sam MacDonald wrote: > > Anyone interested in installing Debian on a machine without a CDROM? > > I have the Floppy Diskettes to do an install that way. > Does it have a network card? If so you can install it with a > minimal number of floppies? > > -- > Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List > (TCLUG) > Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ > Never laugh at live dragons | > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 13:40:02 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> Message-ID: <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> I've got a stack of P1 laptops, w/out HDs...if anyone wants 'em, LOL.... _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 15:32:20 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices Message-ID: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Hi All- Getting my wife/home computer off of Win2k and have been trying out "desktop" distros. I have startcom, xandros, and lycoris burned to cdrom. I had startcom on for a few days - she just didn;t like the gnome setup and some things didn't work off the bat (dvd/cd burner not detected, no NTFS support, Xine stuttered alot etc). Now normally - I'd love to tinker with it, but at this time and on this computer, I don't want to stray into custom setups and quick hacks. Xandros replaced the Startcom install and it looks alot more familiar (KDE with redmond decorations) - the Xandros file manager is a lot like Explorer, NTFS partitions mounted automagically, Xine works great, cdburner detected. The version of Xandros that you buy comes with crossover so we should be able to run some windows stuff like Quicken word etc. Next up is Lycoris, then ??? Linodws?. We need to, out of the box : mount up old windows drives feel like windows run quicken print photos do word and excel like stuff email surf I don't mind spending money on the distro if it meets most of the above - esp. printing photos and running quicken. Would also like nice security updates and package installs... No tinkering needed - Stuff Just Works... thanks john P.S. I run gentoo on my own computers and on a few servers at work... I just don't want ot be tinkering all the time on the home computer _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From skodak at cs.umn.edu Mon Oct 18 15:39:36 2004 From: skodak at cs.umn.edu (Sreekumar Kodakara) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop Message-ID: Hi, I have a dell laptop running Windows 2000. Lately, it seems to me that the hard disk is being accessed too often and makes a lot of noise. At times during boot the sytem fails to recognize the hard disk. I guess the hard disk is in the brink of failure. I am thinking of getting a new hard disk for this laptop. Since there is a lot of installed software in this machine, I was wondering if there is a way to mirror this hard disk image into some backup disk. Later when I get my new disk I can get this disk image into my new hard disk, so that I have the exact system configuration in my new disk. Thanks for the help. Sreekumar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 15:57:53 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Out of the box, to do everything you want to do...there is...Windows. If the shoe fits.... ;) > mount up old windows drives Why? Are you not totally converting to Linux? Or not totally converting yet? If you're switching to Linux, you may as well copy the data over to a Linux native partition. NTFS read support works, but NTFS write support is another story..so everything will need to be saved on the Linux drive anyway...so now your stuff under Linux and your stuff under Windows is out of sync. Any distro should deal with NTFS file systems no problem. > feel like windows Again...if you want it to feel like windows, run windows. :) The closest you are going to get is probally KDE...but it's still not windows. > run quicken You're best bet here is running Windows. Second best bet is CrossOver Office from Code Weavers. > print photos Do you know if your printer is supported by Linux? That's the hard part. From there you just have to decide what application you want to print from. > do word and excel like stuff Open Office does a fine job, or KOffice for the KDE angle. AbiWord and GNumeric are fine applications as well, but they are GNOME/GTK apps not KDE. > email Personally, I perfer thunderbird with http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ installed. I've got the same mail client, with GnuPG support, on Mac, Linux, and Windows. Sweeet. (Even have my girlfriend using it now.) > surf Mozilla Firefox. Pretty much the same reasons as I pick thunderbird. Same program for Mac, Linux, and Windows. Xandros might do what you're after, I can't think of any other distro that includes Cross Over. I haven't used it myself, but hey it's Debian based so I'm already biased. The purchased version includes CrossOver, so you've got that "out of the box" feel. I'm happy enough with just plain old Debian. Things like Cross Over can be installed without much hassle. But commercial stuff like Xandros will be more polished, which is what your wife wants. Maybe to make this all easier on yourself you should grab the 45 day Microsoft Virtual PC trial and install the Linux distros under there until you find the one you want. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From justin.kremer at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 16:08:19 2004 From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <27e6356a04101814087bb854b8@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:32:20 -0500, John Meier wrote: > I run gentoo on my own computers and on a few servers at work... I > just don't want ot be tinkering all the time on the home computer Why not just go with a gentoo stage 3 install? If gentoo is what you use daily, it'll probably be easiest for you to support as well, and it's not like it'll take THAT much tweaking to get it to be usable. -- Justin Kremer _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bbaptist at iexposure.com Mon Oct 18 16:25:25 2004 From: bbaptist at iexposure.com (Bret Baptist) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200410181625.26029.bbaptist@iexposure.com> On Monday 18 October 2004 3:32 pm, John Meier wrote: > Hi All- > > Getting my wife/home computer off of Win2k and have been trying out > "desktop" distros. I have startcom, xandros, and lycoris burned to > cdrom. I had startcom on for a few days - she just didn;t like the > gnome setup and some things didn't work off the bat (dvd/cd burner not > detected, no NTFS support, Xine stuttered alot etc). > > Now normally - I'd love to tinker with it, but at this time and on > this computer, I don't want to stray into custom setups and quick > hacks. > I would give Mandrakelinux 10.1 a shot. Official should hit the mirrors here real soon now. I have been using 10.1 for a little while now and have been extremely pleased with it. My girlfriend is even running it. She has had very little problem with it, other than UofM course material requiring Windows. WTF? -- Bret Baptist Systems and Technical Support Specialist bbaptist@iexposure.com Internet Exposure, Inc. http://www.iexposure.com (612)676-1946 x17 Web Development-Web Marketing-ISP Services ------------------------------------------ Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From lclemens at mn.rr.com Mon Oct 18 16:32:59 2004 From: lclemens at mn.rr.com (Lawrence Clemens) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop References: Message-ID: <03e601c4b55a$0a933480$24fea8c0@selfp6xu3g1ng9> Sreekumar, for about $8 you can get an adapter (CompUSA) that will let you take the laptop drive and put it in a desktop computer. For details see http://techrepublic.com.com/5102-6255-5160538.html You should be able to use Ghost or related programs to clone it to a partition in the hard drive. Or you can just drag and drop most of what you want to save from the notebook to the desktop hard drive. You should see if the W2K setup files (look for an i386 folder in the WNNT folder) are present on the notebook hd, because they will later let you reinstall the operating system on the new drive. If they are there, as insurance go into the registry and find the product key (or Belarc Advisor will find it for you) and copy it down, in case you are prompted for it when you install the OS in the new drive. You can get like a new 30GB notebook drive shipped from NewEgg for about $75. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sreekumar Kodakara" To: Sent: Monday, October 18, 2004 3:39 PM Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop > Hi, > > I have a dell laptop running Windows 2000. Lately, it seems to me that the > hard disk is being accessed too often and makes a lot of noise. At times > during boot the sytem fails to recognize the hard disk. I guess the hard > disk is in the brink of failure. I am thinking of getting a new hard disk > for this laptop. Since there is a lot of installed software in this > machine, I was wondering if there is a way to mirror this hard disk image > into some backup disk. Later when I get my new disk I can get this disk > image into my new hard disk, so that I have the exact system configuration > in my new disk. > > > Thanks for the help. > > Sreekumar > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Mon Oct 18 20:13:51 2004 From: smac at visi.com (Sam MacDonald) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41746A4F.7080301@visi.com> Ghost is great for Windows machines... Sam. Sreekumar Kodakara wrote: >Hi, > >I have a dell laptop running Windows 2000. Lately, it seems to me that the >hard disk is being accessed too often and makes a lot of noise. At times >during boot the sytem fails to recognize the hard disk. I guess the hard >disk is in the brink of failure. I am thinking of getting a new hard disk >for this laptop. Since there is a lot of installed software in this >machine, I was wondering if there is a way to mirror this hard disk image >into some backup disk. Later when I get my new disk I can get this disk >image into my new hard disk, so that I have the exact system configuration >in my new disk. > > >Thanks for the help. > >Sreekumar > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Oct 18 19:36:42 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410190036.i9J0agb30042@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: Power PC For Free I have a couple of old school power pc machines that need to go.I haven't touched either of these things, just held on to them planning to do something, so don't ask me any questions. IBM RS6000 43P-140 Macintosh Performa 6115CD I am in the Western Suburbs and both of these critters are free to good homes. Seller Email address: josh at joshwelch dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 19:45:50 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> Are there any problems with doing a Gentoo install at the installfest? I'm willing to do a stage 3 install for time, but am curious if the nature of this particular beast is such that it does not make for good installfest fun. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 20:28:10 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:25 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2c6699da041018182875d2a34@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 19:45:50 -0500, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > Are there any problems with doing a Gentoo install at the installfest? Depends on the hardware, stage, and time constraints. Every installfest I've been to has a Gentoo installer, so it's not unheard of. If you have a guess of how long it will take on your hardware, and start early enough, usually there's no problem. -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 18 21:01:25 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <2c6699da041018182875d2a34@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> <2c6699da041018182875d2a34@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041019020125.GC22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From strayf at freeshell.org Mon Oct 18 23:16:47 2004 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: <41746A4F.7080301@visi.com> References: <41746A4F.7080301@visi.com> Message-ID: <20041019041647.GA12265@crito> On Mon, Oct 18, 2004 at 07:13:51PM -0600, Sam MacDonald wrote: > Ghost is great for Windows machines... > I just recently started using the System Rescue CD http://www.sysresccd.org which includes a bunch of useful utilities including partimage which can image a drive. -Steve > > Sreekumar Kodakara wrote: > > >Hi, > > > >I have a dell laptop running Windows 2000. Lately, it seems to me that the > >hard disk is being accessed too often and makes a lot of noise. At times > >during boot the sytem fails to recognize the hard disk. I guess the hard > >disk is in the brink of failure. I am thinking of getting a new hard disk > >for this laptop. Since there is a lot of installed software in this > >machine, I was wondering if there is a way to mirror this hard disk image > >into some backup disk. Later when I get my new disk I can get this disk > >image into my new hard disk, so that I have the exact system configuration > >in my new disk. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Mon Oct 18 23:37:37 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: <20041019041647.GA12265@crito> References: <41746A4F.7080301@visi.com> <20041019041647.GA12265@crito> Message-ID: Lemme see if I can remember.... I think if you boot holding alt and then tap d you will get dell disk diagnostics. Not 100% sure though.... If it's a newer Dell, or the BIOS has been updated, you may be able to access it from the F12 menu. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 01:49:40 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: your wife/home computer? I know that some people get attached to their computers but.....man, that is kinda sad. On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:32:20 -0500, John Meier wrote: > Hi All- > > Getting my wife/home computer off of Win2k and have been trying out > "desktop" distros. I have startcom, xandros, and lycoris burned to > cdrom. I had startcom on for a few days - she just didn;t like the > gnome setup and some things didn't work off the bat (dvd/cd burner not > detected, no NTFS support, Xine stuttered alot etc). > > Now normally - I'd love to tinker with it, but at this time and on > this computer, I don't want to stray into custom setups and quick > hacks. > > Xandros replaced the Startcom install and it looks alot more familiar > (KDE with redmond decorations) - the Xandros file manager is a lot > like Explorer, NTFS partitions mounted automagically, Xine works > great, cdburner detected. The version of Xandros that you buy comes > with crossover so we should be able to run some windows stuff like > Quicken word etc. > > Next up is Lycoris, then ??? Linodws?. > > We need to, out of the box : > > mount up old windows drives > feel like windows > run quicken > print photos > do word and excel like stuff > email > surf > > I don't mind spending money on the distro if it meets most of the > above - esp. printing photos and running quicken. Would also like > nice security updates and package installs... No tinkering needed - > Stuff Just Works... > > thanks > john > > P.S. > > I run gentoo on my own computers and on a few servers at work... I > just don't want ot be tinkering all the time on the home computer > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at askewview.net Tue Oct 19 03:18:25 2004 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4174CDD1.7020108@askewview.net> My $.02 being a gentoo guy. Before the installfest get the stage3 and binary disks for your particular processor. That is the easiest way to do a gentoo install. If you look at their "x86 installation handbook" on gentoo.org its the "grp install" also known as the "netless" install. Adam Patrick Hawkins wrote: >Are there any problems with doing a Gentoo install at the installfest? >I'm willing to do a stage 3 install for time, but am curious if the >nature of this particular beast is such that it does not make for good >installfest fun. > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at cmulcahy.com Tue Oct 19 06:35:50 2004 From: tclug at cmulcahy.com (Chris) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <4174CDD1.7020108@askewview.net> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> <4174CDD1.7020108@askewview.net> Message-ID: <1098185750.23607.5.camel@gentoobox> You may want to check out glis (from glis.sourceforge.net) as well. It is an install script for Gentoo. Set a few parameters such as disk space usage, which stage you want, etc. and it will install Gentoo for you. I was unable to use it on my main machine with an AMD64 using SATA drives and a few other unusual pieces of hardware but have used it in vmware a couple of times. Good luck. Gentoo is great, not for the optimizations which are nice but for Portage. Simply wonderful, and this from a formerly Debian guy! On Tue, 2004-10-19 at 03:18, Adam wrote: > My $.02 being a gentoo guy. Before the installfest get the stage3 and > binary disks for your particular processor. That is the easiest way to > do a gentoo install. If you look at their "x86 installation handbook" on > gentoo.org its the "grp install" also known as the "netless" install. > > Adam > > > Patrick Hawkins wrote: > > >Are there any problems with doing a Gentoo install at the installfest? > >I'm willing to do a stage 3 install for time, but am curious if the > >nature of this particular beast is such that it does not make for good > >installfest fun. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 08:10:34 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <1098185750.23607.5.camel@gentoobox> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> <4174CDD1.7020108@askewview.net> <1098185750.23607.5.camel@gentoobox> Message-ID: <68a256c0410190610e473be2@mail.gmail.com> Chris, I just checked out glis, and it seems that development stalled a year ago. I will look around for other install scripts or gui-based options. -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 08:11:32 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <1098185750.23607.5.camel@gentoobox> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> <4173B862.9000209@visi.com> <20041018075612.A3225@baker.space.umn.edu> <1098115210.4173e88acdc4b@my.visi.com> <32fd453704101811406757bc14@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041018174511da3355@mail.gmail.com> <4174CDD1.7020108@askewview.net> <1098185750.23607.5.camel@gentoobox> Message-ID: <2c6699da041019061165e34e1c@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 06:35:50 -0500, Chris wrote: > You may want to check out glis (from glis.sourceforge.net) as well. It > is an install script for Gentoo. Set a few parameters such as disk > space usage, which stage you want, etc. and it will install Gentoo for > you. Isn't that counterproductive? Why would you install Gentoo if you wanted a scripted installer? -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 08:23:13 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc041019062367f40a0f@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 01:49:40 -0500, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > your wife/home computer? > > I know that some people get attached to their computers but.....man, > that is kinda sad. Yep - started out as my girl robot "friend" and , well - heck - "why not"? I says to myself. I upgraded the relationship from friend to wife. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 08:30:01 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc041019063072a0ae3@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:57:53 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > Out of the box, to do everything you want to do...there is...Windows. > > If the shoe fits.... ;) Yeah - been saying that for the last 5 years on this computer... Guess I just get the itch for somehting new. I just cringe everytime I see the bank's online banking site up in Internet Explorer... WE have firefox, but seems like something don't work for her everytime she's online. > > > mount up old windows drives > > Why? Are you not totally converting to Linux? Or not totally > converting yet? If you're switching to Linux, you may as well copy the > data over to a Linux native partition. NTFS read support works, but > NTFS write support is another story..so everything will need to be > saved on the Linux drive anyway...so now your stuff under Linux and > your stuff under Windows is out of sync. Any distro should deal with > NTFS file systems no problem. During the time of testing distros and during the "migration period" once a distro is chosen, we'll need to read NTFS > > > feel like windows > > Again...if you want it to feel like windows, run windows. :) The :) > > > print photos > > Do you know if your printer is supported by Linux? That's the hard > part. From there you just have to decide what application you want to > print from. > Yes it's a HP and I use the HPOJ driver. Gimp seems a bit over kill to print a photo onto 4x6 paper - any other linux photo printing aps out there that folks use and like? > > email > > Personally, I perfer thunderbird with http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > installed. I've got the same mail client, with GnuPG support, on Mac, > Linux, and Windows. Sweeet. (Even have my girlfriend using it now.) Already use it. Like it just fine. > > > surf > > Mozilla Firefox. Pretty much the same reasons as I pick thunderbird. > Same program for Mac, Linux, and Windows. trying to get everyone to use it - even secretly replaced the target of the IE icon to point to firefox. > > Maybe to make this all easier on yourself you should grab the 45 day > Microsoft Virtual PC trial and install the Linux distros under there > until you find the one you want. > :D now that sounds like a good idea! > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 09:51:52 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc041019063072a0ae3@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> <65293fcc041019063072a0ae3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: > I just cringe everytime I see the bank's online banking site up in > Internet Explorer... WE have firefox, but seems like something don't > work for her everytime she's online. Have you tried setting firefox to identify as IE? I've seen examples of sites that didn't work unless the browser identified as a browser that was known to the site. Firefox might render the pages just fine. You can do it the hard way... Go to about:config and change: general.useragent.vendor general.useragent.vendorSub Or the easy way.... http://update.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=59&vid=617 That adds a "User Agent Switcher" option to your Tools menu. It's good to identify as Firefox unless the site you are browsing requires that you identify as IE: http://austinlug.org/archives/alg/2004-01/msg00395.html Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 10:33:14 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:26 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 18 Oct 2004, Ryan Ware wrote: > On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 18:40:20 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller > >> We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they still >> prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). > > VMS is about a rock solid as you can get in both stability and security. Yet there are *many* problems with your statement and with continuing to use VMS. I have some comments below. I would be very interested in hearing more from the people on this list. I am especially interested in knowing any ways in which VMS is *superior* to Linux. Regarding stability: VMS may be a stable OS, but how stable is the software that is running on VMS? Well, that depends. Some VMS software is quite buggy and there is little hope that those bugs will be fixed any time soon. This brings us to the big problem with VMS - very little new software is being developed for VMS. Compare that with Linux! We would like to run R... http://www.r-project.org/ ...but that will never happen on VMS. That's one example. There are dozens of other examples. The corporations that have owned VMS over the past few years (it has changed hands several times) have threatened to put an end to it, but user protest has kept it going. It's a "lock-in" problem for many users - they have code that runs on VMS but not on Linux/UNIX. We have to fight lock-in. Regarding security: Do you have evidence that VMS is secure? More secure than Linux/UNIX? I would like to know more. What I see is that we are running insecure protocols because either SSH is not available for VMS, or our IT staff don't want to run it (maybe it is prohibitively expensive). I have told them that telnet/ftp are not secure - passwords are transmitted in the clear across the internet - but they have not lifted a finger to change this situation in the 3 years I've been here. (I just found a company that sells SSH for VMS, but their price is high enough that they don't list it on their web page, so I left a voice mail in their sales department.) Regarding cost: You didn't mention cost. We just started using spam filtering software on VMS. On Linux, I believe you can get nice spam filtering for free, but the spam filtering software we just ordered for VMS is costing us $3,700 per year. That will be $37,000 in the next decade just for spam filtering. That is just *one* minor program. I doubt the VMS spam filtering software (PreciseMail; www.process.com) is superior to the usual Linux spam filtering software. If someone can convince me that use of VMS on servers is a good plan for a University department, please do so because it will make me feel better about what's happening where I work. I would be especially encouraged if you would recommend it for a new unit that has no server system in place. Thanks. Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From skodak at cs.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 11:26:41 2004 From: skodak at cs.umn.edu (Sreekumar Kodakara) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop Message-ID: Hi, Thanks for all the inputs. Just one more thing. Will a standard 2.5 inch drive which I can get for $75 at newegg.com like the one listed below Samsung 30GB 5400RPM Notebook Hard Drive, Model MP0302H, OEM Drive Only - Specifications - Capacity: 30GB Average Seek Time: 12 ms Buffer: 8MB Rotational Speed: 5,400 RPM Interface: ATA-6 Features: Fluid Dynamic Bearing Motor Technology Packaging: OEM Drive Only Model#: MP0302H Item#: N82E16822152504 work fine with dell laptop (4100)? I was just wondering if there is anything special with hard drives in laptop or in general laptop use the same type of hard drives like the one listed above. Mine is a 4100, which I guess was bought about 3 years or so ago. Thanks Sreekumar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 11:29:10 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > (I just found a company that sells SSH for VMS, but their price is high > enough that they don't list it on their web page, so I left a voice mail > in their sales department.) The company is www.process.com. They are selling SSH for $1,200 per OpenVMS server initial cost, plus $240 per year per server for support. Support is really a requirement because without support you don't get security fixes. So, the 10-year cost for would be $7,200 ($2,880 in the first year) just for SSH for OpenVMS servers, versus $0 for SSH for Linux. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 19 11:47:48 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <41754534.7040906@visi.com> Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 18 Oct 2004, Ryan Ware wrote: > >> On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 18:40:20 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller >> >>> We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they still >>> prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). >> >> >> VMS is about a rock solid as you can get in both stability and security. > > > > Yet there are *many* problems with your statement and with continuing > to use VMS. I have some comments below. I would be very interested > in hearing more from the people on this list. I am especially > interested in knowing any ways in which VMS is *superior* to Linux. > > Regarding stability: VMS may be a stable OS, but how stable is the > software that is running on VMS? Well, that depends. Some VMS > software is quite buggy and there is little hope that those bugs will > be fixed any time soon. This brings us to the big problem with VMS - > very little new software is being developed for VMS. Compare that > with Linux! We would like to run R... > > http://www.r-project.org/ > > ...but that will never happen on VMS. That's one example. There are > dozens of other examples. The corporations that have owned VMS over > the past few years (it has changed hands several times) have > threatened to put an end to it, but user protest has kept it going. > It's a "lock-in" problem for many users - they have code that runs on > VMS but not on Linux/UNIX. We have to fight lock-in. > DEC had a nice version of X and a POSIX layer so in principle it should be able to run R if it doesn't stray too far from the standards - assuming someone wants to go to the trouble. > Regarding security: Do you have evidence that VMS is secure? More > secure than Linux/UNIX? I would like to know more. What I see is > that we are running insecure protocols because either SSH is not > available for VMS, or our IT staff don't want to run it (maybe it is > prohibitively expensive). I have told them that telnet/ftp are not > secure - passwords are transmitted in the clear across the internet - > but they have not lifted a finger to change this situation in the 3 > years I've been here. (I just found a company that sells SSH for VMS, > but their price is high enough that they don't list it on their web > page, so I left a voice mail in their sales department.) > VMS is light years ahead of stock Linux as regards host security. Its object based security model is pretty much the same as the one in NT/2000/XP which works pretty well if developers take the time to do the analysis, but even simple things like access control lists make a big difference and have only recently shown up in Linux. Without getting into my opinion about security at the U in general and the School of Public Health in particular, suffice it to say that I have yet to meet anyone here that I would trust to secure my systems. The thing to keep in mind about VMS is that it hasn't been updated significantly since the days when all networks were considered trusted so its going to be much better against attacks on host security rather than those coming through the network - actually the same seems to be true of most of the IT folks around here :-) > Regarding cost: You didn't mention cost. We just started using spam > filtering software on VMS. On Linux, I believe you can get nice spam > filtering for free, but the spam filtering software we just ordered > for VMS is costing us $3,700 per year. That will be $37,000 in the > next decade just for spam filtering. That is just *one* minor > program. I doubt the VMS spam filtering software (PreciseMail; > www.process.com) is superior to the usual Linux spam filtering software. > > If someone can convince me that use of VMS on servers is a good plan > for a University department, please do so because it will make me feel > better about what's happening where I work. I would be especially > encouraged if you would recommend it for a new unit that has no server > system in place. I can certainly understand the cases where there are long-term projects tied to applications developed against software tightly tied to VMS - think CCCS or ARIC - where the cost of redeploying the applications isn't funded. But only a complete idiot would be doing new development against VMS. The Alpha chip is toast, there's no migration/upgrade path, support is going away, software is expensive/obsolete/proprietary, ... stop me anytime ... :-) --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rudie at rudie.net Tue Oct 19 10:51:20 2004 From: rudie at rudie.net (Kevin Hinze) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041019105120.04b3d180.rudie@rudie.net> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 11:26:41 -0500 (CDT) Sreekumar Kodakara wrote: > Hi, > > Thanks for all the inputs. Just one more thing. Will a standard 2.5 > inch drive which I can get for $75 at newegg.com like the one listed > below > > Samsung 30GB 5400RPM Notebook Hard Drive, Model MP0302H, OEM Drive > Only > > - Specifications - > > Capacity: 30GB > Average Seek Time: 12 ms > Buffer: 8MB > Rotational Speed: 5,400 RPM > Interface: ATA-6 > Features: Fluid Dynamic Bearing Motor Technology > Packaging: OEM Drive Only > > Model#: MP0302H > Item#: N82E16822152504 > > work fine with dell laptop (4100)? I was just wondering if there is > anything special with hard drives in laptop or in general laptop use > the same type of hard drives like the one listed above. Mine is a > 4100, which I guess was bought about 3 years or so ago. > > Thanks > > Sreekumar Laptop drives can come in different physical heights. That is a concern for your Dell 4100. My wife has a near identical machine, and the 12.5mm tall drives don't fit. Make sure you are buying a 9.5mm tall drive. That should be the only compatability issue you may encounter. Good luck! -- -Kevin Hinze rudie@rudie.net | rudie@sihope.com hinz0047@tc.umn.edu | http://rudie.net _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jwreese0 at comcast.net Tue Oct 19 11:58:46 2004 From: jwreese0 at comcast.net (John Reese) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] RE: Desktop distro choices Message-ID: <1098205126.6039.76.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> I've been extremely pleased with Suse Professional 9.1. The Yast2 install/update system is the best I've seen; it picked up my memory stick and DVD player immediately and all my other hardware, which is more standard. The package is huge - 5 CDs - so there is a lot to play with. Down side; Professional is available only for purchase. A lighter 'Personal' desktop is available in live CD and downloadable .iso. I would actually recommend Personal for people new to Linux, as they probably won't be interested in the other four megabytes of Zope, Nagios, etc. Don't use Suse on systems with less than 256 Mb. RAM and an equivalent processor. Less than 512 MB / 1.5 GHz might leave you a little bored, too. You really pay for the KDE 3.2 desktop on smaller desktops. It might be worth waiting until November if you're interested in Professional. Novell will publish v. 9.2 then. John Reese _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 19 12:03:01 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <417548C5.3070601@visi.com> On my 4000 you take out one access screw and drop down an access panel. Give it a yank and the drive comes out. There is a little adapter on the end that mates the drive pins to the slot on the motherboard. Pull that off and slap in on the new drive along with the access panel and pop the whole thing back in. That said, don't be too surprised if it doesn't fix the problem. My Inspiron will occasionally complain that it can't find the primary drive regardless of what drive I'm using at the time. Usually a quick power cycle fixes the problem. --rick Sreekumar Kodakara wrote: >Hi, > >Thanks for all the inputs. Just one more thing. Will a standard 2.5 inch >drive which I can get for $75 at newegg.com like the one listed below > >Samsung 30GB 5400RPM Notebook Hard Drive, Model MP0302H, OEM Drive Only > >- Specifications - > >Capacity: 30GB >Average Seek Time: 12 ms >Buffer: 8MB >Rotational Speed: 5,400 RPM >Interface: ATA-6 >Features: Fluid Dynamic Bearing Motor Technology >Packaging: OEM Drive Only > >Model#: MP0302H >Item#: N82E16822152504 > > >work fine with dell laptop (4100)? I was just wondering if there is >anything special with hard drives in laptop or in general laptop use the >same type of hard drives like the one listed above. Mine is a 4100, which >I guess was bought about 3 years or so ago. > >Thanks > >Sreekumar > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tim at urberg.net Tue Oct 19 12:09:29 2004 From: tim at urberg.net (Tim Urberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] RE: Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <1098205126.6039.76.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> References: <1098205126.6039.76.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> Message-ID: <41754A49.2080106@urberg.net> I just loaded Fedora Core 3 and I enjoy it. It's very cutting edge and there is a new release about 3-4 times a year. John Reese wrote: > I've been extremely pleased with Suse Professional 9.1. The Yast2 > install/update system is the best I've seen; it picked up my memory > stick and DVD player immediately and all my other hardware, which is > more standard. The package is huge - 5 CDs - so there is a lot to play > with. Down side; Professional is available only for purchase. A lighter > 'Personal' desktop is available in live CD and downloadable .iso. I > would actually recommend Personal for people new to Linux, as they > probably won't be interested in the other four megabytes of Zope, > Nagios, etc. > > Don't use Suse on systems with less than 256 Mb. RAM and an equivalent > processor. Less than 512 MB / 1.5 GHz might leave you a little bored, > too. You really pay for the KDE 3.2 desktop on smaller desktops. > > It might be worth waiting until November if you're interested in > Professional. Novell will publish v. 9.2 then. > > John Reese -- Reclaim Your Inbox! http://www.mozilla.org/products/thunderbird _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 12:10:16 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <41754534.7040906@visi.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > DEC had a nice version of X and a POSIX layer so in principle it should > be able to run R if it doesn't stray too far from the standards - > assuming someone wants to go to the trouble. Sure, but I'll bet you $50 that no one ever goes to the trouble and R is *never* available on VMS. You should take me up on this bet because you will only lose after eternity has passed! I feel that it is extremely unlikely that I will lose, but the probability is non-zero. The important point here is that VMS *is* good, and much *could* be done with it, but it ain't gonna happen. Imagine that you are a developer. You could make any of the hundred or so changes on your to-do list, or you could port your program to VMS and have to maintain it there too. If you are smart, you won't waste your time with VMS. > VMS is light years ahead of stock Linux as regards host security. Its > object based security model is pretty much the same as the one in > NT/2000/XP which works pretty well if developers take the time to do the > analysis, but even simple things like access control lists make a big > difference and have only recently shown up in Linux. I don't know the technical details so I won't argue, but this is the first time someone has suggested to me that NT may be superior to Linux in any domain of security. I am aware of access control lists and we want to use them on Linux. I agree that it makes a big difference in our working environment and that VMS seems to have an edge there, but it won't last long. Access control lists are bound to be widely implemented in Linux soon enough and I think they are available in some filesystems already. > The thing to keep in mind about VMS is that it hasn't been updated > significantly since the days when all networks were considered trusted > so its going to be much better against attacks on host security rather > than those coming through the network - actually the same seems to be > true of most of the IT folks around here :-) Sure, but I consider attacks via the network to be much more serious and much more problematic. On Linux/UNIX systems, I can name a dozen or so times that I, or friends of mine, have been cracked via the net, but not one time when it was an inside job. > I can certainly understand the cases where there are long-term projects > tied to applications developed against software tightly tied to VMS - > think CCCS or ARIC - where the cost of redeploying the applications > isn't funded. But only a complete idiot would be doing new development > against VMS. The Alpha chip is toast, there's no migration/upgrade path, > support is going away, software is expensive/obsolete/proprietary, ... > stop me anytime ... :-) No - keep going! ;-) We have long-term projects that may be locked into VMS, but most work can be done on other systems. We need to move as much work as possible off of VMS. We can do this gradually, but we must do it. Reducing the burden on the VMS servers will help the projects that are truly locked into VMS. My choice of OS for our next bunch of servers is Linux. I think some filesystems are already implementing access control lists, but that is one of the only things I really want that we don't have. Am I missing anything? Linux seems very stable and robust now, but I would like to be contradicted on this point if any of you believe that Linux is not so stable and that there are better solutions. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 19 13:26:27 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> Message-ID: <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > VMS is light years ahead of stock Linux as regards host security. Its > object based security model is pretty much the same as the one in > NT/2000/XP which works pretty well if developers take the time to do > the analysis, but even simple things like access control lists make a > big difference and have only recently shown up in Linux. > > I don't know the technical details so I won't argue, but this is the > first time someone has suggested to me that NT may be superior to > Linux in any domain of security. I am aware of access control lists > and we want to use them on Linux. I agree that it makes a big > difference in our working environment and that VMS seems to have an > edge there, but it won't last long. Access control lists are bound to > be widely implemented in Linux soon enough and I think they are > available in some filesystems already. > The Windows security model is actually pretty sophisticated, but MS ignores most of it in the name of user/administrator convenience. If I remember correctly, the Navy's document on changing security settings for a stock NT 4.0 installation to properly secure it ran to 120 pages. Once the SE Linux security provider becomes commonplace Windows will have to play catch-up. The point is that for what you have to pay for VMS applications software the vendor can afford to document what permissions are required for the application to run properly, but still be secure. > >> The thing to keep in mind about VMS is that it hasn't been updated >> significantly since the days when all networks were considered >> trusted so its going to be much better against attacks on host >> security rather than those coming through the network - actually the >> same seems to be true of most of the IT folks around here :-) > > > Sure, but I consider attacks via the network to be much more serious > and much more problematic. On Linux/UNIX systems, I can name a dozen > or so times that I, or friends of mine, have been cracked via the net, > but not one time when it was an inside job. > Again, that's exactly my point. Most IT folks around here are very naive about network security so the desirability of using ssh over telnet is lost on them. There is an attitude that once you cross the U's border firewalls everyone is nice and can be trusted. So they see no problem with telnet or ftp. >> I can certainly understand the cases where there are long-term >> projects tied to applications developed against software tightly tied >> to VMS - think CCCS or ARIC - where the cost of redeploying the >> applications isn't funded. But only a complete idiot would be doing >> new development against VMS. The Alpha chip is toast, there's no >> migration/upgrade path, support is going away, software is >> expensive/obsolete/proprietary, ... stop me anytime ... :-) > > > No - keep going! ;-) > > We have long-term projects that may be locked into VMS, but most work > can be done on other systems. We need to move as much work as > possible off of VMS. We can do this gradually, but we must do it. > Reducing the burden on the VMS servers will help the projects that are > truly locked into VMS. > > My choice of OS for our next bunch of servers is Linux. I think some > filesystems are already implementing access control lists, but that is > one of the only things I really want that we don't have. Am I missing > anything? Linux seems very stable and robust now, but I would like to > be contradicted on this point if any of you believe that Linux is not > so stable and that there are better solutions. I hope its a good idea. I'm in the process of migrating our file/print/authentication services off Windows to a Linux box, and all of our database & web apps have been running on Linux for a couple of years now. But look at it from the IT managers point of view. You've got 100+ people set up for user authentication against VMS with no easy way to utilize that service from Linux/Solaris/etc. So you can require users to have accounts on both the new and old system, or you spring for proprietary software to keep passwords in sync or export the authentication services - I'm pretty sure there's a 3rd party NFS/NIS package available and of course there is always PathWorks (if clear text passwords don't bother you) but they both co$t. And then there's the training costs to move development over to a new system and the ongoing cost of administering two systems during the transition. That generates a lot of inertia even if it is a good idea to switch. Just pray they don't find out about http://freshmeat.net/projects/freevms/ :-) --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 13:15:50 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4a0cafe204101911154fb9846e@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:32:20 -0500, John Meier wrote: > Hi All- > > Getting my wife/home computer off of Win2k and have been trying out > "desktop" distros. I have startcom, xandros, and lycoris burned to > cdrom. I had startcom on for a few days - she just didn;t like the > gnome setup and some things didn't work off the bat (dvd/cd burner not > detected, no NTFS support, Xine stuttered alot etc). > > Now normally - I'd love to tinker with it, but at this time and on > this computer, I don't want to stray into custom setups and quick > hacks. > > Xandros replaced the Startcom install and it looks alot more familiar > (KDE with redmond decorations) - the Xandros file manager is a lot > like Explorer, NTFS partitions mounted automagically, Xine works > great, cdburner detected. The version of Xandros that you buy comes > with crossover so we should be able to run some windows stuff like > Quicken word etc. > > Next up is Lycoris, then ??? Linodws?. > > We need to, out of the box : > > mount up old windows drives > feel like windows > run quicken > print photos > do word and excel like stuff > email > surf > > I don't mind spending money on the distro if it meets most of the > above - esp. printing photos and running quicken. Would also like > nice security updates and package installs... No tinkering needed - > Stuff Just Works... > > thanks > john > > P.S. > > I run gentoo on my own computers and on a few servers at work... I > just don't want ot be tinkering all the time on the home computer Why not use WinXP then? It's very similar to 2000, it has a new look/feel to it, and everything works out of box. Then put firefox on it. If there are problems with pages not working, it's more than likely 'cause the page was built for ie. I use firefox on windows right now and haven't had any problems with it yet. If you really really want to go to linux, use gentoo. You know it well. You can teach her the "emerge" command very easily. Then everything is pretty simple to setup. >From what it sounds like, you should just stick to windows. I use WinXP at home, 'cause there have been several things I need that I haven't found on linux..... and I like to play the ocassionla game here and there. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 13:33:49 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > Again, that's exactly my point. Most IT folks around here are very naive > about network security so the desirability of using ssh over telnet is > lost on them. There is an attitude that once you cross the U's border > firewalls everyone is nice and can be trusted. So they see no problem > with telnet or ftp. Which reminds me - we don't have a firewall. > Just pray they don't find out about http://freshmeat.net/projects/freevms/ > :-) If it was really up and running and working now, maybe more code would be ported to it and maybe it would be worthwhile. For now, it looks likely to wither on the vine. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 13:38:26 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever In-Reply-To: <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > But look at it from the IT managers point of view. You've got 100+ > people set up for user authentication against VMS with no easy way to > utilize that service from Linux/Solaris/etc. So you can require users to > have accounts on both the new and old system, or you spring for > proprietary software to keep passwords in sync or export the > authentication services - I'm pretty sure there's a 3rd party NFS/NIS > package available and of course there is always PathWorks (if clear text > passwords don't bother you) but they both co$t. We have been using an NT box to do authentication for the VMS machines. I don't know the details there, but I think the VMS system passwords are the same as the NT Domain passwords and the VMS box communicates with the NT box when someone tries to log into the VMS server. We want Linux to be able to use this same system. How can that be accomplished? Our IT guys thought there might be an LDAP-based solution, but they haven't been able to come up with it yet. It would be a big time saver if we could get something to do the authentication for us. Thanks in advance for any tips. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ben at nerp.net Tue Oct 19 14:19:41 2004 From: ben at nerp.net (Ben Kochie) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:27 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG Spread Firefox team? It would be cool to get our group listed. - -ben "Unix is user friendly, Its just picky about its friends." -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFBdWjPflzKmtpiQEMRAqNeAKCYcErS0ZB752x0CFb714/C1LmwpgCeOoiP SpJxHg92Icg0VlLFOpN1rrI= =Udeh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bradyh at bitstream.net Tue Oct 19 14:38:15 2004 From: bradyh at bitstream.net (Brady Hegberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1098214695.2565.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> I could get behind that. Brady > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG Spread Firefox team? > > It would be cool to get our group listed. > > - -ben > > "Unix is user friendly, Its just picky about its friends." > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFBdWjPflzKmtpiQEMRAqNeAKCYcErS0ZB752x0CFb714/C1LmwpgCeOoiP > SpJxHg92Icg0VlLFOpN1rrI= > =Udeh > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Brady Hegberg _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nassarmu at redconcepts.net Tue Oct 19 14:46:16 2004 From: nassarmu at redconcepts.net (nassarmu@redconcepts.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: authentication via NT domain, or whatever References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Message-ID: Mike Miller writes: > We have been using an NT box to do authentication for the VMS machines. > I don't know the details there, but I think the VMS system passwords are > the same as the NT Domain passwords and the VMS box communicates with the > NT box when someone tries to log into the VMS server. We want Linux to be > able to use this same system. How can that be accomplished? Our IT guys > thought there might be an LDAP-based solution, but they haven't been able > to come up with it yet. It would be a big time saver if we could get > something to do the authentication for us. there are ways to do this such as pam_smb and i believe winbind lets you do this as well. -- Munir Nassar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From JCMontz at jamestower.com Tue Oct 19 14:44:49 2004 From: JCMontz at jamestower.com (Montz, James C. (James Tower)) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever Message-ID: <01E4A5BAEE42D411977100508BC22C9F0D594273@tcexch3.taylorcorp.com> Samba/Winbind; Windbind can be configured to authenticate directly to the NT Domain. No need for local user accounts, and keeping passwords in sync. Very handy. I even have it setup to authenticate users for our domain for Telnet/SSH/Samba Share/FTP, etc. Previous to winbind, you had to have a local system account for anything but the Samba Shares/Printers. James -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:38 PM To: TCLUG Mailing List Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > But look at it from the IT managers point of view. You've got 100+ > people set up for user authentication against VMS with no easy way to > utilize that service from Linux/Solaris/etc. So you can require users to > have accounts on both the new and old system, or you spring for > proprietary software to keep passwords in sync or export the > authentication services - I'm pretty sure there's a 3rd party NFS/NIS > package available and of course there is always PathWorks (if clear text > passwords don't bother you) but they both co$t. We have been using an NT box to do authentication for the VMS machines. I don't know the details there, but I think the VMS system passwords are the same as the NT Domain passwords and the VMS box communicates with the NT box when someone tries to log into the VMS server. We want Linux to be able to use this same system. How can that be accomplished? Our IT guys thought there might be an LDAP-based solution, but they haven't been able to come up with it yet. It would be a big time saver if we could get something to do the authentication for us. Thanks in advance for any tips. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 14:56:33 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever In-Reply-To: <01E4A5BAEE42D411977100508BC22C9F0D594273@tcexch3.taylorcorp.com> References: <01E4A5BAEE42D411977100508BC22C9F0D594273@tcexch3.taylorcorp.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:44:49 -0500, Montz, James C. (James Tower) wrote: > Samba/Winbind; > > Windbind can be configured to authenticate directly to the NT Domain. > No need for local user accounts, and keeping passwords in sync. I'll second the recommendation for Samba/winbind. I've been running it in production for 2+ years now, and the only issues we've had with it have been solved by restarting the winbind service, and I only need to do that once per month or so... _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 19 15:05:12 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Message-ID: <41757378.1050505@visi.com> If you're really using NT I would think that pam_smb (http://pamsmb.sourceforge.net/) would do the trick. If you're using active directory I seem to recall someone going into the details of setting up an ldap link to authenticate against AD, but the details escape me. It may have even been a NET-PEOPLE posting. I think that pam_smb will do the authentication, but it doesn't do anything for mapping across groups and the likes so those still end up being maintained on the unix side while the ldap solution can fetch back group memberships and the likes. --rick Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 19 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > >> But look at it from the IT managers point of view. You've got 100+ >> people set up for user authentication against VMS with no easy way to >> utilize that service from Linux/Solaris/etc. So you can require users >> to have accounts on both the new and old system, or you spring for >> proprietary software to keep passwords in sync or export the >> authentication services - I'm pretty sure there's a 3rd party NFS/NIS >> package available and of course there is always PathWorks (if clear >> text passwords don't bother you) but they both co$t. > > > We have been using an NT box to do authentication for the VMS > machines. I don't know the details there, but I think the VMS system > passwords are the same as the NT Domain passwords and the VMS box > communicates with the NT box when someone tries to log into the VMS > server. We want Linux to be able to use this same system. How can > that be accomplished? Our IT guys thought there might be an > LDAP-based solution, but they haven't been able to come up with it > yet. It would be a big time saver if we could get something to do the > authentication for us. > > Thanks in advance for any tips. > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From whtdruid at druids-grove.net Tue Oct 19 15:24:04 2004 From: whtdruid at druids-grove.net (Daniel Rysztak) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: Message-ID: What would be required to be part of the team? ============================ Daniel Rysztak, CCNP http://www.druids-grove.net/ -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Ben Kochie Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 2:20 PM To: TCLUG Mailing List Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG Spread Firefox team? It would be cool to get our group listed. - -ben "Unix is user friendly, Its just picky about its friends." -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFBdWjPflzKmtpiQEMRAqNeAKCYcErS0ZB752x0CFb714/C1LmwpgCeOoiP SpJxHg92Icg0VlLFOpN1rrI= =Udeh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rick at eworld3.net Tue Oct 19 16:49:49 2004 From: rick at eworld3.net (Rick Meyerhoff) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: OT: Hard Disk problems in Dell Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41758BFD.6090007@eworld3.net> After you get that new HD installed you might as well put one of the many fine Linux distros on this machine ;-) Sreekumar Kodakara wrote: > Hi, > > Thanks for all the inputs. Just one more thing. Will a standard 2.5 inch > drive which I can get for $75 at newegg.com like the one listed below > > Samsung 30GB 5400RPM Notebook Hard Drive, Model MP0302H, OEM Drive Only > > - Specifications - > > Capacity: 30GB > Average Seek Time: 12 ms > Buffer: 8MB > Rotational Speed: 5,400 RPM > Interface: ATA-6 > Features: Fluid Dynamic Bearing Motor Technology > Packaging: OEM Drive Only > > Model#: MP0302H > Item#: N82E16822152504 > > > work fine with dell laptop (4100)? I was just wondering if there is > anything special with hard drives in laptop or in general laptop use the > same type of hard drives like the one listed above. Mine is a 4100, which > I guess was bought about 3 years or so ago. > > Thanks > > Sreekumar > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -- Eric (Rick) Meyerhoff _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Oct 19 16:58:03 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <65293fcc04101914581cb7c87e@mail.gmail.com> Yeah - what's required - I'll be part of it - probably.... On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 15:24:04 -0500, Daniel Rysztak wrote: > What would be required to be part of the team? > > ============================ > Daniel Rysztak, CCNP > http://www.druids-grove.net/ > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Ben Kochie > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 2:20 PM > To: TCLUG Mailing List > Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG Spread Firefox team? > > It would be cool to get our group listed. > > - -ben > > "Unix is user friendly, Its just picky about its friends." > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFBdWjPflzKmtpiQEMRAqNeAKCYcErS0ZB752x0CFb714/C1LmwpgCeOoiP > SpJxHg92Icg0VlLFOpN1rrI= > =Udeh > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Tue Oct 19 16:52:06 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Desktop distro choices In-Reply-To: <4a0cafe204101911154fb9846e@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc04101813323b4f8a2c@mail.gmail.com> <4a0cafe204101911154fb9846e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <41758C86.5040502@comcast.net> Josh Close wrote: >On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:32:20 -0500, John Meier wrote: > > >>Hi All- >> >>Getting my wife/home computer off of Win2k and have been trying out >>"desktop" distros. I have startcom, xandros, and lycoris burned to >>cdrom. I had startcom on for a few days - she just didn;t like the >>gnome setup and some things didn't work off the bat (dvd/cd burner not >>detected, no NTFS support, Xine stuttered alot etc). >> >>Now normally - I'd love to tinker with it, but at this time and on >>this computer, I don't want to stray into custom setups and quick >>hacks. >> >>Xandros replaced the Startcom install and it looks alot more familiar >>(KDE with redmond decorations) - the Xandros file manager is a lot >>like Explorer, NTFS partitions mounted automagically, Xine works >>great, cdburner detected. The version of Xandros that you buy comes >>with crossover so we should be able to run some windows stuff like >>Quicken word etc. >> >>Next up is Lycoris, then ??? Linodws?. >> >>We need to, out of the box : >> >>mount up old windows drives >>feel like windows >>run quicken >>print photos >>do word and excel like stuff >>email >>surf >> >>I don't mind spending money on the distro if it meets most of the >>above - esp. printing photos and running quicken. Would also like >>nice security updates and package installs... No tinkering needed - >>Stuff Just Works... >> >>thanks >>john >> >>P.S. >> >> I run gentoo on my own computers and on a few servers at work... I >>just don't want ot be tinkering all the time on the home computer >> >> > > > > I am new To Linux; So far the two that seemed to configure almost automatic were Fedora Core 1 and Mandrake 10.0 Official Trying to install Mandrake 10.1 and 10.1 r1 Community but some kind of bug which I reported on Bugzilla. Will wait for the 10.1 Official to be released. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From hick0088 at tc.umn.edu Tue Oct 19 23:45:04 2004 From: hick0088 at tc.umn.edu (Mike Hicks) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> Message-ID: <1098247503.3593.18.camel@3po> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From stutterstutt at comcast.net Wed Oct 20 00:38:42 2004 From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:28 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 18 Oct 2004, Ryan Ware wrote: > >> VMS is about a rock solid as you can get in both stability and security. > > > Yet there are *many* problems with your statement and with continuing > to use VMS. I have some comments below. I would be very interested > in hearing more from the people on this list. I am especially > interested in knowing any ways in which VMS is *superior* to Linux. Stability. Security. Reliability. Availability. > Regarding stability: VMS may be a stable OS, but how stable is the > software that is running on VMS? Well, that depends. Some VMS > software is quite buggy and there is little hope that those bugs will > be fixed any time soon. This brings us to the big problem with VMS - > very little new software is being developed for VMS. Compare that > with Linux! We would like to run R... > http://www.r-project.org/ > > ...but that will never happen on VMS. That's one example. There are > dozens of other examples. The corporations that have owned VMS over > the past few years (it has changed hands several times) have > threatened to put an end to it, but user protest has kept it going. > It's a "lock-in" problem for many users - they have code that runs on > VMS but not on Linux/UNIX. We have to fight lock-in. Nothing gets ported or even written for Linux unless someone steps up and does it. You are certainly free to port R to VMS if you like. Yes, VMS has a very loyal customer base. And VMS is still going strong. > Regarding security: Do you have evidence that VMS is secure? More > secure than Linux/UNIX? I would like to know more. First, VMS is secure because security was designed into the operating system, not added as an afterthought. For example, the 4-layer ring design, where the core ring is the most trusted (kernel mode) and the outer ring least trusted (user mode). Another example: the specialization of privileges and access control lists. There's just one privilege (root) with Linux, though access control lists are starting to appear. Second, DEFCON 9 (July 2001) labeled VMS "Cool and Unhackable" after attempts were made to hack into a standard VMS system with no firewall between it and the hackers. The hackers even had access to an unprivileged user account. VMS is the only operating system to achieve this rating. Third, VMS has earned a security rating from the Department of Defense. > What I see is that we are running insecure protocols because either > SSH is not available for VMS, or our IT staff don't want to run it > (maybe it is prohibitively expensive). I have told them that > telnet/ftp are not secure - passwords are transmitted in the clear > across the internet - but they have not lifted a finger to change this > situation in the 3 years I've been here. (I just found a company that > sells SSH for VMS, but their price is high enough that they don't list > it on their web page, so I left a voice mail in their sales department.) A recent version of HP TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS supports SSH. Perhaps you didn't realize it was available? And seeing as how you are at a university, you might consider talking to your HP representative to see if you qualify for the university pricing. I hear it's quite attractive. > If someone can convince me that use of VMS on servers is a good plan > for a University department, please do so because it will make me feel > better about what's happening where I work. I would be especially > encouraged if you would recommend it for a new unit that has no server > system in place. Let me know if I can be of any more help. I would be happy to put you in touch with someone at HP who can better talk to your needs. > Thanks. > > Mike You're welcome. -Jeff Disclaimer: HP is my employer. I am an OpenVMS operating system software engineer. I don't work in sales or marketing, I just write code (and sometimes teach). Statements made represent my understanding of facts, my opinions, and are not official statements from HP. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From stutterstutt at comcast.net Wed Oct 20 01:10:21 2004 From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <41754534.7040906@visi.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> Message-ID: <4176014D.4000602@comcast.net> Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > VMS is light years ahead of stock Linux as regards host security. Its > object based security model is pretty much the same as the one in > NT/2000/XP which works pretty well if developers take the time to do > the analysis, but even simple things like access control lists make a > big difference and have only recently shown up in Linux. I agree. > Without getting into my opinion about security at the U in general and > the School of Public Health in particular, suffice it to say that I > have yet to meet anyone here that I would trust to secure my systems. > The thing to keep in mind about VMS is that it hasn't been updated > significantly since the days when all networks were considered trusted > so its going to be much better against attacks on host security rather > than those coming through the network - actually the same seems to be > true of most of the IT folks around here :-) My earlier response pointed out where VMS is in fact secure against network attacks. Your point seems to be that since VMS has not been "updated significantly" it must be vulnerable. Although I don't agree with your premise, how about considering this: VMS is secure by design and doesn't need a lot of updating to stay that way. > I can certainly understand the cases where there are long-term > projects tied to applications developed against software tightly tied > to VMS - think CCCS or ARIC - where the cost of redeploying the > applications isn't funded. But only a complete idiot would be doing > new development against VMS. The Alpha chip is toast, there's no > migration/upgrade path, support is going away, software is > expensive/obsolete/proprietary, ... stop me anytime ... :-) OK, you can stop. :-) First, Alpha research and development has ended, but that does not mean the end of Alpha systems. See HP's published roadmaps for Alpha systems. Second, there is a migration path: http://www.hp.com/products1/evolution/alpha_retaintrust/index.html . OpenVMS is running today on the HP Integrity Server platform running the Intel Itanium processor. The operating system is in field test, with a production release (version 8.2) scheduled for the end of this year. You can obtain an SDK by going to the migration website noted above. Third, support is not going away. See the HP roadmaps. Forth, applications are being ported to OpenVMS I64. The above-mentioned migration site contains information, as does the independent website www.openvms.org. I hope I've corrected any misconceptions. Please feel free to contact me (offlist) if you would like more information. -Jeff Disclaimer: HP is my employer and I am an OpenVMS operating system software engineer, so I know a thing or two about OpenVMS :-). I don't work in sales or marketing, I just write code (and sometimes teach). Statements made represent my understanding of facts, my opinions, and are not official statements from HP. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tmarble at info9.net Wed Oct 20 07:08:40 2004 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Open Source Licensing and Developer Tools In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41765548.6030708@info9.net> Mike Bresnahan wrote: > I thought this might be of interest to some on the TCLUG list. > ----- > Ann Williamson will be giving a talk on Open Source Licenses. > http://www.otug.org/meeting/20041019.html I really regret not being able to attend this due to a family commitment... Did anyone see this presentation? Can anyone share what happened (interesting comments from the speaker and/or the audience)? Thanks! --Tom _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 07:55:03 2004 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan Ware) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <307a337f04102005551bfc58e1@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 10:33:14 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 18 Oct 2004, Ryan Ware wrote: > > > On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 18:40:20 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller > > > >> We have IT staff but they are just getting into Linux (they still > >> prefer to run VMS, believe it or not). > > > > VMS is about a rock solid as you can get in both stability and security. > > Yet there are *many* problems with your statement and with continuing to > use VMS. I have some comments below. I would be very interested in > hearing more from the people on this list. I am especially interested in > knowing any ways in which VMS is *superior* to Linux. Mike, In general for your needs it sounds like Linux would be much cheaper to acquire and will support more of the apps you want. Aqcuisition cost is but one thing to consider though, maintenance, et al are all factors. In a university setting you have an advantage - cheap labor supply (students) that can do a lot of the support for Linux. Almost none of them will have any VMS knowledge compared to the ones with rudimentary Linux knowledge. VMS is usually run by large companies who need reliablity. I'm guessing your university uses or at least used VMS at one time for it's record keeping. As far as stability, yes third party apps can be crap, but that effects Windows, and Linux too. VMS as an operating system is as stable as any UNIX or UNIX like operating system out there. Security. Here is an interesting read I found on The Inquirer http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=13420 VMS does much better than *nix. Also if memory serves VMS is the ONLY operating system that has been tested at the Defcon that wasn't compromised. I especially thought this quote in the article sheds some light on why we have the security issues we do. "The other significant feature of these operating systems is the language in which they are written. The two from IBM are both written in assembler and OpenVMS uses a range of about ten languages, one of which is C. C and similar languages that use pass-by-value techniques are exceptionally prone to buffer overflow and the consequent potential for unauthorized users to execute either their own malicious code or other programs which run with enhanced access privileges. Avoiding the use of these languages at the most vulnerable points, namely user I/O and network I/O, would appear to be wise" In the words of Sam McDonald "I'm in an asbestos suit standing in the middle of Lake Superior" if the C fans need to vent. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 20 08:53:26 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] authentication via NT domain, or whatever In-Reply-To: <1098247503.3593.18.camel@3po> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <41755C53.8000400@visi.com> <1098247503.3593.18.camel@3po> Message-ID: <41766DD6.6070902@visi.com> I would never use the X.500 system here for authentication on our systems. The whole concept is too easy to spoof unless you can count on the user to always check that the address they're connecting for the login screen is in fact the centralized server. How many do you think will notice that they've been directed to http:// rather than https:// or that they've been directed to https://www.umn.edu.login.com rather than https://www.umn.edu? --rick Mike Hicks wrote: >On Tue, 2004-10-19 at 13:38, Mike Miller wrote: > > >>We have been using an NT box to do authentication for the VMS machines. >>I don't know the details there, but I think the VMS system passwords are >>the same as the NT Domain passwords and the VMS box communicates with the >>NT box when someone tries to log into the VMS server. We want Linux to be >>able to use this same system. How can that be accomplished? Our IT guys >>thought there might be an LDAP-based solution, but they haven't been able >>to come up with it yet. It would be a big time saver if we could get >>something to do the authentication for us. >> >> > >You seem to be at the U. Are you using X.500 IDs at all? I guess that >your department must be using something else if the IT guys haven't >found a shared ID system yet. Finding some way to authenticate with the >university's X.500 tree is one of the better ways of doing signons in >the university system, although I guess certain aspects are somewhat >poor (I think it might be harder to enforce password age restrictions, >for instance). There are a number of ways to talk to that system. >Heck, if the situation got to be really dire, it could be possible to >hack something together that emulates an HTTPS web client to do UMN >cookieauth of all things [http://www1.umn.edu/cookieauth/]. But that >would be a pretty crazy method. > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 20 09:03:36 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Message-ID: <41767038.5010809@visi.com> Jeff Nelson wrote: > > First, VMS is secure because security was designed into the operating > system, not added as an afterthought. For example, the 4-layer ring > design, where the core ring is the most trusted (kernel mode) and the > outer ring least trusted (user mode). Another example: the > specialization of privileges and access control lists. There's just > one privilege (root) with Linux, though access control lists are > starting to appear. > > Second, DEFCON 9 (July 2001) labeled VMS "Cool and Unhackable" after > attempts were made to hack into a standard VMS system with no firewall > between it and the hackers. The hackers even had access to an > unprivileged user account. VMS is the only operating system to achieve > this rating. > > Third, VMS has earned a security rating from the Department of Defense. VMS may be the only on to get the "Cool and Unhackable" from DEFCON but I would be shocked if any of the trusted versions of AIX, Solaris, HP/UX, etc. wouldn't prove to be just as hard to hack. That's why SELinux is so interesting; although, I'll admit that VMS is going to be easier to administer for the foreseeable future than SELinux. --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Wed Oct 20 08:49:39 2004 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ACLs [was VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies")] In-Reply-To: <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 12:38:42AM -0500, Jeff Nelson wrote: > First, VMS is secure because security was designed into the operating > system, not added as an afterthought. For example, the 4-layer ring > design, where the core ring is the most trusted (kernel mode) and the > outer ring least trusted (user mode). Another example: the > specialization of privileges and access control lists. There's just one > privilege (root) with Linux, though access control lists are starting to > appear. What are advantages of ACLs? How do they benefit a medium-sized network? I understand that they are more flexible than the traditional Unix groups approach, but they are also more complex to deal with. I have not seen any good case studies or documentation that explains what problems ACLs solve better than groups. Well-designed Linux distributions have few processes running as root. I realize that there are situations where the extra power of ACLs would come in handy, but most networks don't even make full use of the power of groups. Why should we expect them to use ACLs effectively? Anyway, if anyone has any links to some good information on ACLs, I would appreciate seeing them. I keep hearing about them, but I cannot understand the fascination. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 20 09:14:30 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <307a337f04102005551bfc58e1@mail.gmail.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <307a337f04102005551bfc58e1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <417672C6.8050000@visi.com> Ryan Ware wrote: >Security. Here is an interesting read I found on The Inquirer >http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=13420 >VMS does much better than *nix. Also if memory serves VMS is the ONLY >operating system that has been tested at the Defcon that wasn't >compromised. I especially thought this quote in the article sheds >some light on why we have the security issues we do. "The other >significant feature of these operating systems is the language in >which they are written. The two from IBM are both written in assembler >and OpenVMS uses a range of about ten languages, one of which is C. > >C and similar languages that use pass-by-value techniques are >exceptionally prone to buffer overflow and the consequent potential >for unauthorized users to execute either their own malicious code or >other programs which run with enhanced access privileges. Avoiding the >use of these languages at the most vulnerable points, namely user I/O >and network I/O, would appear to be wise" > > Its been a long time since I've done development against VMS but as I recall one of the things we loved about the DEC compilers is that they used different stacks for variable length arguments as compared to fixed length data values, i.e. numbers/addresses on one stack and strings on another making it less of a problem. When we were starting the release testing process, the first box to get the new version was the VAX because it would kick out all sorts of faults that the other OS's and compilers would miss. Of course, at the time it was the only box out there that supported the concept of protected memory. I'd also be remiss if I didn't mention that the reason that you see C and assembler used for I/O is because that is a place where optimal code is needed the most. --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rbentz at dunwoody.edu Wed Oct 20 10:01:58 2004 From: rbentz at dunwoody.edu (rbentz@dunwoody.edu) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro Message-ID: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBC5@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it be? I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, processes, setups, and other geek stuff. Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network configs, (the list goes on) Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of skills/methods for computing. Too broad of a question? Thoughts? Rob _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rbentz at dunwoody.edu Wed Oct 20 10:07:07 2004 From: rbentz at dunwoody.edu (rbentz@dunwoody.edu) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro Message-ID: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it be? I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, processes, setups, and other geek stuff. Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network configs, (the list goes on) Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of skills/methods for computing. Too broad of a question? Thoughts? Rob _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 10:15:58 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBC5@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBC5@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <4a0cafe204102008153ee28de5@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:01:58 -0500, rbentz@dunwoody.edu wrote: > If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it > be? > I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, > processes, setups, and other geek stuff. > Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows > does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network > configs, (the list goes on) > > Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but > think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the > thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of > skills/methods for computing. > > Too broad of a question? Thoughts? > > Rob My thought would be to use gentoo. You'll learn more during an install than you will setting up redhat and using if for months. The install docs are very detailed, and explain how things work. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tommyj27 at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 10:29:07 2004 From: tommyj27 at gmail.com (Thomas Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> rob, when i finally learned linux for real i wiped windows, loaded slackware (www.slackware.com), gave my windows discs to a buddy with the instruction to not let me have them back for at least a year. talk about trial by fire. obviously your mileage may vary and mine might not have been the wisest choice, but i think slackware is a good distro if you really want to learn about how things work rather than just use linux. other's here will vehemently disagree with me, but that's my two cents. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rbentz at dunwoody.edu Wed Oct 20 11:20:03 2004 From: rbentz at dunwoody.edu (rbentz@dunwoody.edu) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro Message-ID: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> > > On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:01:58 -0500, rbentz@dunwoody.edu > wrote: > > If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it > > be? > > I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, > > processes, setups, and other geek stuff. > > Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows > > does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network > > configs, (the list goes on) > > > > Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but > > think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the > > thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of > > skills/methods for computing. > > > > Too broad of a question? Thoughts? > > > > Rob > > My thought would be to use gentoo. You'll learn more during an > install than you will setting up redhat and using if for months. The > install docs are very detailed, and explain how things work. > > -Josh Josh - Have you ever run a dual boot XP and Gentoo? I noticed another post that you use XP too. I'd like to figure out how to do this and not blow up XP, need XP for work until I get better at the Linux configs. Any recommendations? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 11:31:15 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:29 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <16758.37587.223563.995921@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "rbentz" == rbentz writes: >> >> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:01:58 -0500, rbentz@dunwoody.edu >> wrote: >> > If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would rbentz> it >> > be? >> > I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, >> > processes, setups, and other geek stuff. >> > Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows >> > does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network >> > configs, (the list goes on) >> > >> > Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but >> > think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With rbentz> the >> > thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new rbentz> set of >> > skills/methods for computing. >> > >> > Too broad of a question? Thoughts? >> > >> > Rob >> >> My thought would be to use gentoo. You'll learn more during an >> install than you will setting up redhat and using if for months. The >> install docs are very detailed, and explain how things work. >> >> -Josh rbentz> Josh - Have you ever run a dual boot XP and Gentoo? I noticed another rbentz> post that you use XP too. I'd like to figure out how to do this and not rbentz> blow up XP, need XP for work until I get better at the Linux configs. rbentz> Any recommendations? I've got a dual-boot Mandrake + XP machine. I use Mandrake, because well, I got started with it a long time ago (liked the KDE feel better than the old RedHat Gnome feel), and now I don't feel like wasting the time to learn another. [So leave me out of the distro flame war!] Reasons why Mandrake might be good: prebuilt (if you want to use gentoo, just ignore this altogether); comes with tools to resize your Windows NTFS partitions for dual-boot w/o having to buy partition magic; allegedly has easier install process (I don't go recreationally doing Linux installs, so I can't compare this with others). Cheers, R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Wed Oct 20 11:24:01 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <1098289441.41769121a8e6b@my.visi.com> Been a while sense I've seen a question that will stir the pot like this one :-O What do you want to learn? If you want to learn "Linux" then install a base system (no X-windows) and grow it to where you want to go. For this Debian would be a good choice because it has apt-get and other tools for installing applications over the wire that are very easy to use. If you want to use office applications and the guts don't matter then Fedora Core 2 may the way to go. This is only my humble opinion. Putting on flame proof suit, standing in lake Minnetonka, and holding a fire extinguisher, LOL! Sam. Quoting "rbentz@dunwoody.edu" : > > If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it > be? > I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, > processes, setups, and other geek stuff. > Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows > does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network > configs, (the list goes on) > > Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but > think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the > thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of > skills/methods for computing. > > Too broad of a question? Thoughts? > > Rob > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 11:27:51 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <4a0cafe204102008153ee28de5@mail.gmail.com> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBC5@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <4a0cafe204102008153ee28de5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16758.37383.41473.651721@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Josh" == Josh Close writes: Josh> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:01:58 -0500, rbentz@dunwoody.edu Josh> wrote: >> If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it >> be? >> I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, >> processes, setups, and other geek stuff. >> Skill area is intermediate, mainly confused about the things windows >> does easily - drivers, updates, kernel compiles, dual boots, network >> configs, (the list goes on) >> >> Goal: Build an optimized home system (very curious about gentoo but >> think I might drown in steps) and it would run on a laptop. With the >> thought in mind to get rid of windo$e for a while and learn a new set of >> skills/methods for computing. >> >> Too broad of a question? Thoughts? >> >> Rob Josh> My thought would be to use gentoo. You'll learn more during an Josh> install than you will setting up redhat and using if for months. The Josh> install docs are very detailed, and explain how things work. I would actually recommend one of the more pre-built distros. Rob seems to want to learn about tools, processes, etc. I think it would be fine to first install a ready-built distribution, get familiar with using linux day-to-day, profiting from someone else having done a lot of the work, then move to gentoo. but then, I'm not sure what "intermediate" means in Rob's original message... But I had about a decade of work on Solaris before I started using Linux, and I sure wouldn't have wanted to jump right into gentoo! OTOH, for me that was a decade of USER work on Solaris, with not one day of sysadmin work, so YMMV. R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 12:00:28 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <4a0cafe2041020100073acfcc0@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 11:20:03 -0500, rbentz@dunwoody.edu wrote: > Josh - Have you ever run a dual boot XP and Gentoo? I noticed another > post that you use XP too. I'd like to figure out how to do this and not > blow up XP, need XP for work until I get better at the Linux configs. > Any recommendations? Yes, I have. I set it up from an empty drive though. My suggestion would be to do the same, or use partition magic or some tool to move the partitions around. It's pretty simple how it works. It's all documented in the gentoo install doc also. You just setup your linux partitions, then make one extra for xp. /dev/hda1 - boot partition, where grub and linux kernel are stored /dev/hda2 - swap partition, where linux swap is used /dev/hda3 - / (root) partition, where all your linux stuff will go /dev/hda4 - xp partition Each of these are a different filesystem also, but that's explained in detail in the docs. You can also setup all the linux partition in one partition if you want to. Just preference I guess. You will want the boot partition to be bootable, and not the xp partition. Then you can have grub ( or lilo ) have a menu with a list of linux kernels to boot into, or xp. You can make it default into xp if you want also. I would suggest reading the gentoo docs. There is a lot of information there. The setup is really easy once you've made it through the first time or so. If you run into any troubles, the gentoo forums are a very helpful place to find a lot of good information. People there are very helpful also. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 20 12:18:34 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ACLs [was VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies")] In-Reply-To: <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> Message-ID: <41769DEA.9010807@visi.com> Jim Crumley wrote: >On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 12:38:42AM -0500, Jeff Nelson wrote: > > >>First, VMS is secure because security was designed into the operating >>system, not added as an afterthought. For example, the 4-layer ring >>design, where the core ring is the most trusted (kernel mode) and the >>outer ring least trusted (user mode). Another example: the >>specialization of privileges and access control lists. There's just one >>privilege (root) with Linux, though access control lists are starting to >>appear. >> >> > >What are advantages of ACLs? How do they benefit a medium-sized >network? I understand that they are more flexible than the >traditional Unix groups approach, but they are also more complex >to deal with. I have not seen any good case studies or >documentation that explains what problems ACLs solve better than >groups. Well-designed Linux distributions have few processes >running as root. I realize that there are situations where the >extra power of ACLs would come in handy, but most networks don't >even make full use of the power of groups. Why should we expect >them to use ACLs effectively? > > > My personal opinion is that it isn't possible to properly secure a production system without the ability to absolutely deny access of a system resource to specific individuals and classes of users. ACLs let you do that fairly easily. They also let you make ad hoc access available to specific resources without having to construct narrowly defined groups, i.e. the files in /home/dev are available to all members of dev, but I want to make buglist.txt available to management without constructing a dev+management group to access that particular file. With ACLs I can pick a file, or directory, or resource (say a CD writer) and make it available to a particular individual or group and deny it to everyone else. And if you belong to a group that has been denied access, you are denied access to the resource regardless of whatever other privileges you may have via memberships in other groups. Most commercial OSs support some form of ACL even if it may be optional; for example, AIX supports the normal unix wgu-rwx file controls but also allows you to apply additional controls using their ACL system. Most good admins with access the ACLs make pretty good use of it. In our Windows system we have different groups for different studies and functions within the study. Those groups are given access to different areas on the server and people are added to the appropriate groups as required. Then 'Everyone' is denied access to the entire file system. Even with admin privileges I can't see large parts of the data unless I want to take ownership of the files and add myself to the ACL. It gets used because it is easier. >Anyway, if anyone has any links to some good information on >ACLs, I would appreciate seeing them. I keep hearing about them, >but I cannot understand the fascination. > > > The SUSE folks have a couple and I would expect that the NSA SELinux has some detailed docs floating around. --rick http://www.nsa.gov/selinux/index.cfm http://www.suse.de/~agruen/acl/linux-acls/linux-acls-final.pdf http://www.suse.de/~agruen/acl/chapter/fs_acl-en.pdf _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at askewview.net Wed Oct 20 12:11:30 2004 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EC1E@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> Message-ID: <6063.134.29.178.254.1098292290.squirrel@134.29.178.254> Rob, I run Gentoo and Windows XP on my dell laptop. The Gentoo installation handbook provides excelent detail for installation and getting grub to boot Gentoo and Windows Xp. One thing to beware of, by default Gentoo compiles everything on the fly. If you dont have a faster machine be prepared for it to take for ever. Even on my 3.06GHz p4 it took 5-6 hours to get gentoo installed and get X installed Adam > Josh - Have you ever run a dual boot XP and Gentoo? I noticed another > post that you use XP too. I'd like to figure out how to do this and not > blow up XP, need XP for work until I get better at the Linux configs. > Any recommendations? > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Oct 20 12:49:45 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:29:07 -0500 Thomas Johnson wrote: > rob, > > when i finally learned linux for real i wiped windows, loaded > slackware (www.slackware.com), gave my windows discs to a buddy with > the instruction to not let me have them back for at least a year. > talk about trial by fire. obviously your mileage may vary and mine > might not have been the wisest choice, but i think slackware is a > good distro if you really want to learn about how things work rather > than just use linux. other's here will vehemently disagree with me, > but that's my two cents. I vehemently agree with your recommendation. If you are ok with a little trial by fire I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better distro than slackware. If you're looking for pretty Windows-esque GUI's to configure your sound card best to stay with Redhat, SuSE or Mandrake. After years of frustration I personally refuse to install a distro that's based on RPMs for packages (Redhat, SuSE and others). Debian is also a nice choice that's in the middle-ground if you don't need bleeding edge stuff. None of the above mentioned distros are evil, I just developed by preferences over time. My recomendation, find an old pc you can play with and not worry about, try a distro for a while, if you don't like it try another, or setup a dual/triple-boot. Stick around on the list long enough and someone will eventually be selling cheap hardware if you don't have a spare PC. My $0.02. P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames as my personal favorites: PostgreSQL or MySQL? PhP, Perl or Python? What's the best MTA? :) Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From narshe at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 13:26:35 2004 From: narshe at gmail.com (Josh Close) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <4a0cafe204102011265a6e708e@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 12:49:45 -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames > as my personal favorites: > > PostgreSQL or MySQL? > PhP, Perl or Python? > What's the best MTA? > > :) > > Josh Hmm...... Postgres, Python, Postfix...... Triple P. -Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rotbau at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 13:31:29 2004 From: rotbau at gmail.com (rotbau) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello all, I am running SUSE 9.0. I am having some problems with a recently installed HP Surestore DAT 40. When I try and run a backup, the computer freezes, slowly at first and then progressively gets more locked up. Here is what happens. Start Backup BU software starts the jobs and hits a good xfer rate. Usually within 30-50 seconds of starting the job the backup throughput falls and eventually goes to 0. The tape drive stops receiving data (light stops flashing). The backup software interface still functions but becomes increasingly unresponsive. Same with the GUI interface. Eventually all user interfaces lock up. If I run a very small backup job (like the htdocs directory) it will work fine. Any larger job causes the hang. No matter how long I wait, the software never generates and error message. Also, nothing in any of the log files I checked to say what is happening. This box has apache and qmail running on it as well. When it is locking up, I can still access the apache test page text, but the graphic won't load. I can telnet to qmail but it won't send any mail. Here is the setup. Compaq Smart 2SL attached to 2 x 9 GB drives in RAID 1 and 1 36 GB drive. HP DAT is connected to on board Adaptec 7860 controller along with a NEC cdrom drive. The CD is the last device on the chain. Backup software tried (both Tapeware and Arkeia). All drives appear as expected. I can format tapes in the drive and have been able to work with as expected until I start a backup job. I suspect it is a hardware issue. The 7860 is a ultra/narrow controller whereas the DAT drive is a Ultra/LVD drive. Is it possible that this is the cause? Could the location of the DAT on the cable be a problem, should it be last? This server also has a 7890 on-board controller that is Ultra/LVD, but when I enable it the machine won't boot to the Compaq raid controller. I think I need to disable some stuff in the scsi bios to fix that problem, but I haven't had time. The compaq 2sl also has a second channel, but the documentation that came with the dat suggests you shouldn't connect it to a raid controller if possible. Any suggestions on where to look for this problem would be helpful. Thanks in advance. rotbau _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Wed Oct 20 13:37:52 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: LATE BREAKING NEWS ABOUT INSTALLFEST In-Reply-To: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin>; from clay@fandre.com on Sat, Oct 16, 2004 at 11:57:29AM -0500 References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: <20041020133752.A5020@thinkunix.net> Clay Fandre wrote: > Next TCLUG Installfest > > When: > Saturday, Oct 23rd, 2004 11:00 am - 5:00 pm > > Info: > In return for the free use of the space and network folks who attend > the installfest should purchase food/drink from the Cafe in the > building. We need an approximate headcount of the number that plan on > attending and that are interested in pizza. The Cafe will make the > pizza. Sandwiches are also available. We would pay the Cafe for the > food/drinks. > > A poster for the installfest can be found here: > http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/installfest-poster-20041023.pdf > Please help promote the installfest by printing it out and posting it > where appropriate. > > Where: > The Renaissance Box > 509 Sibley Street > Saint Paul, MN 55101 > 1st floor North > http://www.renbox.com > > Directions: http://www.renbox.com/content.asp?id=26 > > Parking: > There's a parking lot across the street from the building (North side > of 10th St). It's $2/day on weekends. Otherwise there are meters > around the side streets and you DO have to pay on Saturdays. > > There are several one-way streets around the building. If you get > lost, go North on Jackson St to 10th St. Turn East (right) on 10th St. > The parking lot will be on your left across from the building. You > can't miss the building. There's a big sign on the top that says > "Renaissance Box" on it. Folks, Additional details about this weekend's installfest; please read and heed. - There are about 60 FREE PARKING spaces on the weekend at the 1st Baptist church parking lot; you'll see the church as you're driving around. - Don't park in the lot at the grocery store on 10th St or YOU WILL BE TOWED. - NO FOOD OR DRINK CAN BE BROUGHT IN. In order to get the space for free, we need to buy food/drinks from the cafe. The cafe has great coffee, soda, chips, sandwiches and pizza. I had to pre-order pizzas so they would be ready for Saturday. If we buy 15 pizzas and buy drinks from the cafe we're covered. If not I'll get charged for the space and I don't have that kind of cash. I don't think this is too much to ask of folks in exchange for the free event space, network, etc. - We need to have the room cleared by 4:30pm as there is another event happening right after ours. If you plan to install gentoo or some other LFS/roll-your-own/compile everything from scratch distro, my advise is to arrive early and have a fast machine. I will take the network down when closing time arrives. You have been warned. - Wireless access is available but we ask that folks only use it for casual websurfing, email, ssh, etc. PLEASE DO NOT DOWNLOAD ISOS OR ATTEMPTED INSTALLS OVER THE WIRELESS NETWORK. If someone wants to bring their own wireless AP, you can plug it into the "installfest" network that I will have setup and install over that. We just need to be considerate of the buildings other tenants and customers. - Please bring switches, network cables, power strips or any other cables/accessories you need to make your computer go. I will have a couple 8 port switches there but we will obviously need more. - BYOM (bring your own CDR/CDRW media). I will have my book of ISOs but I don't have a burner in the installfest server or any media. I will have some isos locally for ftp installs (RH9, slackware 10.0, possibly others as time permits). If you have questions/comments contact me directly off list or directly at 612.823.2781. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Wed Oct 20 13:41:07 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <1098297667.4176b1438bf27@my.visi.com> Old PC is a GREAT idea it lets you break it before doing your main machine. I have more computers then I should have but each machine has it's purpose. F&P Server, Web Server, workstation, mobile, test, and my wife and kids each have machines. I don't have to beg to use the computer and I don't have to deal with their problems on a machine I use for what ever purpose. Sam. Quoting Josh Trutwin : > On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:29:07 -0500 > Thomas Johnson wrote: > > > rob, > > > > when i finally learned linux for real i wiped windows, loaded > > slackware (www.slackware.com), gave my windows discs to a buddy with > > the instruction to not let me have them back for at least a year. > > talk about trial by fire. obviously your mileage may vary and mine > > might not have been the wisest choice, but i think slackware is a > > good distro if you really want to learn about how things work rather > > than just use linux. other's here will vehemently disagree with me, > > but that's my two cents. > > I vehemently agree with your recommendation. If you are ok with a > little trial by fire I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better > distro than slackware. If you're looking for pretty Windows-esque > GUI's to configure your sound card best to stay with Redhat, SuSE or > Mandrake. After years of frustration I personally refuse to install a > distro that's based on RPMs for packages (Redhat, SuSE and others). > Debian is also a nice choice that's in the middle-ground if you don't > need bleeding edge stuff. > > None of the above mentioned distros are evil, I just developed by > preferences over time. My recomendation, find an old pc you can play > with and not worry about, try a distro for a while, if you don't like > it try another, or setup a dual/triple-boot. Stick around on the list > long enough and someone will eventually be selling cheap hardware if > you don't have a spare PC. > > My $0.02. > > P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames > as my personal favorites: > > PostgreSQL or MySQL? > PhP, Perl or Python? > What's the best MTA? > > :) > > Josh > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 13:35:46 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <1098289441.41769121a8e6b@my.visi.com> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1098289441.41769121a8e6b@my.visi.com> Message-ID: <16758.45058.905342.973084@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "smac" == smac writes: smac> Been a while sense I've seen a question that will stir the smac> pot like this one :-O What do you want to learn? smac> If you want to learn "Linux" then install a base system (no smac> X-windows) and grow it to where you want to go. For this smac> Debian would be a good choice because it has apt-get and smac> other tools for installing applications over the wire that smac> are very easy to use. [I hope this isn't a flame] I can't imagine anyone wanting a non-X windows linux system. Even if your Mr. Text Mode like me, and mostly use the command-line and emacs, X is too handy to give up. E.g., I love hopping back and forth between multiple konsole tabs, like having bigger console and Emacs windows, like having multiple emacs frames, like having my choice of readable black fonts on nice mild gray backgrounds, etc., etc. And I'm MORE of a text-using geezer than just about anyone I know! I don't see that no X means "learning linux" --- it sounds more like learning pdp-11 Unix to me! :-) Note that this would NOT be true if you're interrested in learning to run a secure, production-quality SERVER. In that case no-X is perfectly reasonable. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From obelin23 at gmail.com Wed Oct 20 13:53:12 2004 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:30 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <72278d104102011536dbc0567@mail.gmail.com> Here's another $.02 for Slackware from a relative newcomer to Linux. I first started with Linux last March, starting with Mandrake, and I've played with a half-dozen or so distros. I switched to Slackware for my main machine this year. I find Slackware to be simple, uncluttered, clean, fast and very stable. (I dual-boot it with WinXP). It think it's a good distro to use if you want to really get to know how Linux works. If you do try Slack, the Slackware forum on linuxquestions.org is worth checking out. As one of the people on that list said - Slack's not hard, it just makes you learn faster. (For that matter, I think it's reputation for difficulty is greatly overstated.) I think it's obvious from this list that your task is not to find the one good distro. From what I can see you have a plethora of really good choices. You might find it amusing to nose around distrowatch.com, both to compare distros and to see what a wide choice you have. Cheers, Charles Null Obert (I have no middle name, and yes, I did get mail addressed to me like that.) On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 12:49:45 -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:29:07 -0500 > Thomas Johnson wrote: > > > rob, > > > > when i finally learned linux for real i wiped windows, loaded > > slackware (www.slackware.com), gave my windows discs to a buddy with > > the instruction to not let me have them back for at least a year. > > talk about trial by fire. obviously your mileage may vary and mine > > might not have been the wisest choice, but i think slackware is a > > good distro if you really want to learn about how things work rather > > than just use linux. other's here will vehemently disagree with me, > > but that's my two cents. > > I vehemently agree with your recommendation. If you are ok with a > little trial by fire I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better > distro than slackware. If you're looking for pretty Windows-esque > GUI's to configure your sound card best to stay with Redhat, SuSE or > Mandrake. After years of frustration I personally refuse to install a > distro that's based on RPMs for packages (Redhat, SuSE and others). > Debian is also a nice choice that's in the middle-ground if you don't > need bleeding edge stuff. > > None of the above mentioned distros are evil, I just developed by > preferences over time. My recomendation, find an old pc you can play > with and not worry about, try a distro for a while, if you don't like > it try another, or setup a dual/triple-boot. Stick around on the list > long enough and someone will eventually be selling cheap hardware if > you don't have a spare PC. > > My $0.02. > > P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames > as my personal favorites: > > PostgreSQL or MySQL? > PhP, Perl or Python? > What's the best MTA? > > :) > > Josh > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Wed Oct 20 13:37:52 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] Re: LATE BREAKING NEWS ABOUT INSTALLFEST In-Reply-To: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin>; from clay@fandre.com on Sat, Oct 16, 2004 at 11:57:29AM -0500 References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: <20041020133752.A5020@thinkunix.net> Clay Fandre wrote: > Next TCLUG Installfest > > When: > Saturday, Oct 23rd, 2004 11:00 am - 5:00 pm > > Info: > In return for the free use of the space and network folks who attend > the installfest should purchase food/drink from the Cafe in the > building. We need an approximate headcount of the number that plan on > attending and that are interested in pizza. The Cafe will make the > pizza. Sandwiches are also available. We would pay the Cafe for the > food/drinks. > > A poster for the installfest can be found here: > http://www.mn-linux.org/installfest/installfest-poster-20041023.pdf > Please help promote the installfest by printing it out and posting it > where appropriate. > > Where: > The Renaissance Box > 509 Sibley Street > Saint Paul, MN 55101 > 1st floor North > http://www.renbox.com > > Directions: http://www.renbox.com/content.asp?id=26 > > Parking: > There's a parking lot across the street from the building (North side > of 10th St). It's $2/day on weekends. Otherwise there are meters > around the side streets and you DO have to pay on Saturdays. > > There are several one-way streets around the building. If you get > lost, go North on Jackson St to 10th St. Turn East (right) on 10th St. > The parking lot will be on your left across from the building. You > can't miss the building. There's a big sign on the top that says > "Renaissance Box" on it. Folks, Additional details about this weekend's installfest; please read and heed. - There are about 60 FREE PARKING spaces on the weekend at the 1st Baptist church parking lot; you'll see the church as you're driving around. - Don't park in the lot at the grocery store on 10th St or YOU WILL BE TOWED. - NO FOOD OR DRINK CAN BE BROUGHT IN. In order to get the space for free, we need to buy food/drinks from the cafe. The cafe has great coffee, soda, chips, sandwiches and pizza. I had to pre-order pizzas so they would be ready for Saturday. If we buy 15 pizzas and buy drinks from the cafe we're covered. If not I'll get charged for the space and I don't have that kind of cash. I don't think this is too much to ask of folks in exchange for the free event space, network, etc. - We need to have the room cleared by 4:30pm as there is another event happening right after ours. If you plan to install gentoo or some other LFS/roll-your-own/compile everything from scratch distro, my advise is to arrive early and have a fast machine. I will take the network down when closing time arrives. You have been warned. - Wireless access is available but we ask that folks only use it for casual websurfing, email, ssh, etc. PLEASE DO NOT DOWNLOAD ISOS OR ATTEMPTED INSTALLS OVER THE WIRELESS NETWORK. If someone wants to bring their own wireless AP, you can plug it into the "installfest" network that I will have setup and install over that. We just need to be considerate of the buildings other tenants and customers. - Please bring switches, network cables, power strips or any other cables/accessories you need to make your computer go. I will have a couple 8 port switches there but we will obviously need more. - BYOM (bring your own CDR/CDRW media). I will have my book of ISOs but I don't have a burner in the installfest server or any media. I will have some isos locally for ftp installs (RH9, slackware 10.0, possibly others as time permits). If you have questions/comments contact me directly off list or directly at 612.823.2781. -- scot _______________________________________________ Twin Cities Linux Users Group Announcements - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota http://www.mn-linux.org tclug-announce mailing list tclug-announce@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-announce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nassarmu at redconcepts.net Wed Oct 20 14:01:19 2004 From: nassarmu at redconcepts.net (Munir Nassar) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <16758.45058.905342.973084@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1098289441.41769121a8e6b@my.visi.com> <16758.45058.905342.973084@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <4176B5FF.9070809@redconcepts.net> rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > I can't imagine anyone wanting a non-X windows linux system. Even if > your Mr. Text Mode like me, and mostly use the command-line and emacs, > X is too handy to give up. E.g., I love hopping back and forth > between multiple konsole tabs, like having bigger console and Emacs > windows, like having multiple emacs frames, like having my choice of > readable black fonts on nice mild gray backgrounds, etc., etc. but you can do all that in console, first off compile the fb driver that corresponds to your videocard into the kernel, (in my case it is a neofb) and compile in framebuffer console support. if you do not have a driver for your video card you can try vesafb or better yet vesafb-tng add video=neofb:1024x768-16@60 to get a nice big screen, if your video card supporta a higher resolution go for it. use screen or twin to get the windowing abilities. use setterm to change the colours like: setterm -foreground green -background black to get your greenscreen back... or in your case you probably want -foreground black -background white really now... dump that X and free up the memory for more usefull stuff. -- Munir Nassar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From chewie at wookimus.net Wed Oct 20 14:37:34 2004 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Home Networks... Message-ID: <20041020193734.GN18495@wookimus.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 15:27:53 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <4a0cafe204102011265a6e708e@mail.gmail.com> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> <4a0cafe204102011265a6e708e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16758.51785.466365.415944@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Josh" == Josh Close writes: Josh> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 12:49:45 -0500, Josh Trutwin Josh> wrote: >> P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames >> as my personal favorites: >> >> PostgreSQL or MySQL? >> PhP, Perl or Python? >> What's the best MTA? >> >> :) >> >> Josh Josh> Hmm...... Postgres, Python, Postfix...... Triple P. P...p...P What begins with P? Postgres, Python, Postfix P...p...P >From Dr. Torvalds' A-B-C.... R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rbentz at dunwoody.edu Wed Oct 20 15:32:20 2004 From: rbentz at dunwoody.edu (rbentz@dunwoody.edu) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro Message-ID: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7ED65@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> > smac@visi.com wrote: > > Been a while sense I've seen a question that will stir the pot like this > one :-O > > What do you want to learn? > > If you want to learn "Linux" then install a base system (no X-windows) and > grow > it to where you want to go. For this Debian would be a good choice because > it > has apt-get and other tools for installing applications over the wire that > are > very easy to use. > > If you want to use office applications and the guts don't matter then > Fedora > Core 2 may the way to go. > > This is only my humble opinion. > > Putting on flame proof suit, standing in lake Minnetonka, and holding a > fire > extinguisher, LOL! > > Sam. > > Quoting "rbentz@dunwoody.edu" : > > > > > If you were to recommend a distro for someone to learn on what would it > > be? > > I would like to understand the common things about linux -- tools, > > processes, setups, and other geek stuff. Well I knew I was taking a chance that y'all might think I was trollin' but really what I'd like to do is learn the common things. I understand the Linux file system and the directory structure, and user setup but it ends there. I've setup X on Slack seemed simple enough, are the X config tools the same for all distros? I have good scripting knowledge, understand networking fluently (name resolution, subnets, firewalls, etc.) but no clue how to get all that stuff packed into a linux box. Examples of things I've had go wrong with no clue where to start are: Network communication: Do I have an address, is the gateway right? Boot Failure: How to view partition info, active partition, boot config etc. Device not working: Where is the driver, is there a Device mangler? This has got to be one of the basic tools that exist in all distros, right? Or maybe not? That's what I want to start with, what tools/configs/processes are common on say 70% of Linux. I've read the huge sections of the gentoo docs and get lost in things like "make." Is that in all Linux too? So maybe that helps clarify my understanding/skills... _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 15:27:06 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <16758.51738.581158.301612@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Josh" == Josh Trutwin writes: Josh> On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:29:07 -0500 Josh> Thomas Johnson wrote: Josh> P.S. I don't think this question will generate nearly as many flames Josh> as my personal favorites: Josh> PostgreSQL or MySQL? Josh> PhP, Perl or Python? Josh> What's the best MTA? Josh> :) Gee, what do you have against Emacs or vm? :-) R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cdf123 at cdf123.net Wed Oct 20 16:00:24 2004 From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Logging network trafic/Parental Control Message-ID: <4176D1E8.3000505@cdf123.net> Hi all, I was wondering if anyone has dealt with a parental log of some sort with Linux. Not so much of a firewall that blocks traffic, but more of a system log of sites/ip addresses that were accessed. Something that you can just set up a client computer with a gateway and at the end of the month (or whenever you wanted), get a report of the activity that was done. Price might be an issue, so free is better. I'd even be willing to piece one together myself. Maybe a tcpdump outputting to files that can be parsed by perl/php into a nice web report. The common areas would be easy (http/https/ftp/etc...) but I wouldn't know much about monitoring chatting/IM programs. Any ideas or recommendations on what I could do? Thanks Chris Frederick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Wed Oct 20 16:17:56 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Logging network trafic/Parental Control In-Reply-To: <4176D1E8.3000505@cdf123.net> References: <4176D1E8.3000505@cdf123.net> Message-ID: <20041020211756.GD79735@therub.org> On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 04:00:24PM -0500, Chris Frederick wrote: > Hi all, > > I was wondering if anyone has dealt with a parental log of some sort > with Linux. Not so much of a firewall that blocks traffic, but more of > a system log of sites/ip addresses that were accessed. Something that > you can just set up a client computer with a gateway and at the end of > the month (or whenever you wanted), get a report of the activity that > was done. > > Price might be an issue, so free is better. > > I'd even be willing to piece one together myself. Maybe a tcpdump > outputting to files that can be parsed by perl/php into a nice web > report. The common areas would be easy (http/https/ftp/etc...) but I > wouldn't know much about monitoring chatting/IM programs. > > Any ideas or recommendations on what I could do? > > Thanks > > Chris Frederick Yeah, I had to set this up at work *sigh*.. What I ended up doing was set up a squid cache proxy on my firewall, then in my firewall ruleset redirect outgoing port 80 to localhost 3129 (i think that's the right port..). Squid by default logs all activity. There's a nice squid log analyzer called sarg that creates nice traffic reports per IP. I think I have some notes on a wiki somewhere. Let me know if you need help. It also might be worth looking at some of the firewall distros - i don't know but i'd suspect one of them has something like dans guardian built in (which is an add on to the setup above to actually block content). Dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Wed Oct 20 16:49:19 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <4176B5FF.9070809@redconcepts.net> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1098289441.41769121a8e6b@my.visi.com> <16758.45058.905342.973084@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <4176B5FF.9070809@redconcepts.net> Message-ID: <16758.56671.117707.526130@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Munir" == Munir Nassar writes: Munir> rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: >> I can't imagine anyone wanting a non-X windows linux system. Even if >> your Mr. Text Mode like me, and mostly use the command-line and emacs, >> X is too handy to give up. E.g., I love hopping back and forth >> between multiple konsole tabs, like having bigger console and Emacs >> windows, like having multiple emacs frames, like having my choice of >> readable black fonts on nice mild gray backgrounds, etc., etc. Munir> but you can do all that in console, Munir> first off compile the fb driver that corresponds to your videocard into Munir> the kernel, (in my case it is a neofb) and compile in framebuffer Munir> console support. Munir> if you do not have a driver for your video card you can try vesafb or Munir> better yet vesafb-tng Munir> add video=neofb:1024x768-16@60 to get a nice big screen, if your video Munir> card supporta a higher resolution go for it. Munir> use screen or twin to get the windowing abilities. Munir> use setterm to change the colours like: Munir> setterm -foreground green -background black to get your greenscreen Munir> back... or in your case you probably want -foreground black -background Munir> white Munir> really now... dump that X and free up the memory for more Munir> usefull stuff. You meant to put a :-) on this, right? cycles are cheap. memory is cheap. I have a dual-p4 3Gig with 1 G of memory that cost O($500) from Dell. my time is expensive. I suppose I COULD do all that to show that it's possible, but why would I? Why would you? Especially since every now and then I *do* want to examine images, like scientific plots, other peoples' articles in pdf, etc. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Wed Oct 20 17:06:59 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <4176014D.4000602@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <4176014D.4000602@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4176E183.4030208@visi.com> Jeff Nelson wrote: > Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > >> I can certainly understand the cases where there are long-term >> projects tied to applications developed against software tightly tied >> to VMS - think CCCS or ARIC - where the cost of redeploying the >> applications isn't funded. But only a complete idiot would be doing >> new development against VMS. The Alpha chip is toast, there's no >> migration/upgrade path, support is going away, software is >> expensive/obsolete/proprietary, ... stop me anytime ... :-) > > > OK, you can stop. :-) > > First, Alpha research and development has ended, but that does not > mean the end of Alpha systems. See HP's published roadmaps for Alpha > systems. > > Second, there is a migration path: > http://www.hp.com/products1/evolution/alpha_retaintrust/index.html . > > OpenVMS is running today on the HP Integrity Server platform running > the Intel Itanium processor. The operating system is in field test, > with a production release (version 8.2) scheduled for the end of this > year. You can obtain an SDK by going to the migration website noted > above. > > Third, support is not going away. See the HP roadmaps. > > Forth, applications are being ported to OpenVMS I64. The > above-mentioned migration site contains information, as does the > independent website www.openvms.org. > > I hope I've corrected any misconceptions. Please feel free to contact > me (offlist) if you would like more information. OK, you can stop - I stand corrected :-) --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cdf123 at cdf123.net Wed Oct 20 17:13:36 2004 From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Logging network trafic/Parental Control In-Reply-To: <20041020211756.GD79735@therub.org> References: <4176D1E8.3000505@cdf123.net> <20041020211756.GD79735@therub.org> Message-ID: <4176E310.20008@cdf123.net> Dan Rue wrote: > Yeah, I had to set this up at work *sigh*.. > > What I ended up doing was set up a squid cache proxy on my firewall, > then in my firewall ruleset redirect outgoing port 80 to localhost 3129 > (i think that's the right port..). > > Squid by default logs all activity. There's a nice squid log analyzer > called sarg that creates nice traffic reports per IP. > > I think I have some notes on a wiki somewhere. Let me know if you need > help. > > It also might be worth looking at some of the firewall distros - i don't > know but i'd suspect one of them has something like dans guardian built > in (which is an add on to the setup above to actually block content). > > Dan > That would be great, could you send me a snip of a report? The sarg site has a sample up and it looks great, but all it shows is the HOST, and not the GET. If it can show the GET lines, then you can see exactly what files were accessed on the site. If the site is something like members.tripod.com, the GET line could be either "GET /~linux_user/index.php" or "GET /~ms_user/exploits.asp". One is clearly more devious than the other, but if all that is known is the HOST, you can't tell if it was ok or not. I'm doing this for a non-tech family right now so thats why I'm asking/being picky. :) If this goes well, I'll probably use the same setup myself. Are you doing anything for IM (msn/icq/aol/yahoo)? These are the tricky ones since most traffic will be sent to a server, I'll probably have to analyze the content instead, maybe by a keyword search or something (I don't want to steal ALL of the kids' privacy). I don't think I'd set it up to block traffic, having the kids know that their parents are monitoring them online should be enough of a deterrent. That and a system that just blocks everything is bound to have flaws or make false positives/negatives, and can make for lazy parents. If they want to in the future, at least I will know that it's available, as long as it logs/reports what it's doing. With a report, if something comes up, the parents can deal with it in their own way. Having the content blocked, without anyone knowing, wouldn't change the bad behavior, parental intervention would have better luck. Thanks for the info Chris Frederick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Wed Oct 20 17:06:05 2004 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:31 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] good beginner distro In-Reply-To: <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> References: <6AB7D20645D1E345942B8D67BFFF8DCD03F7EBCD@web31.dunwoody.tec.mn.us> <1469cda204102008294df4337f@mail.gmail.com> <20041020124945.00003776@jtrutwinxp.ntbsi.bsi.corp> Message-ID: <20041020170605.A13135@baker.space.umn.edu> On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 12:49:45PM -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > I vehemently agree with your recommendation. If you are ok with a > little trial by fire I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better > distro than slackware. If you're looking for pretty Windows-esque > GUI's to configure your sound card best to stay with Redhat, SuSE or > Mandrake. After years of frustration I personally refuse to install a > distro that's based on RPMs for packages (Redhat, SuSE and others). > Debian is also a nice choice that's in the middle-ground if you don't > need bleeding edge stuff. How does Debian unstable not have software that's bleeding edge? its been a while since I have played with Gentoo, but my impression has always been that new software gets into Debian unstable at least as fast as Gentoo. If by bleeding edge, you mean compiled on you own box, well the benfits of compiling yourself are far from proven for most software. But that's just my Debian-centric view, I know that many Gentoo-heads feel differently :). Anyway, I would (surprise, surprise) recommend Debian in this situation. Debian is good for someone who isn't afraid to roll-up their sleeves and dive in in order to see what's really going on on their box. I find Debian easier to maintain then Gentoo or Slackware, while also easier to do what you want it to then Red Hat, Mandrake, or Suse. -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at askewview.net Wed Oct 20 17:17:09 2004 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Home Networks... In-Reply-To: <20041020193734.GN18495@wookimus.net> References: <20041020193734.GN18495@wookimus.net> Message-ID: <4176E3E5.4080802@askewview.net> Ipcop makes it nice and easy to talk an old 133mhz+ with a gig harddrive or so and turn it in to a great home nat box Adam Chad Walstrom wrote: >THREAD BREAK... > >smac@visi.com wrote: > > >>purpose. F&P Server, Web Server, workstation, mobile, test, and my >>wife and kids each have machines. I don't have to beg to use the >>computer and I don't have to deal with their problems on a machine I >>use for what ever purpose. >> >> > >This is a very good setup. My workstation used to do double-duty as a >firewall/NAT box, but that proved inflexible when I wanted to go to LAN >parties. My wife would no longer be able to get on-line with the >wireless-laptop. The ideal, basic home network should include a >separate firewall/proxy box, a file server, and either multiple >workstations or one "terminal server" and many "thin clients", in >addition to any special workstations you might need. I just think it'd >be cool to have touch-screen consoles in each room. ;-) > >Honestly, I don't foresee my children ever needing a separate >workstation for themselves. Of course, I'm a BOFH and control-freak, so >YMMV. > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Wed Oct 20 19:03:49 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Logging network trafic/Parental Control In-Reply-To: <4176E310.20008@cdf123.net> References: <4176D1E8.3000505@cdf123.net> <20041020211756.GD79735@therub.org> <4176E310.20008@cdf123.net> Message-ID: <20041021000349.GE79735@therub.org> On Wed, Oct 20, 2004 at 05:13:36PM -0500, Chris Frederick wrote: > >What I ended up doing was set up a squid cache proxy on my firewall, > >then in my firewall ruleset redirect outgoing port 80 to localhost 3129 > >(i think that's the right port..). > > > >Squid by default logs all activity. There's a nice squid log analyzer > >called sarg that creates nice traffic reports per IP. > > That would be great, could you send me a snip of a report? The sarg > site has a sample up and it looks great, but all it shows is the HOST, > and not the GET. If it can show the GET lines, then you can see exactly > what files were accessed on the site. If the site is something like > members.tripod.com, the GET line could be either "GET > /~linux_user/index.php" or "GET /~ms_user/exploits.asp". One is clearly > more devious than the other, but if all that is known is the HOST, you > can't tell if it was ok or not. I only ran sarg long enough to check it out - I don't like the privacy invasion, either, unless I have to (i.e. the PHB tells me to). I'll put the sample that I have up at http://therub.org/squid-reports. It looks like it only breaks it up by domains - if you want specific GET requests you'll have to grep the squid access log yourself, probably. It seems like looking by domain would be sufficient, thoguh - at least to get an idea the sites that are being frequented (check out the "Topsites" report). The squid.conf file is enormous, and has setting to block based on a regular expression against the url, domain based, etc - and can be really useful for blocking malicious content, if you need to eventually. > Are you doing anything for IM (msn/icq/aol/yahoo)? These are the tricky > ones since most traffic will be sent to a server, I'll probably have to > analyze the content instead, maybe by a keyword search or something (I > don't want to steal ALL of the kids' privacy). No, I wouldn't know where to start on that.. Good luck let me know if you come up with a clever solution! dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rick at eworld3.net Thu Oct 21 10:29:17 2004 From: rick at eworld3.net (Rick Meyerhoff) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4177D5CD.30005@eworld3.net> Here I come from out in left field, unencumbered by the thought process... It's been a while since I've worked with any SCSI devices but you used to have to have a terminator (BTR) at the end of the chain. Without that you would get strange behavior. One way to approach this, especially if you suspect hardware, is to pull everything out of the system except what is absolutely necessary to use the tape drive. In other words, minimal RAM, the boot drive on a simple (non-RAID) controller, no CD, no NIC, bare bones. Another way is to talk to HP tech support about the tape drive or see if their web site says anything about this problem. Maybe they have an updated driver. There may be an update for the backup software. I'm also wondering if you are putting one big file on the tape or many small files? Maybe you are hitting one file that is causing problems. Maybe my guesses will get someone else to reply... rotbau wrote: > Hello all, > > I am running SUSE 9.0. I am having some problems with a recently > installed HP Surestore DAT 40. When I try and run a backup, the > computer freezes, slowly at first and then progressively gets more > locked up. Here is what happens. > > Start Backup > BU software starts the jobs and hits a good xfer rate. Usually within > 30-50 seconds of starting the job the backup throughput falls and > eventually goes to 0. The tape drive stops receiving data (light > stops flashing). The backup software interface still functions but > becomes increasingly unresponsive. Same with the GUI interface. > Eventually all user interfaces lock up. If I run a very small backup > job (like the htdocs directory) it will work fine. Any larger job > causes the hang. No matter how long I wait, the software never > generates and error message. Also, nothing in any of the log files I > checked to say what is happening. > > This box has apache and qmail running on it as well. When it is > locking up, I can still access the apache test page text, but the > graphic won't load. I can telnet to qmail but it won't send any mail. > > Here is the setup. > > Compaq Smart 2SL attached to 2 x 9 GB drives in RAID 1 and 1 36 GB drive. > HP DAT is connected to on board Adaptec 7860 controller along with a > NEC cdrom drive. The CD is the last device on the chain. > Backup software tried (both Tapeware and Arkeia). > All drives appear as expected. I can format tapes in the drive and > have been able to work with as expected until I start a backup job. > > I suspect it is a hardware issue. The 7860 is a ultra/narrow > controller whereas the DAT drive is a Ultra/LVD drive. Is it possible > that this is the cause? Could the location of the DAT on the cable be > a problem, should it be last? > > This server also has a 7890 on-board controller that is Ultra/LVD, but > when I enable it the machine won't boot to the Compaq raid controller. > I think I need to disable some stuff in the scsi bios to fix that > problem, but I haven't had time. The compaq 2sl also has a second > channel, but the documentation that came with the dat suggests you > shouldn't connect it to a raid controller if possible. > > Any suggestions on where to look for this problem would be helpful. > Thanks in advance. > > rotbau > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -- Eric (Rick) Meyerhoff _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wilson at visi.com Thu Oct 21 11:05:25 2004 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] mod_proxy with Apache 1.3 from Debian testing Message-ID: Hey all, It looks like there's no way to enable mod_proxy with the standard apache 1.3 package from Debian testing (currently ver. 1.3.31-6). It's not present when I view the server-info page and there doesn't seem to be a .info file for mod_proxy that would allow me to enable it using apache-modconf. Anybody got this running? -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Thu Oct 21 11:35:38 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <16759.58714.338538.420920@gargle.gargle.HOWL> For those who care (and anyone who happens to be googling for an answer to a similar problem), I found out what was wrong with my USB hard drive. It was...(drum roll please)... supermount! Unmounting the drive, and remounting it by hand (and telling the OS it was ext3, rather than "vfat:ext2"), bumped the transfer rate and stopped the constant remounting. Why? THAT I don't know. Cheers to all _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Thu Oct 21 12:43:32 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: <4177D5CD.30005@eworld3.net> References: <4177D5CD.30005@eworld3.net> Message-ID: <67f3084a041021104342954a55@mail.gmail.com> How is the tape media? I have a Seagate DDS-3 DAT drive that was causing problems. I did have to replace it because it wouldn't eject tapes properly. Even after replacing it, I was running into read/write IO errors on a couple of tapes. I tried a new one, and was able to perform backups and restore from it successfully. Needless to say, I chucked the bad tapes into the trash. BTW, anyone know a place that will service my DAT drive? I think it just needs a good cleaning to allow me to eject tapes correctly. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com Thu Oct 21 12:43:41 2004 From: jeremy.rosengren at gmail.com (Jeremy Rosengren) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: <16759.58714.338538.420920@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <16759.58714.338538.420920@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: Not being one who uses Mandrake, I didn't even consider supermount, but here's a Mandrake bugzilla ID if you'd like to track it (and the peripheral discussion) http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8244 -- jeremy On Thu, 21 Oct 2004 11:35:38 -0500, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > > For those who care (and anyone who happens to be googling for an > answer to a similar problem), I found out what was wrong with my USB > hard drive. It was...(drum roll please)... > > supermount! > > Unmounting the drive, and remounting it by hand (and telling the > OS it was ext3, rather than "vfat:ext2"), bumped the transfer rate and > stopped the constant remounting. Why? THAT I don't know. > > Cheers to all > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Thu Oct 21 14:53:19 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <914f813c04102112534a17d455@mail.gmail.com> The first thing I would try is both the SCSI cable and terminator. They are relatively cheap, and you should have backups (if you don't already) anyway, and it only takes a minute to change the cable and terminator. From there, I would pursue the lines of thought pointed out by others. But to start, keep it simple to rule that out. John On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 13:31:29 -0500, rotbau wrote: > Hello all, > > I am running SUSE 9.0. I am having some problems with a recently > installed HP Surestore DAT 40. When I try and run a backup, the > computer freezes, slowly at first and then progressively gets more > locked up. Here is what happens. > > Start Backup > BU software starts the jobs and hits a good xfer rate. Usually within > 30-50 seconds of starting the job the backup throughput falls and > eventually goes to 0. The tape drive stops receiving data (light > stops flashing). The backup software interface still functions but > becomes increasingly unresponsive. Same with the GUI interface. > Eventually all user interfaces lock up. If I run a very small backup > job (like the htdocs directory) it will work fine. Any larger job > causes the hang. No matter how long I wait, the software never > generates and error message. Also, nothing in any of the log files I > checked to say what is happening. > > This box has apache and qmail running on it as well. When it is > locking up, I can still access the apache test page text, but the > graphic won't load. I can telnet to qmail but it won't send any mail. > > Here is the setup. > > Compaq Smart 2SL attached to 2 x 9 GB drives in RAID 1 and 1 36 GB drive. > HP DAT is connected to on board Adaptec 7860 controller along with a > NEC cdrom drive. The CD is the last device on the chain. > Backup software tried (both Tapeware and Arkeia). > All drives appear as expected. I can format tapes in the drive and > have been able to work with as expected until I start a backup job. > > I suspect it is a hardware issue. The 7860 is a ultra/narrow > controller whereas the DAT drive is a Ultra/LVD drive. Is it possible > that this is the cause? Could the location of the DAT on the cable be > a problem, should it be last? > > This server also has a 7890 on-board controller that is Ultra/LVD, but > when I enable it the machine won't boot to the Compaq raid controller. > I think I need to disable some stuff in the scsi bios to fix that > problem, but I haven't had time. The compaq 2sl also has a second > channel, but the documentation that came with the dat suggests you > shouldn't connect it to a raid controller if possible. > > Any suggestions on where to look for this problem would be helpful. > Thanks in advance. > > rotbau > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- John T. Hoffoss _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Thu Oct 21 23:34:14 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Jeff Nelson wrote: > Disclaimer: HP is my employer. I am an OpenVMS operating system software > engineer. I don't work in sales or marketing, I just write code (and > sometimes teach). Statements made represent my understanding of facts, > my opinions, and are not official statements from HP. It is great to have someone with your expertise on the list. I will take your comments very seriously because you know so much about VMS. I wanted to find something about DefCon 9 and OpenVMS, so I did a google search. Everything I found seemed very 'corporate.' For example, on this web page it shows the CEO of HP and it says "MIT is the soul of OpenVMS Technology": http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html I assumed that MIT stood for Massachusetts Institute of Technology. So I went to MIT web pages to see what they had to say about OpenVMS and this was one of the first things I found: http://www.psfc.mit.edu/cmod/unix/move_analysis.html The OpenVMS computers are aging, and will soon be going away. All interactive and batch jobs will eventually need to be moved to either the new unix machines or nodes of the beowulf cluster. Jobs should run five to ten times faster on the new machines. It is interesting that so many people believe that VMS is superior to UNIX OSs, yet VMS is basically dying and being replaced by UNIX/Linux. This has been going on for a decade or so, at least at universities. The corporate line is clearly that OpenVMS gives better uptime than UNIX/Linux, but where is the data? I found no data. No independent tests. It is probably a difficult comparison to make when both Linux and VMS boxes will run for months or years without a reboot. I do know that our most important service - e-mail - has been down very often during the past few years. Delivery is generally very slow. I'm very sure that a Linux solution would have given us better e-mail availability. Data? Oops - I don't have any either! On the other hand, with a small number of users on my Solaris box, I have kept e-mail up as long as I've had power for the past 7 years. It has never delayed delivery of any message as far as I can tell. I think Linux would perform at least as well. More messages to come... Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bhurt at spnz.org Fri Oct 22 00:12:18 2004 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, 21 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > It is interesting that so many people believe that VMS is superior to UNIX > OSs, yet VMS is basically dying and being replaced by UNIX/Linux. This > has been going on for a decade or so, at least at universities. Unix has one advantage VMS doesn't/didn't have: Unix is open source. VMS's success is tied to DEC's success- DEC gets bought out, their buyer gets bought out, development teams get downsized to pure maintainance, sales forces are non-existant, current customers are maintained only until they can be switched over to some other platform, and VMS dies as well. VMS joins the ranks of AmigaOS, DomainOS, Primos, and other "superior" technology OSs in the dustbin of tech history. Meanwhile, if AT&T leaves the market, sells the code "rights" to someone else, who subleases them to a bunch of a**holes, Unix itself isn't much hurt. Development goes on, even whole new from-scratch implementations show up (like Linux). Unix as managed to even transcend a specific software implementation and become an almost idealized concept. -- "Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." - Gene Spafford Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 00:03:06 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Jeff Nelson wrote: > Mike Miller wrote: > >> I would be very interested in hearing more from the people on this >> list. I am especially interested in knowing any ways in which VMS is >> *superior* to Linux. > > Stability. > Security. > Reliability. > Availability. Are there any independent studies comparing VMS with Linux/UNIX OSs? I've seen claims like 99.999% availability, but that would be only 5 minutes downtime per year. We haven't been that lucky where I work. Also, where I work, we can live with an occasional hour of downtime to get the rich features and low cost of Linux instead of the feature poverty and high cost of VMS. > Nothing gets ported or even written for Linux unless someone steps up > and does it. You are certainly free to port R to VMS if you like. I guess we agree, but did you understand my point? My point was not that it is impossible to write software for VMS, or that it is harder to write for VMS than for Linux/UNIX, my point was that thousands of people have developed hundreds or thousands of programs to run on Linux/UNIX and these programs are freely available on the internet. VMS is not undergoing any of this development. It is stagnating. Sure, someone could reverse that trend and port R, Octave, and other programs to VMS, but it looks like isn't going to happen. At any rate, it hasn't happened, and this is the chief reason why I already prefer Linux/UNIX to VMS. > VMS has a very loyal customer base. And VMS is still going strong. If by that statement, you mean that your employer, HP, if it remains solvent, has no immediate plan to put an end to VMS development, I believe you. If by "going strong" you mean that many independent programmers are developing open source software for OpenVMS, I don't think so. > Another example: the specialization of privileges and access control > lists. There's just one privilege (root) with Linux, though access > control lists are starting to appear. I appreciate your > Second, DEFCON 9 (July 2001) labeled VMS "Cool and Unhackable" after > attempts were made to hack into a standard VMS system with no firewall > between it and the hackers. The hackers even had access to an > unprivileged user account. VMS is the only operating system to achieve > this rating. To be "labeled" as "Cool and Unhackable" is a "rating"? Do you have any evidence for this? I thought I would find something official about this, but I only found a lot of corporate marketing stuff that used similar, but not identical claims. I have the impression that hackers aren't interested in OpenVMS and they aren't using it at DefCon anymore. This could be a good thing for OpenVMS. > Third, VMS has earned a security rating from the Department of Defense. I don't know what that means. Is that something that DoD has given to VMS but not to any Linux or UNIX OSs? > A recent version of HP TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS supports SSH. Perhaps > you didn't realize it was available? And seeing as how you are at a > university, you might consider talking to your HP representative to see > if you qualify for the university pricing. I hear it's quite attractive. You are right, I didn't know it was available. I wonder if our IT guys didn't know about this. It was part of our Divisional >> If someone can convince me that use of VMS on servers is a good plan >> for a University department, please do so because it will make me feel >> better about what's happening where I work. I would be especially >> encouraged if you would recommend it for a new unit that has no server >> system in place. > > Let me know if I can be of any more help. I thank you again for your comments. If you want to respond to my more recent comments, that would be great. In general, I'm interested in Linux/VMS interoperability. I'm also interested in moving services from VMS to Linux. Nothing you have told me makes me think that I should not try to move almost everything from VMS to Linux. We don't want to get rid of our VMS machines yet and we might keep them for quite a few years, but we can get more out of Linux. > I would be happy to put you in touch with someone at HP who can better > talk to your needs. We are already in touch with HP because we have two OpenVMS servers. We also use HP for support for Linux. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 00:08:39 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <4176014D.4000602@comcast.net> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <41754534.7040906@visi.com> <4176014D.4000602@comcast.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Jeff Nelson wrote: > Second, there is a migration path: > http://www.hp.com/products1/evolution/alpha_retaintrust/index.html . It would be nice for us if we could reduce our dependency on your corporation. Of course, OpenVMS will not run on just any hardware, so the only migration path is to HP machines. I think it is important to fight lock-in. The only way to do that is to move more services away from the VMS systems to an open source system like Linux. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 05:44:02 2004 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan Ware) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> Message-ID: <307a337f04102203445cae71ba@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 00:03:06 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Jeff Nelson wrote: > > > Mike Miller wrote: > > SNIP > I guess we agree, but did you understand my point? My point was not that > it is impossible to write software for VMS, or that it is harder to write > for VMS than for Linux/UNIX, my point was that thousands of people have > developed hundreds or thousands of programs to run on Linux/UNIX and these > programs are freely available on the internet. VMS is not undergoing any > of this development. It is stagnating. Sure, someone could reverse that > trend and port R, Octave, and other programs to VMS, but it looks like > isn't going to happen. At any rate, it hasn't happened, and this is the > chief reason why I already prefer Linux/UNIX to VMS. Linux is a lowest common denomenator operating system. It runs on commodity hardware that everyone and their dog has. VMS doesn't. That makes it more likely that things get ported to it first. That doesn't mean Linux is better than VMS in quality only that more stuff is ported to it. Incidentally, portability has been why UNIX has expanded while other "superior" OS's have shrunk in market share. C is portable assembly for the most part, so UNIX could be made to run on any hardware that came down the pipe easily or at least easier than almost anything else. SNIP _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 09:27:34 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:32 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <307a337f04102203445cae71ba@mail.gmail.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> <307a337f04102203445cae71ba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Ryan Ware wrote: > Linux is a lowest common denomenator operating system. It runs on > commodity hardware that everyone and their dog has. VMS doesn't. That > makes it more likely that things get ported to it first. That doesn't > mean Linux is better than VMS in quality only that more stuff is ported > to it. Incidentally, portability has been why UNIX has expanded while > other "superior" OS's have shrunk in market share. C is portable > assembly for the most part, so UNIX could be made to run on any hardware > that came down the pipe easily or at least easier than almost anything > else. Essentially, the claim here is that a single superior feature of UNIX/Linux has caused it to outsell VMS even though VMS has many superior features when compared with UNIX/Linux. So C code compiles more easily on UNIX/Linux than on VMS? Maybe it was true even a decade ago that more software was readily available for UNIX than for VMS. I can believe that, but does anyone know if that is true? Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 09:22:55 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Brian Hurt wrote: > On Thu, 21 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > >> It is interesting that so many people believe that VMS is superior to >> UNIX OSs, yet VMS is basically dying and being replaced by UNIX/Linux. >> This has been going on for a decade or so, at least at universities. > > Unix has one advantage VMS doesn't/didn't have: Unix is open source. Well, some UNIX OSs are open source, some are not. A decade ago when many university systems were switching over from VMS to UNIX, I didn't hear much about open source. I'm not sure why they were doing it. It could be that DEC was just charging too much and universities were saving money with UNIX. I don't know. Anyone know the history? Incidentally, UNIX is older than VMS. I used to think it was the other way around but someone taught me otherwise a few years ago. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bruce.broecker at toro.com Fri Oct 22 09:48:17 2004 From: bruce.broecker at toro.com (Bruce Broecker) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] NessusWeb Message-ID: I've started to do some work with Nessus, and I'd like to make a web frontend available to the server, network, and security teams here. NessusWeb looks like the best fit visually and functionally, but I can't get it up and running for the life of me. Anybody have any success with this? Any distros that have it packaged and ready to install? Bruce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Fri Oct 22 11:11:00 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41793114.1010701@visi.com> Mike Miller wrote: > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Brian Hurt wrote: > >> On Thu, 21 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: >> >>> It is interesting that so many people believe that VMS is superior >>> to UNIX OSs, yet VMS is basically dying and being replaced by >>> UNIX/Linux. This has been going on for a decade or so, at least at >>> universities. >> >> >> Unix has one advantage VMS doesn't/didn't have: Unix is open source. > > > Well, some UNIX OSs are open source, some are not. A decade ago when > many university systems were switching over from VMS to UNIX, I didn't > hear much about open source. I'm not sure why they were doing it. It > could be that DEC was just charging too much and universities were > saving money with UNIX. I don't know. Anyone know the history? > There's an extensive history online as part of the whole SCO debacle(see http://www.opensource.org/sco-vs-ibm.html or http://salon.com/tech/feature/1999/11/30/lions/index.html), but the basic reason Unix is so popular in academics is that AT&T made the source code available for a fairly low licensing fee which made it very popular for teaching and research. In the early years most networks were using proprietary networking protocols so DEC stuff used DECNet and pretty much only talked to DEC stuff, same with IBM, etc. Having source code made it easier to play with stuff like tcp/ip, uucp, etc. I can still remember when the U dumped BSD for VMS on the public VAX back in the early 80's - it wasn't a real popular move in some quarters. And stuff was always expensive back then, so if you already had access to Printer Brand A and didn't want to buy DEC Printer XYZ it was a lot easier if you already had source code to a print driver that you could hack until it worked with A. That made unix a lot more flexible. 'Open Source' has always been there. In the early days of Unix, CP/M and Apple a lot of people wrote software that they simply dumped into the public domain. It wasn't until the advent of the IBM PC that we started to see the whole shareware approach. There were a number of usenet newsgroups devoted to distributing source code for applications, utilities, etc. --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Fri Oct 22 11:01:16 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] USB hard drives In-Reply-To: References: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD7431B9@owa.compellent.com> <1096513052.5040.8508.camel@3po> <16743.12974.902187.604913@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041009034014.GV2829@momentum.poptix.net> <16745.35594.620771.482640@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <16759.58714.338538.420920@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <16761.11980.402012.547080@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "Jeremy" == Jeremy Rosengren writes: Jeremy> Not being one who uses Mandrake, I didn't even consider Jeremy> supermount, but here's a Mandrake bugzilla ID if you'd Jeremy> like to track it (and the peripheral discussion) Jeremy> http://qa.mandrakesoft.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8244 thanks, Jeremy. That was very interesting reading! I'm impressed you found it. Explains exactly the bad behavior I was having! Supermount was apparently repeatedly unmounting the drive, then remounting it as read-only, then unmounting it as rw, then.... No wonder the mount count was skyrocketing! Best, R _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 12:56:03 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <41793114.1010701@visi.com> References: <41793114.1010701@visi.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > There's an extensive history online as part of the whole SCO debacle(see > http://www.opensource.org/sco-vs-ibm.html or > http://salon.com/tech/feature/1999/11/30/lions/index.html), but the > basic reason Unix is so popular in academics is that AT&T made the > source code available for a fairly low licensing fee which made it very > popular for teaching and research. In the early years most networks were > using proprietary networking protocols so DEC stuff used DECNet and > pretty much only talked to DEC stuff, same with IBM, etc. Having source > code made it easier to play with stuff like tcp/ip, uucp, etc. I can > still remember when the U dumped BSD for VMS on the public VAX back in > the early 80's - it wasn't a real popular move in some quarters. > > And stuff was always expensive back then, so if you already had access > to Printer Brand A and didn't want to buy DEC Printer XYZ it was a lot > easier if you already had source code to a print driver that you could > hack until it worked with A. That made unix a lot more flexible. > > 'Open Source' has always been there. In the early days of Unix, CP/M and > Apple a lot of people wrote software that they simply dumped into the > public domain. It wasn't until the advent of the IBM PC that we started > to see the whole shareware approach. There were a number of usenet > newsgroups devoted to distributing source code for applications, > utilities, etc. With regard to UNIX v. VMS, it looks like the issue now is the same as it ever was: the expensive, closed-source, corporate OS may be profitable but it is designed by a corporation for a corporation and not by the users and not for the benefit of the users. Jeff Nelson suggested dramatically that VMS is superior to Linux in terms of "Stability. Security. Reliability. Availability." But Linux, properly managed, seems to do quite well on these dimensions. The Mizzou LUG's Linux machine had many users and it ran for a full year without a reboot during which time it was continually accessible and never cracked ('hacked') -- and they were giving shell accounts to anyone who requested one by e-mail. It seems to me that "stability, reliability and availability" are three ways of saying the same thing and Linux is adequate on all three. VMS may be better, but I can't see why it should matter to me. Any improvement on Linux's level of availability would be so minor that it would be unnoticable for our users. That said, I can understand why the NY Stock Exchange might prefer VMS to Linux. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From elhaddi at constantdata.com Fri Oct 22 10:35:32 2004 From: elhaddi at constantdata.com (elhaddi@constantdata.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Well, some UNIX OSs are open source, some are not. A decade ago when many > university systems were switching over from VMS to UNIX, I didn't hear > much about open source. I'm not sure why they were doing it. It could be > that DEC was just charging too much and universities were saving money > with UNIX. I don't know. Anyone know the history? Well, actually back in the early/mid 80s there was lots of talk about open systems rather than open source. The switch in Universities was fueled (At least in my experience) by research grants. It was much easier for us to get grants from the National Science Foundation(NSF), NASA DOE or even foundations to outfit research labs with Sun 3/60s,/50s or sun 280 and SGIs and to get computational time on one of the major NSF supercomputer centers than to get $$ to pay for recurring costs of running your stat/modeling jobs on VMS or CDC Cyber 6xxx boxes. I believe the Grand Challenges initiatives and the defense programs of the early/mid 80s fueled much of the conversion because of the nature of the computational needs(the engineering problems that needed to be solved relied on a combination of visualization, number crunching and ubiquitousness of tools). Most proposals for aerospace/climate/weather/bio sci etc included MIPS, M68xxx's running some flavor of *nix*. The first time I saw some thing different was when Tannenbaum shipped his first Minix version for 8086. I saw an integrator advertise it with some sort RS software. I believe These factors could explain the speed-ed conversion but some one from the history of science may shed better light! I also believe places where the Hardware is used by more than one business unit (research and admin) lagged in conversion because they are usually dominated by pragmatists rather than visionaries who are usually early adopters. --elhaddi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 13:20:29 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 elhaddi@constantdata.com wrote: > I also believe places where the Hardware is used by more than one > business unit (research and admin) lagged in conversion because they are > usually dominated by pragmatists rather than visionaries who are usually > early adopters. Elhaddi-- Your message was very informative, clear and helpful. I will focus now on your final statement (reproduced above). In the division where I work, the Chief Accountant plays a very key role in computing. He supervises the entire IT department and he takes extraordinary control over things. In fact, he goes so far as to not do what the faculty (e.g., our Computer Services Committee) want him to do. He is given his power by the Division Head and it is rather hard to make anything happen with him in the way (the Division Head is very busy, etc.). Why we have done this to ourselves is beyond me (it happened before I got here), but we will continue to strive to improve the flexibility and responsiveness of our administrative structure. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 13:29:40 2004 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <914f813c04102211293fbc5025@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 13:20:29 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > the Chief Accountant plays a very key role in computing. He supervises > the entire IT department and he takes extraordinary control over things. > In fact, he goes so far as to not do what the faculty (e.g., our Computer > Services Committee) want him to do. He is given his power by the Division > Head and it is rather hard to make anything happen with him in the way > (the Division Head is very busy, etc.). Why we have done this to > ourselves is beyond me (it happened before I got here), but we will > continue to strive to improve the flexibility and responsiveness of our > administrative structure. Welcome to the U. -John, former U employee & student (Incidentally, IT-under-finance/accounting/CFO is a common setup in private business, especially where a company is too small to warrant a CIO, FWIW.) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Fri Oct 22 13:24:27 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > Your message was very informative, clear and helpful. And there's absolutely no place for that kind of thing here! Please restrict posts to flames and petty arguments. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 13:51:20 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Adam Maloney wrote: > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > >> Your message was very informative, clear and helpful. > > And there's absolutely no place for that kind of thing here! Please > restrict posts to flames and petty arguments. What an utterly asinine thing to say!! ;-) Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 13:48:00 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: <914f813c04102211293fbc5025@mail.gmail.com> References: <914f813c04102211293fbc5025@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > (Incidentally, IT-under-finance/accounting/CFO is a common setup in > private business, especially where a company is too small to warrant a > CIO, FWIW.) Makes sense. We have a faculty-run "Computer Services Committee" that could take on the role of the CIO. Our chief accountant has no real computer knowledge, so he is better at standing in the way than he is at improving things. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Fri Oct 22 13:56:06 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] VMS (was "local Linux consulting companies") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Adam Maloney wrote: > > And there's absolutely no place for that kind of thing here! Please > > restrict posts to flames and petty arguments. > > What an utterly asinine thing to say!! Much better. But TRIM YOUR POSTS!! Just keeping up with tradition, Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 14:57:09 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? Message-ID: Here is a message from MLUG (Missouri) two months ago: http://mlug.missouri.edu/list-archives/discussion/2004-08/msg00138.php3 Jon King is really a smart guy - professor with degrees from Yale and CMU - and I have a high regard for his nonexpert opinions. So of course this gives me another reason to be concerned about continuing to invest in HP products such as VMS. They have recovered partially from their devastating August nose dive... http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=HPQ&t=3m ...but the future of any corporation is uncertain. This adds much to the appeal of open-source software. Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 15:21:31 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2c6699da04102213216b01f85f@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 14:57:09 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > Jon King is really a smart guy - professor with degrees from Yale and CMU > - and I have a high regard for his nonexpert opinions. So of course this > gives me another reason to be concerned about continuing to invest in HP > products such as VMS. > ...but the future of any corporation is uncertain. This adds much to the > appeal of open-source software. I think I lost respect for HP after the firing of Bruce Perens. The merger with Compaq didn't thrill me, as my employer was a Compaq customer. HP has been developing some pretty crappy hardware lately, so I expect to see the quality of our servers diminish as time goes on. -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Fri Oct 22 16:40:58 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:33 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT - Sort of... more then one topic. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1098481258.41797e6a049ae@my.visi.com> Way to much brain power for a Friday, I think a beer is in order after reading all of the great posts today. Obviously I wasn't posting :oD I spent the better part of last Sunday de-bugging an XP Home PC as a favor. The guy wants to change the way he uses his computer. He has 5 - 6000 pictures on this XP Home machine so he wants a laptop for eMail and web surfing. John said "Gates stuff gets to many guy's wanting to break it, I'm not a computer expert, I don't want to figure out how to fix it." In return for fixing his computer John is going to help the Cub Scouts build Pine Wood Derby (PWD) cars, John is a great wood worker. He asked about a MAC (John and his Wife are their 70's) and wondered if I ever got any MAC's to sell "Very Rare". He was interested in Linux but thought it may be to hard to use. I showed him a Debian distro with KDE, he couldn't tell the difference between KDE and M$ Windows. He understands installing M$ Windows applications would not work without more work then he is willing to do. Anyone ever think about approaching the senior community about secure computing with Linux? I'm a little shy of selling someone a Laptop with Linux on it. I'm not up to doing support of anything right now, I'm to busy. Supporting the elder community on Linux would be a challenge Other related Topic... I was wondering if anyone would be interested developing software to time the PWD cars using standard PWD timing devices. The timer has a serial output for collecting data. Having OSS to time PWD cars would be very cool. Let me know if you?re interested in the PWD project, I have the timer and track so it may be a real fun project. A beer meeting with a PWD car race, that might be way to much fun :-D Sam. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us Fri Oct 22 16:50:28 2004 From: mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us (Mike Tuller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email Message-ID: I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it so that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That way I can monitor if backups are being done. It looks like it has run, but I don't receive an email, so it must not be. Here is what I have as the part of the script that sends the email. echo "Email message body here." | mail -s "Email subject" me@domain.com What is wrong with this? Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 17:11:11 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Mike Tuller wrote: > I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it > so that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That > way I can monitor if backups are being done. It looks like it has run, > but I don't receive an email, so it must not be. Here is what I have as > the part of the script that sends the email. > > echo "Email message body here." | mail -s "Email subject" me@domain.com > > What is wrong with this? Is it finding 'mail'? Is mail aliased? In the path? It is always safer to use "/bin/mail" because you know what you're getting. Can you do that (echo | mail) from the command line and have it work? If not, there may be a bigger problem with mail on your system. If it does work from the command line, and my fix above doesn't help, I'd say that it is a network problem. Let us know how it turns out. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Fri Oct 22 17:16:00 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <417986A0.6040809@knicknack.net> Mike Tuller wrote: > I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it so > that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That way I > can monitor if backups are being done. It looks like it has run, but I don't > receive an email, so it must not be. Here is what I have as the part of the > script that sends the email. > > > echo "Email message body here." | mail -s "Email subject" me@domain.com > > > What is wrong with this? > > > > Mike > Looks good to me. Have you tried it from the command line? Are you sure mail is the right command for mail? Does the man page for mail give you any clue? Is there anything in the script that might cause it to exit prematurely? HTH, Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Fri Oct 22 17:23:10 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT - Sort of... more then one topic. In-Reply-To: <1098481258.41797e6a049ae@my.visi.com> References: <1098481258.41797e6a049ae@my.visi.com> Message-ID: <4179884E.2020101@comcast.net> smac@visi.com wrote: > > >Anyone ever think about approaching the senior community about secure computing >with Linux? I'm a little shy of selling someone a Laptop with Linux on it. I'm >not up to doing support of anything right now, I'm to busy. Supporting the >elder community on Linux would be a challenge > > > > >Sam. > > > Yes as a volunteer at Thompson Park Activity Center in West St Paul. The city of Mendota Heights donated six Compaq 1.6 Ghz computers to the activity center as part of the Senior Education activities at Thompson Park about two years ago. The city of Mendota Heights also donated Windows XP Professional software, Windows 2000 Office suite and license for each computer. The IT department of school district ISD197 administrators the computers and access to the internet, computers are on the ISD197 fiber network for internet, so we have no authorization to change software. Asked if we could have one computer with a Linux OS installed, even dual boot, answer was NO! But have Mandrake Move CD and have shown a few others what that distro looks like. At least the IT has not messed up the BIOS and can use a CD version of Linux. But not one seems to be interested, they are all "happy" with Windows. There are about eight volunteers who come to the activity center a few times a week and assist seniors or older adults with computer skills for free. The older adults who do come in have a hard enough time with Windows, so do not think they would like Linux. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Fri Oct 22 17:39:10 2004 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email Message-ID: Mike, I assume you want to run this from cron. If so, I recommend always using complete paths when referring to executables, as the other Mike suggested. If you use any more than once, especially commands with long paths, put that path in an environment variable: ECHO=/bin/echo MAIL=/bin/mail $ECHO "Email message body here." | $MAIL -s "Email subject" me@domain.com Or, you can go overboard and "variablize" everything: ECHO=/bin/echo MAIL=/bin/mail BODY="Email message body here." SUB="Email subject" ADDR=me@domain.com $ECHO $BODY | $MAIL -s $SUB $ADDR but that's just crazy. ;-) Actually, it can be nice to reduce longer command lines so they fit on one line and make immediate sense to the reader. Good luck, Troy >>> mtuller@ce.anoka.k12.mn.us 10/22/04 04:50PM >>> I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it so that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That way I can monitor if backups are being done. It looks like it has run, but I don't receive an email, so it must not be. Here is what I have as the part of the script that sends the email. echo "Email message body here." | mail -s "Email subject" me@domain.com What is wrong with this? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mcnixon at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 18:02:22 2004 From: mcnixon at gmail.com (Mike Nixon) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:34 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT - Sort of... more then one topic. In-Reply-To: <4179884E.2020101@comcast.net> References: <1098481258.41797e6a049ae@my.visi.com> <4179884E.2020101@comcast.net> Message-ID: I'm not sure that Windows is easier for them to learn than Linux. Twice in the last 24 hours I've talked to people who have major spyware issues because they use IE on Windows. And others I know are swamped with SPAM. I think the barriers to overcome are: 1- Attitude about Linux/Open Source of: PHB, Volunteers, and Potential Users. 2- Getting enough Volunteers who can do the training/support/hand-holding. 3- What are the users needs/desires and how good (easy to use?) are the applications available that do these things on Linux. Mike Nixon On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 17:23:10 -0500, Jerry W wrote: > The older adults who do come in have a hard enough time with Windows, so do not think they would like Linux. > > Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mcnixon at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 18:24:57 2004 From: mcnixon at gmail.com (Mike Nixon) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:35 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Install Debian tonight or wait for installfest? Message-ID: At previous installfests I've gotten grub installed to dual boot with Windows and RedHat 7.1 and later RH8.0, but I haven't done much in my linux partition lately (IIRC I can't login because I lost the password or I made too many hardware changes), occasionally I use Knoppix I want to convert to Debian, should I: download something (like a mini-ISO off debian.org) and start an install tonight (I have a few hours) or wait and bring my PC tomorrow to the installfest? or can I use Knoppix to start an install? TIA, Mike Nixon _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 18:45:48 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:35 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [Semi-OT] Hosting Services.... Message-ID: <32fd4537041022164550226f61@mail.gmail.com> I'm starting to look for other hosting services, as I'm having trouble for the second time with my current provider, Hostica. (www.hostica.com) as one of my clients (I have a reseller account at hostica) keeps getting blocked at their router from reaching his sites. What other hosting services have you guys used, that you would recommend? Reseller ability is needed as well, and if I can do it in a convoluted way I suppose I could do that as well. I will also mention this at the installfest tommorow, which sadly I won't make it there until shortly after 1, as I have work in the morning. *goes to mail info@mn-linux.org about the change* Thanks much! Keith Bachman _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Fri Oct 22 18:45:50 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:35 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Install Debian tonight or wait for installfest? In-Reply-To: ; from mcnixon@gmail.com on Fri, Oct 22, 2004 at 06:24:57PM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20041022184550.A18527@thinkunix.net> Mike Nixon wrote: > At previous installfests I've gotten grub installed to dual boot with > Windows and RedHat 7.1 and later RH8.0, but I haven't done much in my > linux partition lately (IIRC I can't login because I lost the password > or I made too many hardware changes), occasionally I use Knoppix > > I want to convert to Debian, should I: > download something (like a mini-ISO off debian.org) and start an > install tonight (I have a few hours) > or wait and bring my PC tomorrow to the installfest? > or can I use Knoppix to start an install? I will have the 7 debian stable cd's tomorrow at the installfest. You generally only need one to get going. The mini-iso is a good option too. If you have broadband, might want to grab and burn that one tonight. Alternatively, you can even install from a several floppies if you have broadband to install the rest. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Fri Oct 22 18:54:36 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:35 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] OT - Sort of... more then one topic. In-Reply-To: References: <1098481258.41797e6a049ae@my.visi.com> <4179884E.2020101@comcast.net> Message-ID: <41799DBC.7070409@comcast.net> Mike Nixon wrote: >I'm not sure that Windows is easier for them to learn than Linux. >Twice in the last 24 hours I've talked to people who have major >spyware issues because they use IE on Windows. And others I know are >swamped with SPAM. > >I think the barriers to overcome are: >1- Attitude about Linux/Open Source of: PHB, Volunteers, and Potential Users. >2- Getting enough Volunteers who can do the training/support/hand-holding. >3- What are the users needs/desires and how good (easy to use?) are >the applications available that do these things on Linux. > >Mike Nixon > > > I agree with you Mike. Can not even get any of the other volunteers even to try to use the Mandrake Move CD system or any Linux OS. Then the IT department of ISD197 is to busy with school computers and don't want to worry or do much for the computers at the activity center. The IT department installed reborn cards on each computer so "we" don't mess things up. So "we" behave our self's and do not bother the IT at the school district. Thankful with what we do have to help older adults with small problems like email and maybe once and a while a person comes in and asks to learn more about Microsoft Word or Excel. Don't want to "rock the boat", this volunteer work gets me out of a senior building where the main interest seems to be sitting around watching the boob tube or if there is a free bus ride to a casino, watch out you get run over by a stampede to the bus! Tried to get a computer interest group at the building (195 residents), not one taker, but know there are others who have a computer in the building and are complacent with what they have. I do wish there was something on the order like "our" computer center at Thompson Park for Linux. I am fairly new to Linux myself and could use some "hand holding" in certain aspects, but reading on the distro sites, picked up the book "Linux For Non-Geeks" by Rickford Grant and learning some from that book. Jerry . _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jsanborn at earthlink.net Fri Oct 22 18:50:20 2004 From: jsanborn at earthlink.net (John Sanborn) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 19:06:13 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a041022170669cd16ee@mail.gmail.com> Would wget help you out in this situation? On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:50:20 -0500, John Sanborn wrote: > > Anyone have an idea where to find (or find out how to write) a script that > will save a URL to text file? The URL is on a Windows 2k3 server and > requires a login. > > Text files are written to a directory on a web server daily that are > accessible via https and a login. I'd like to automate the process to move > the files to a remote location and it seems to me that it would be much > easier to simply retrieve them from the remote location than to try > automating a process of shipping the files by secure ftp or email from the > web server. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 19:04:43 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Install Debian tonight or wait for installfest? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Knoppix has an option to install to the hard drive. If you like it, why not use it? If you are going the Debian route, your best bet is the netinst image or the business card image from http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/ The business card has to download the base system...so I'd go with the netinst unless you really really just have to start installing now. Personally, I just finished backing up my Debian box and am going to get around to installing Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntulinux.org/) tomorrow (Maybe I'll make it to the install fest...maybe....). I setup a Ubuntu box at work and the installer is basically the same as Sarge. For a desktop box it works great, espically when you just stick to the ubuntu core (supported) packages. Unfortunatly, the main application for the work box was in Ubuntu Univers (Unsupported packages) and went all sig11 on me, so I went back to Sarge. Anyway, the experiince was that Ubuntu is very well done, it is Debian based, and if you're looking for a nice up to date desktop box I'd give it a shot. The download CD is a bit larger (full 700 mb ISO.) compared to the Debian netinstall CDs, so you're probally downloading more than you need, but I like the out of the box look and feel of ubuntu, and the inprovments of GNOME 2.8 over 2.4 are quite noticible. (Probally doesn't matter much if you're a KDE fan). -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bhurt at spnz.org Fri Oct 22 19:45:47 2004 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > Here is a message from MLUG (Missouri) two months ago: > > http://mlug.missouri.edu/list-archives/discussion/2004-08/msg00138.php3 > > Jon King is really a smart guy - professor with degrees from Yale and CMU > - and I have a high regard for his nonexpert opinions. So of course this > gives me another reason to be concerned about continuing to invest in HP > products such as VMS. I am not an HP employee, and never have been. So take the following comments with a grain of salt. But one of the most destructive things that can happen with a company is to get a CEO who doesn't want to be running *that* company, but some other company. Decisions will be made with the goal to turn the company into a clone of the other company, and not what makes the most sense with where this company currently is. Gaurenting sub-optimal decisions. At best- worst case, decisions will be made in terms of what makes sense for the other company, and not for this company, gaurenteeing totally wrong decisions. >From what I've seen, Carly doesn't want to be running HP. She wants to be running Dell. And that this long-term dooms HP. -- "Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." - Gene Spafford Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jsanborn at earthlink.net Fri Oct 22 19:55:15 2004 From: jsanborn at earthlink.net (John Sanborn) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file In-Reply-To: <67f3084a041022170669cd16ee@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Looks promising. If it can be scripted so a URL variable could be dynamically created based on the date, and if it can pass login credentials, then I'd say this definitely has potential. Any other thoughts here? -----Original Message----- From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Shawn Fertch Sent: Friday, October 22, 2004 7:06 PM To: TCLUG Mailing List Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file Would wget help you out in this situation? On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:50:20 -0500, John Sanborn wrote: > > Anyone have an idea where to find (or find out how to write) a script > that will save a URL to text file? The URL is on a Windows 2k3 server > and requires a login. > > Text files are written to a directory on a web server daily that are > accessible via https and a login. I'd like to automate the process to > move the files to a remote location and it seems to me that it would > be much easier to simply retrieve them from the remote location than > to try automating a process of shipping the files by secure ftp or > email from the web server. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Fri Oct 22 20:22:58 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file In-Reply-To: ; from jsanborn@earthlink.net on Fri, Oct 22, 2004 at 07:55:15PM -0500 References: <67f3084a041022170669cd16ee@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041022202258.C16237@thinkunix.net> John Sanborn wrote: > Looks promising. If it can be scripted so a URL variable could be > dynamically created based on the date, and if it can pass login credentials, > then I'd say this definitely has potential. Any other thoughts here? how about Expect and cadaver? I'm assuming you're trying to get these files onto a *nix box. cadaver is a command line webdav client that can handle https. If the windows2003 server can make that directory where the files live webdav accessible, you should be able to pull them down manually with cadaver. Once that works, just automate the process with Expect. (Expect is a scripting language used for automating interactive processes like telnet, ftp, and a host of other things) > -----Original Message----- > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 18:50:20 -0500, John Sanborn > wrote: > > > > Anyone have an idea where to find (or find out how to write) a script > > that will save a URL to text file? The URL is on a Windows 2k3 server > > and requires a login. > > > > Text files are written to a directory on a web server daily that are > > accessible via https and a login. I'd like to automate the process to > > move the files to a remote location and it seems to me that it would > > be much easier to simply retrieve them from the remote location than > > to try automating a process of shipping the files by secure ftp or > > email from the web server. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nik at black-nyx.com Fri Oct 22 21:03:17 2004 From: nik at black-nyx.com (Nik) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:37 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Is it too late? to get involved in the installfest? Message-ID: <4179BBE5.4060607@black-nyx.com> Hey, I've been way too busy lately. I don't post much, I mostly just read, but I really would like to go to the installfest and maybe get some help with some little problems I'm having plus get gentoo installed. Is it too late to get involved in the installfest tomorrow? I can't believe I caught it in time but I'm not sure if there's anything I should know, I have the address to getting there and I just signed up. Anyhow, my goal is to get gentoo installed and hopefully working well, I have SuSe right now. But my problem is, I have 2 hard drives and on my 2nd hard drive I have TONS of media files that I can NOT lose, but I'd like to clean up the rest of the hard drive and make it useable for linux, so if anyone could suggest the best way of doing that, I'd appreciate it. Plus I'm having trouble getting linux to read my music CDs that I try to play in XMMS. But, hopefully I'll see some of you tomorrow, I hope it goes well. ~Nikki _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 22 22:29:33 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <2c6699da04102213216b01f85f@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da04102213216b01f85f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041022222933.00005b44@schubert> On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 15:21:31 -0500 Brian Wall wrote: > HP has been developing some pretty crappy hardware > lately, so I expect to see the quality of our servers diminish as > time goes on. Man, amen about that. My last (it really will be my last) piece of HP hardware was a SCSI CD-RW drive that I have yet to get to function, even on a Winders box. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 22:55:04 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Is it too late? to get involved in the installfest? In-Reply-To: <4179BBE5.4060607@black-nyx.com> References: <4179BBE5.4060607@black-nyx.com> Message-ID: <32fd45370410222055658f966f@mail.gmail.com> By no means...feel free to show up. We usually ask people to register ahead of time on the site so that we have a rough estimate of how many to expect. We don't require everyone to register, but it is useful. For a Gentoo intstall, I've heard showing up right away is good, as it can take a while. Keith Bachman _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 23:14:57 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: <417986A0.6040809@knicknack.net> References: <417986A0.6040809@knicknack.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Eric Stanley wrote: > Is there anything in the script that might cause it to exit prematurely? That's a suggestion I didn't make but should have made. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rotbau at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 23:30:07 2004 From: rotbau at gmail.com (rotbau) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > From: Rick Meyerhoff > It's been a while since I've worked with any SCSI devices but you used > to have to have a terminator (BTR) at the end of the chain. Without that > you would get strange behavior. Yeah I've tried several different cables and used both an active terminator at the end of the cable and the onboard jumper terminator on the hp dat drive. All provided the same results. > I'm also wondering if you are putting one big file on the tape or many > small files? Maybe you are hitting one file that is causing problems. The freeze happens within 30 - 50 seconds of start, usually just going through some smaller files. Nothing really big on the system yet. I have tried various directories trying to rule out a particular file bugging it out. It even happens with tar. I was able to tar a small job (like maybe 50-60 files). The bigger tar job frooze just the same as the rest. > > > > I am running SUSE 9.0. I am having some problems with a recently > > installed HP Surestore DAT 40. When I try and run a backup, the > > computer freezes, slowly at first and then progressively gets more > > locked up. Here is what happens. > > > > Start Backup > > BU software starts the jobs and hits a good xfer rate. Usually within > > 30-50 seconds of starting the job the backup throughput falls and > > eventually goes to 0. The tape drive stops receiving data (light > > stops flashing). The backup software interface still functions but > > becomes increasingly unresponsive. > > Backup software tried (both Tapeware and Arkeia). _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rotbau at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 23:37:02 2004 From: rotbau at gmail.com (rotbau) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:53:19 -0500, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > The first thing I would try is both the SCSI cable and terminator. > They are relatively cheap, and you should have backups (if you don't > already) anyway, and it only takes a minute to change the cable and > terminator. From there, I would pursue the lines of thought pointed > out by others. But to start, keep it simple to rule that out. > > John John, Thanks for the reply. I did try several different cables and used both an active terminator and the on board jumper. Both caused the locks. I've tried about all I can think of. I was thinking of going to the 2.6 kernel in suse 9.1. I have come across one or two bits on the net about SMP kernels causing scsi bus freezes, but some of the stuff was pretty old (like 2.2 kernel stuff). I am going to try and boot to a single proc kernel and see if the same thing happens. cheers, rotbau _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 22 23:33:43 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Script to save a URL to a text file In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 22 Oct 2004, John Sanborn wrote: > Anyone have an idea where to find (or find out how to write) a script > that will save a URL to text file? The URL is on a Windows 2k3 server > and requires a login. > > Text files are written to a directory on a web server daily that are > accessible via https and a login. I'd like to automate the process to > move the files to a remote location and it seems to me that it would be > much easier to simply retrieve them from the remote location than to try > automating a process of shipping the files by secure ftp or email from > the web server. If the files always have the same names, you can use lynx: lynx -auth=login:passwd -source URL > filename You'd have to write one line per file. I think wget will handle the multiple files in a single command so long as your web server gives directory listings. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rotbau at gmail.com Fri Oct 22 23:45:38 2004 From: rotbau at gmail.com (rotbau) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Tape drive hanging server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 12:43:32 -0500 > From: Shawn Fertch > > How is the tape media? I have a Seagate DDS-3 DAT drive that was > causing problems. I did have to replace it because it wouldn't eject > tapes properly. Even after replacing it, I was running into > read/write IO errors on a couple of tapes. Tape media is brand new, purchased a couple of months ago. I did try several different ones and got the same results. I don't even get any errors, just the mr freeze routine and game over - reset. > BTW, anyone know a place that will service my DAT drive? I think it > just needs a good cleaning to allow me to eject tapes correctly. Sorry, I can't help you with that one. I have been looking for someone to repair a DLT drive. I'll post to the list if I ever find someone. cheers, rotbau _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 23 03:10:03 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <20041022222933.00005b44@schubert> References: <2c6699da04102213216b01f85f@mail.gmail.com> <20041022222933.00005b44@schubert> Message-ID: I know that, at least in the local Minneapolis area, UPS buys exclusively Compaq/HP computer stuff. I am assuming that this would be a nation wide standard (given the nature of UPS, which is all about standards) With a contract like that, it is hard to see how HP could screw things up so bad as to run themselves out of business. On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 22:29:33 -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 15:21:31 -0500 > Brian Wall wrote: > > > > > HP has been developing some pretty crappy hardware > > lately, so I expect to see the quality of our servers diminish as > > time goes on. > > Man, amen about that. My last (it really will be my last) piece of HP hardware was a SCSI CD-RW drive that I have yet to get to function, even on a Winders box. > > Josh > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Sat Oct 23 08:16:03 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest Message-ID: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sat Oct 23 08:26:17 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest In-Reply-To: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5> References: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <68a256c0410230626766ba3c2@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 08:16:03 -0500, Todd wrote: > > Quick question about the installfest. With this being my first installfest > I'm not sure if your suppose to bring a monitor and keyboard as well. > > Thanks, > > Todd It's my first as well, but I'm pretty sure that the answer is YES. -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sat Oct 23 08:26:11 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest In-Reply-To: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5>; from todd@xnewbie.com on Sat, Oct 23, 2004 at 08:16:03AM -0500 References: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5> Message-ID: <20041023082611.A21961@thinkunix.net> Todd wrote: > Quick question about the installfest. With this being my first installfest I'm not sure if your suppose to bring a monitor and keyboard as well. > yes, you should bring *EVERYTHING* you need to make your computer run: keyboard, mouse, monitor, power cords, ethernet cables, and if you have them power strips and an ethernet switch. Generally there are no "spare" monitor/keyboards at the installfests. bring what ever you need with you. see you later today. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Sat Oct 23 08:40:47 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest References: <007801c4b902$7410fcc0$6600a8c0@baker5> <20041023082611.A21961@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <008c01c4b905$e8b86470$6600a8c0@baker5> Cool, thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scot Jenkins" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Saturday, October 23, 2004 8:26 AM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] Installfest > Todd wrote: > > Quick question about the installfest. With this being my first installfest I'm not sure if your suppose to bring a monitor and keyboard as well. > > > > yes, you should bring *EVERYTHING* you need to make your computer run: > keyboard, mouse, monitor, power cords, ethernet cables, and if you have > them power strips and an ethernet switch. > > Generally there are no "spare" monitor/keyboards at the installfests. > bring what ever you need with you. > > see you later today. > -- > scot > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nate at refried.org Sat Oct 23 10:06:26 2004 From: nate at refried.org (nate@refried.org) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041023150626.GA25548@refried.org> On Fri, Oct 22, 2004 at 04:50:28PM -0500, Mike Tuller wrote: > I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it so > that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That way I If you run this from cron, any output is usually sent in a mail to the user that owns the cron job. If you're running this as root, just forward the mail from root to your email address. Nate _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 23 10:35:20 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:38 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: <20041023150626.GA25548@refried.org> References: <20041023150626.GA25548@refried.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 nate@refried.org wrote: > On Fri, Oct 22, 2004 at 04:50:28PM -0500, Mike Tuller wrote: >> I have created a script to backup files on a system, and want to set it so >> that when the backup is completed it will send an email to me. That way I > > If you run this from cron, any output is usually sent in a mail to the > user that owns the cron job. If you're running this as root, just > forward the mail from root to your email address. That applies to stdout and stderr, but if there is no such output, no mail is sent. If the cron job is a script that sends an e-mail message, it should send that message to the adressee, not to the owner of the cron job. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mcnixon at gmail.com Sat Oct 23 12:37:18 2004 From: mcnixon at gmail.com (Mike Nixon) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: ubuntu CDs [was: Install Debian tonight or wait for installfest?] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks for the tip on ubuntu, I downloaded two iso's last night, the i386 install and the liveCD. I'll bring them today, be there about 2:30 I hope. Install went pretty smooth, but I think my disk had some bad sectors, so I could use a few tips on scanning the drive. thanks, Mike Nixon On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 19:04:43 -0500, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > Knoppix has an option to install to the hard drive. If you like it, > why not use it? If you are going the Debian route, your best bet is > the netinst image or the business card image from > http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/ > > The business card has to download the base system...so I'd go with the > netinst unless you really really just have to start installing now. > > Personally, I just finished backing up my Debian box and am going to > get around to installing Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntulinux.org/) tomorrow > (Maybe I'll make it to the install fest...maybe....). I setup a Ubuntu > box at work and the installer is basically the same as Sarge. For a > desktop box it works great, espically when you just stick to the > ubuntu core (supported) packages. > > Unfortunatly, the main application for the work box was in Ubuntu > Univers (Unsupported packages) and went all sig11 on me, so I went > back to Sarge. Anyway, the experiince was that Ubuntu is very well > done, it is Debian based, and if you're looking for a nice up to date > desktop box I'd give it a shot. The download CD is a bit larger (full > 700 mb ISO.) compared to the Debian netinstall CDs, so you're probally > downloading more than you need, but I like the out of the box look and > feel of ubuntu, and the inprovments of GNOME 2.8 over 2.4 are quite > noticible. (Probally doesn't matter much if you're a KDE fan). > > -- > Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us > A password is like your underwear; Change it > frequently, don't share it with others, and > don't ask to borrow someone else's. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nate at refried.org Sat Oct 23 13:35:23 2004 From: nate at refried.org (nate@refried.org) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: <20041023150626.GA25548@refried.org> Message-ID: <20041023183523.GA11014@refried.org> On Sat, Oct 23, 2004 at 10:35:20AM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 nate@refried.org wrote: > >If you run this from cron, any output is usually sent in a mail to the > >user that owns the cron job. If you're running this as root, just > >forward the mail from root to your email address. > > That applies to stdout and stderr, but if there is no such output, no mail > is sent. If the cron job is a script that sends an e-mail message, it > should send that message to the adressee, not to the owner of the cron > job. It sounded to me like Mike had full control over the system he was running backups on. If he changed the script to output a message the email part would be taken care of for him. If he wants the mail to go somewhere else than the account running the cron job, there are many ways to redirect the cron email to the correct address. I just wanted to make it clear there might be other ways to get the end result he wants. Nate _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 23 13:55:56 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: <20041023183523.GA11014@refried.org> References: <20041023150626.GA25548@refried.org> <20041023183523.GA11014@refried.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 nate@refried.org wrote: > If he wants the mail to go somewhere else than the account running the > cron job, there are many ways to redirect the cron email to the correct > address. > > I just wanted to make it clear there might be other ways to get the end > result he wants. Let's just say you are right, but I can't see how your idea is better than the one he already had. He can control the subject line, the content of the message body and the receiving address using his simple system. Your approach will do none of those things without filtering incoming messages in some complex way. The best thing for him to do is fix what he already had. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jwreese0 at comcast.net Sat Oct 23 16:07:58 2004 From: jwreese0 at comcast.net (John Reese) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Request information re: Gentoo Message-ID: <1098565678.6030.12.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> I have been a Linux desktop user and sysadmin for four years - main experience is Redhat/Fedora, Suse, and Slackware. I have no experience with Gentoo, but I notice the community has a lot to say about it. Looking for education here - why would I want to try Gentoo, and why do you like it? John Reese _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sat Oct 23 16:45:38 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest Message-ID: <1098567938.20832.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> Thanks to Carl and Nik and others for letting me look over their shoulder while doing the install of Ubuntu today, and other tools, have downloaded the iso and have installed Ubuntu, cool. I hope I wasn't a pest. Thanks to tclug group for the install fest today. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Sat Oct 23 17:17:33 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Request information re: Gentoo In-Reply-To: <1098565678.6030.12.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> References: <1098565678.6030.12.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 16:07:58 -0500, John Reese wrote: > I have been a Linux desktop user and sysadmin for four years - main > experience is Redhat/Fedora, Suse, and Slackware. I have no experience > with Gentoo, but I notice the community has a lot to say about it. > Looking for education here - why would I want to try Gentoo, and why do > you like it? I just about started writing an explanationg of why I love gentoo, but then I realized that the answer can be found in a quote from the gentoo website: "The Gentoo philosophy, in a paragraph, is this. Every user has work they need to do. The goal of Gentoo is to design tools and systems that allow a user to do their work pleasantly and efficiently as possible, as they see fit. Our tools should be a joy to use, and should help the user to appreciate the richness of the Linux and free software community, and the flexibility of free software. This is only possible when the tool is designed to reflect and transmit the will of the user, and leave the possibilities open as to the final form of the raw materials (the source code.) If the tool forces the user to do things a particular way, then the tool is working against, rather than for, the user. We have all experienced situations where tools seem to be imposing their respective wills on us. This is backwards, and contrary to the Gentoo philosophy." taken from here: http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/philosophy.xml I've been using Gentoo for about a year now, and I'm absolutely in love with it. After becoming comfortable with Gentoo in a "tesing" environment, I have since moved all but one of my linux boxes at work over to Gentoo. It has proven to be the most stable, flexible, and easy to maintain distribution I've had experience with. Before Gentoo, I was running Redhat and some Debian at work. One of the best things I've found in Gentoo world is the *very* active and helpful community of users it has. I have yet to find a problem that hasn't been easily solved by posting a question to either the gentoo forums or their IRC channel. I have heard a few nay-sayers on the list badmouth the use of Gentoo in production environments due to instability issues. I don't know exactly where they're coming from, as I've found Gentoo to be just as stable as any other linux distribution and *much* easier to maintain/update than any other. The only other distro that can compete w/ gentoo in the "ease of updating" category is Debian and its apt repository. I see Debian's apt and Gentoo's emerge as close cousins. The difference is that apt generally installs pre-compiled binary packages and emerge generally installs/compiles apps from source. If you know what you're doing, you can get a slight preformance increase by compiling from source if you set your build flags correctly. This is an area where you can get yourself in trouble. As with many things, along with the great things that Gentoo's flexibility provides, it also provides opportunities for you to make life very difficult for yourself. If you set the wrong build flags, you run the chance of having apps that won't even run correctly on your processor or having apps that are very buggy and unstable. Well I think that's all I have for now. If you decide to give gentoo a go, please feel free to write me with any questions you come up with. Also, as I mentioned before, the forums and irc channel are both great resources as well. -Erik Anderson _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 23 21:31:59 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: I just want to say that I made a brief appearance at the installfest and I was very impressed by the number of people there and with the level of activity and enthusiasm. You have a really good LUG here! Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sat Oct 23 23:04:37 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [TCLUG-ANNOUNCE] TCLUG Installfest coming up!!! In-Reply-To: ; from mbmiller@taxa.epi.umn.edu on Sat, Oct 23, 2004 at 09:31:59PM -0500 References: <20041016165729.GC21673@clavin> Message-ID: <20041023230437.A3607@thinkunix.net> Mike Miller wrote: > I just want to say that I made a brief appearance at the installfest and I > was very impressed by the number of people there and with the level of > activity and enthusiasm. You have a really good LUG here! Today's installfest was actually one of the "slower" less populated events we've had. Nevertheless I believe it was productive and we help a lot of folks solve problems and get Linux installed and/or upgraded. Glad you could make it and enjoyed the installfest. Spread the word to your friends, family and neighbors and help the Linux and Open Source communities grow. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Sun Oct 24 09:52:14 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd Baker) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest Message-ID: <001201c4b9d9$106a24d0$0500a8c0@baker6> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Sun Oct 24 09:45:53 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] image tools for PHP under Debian Message-ID: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com> I'm messing around with images under PHP. It appears that I don't have the image components installed, but I can't figure out what package that lives in. Can someone give me a hand? -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Sun Oct 24 11:01:52 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] image tools for PHP under Debian In-Reply-To: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041024160152.GA32512@mail.el-swifto.com> On Sun, Oct 24, 2004 at 09:45:53AM -0500, Brian Wall wrote: > I'm messing around with images under PHP. It appears that I don't > have the image components installed, but I can't figure out what > package that lives in. Can someone give me a hand? When I do 'apt-cache search php' I see (among others): php4-gd - GD module for php4 php4-gd2 - GD module (with GD2) for php4 libphp-phplot - The graphic library for php. Is this what you had in mind? -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sun Oct 24 12:21:52 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] image tools for PHP under Debian In-Reply-To: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com>; from kc0iog@gmail.com on Sun, Oct 24, 2004 at 09:45:53AM -0500 References: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041024122152.A29883@thinkunix.net> Brian Wall wrote: > I'm messing around with images under PHP. It appears that I don't > have the image components installed, but I can't figure out what > package that lives in. Can someone give me a hand? can you be more specific? would need more info to help you. what distro/OS are you running? what is the error you are getting? a missing library or binary? There's also the TCPHP user's group: http://tcphp.org/ -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nik at black-nyx.com Sun Oct 24 12:35:32 2004 From: nik at black-nyx.com (Nik) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:39 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] installfest yesterday Message-ID: <417BE7E4.3010707@black-nyx.com> Just wanted to say that the installfest yesterday was great, I learned quite a bit, though I wish I had a better memory as I was shown many things that I can't remember today. Jerry I don't mind at all that you watched all day, I'm glad you got Ubuntu installed on your computer. I'm still having a number of problems as I really did try to acomplish more than I knew we'd have time for yesterday but I'm glad I came and dove right in, I think once I get the kinks worked out I'll really be glad I started. A huge thanks again to everyone who helped me with my computer. Hopefully by next installfest my computer will be running good and I'll know a lot more! ~Nik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sun Oct 24 15:05:26 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Installfest Message-ID: <20041024150526.C29883@thinkunix.net> Folks, I'd like to thank everyone who came out to the TCLUG installfest yesterday. It was another success. I believe we helped lots of folks, it was a great networking opportunity, and everyone had a good time. We had a number of people who just stopped by to see what an installfest is all about. Hopefully we sparked their interest further in Linux and the OpenSource community. A special thanks to all the more experienced TCLUG'ers who showed up to help others out. You help make these events such a success. We couldn't do it without you. I'd especially like to thank Martin, Xavier, Eddie, Manuel and the rest of the staff at the Renaissance Box [1] for allowing us to use the event space and for their hard work in helping us make this event a success. Please keep them in mind if you need event space for meetings, conferences, seminars or parties. They also have really cool office space for rent. I have some gift certificates for a free coffee and a tour of the building. If you're serious about renting office or event space, contact me offlist and I'll put you in touch with the right folks there. [1] http://www.renbox.com/ And last but not least, thanks to Allie Micka for making me aware of the Renaissance Box in the first place, and for the computer gear she loaned us for the event. I just knew that old Packard Bell PC would come in handy some day :) For those of you who didn't get a chance to speak with Allie, she's running a developer focused web-hosting company called pajunas interactive [2]. If you're a web developer, or are looking for a hosting provider with a different approach, check out pajunas. [2] http://www.pajunas.com/ -- scot 612.823.2781 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From d9387120 at sihope.com Sun Oct 24 17:29:51 2004 From: d9387120 at sihope.com (dan) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo Message-ID: <417C2CDF.2000303@sihope.com> May I ask just what Gentoo is??? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Sun Oct 24 17:45:09 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo In-Reply-To: <417C2CDF.2000303@sihope.com> References: <417C2CDF.2000303@sihope.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 17:29:51 -0500, dan wrote: > May I ask just what Gentoo is??? Not to be a inflammatory, but did you google this? It's a linux distribution. See the recent query that John Reese sent to the list: http://archives.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/2004-October/068442.html and my response: http://archives.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/2004-October/068444.html -Erik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Oct 24 18:44:58 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo In-Reply-To: References: <417C2CDF.2000303@sihope.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 24 Oct 2004, Erik Anderson wrote: > On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 17:29:51 -0500, dan wrote: > >> May I ask just what Gentoo is??? > > Not to be a inflammatory, but did you google this? It's a linux > distribution. By the way, it's also a species of penguin. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Sun Oct 24 18:54:01 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo In-Reply-To: References: <417C2CDF.2000303@sihope.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 18:44:58 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > By the way, it's also a species of penguin. Haha - yeah I had forgotten about that! Well put. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Sun Oct 24 20:33:39 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] image tools for PHP under Debian In-Reply-To: <20041024122152.A29883@thinkunix.net> References: <2c6699da04102407452c7a856a@mail.gmail.com> <20041024122152.A29883@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <2c6699da0410241833686c9994@mail.gmail.com> > can you be more specific? would need more info to help you. Sorry for all the confusion. The functions I needed were in php4-gd, but I needed to restart apache o make them go into effect. Now everything is working. Thanks anyway! -Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wilson at visi.com Mon Oct 25 08:58:43 2004 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi everyone, Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that I'd like to send from the command line to my regular email account. Doing mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the message (and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an attachment. How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an email? -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Mon Oct 25 09:23:16 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <2c6699da04102213216b01f85f@mail.gmail.com> <20041022222933.00005b44@schubert> Message-ID: <417D0C54.2070509@visi.com> The joke at the time of the HP-Compaq merger was that the main business synergy was the money they'd save only having to file a single bankruptcy petition. -- rick Loren H. Burlingame wrote: >I know that, at least in the local Minneapolis area, UPS buys >exclusively Compaq/HP computer stuff. > >I am assuming that this would be a nation wide standard (given the >nature of UPS, which is all about standards) > >With a contract like that, it is hard to see how HP could screw things >up so bad as to run themselves out of business. > > >On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 22:29:33 -0500, Josh Trutwin > wrote: > > >>On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 15:21:31 -0500 >>Brian Wall wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>>HP has been developing some pretty crappy hardware >>>lately, so I expect to see the quality of our servers diminish as >>>time goes on. >>> >>> >>Man, amen about that. My last (it really will be my last) piece of HP hardware was a SCSI CD-RW drive that I have yet to get to function, even on a Winders box. >> >>Josh >> >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >>Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >>Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org >>https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> > > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Mon Oct 25 09:27:35 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <417D0D57.3070601@visi.com> I use the Mail::Sender and do a quick Perl script. It takes care of building the necessary mime overhead for attachments. --rick Tim Wilson wrote: >Hi everyone, > >Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that I'd >like to send from the command line to my regular email account. Doing > >mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz > >sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the message >(and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an attachment. > >How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an email? > >-Tim > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Oct 25 09:11:52 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Tim Wilson wrote: > Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that > I'd like to send from the command line to my regular email account. > Doing > > mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz > > sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the > message (and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an > attachment. > > How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an > email? Got pine? From "man pine"... -attach file Send mail with the listed file as an attachment. -attachlist file-list Send mail with the listed file-list as an attachments. -attach_and_delete file Send mail with the listed file as an attachment, and remove the file after the message is sent. I haven't done it myself, but I'll bet it works. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Mon Oct 25 09:21:16 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? Message-ID: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Mon Oct 25 09:16:18 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041025141618.GE73710@therub.org> uuencode file.tar.gz file.tar.gz | mail myemail@example.com dan On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 08:58:43AM -0500, Tim Wilson wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that I'd > like to send from the command line to my regular email account. Doing > > mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz > > sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the message > (and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an attachment. > > How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an email? > > -Tim > > -- > Tim Wilson > Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA > Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy > mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Oct 25 09:09:23 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:40 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ACLs on Linux In-Reply-To: <41769DEA.9010807@visi.com> References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> <41769DEA.9010807@visi.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > My personal opinion is that it isn't possible to properly secure a > production system without the ability to absolutely deny access of a > system resource to specific individuals and classes of users. ACLs let > you do that fairly easily. With our research teams, projects and health data, it would be very nice to use ACLs. Does anyone know what the status is of ACLs on Linux? I know that some of the filesystems were incorporating ACLs, or were going to do so. Are they available yet? Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 25 09:32:39 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ACLs on Linux In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> <41769DEA.9010807@visi.com> Message-ID: <20041025143239.GJ22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 25 09:33:31 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Message-ID: <20041025143331.GK22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From blj at umn.edu Mon Oct 25 09:33:21 2004 From: blj at umn.edu (Brian Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Message-ID: <417D0EB1.50902@umn.edu> you can use md5sum, it normally takes input from a file but you can always pipe the string to it via echo. many databases, such as mysql have a built in funtion to calculate md5 hashes, check your docs to see how to use it brian Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Is there a command line tool to create an MD5 hash from a text > string? I would like to store encrypted passwords in a database, but > I have having a tough time finding a utility to create them for me. > > Thanks in advance! > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Mon Oct 25 09:25:08 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Message-ID: md5? su-2.05b# echo "test" | md5 d8e8fca2dc0f896fd7cb4cb0031ba249 On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Is there a command line tool to create an MD5 hash from a text string? I > would like to store encrypted passwords in a database, but I have having a > tough time finding a utility to create them for me. > > Thanks in advance! > > -- > Thomas T. Veldhouse > Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1 > Spammers please contact me at renegade@veldy.net. > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Mon Oct 25 10:04:08 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200410251004.08423.barnabas@knicknack.net> Tim, I would use mutt: 'mutt -a file.tar.gz myemail@example.com'. Only potential drawback is that you probably need a .muttrc containing something like the following: set from=myemail@example.com set hostname=example.com set realname="Real Name" send-hook . my_hdr From: myemail@example.com send-hook . my_hdr Return-Path: send-hook . "set realname='Real Name'" You may not need all that, but its what I have. I have used this technique before and it does work. Eric On Monday 25 October 2004 08:58, Tim Wilson wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that I'd > like to send from the command line to my regular email account. Doing > > mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz > > sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the message > (and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an attachment. > > How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an email? > > -Tim _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Mon Oct 25 10:16:00 2004 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email Message-ID: mimencode will work similarly, but the man page says it is more reliable. >>> drue@therub.org 10/25/04 09:16AM >>> uuencode file.tar.gz file.tar.gz | mail myemail@example.com dan On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 08:58:43AM -0500, Tim Wilson wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Here's a variation on the theme. I've got a tarred, gzipped file that I'd > like to send from the command line to my regular email account. Doing > > mail myemail@example.com < file.tar.gz > > sends the message alright, but the file shows up in the body of the message > (and looking rather scrambled, of course) instead of as an attachment. > > How can I send a file from the command line as an attachment to an email? > > -Tim > > -- > Tim Wilson > Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA > Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy > mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Mon Oct 25 10:51:20 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] ACLs on Linux In-Reply-To: References: <307a337f04101804534bd328dc@mail.gmail.com> <4175F9E2.4000600@comcast.net> <20041020084939.A11747@baker.space.umn.edu> <41769DEA.9010807@visi.com> Message-ID: <2340.192.168.100.2.1098719480.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Specifically what type of ACL's are you thinking of? Do you need personal ones? Linux does a wonderful (routing-type) job of using ACL's through IPtables. > On Wed, 20 Oct 2004, Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > >> My personal opinion is that it isn't possible to properly secure a >> production system without the ability to absolutely deny access of a >> system resource to specific individuals and classes of users. ACLs let >> you do that fairly easily. > > With our research teams, projects and health data, it would be very nice > to use ACLs. Does anyone know what the status is of ACLs on Linux? I > know that some of the filesystems were incorporating ACLs, or were going > to do so. Are they available yet? > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us Mon Oct 25 10:43:05 2004 From: mtuller at ce.anoka.k12.mn.us (Mike Tuller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Shell command to send email In-Reply-To: <20041023183523.GA11014@refried.org> Message-ID: I do have full control over my system. I want to use the mail command so that the script will be more portable. This script will run on an OS X system that has PostFix running on it, but if I were later to run it on Linux with another email server, then the script would still send out emails without needing to change things around. I also didn't want to have to install other software for the same reason. As it turns out, my script works. Just not on my laptop that I created it on. Don't know why. I have just ran upgrades for 2 years, and this is another sign that I need to do a clean install. Here is the script that I am using if anyone has forgot. #! /bin/bash echo "Email message body here." | /usr/bin/mail -s "Email subject" mtuller@ce.anoka.k12.mn.u Thanks all for the help. Mike On 10/23/04 1:35 PM, "nate@refried.org" wrote: > On Sat, Oct 23, 2004 at 10:35:20AM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: >> On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 nate@refried.org wrote: >>> If you run this from cron, any output is usually sent in a mail to the >>> user that owns the cron job. If you're running this as root, just >>> forward the mail from root to your email address. >> >> That applies to stdout and stderr, but if there is no such output, no mail >> is sent. If the cron job is a script that sends an e-mail message, it >> should send that message to the adressee, not to the owner of the cron >> job. > > It sounded to me like Mike had full control over the system he was > running backups on. If he changed the script to output a message the > email part would be taken care of for him. > > If he wants the mail to go somewhere else than the account running the > cron job, there are many ways to redirect the cron email to the correct > address. > > I just wanted to make it clear there might be other ways to get the end > result he wants. > > Nate > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Mon Oct 25 11:13:31 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:41 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Message-ID: <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 09:21:16AM -0500, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Is there a command line tool to create an MD5 hash from a text string? > I would like to store encrypted passwords in a database, but I have > having a tough time finding a utility to create them for me. % echo "test" | openssl md5 d8e8fca2dc0f896fd7cb4cb0031ba249 -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 12:23:41 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <2340.192.168.100.2.1098719480.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: <20041025172341.73706.qmail@web60007.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jonner.2530195 at bloglines.com Mon Oct 25 12:43:48 2004 From: jonner.2530195 at bloglines.com (jonner.2530195@bloglines.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? Message-ID: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> --- TCLUG Mailing List I put up Fedora Core 2 on a Celeron machine. > > > > The machine runs windows XP faultlessly (from the machine view). > > > > Linux installed okay, but on booting, it gets partway up and reboots, over and over. > > > > I have tried other distributions and the same result. Ideas? (throw away the box and get a new one?) > > > > Paul Schumacher > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today! > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > I believe it's probably the motherboard. I know that there was a bug in the kernel that shipped with FC2 that kept resetting with certain motherboards. I know it did with mine. I think it's probably related to 2.6 kernels more than any particular distro. I'm hoping that it gets fixed in FC3. My advice is to try another motherboard (if it's an option), or wait until FC3 comes out (in about a week or so) to see if it's been fixed. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mmurphy at tc-tech.com Mon Oct 25 12:56:56 2004 From: mmurphy at tc-tech.com (Matt Murphy) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> References: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> Message-ID: <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> > I'm hoping that it gets fixed > in FC3. My advice is to try another motherboard (if it's an option), or wait > until FC3 comes out (in about a week or so) to see if it's been fixed. My roommate downloaded FC3 yesterday, I believe it's out! -- Matt Murphy TC Tech _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 13:22:48 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> Message-ID: <20041025182248.70508.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 13:23:59 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> Message-ID: <20041025182359.6118.qmail@web60002.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 25 13:31:15 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> References: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> Message-ID: <20041025183115.GL22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From shanson at cruiskeen.com Mon Oct 25 13:35:01 2004 From: shanson at cruiskeen.com (Steve Hanson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> References: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> Message-ID: <417D4755.9080401@cruiskeen.com> Matt Murphy wrote: > >> I'm hoping that it gets fixed >> in FC3. My advice is to try another motherboard (if it's an option), >> or wait >> until FC3 comes out (in about a week or so) to see if it's been fixed. > > > My roommate downloaded FC3 yesterday, I believe it's out! > > Not out - there's a release candidate tree, and several previous test releases. It won't ship till the 8th. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From thurianknight at gmail.com Mon Oct 25 13:52:53 2004 From: thurianknight at gmail.com (Dave Sherman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <20041025183115.GL22024@iucha.net> References: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> <20041025183115.GL22024@iucha.net> Message-ID: <7bdea6e304102511525fb48b3d@mail.gmail.com> If you install FC3-Test3, then when you run up2date you will automatically be upgraded to FC3-Final when it is released, right? On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 13:31:15 -0500, Florin Iucha wrote: > On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 12:56:56PM -0500, Matt Murphy wrote: > > > > >I'm hoping that it gets fixed > > >in FC3. My advice is to try another motherboard (if it's an option), or > > >wait > > >until FC3 comes out (in about a week or so) to see if it's been fixed. > > > > My roommate downloaded FC3 yesterday, I believe it's out! > > No, it is not. FC3 Test3 is out. > > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/schedule/ > > florin > > -- > > Don't question authority: they don't know either! > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > -- Dave Sherman MCSA, MCSE, CCNA [Insert witty .sig here.] _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Mon Oct 25 14:33:06 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Fedora Core 2 problem Message-ID: <417D54F2.8020507@comcast.net> Paul, Have you tried one of the "Live CD" on the machine that is giving you problems? One that seemed to work was Knoppix 3.4 a version of "Debian" Nice GUI! Knoppix 3.4 has Kernel 2.4.26 (default) and Kernel 2.6.5 (as boot option). Maybe one way to test the Kernels. Knoppix will run live off the CD and RAM (128 Meg minimum) If you can burn a iso image here is the ftp site: http://source.rfc822.org/pub/mirror/knoppix/ KNOPPIX_V3.4-2004-05-17-EN.iso is worth a try. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Mon Oct 25 14:51:41 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:42 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Fedora Core 2 problem In-Reply-To: <417D54F2.8020507@comcast.net> References: <417D54F2.8020507@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1098733901.417d594d88f34@my.visi.com> If it just will not go look at CYGWIN http://www.cygwin.com/ It's emulated but it works. Sam Quoting Jerry W : > Paul, > > Have you tried one of the "Live CD" on the machine that is giving you > problems? > > One that seemed to work was Knoppix 3.4 a version of "Debian" > Nice GUI! > Knoppix 3.4 has Kernel 2.4.26 (default) and Kernel 2.6.5 (as boot option). > Maybe one way to test the Kernels. > Knoppix will run live off the CD and RAM (128 Meg minimum) > If you can burn a iso image here is the ftp site: > http://source.rfc822.org/pub/mirror/knoppix/ > > KNOPPIX_V3.4-2004-05-17-EN.iso > is worth a try. > > Jerry > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From obelin23 at gmail.com Mon Oct 25 16:08:06 2004 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <7bdea6e304102511525fb48b3d@mail.gmail.com> References: <1098726228.80784703.6014.sendItem@bloglines.com> <417D3E68.4040709@tc-tech.com> <20041025183115.GL22024@iucha.net> <7bdea6e304102511525fb48b3d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <72278d10410251408688414c6@mail.gmail.com> One of the machines at the Installfest was having that same boot problem. That machine seemed to work fine with the Ubuntu Live CD. CO2 On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 13:52:53 -0500, Dave Sherman wrote: > If you install FC3-Test3, then when you run up2date you will > automatically be upgraded to FC3-Final when it is released, right? > > > > > On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 13:31:15 -0500, Florin Iucha wrote: > > On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 12:56:56PM -0500, Matt Murphy wrote: > > > > > > >I'm hoping that it gets fixed > > > >in FC3. My advice is to try another motherboard (if it's an option), or > > > >wait > > > >until FC3 comes out (in about a week or so) to see if it's been fixed. > > > > > > My roommate downloaded FC3 yesterday, I believe it's out! > > > > No, it is not. FC3 Test3 is out. > > > > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/schedule/ > > > > florin > > > > -- > > > > Don't question authority: they don't know either! > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > > > -- > Dave Sherman > MCSA, MCSE, CCNA > [Insert witty .sig here.] > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From lists at turbobit.com Mon Oct 25 13:39:50 2004 From: lists at turbobit.com (Karl Bongers) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> Message-ID: <20041025183950.GA14717@dad1> On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 09:21:16AM -0500, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Is there a command line tool to create an MD5 hash from a text string? > I would like to store encrypted passwords in a database, but I have > having a tough time finding a utility to create them for me. > > Thanks in advance! > $ echo -n "test" | md5sum # (NOTE the -n) 098f6bcd4621d373cade4e832627b4f6 - $ python import md5 print md5.new("test").hexdigest() 098f6bcd4621d373cade4e832627b4f6 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Oct 25 18:51:25 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <20041025183950.GA14717@dad1> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025183950.GA14717@dad1> Message-ID: On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Karl Bongers wrote: > On Mon, Oct 25, 2004 at 09:21:16AM -0500, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > >> Is there a command line tool to create an MD5 hash from a text string? >> I would like to store encrypted passwords in a database, but I have >> having a tough time finding a utility to create them for me. > > $ echo -n "test" | md5sum # (NOTE the -n) > 098f6bcd4621d373cade4e832627b4f6 - I hope everyone noticed what you did there. I think this means that the earlier suggestions were wrong. The "-n" option is necessary because the md5sum program will hash the newline unless you don't give it a newline. I didn't think of that until Thomas pointed it out. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Oct 25 18:52:10 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025183950.GA14717@dad1> Message-ID: On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Karl Bongers wrote: > >> $ echo -n "test" | md5sum # (NOTE the -n) >> 098f6bcd4621d373cade4e832627b4f6 - > [snip] > I didn't think of that until Thomas pointed it out. Sorry - until *Karl* pointed it out. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 22:27:16 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Fedora Core 2 problem In-Reply-To: <1098733901.417d594d88f34@my.visi.com> Message-ID: <20041026032716.48004.qmail@web60007.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 22:26:36 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Fedora Core 2 problem ??? In-Reply-To: <72278d10410251408688414c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041026032636.70162.qmail@web60001.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 22:33:19 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] fedora core 2 problem -- more info Message-ID: <20041026033319.26567.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 25 22:26:00 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:43 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: Fedora Core 2 problem In-Reply-To: <417D54F2.8020507@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20041026032600.69926.qmail@web60001.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Mon Oct 25 23:05:05 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] fedora core 2 problem -- more info In-Reply-To: <20041026033319.26567.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041026033319.26567.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041026040505.GO22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nik at black-nyx.com Tue Oct 26 00:01:02 2004 From: nik at black-nyx.com (Nik) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sources.conf - sources.list for ubuntu Message-ID: <417DDA0E.8080208@black-nyx.com> Hey, Could someone who has installed ubuntu recently post their sources.conf or sources.list for me? I'm not sure what happened but when I try to go and edit them, they're not there, and I hadn't touched them. Also, Karl, I've reformatted my 120GB hard drive, made a swap partition, and 3 equal sized partitions for different distros mounted as reiserFS, but now I need ubuntu to mount my hda. I ended up reformatting it to ext3 and just putting ubuntu on it so I could move my media to it so its one large partition. (Yes I do things the long way because I always mess up the short routes but at least eventually accomplish what I need) root@pandora:~ # mount -t ext3 /dev/hda /mnt/hda mount: /dev/hda already mounted or /mnt/hda busy root@pandora:~ # umount -t ext/3 /dev/hda umount: /dev/hda: not mounted root@pandora:~ # umount -t ext/3 /mnt/hda umount: /mnt/hda: not mounted ~Nik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nik at black-nyx.com Tue Oct 26 00:12:31 2004 From: nik at black-nyx.com (Nik) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] More: What I've done thusfar. Message-ID: <417DDCBF.3050302@black-nyx.com> root@pandora:~ # df -h Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on /dev/hdb2 33G 251M 33G 1% / tmpfs 253M 0 253M 0% /dev/shm /dev/hdb3 33G 42M 33G 1% /home /dev/hdb4 42G 1.3G 41G 3% /usr root@pandora:~ # fdisk -l Disk /dev/hda: 40.0 GB, 40060403712 bytes 16 heads, 63 sectors/track, 77622 cylinders Units = cylinders of 1008 * 512 = 516096 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/hda1 * 1 76629 38620984+ 83 Linux /dev/hda2 76630 77622 500472 f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/hda5 76630 77622 500440+ 82 Linux swap Disk /dev/hdb: 120.0 GB, 120000000000 bytes 16 heads, 63 sectors/track, 232514 cylinders Units = cylinders of 1008 * 512 = 516096 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/hdb1 * 1 9688 4882720+ 82 Linux swap /dev/hdb2 9689 77505 34179768 83 Linux /dev/hdb3 77506 145322 34179768 83 Linux /dev/hdb4 145323 232514 43944768 83 Linux root@pandora:~ # sudo gedit /etc/fstab (gedit:6102): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: <---- ? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From florin at iucha.net Tue Oct 26 00:51:13 2004 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] More: What I've done thusfar. In-Reply-To: <417DDCBF.3050302@black-nyx.com> References: <417DDCBF.3050302@black-nyx.com> Message-ID: <20041026055113.GP22024@iucha.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Tue Oct 26 07:52:09 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025183950.GA14717@dad1> Message-ID: <417E4879.6080409@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Tue Oct 26 07:50:54 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Tue Oct 26 08:20:48 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Thanks. It turns out what I needed was actually something different. I > needed the output of the crypt function, and for that, I used perl :-) > > perl -le 'print crypt("password", "ab");' > > where "ab" are any two random characters. > > [veldy@fuggle veldy]$ perl -le 'print crypt("password", "ab");' > abJnggxhB/yWI You're generating the salt (the two random characters) dynamically, right? I usually use something like: srand($$|time); $salt = join('', ('.', '/', 0..9, 'A'..'Z', 'a'..'z')[rand 64, rand 64]); $epasswd = crypt($ascii_passwd, $salt); That's part of a larger script, of course (which I can provide if requested). I also don't advise typing the password on the command line; it'll usually end up in your history file, which could be a security issue. Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 09:10:14 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:44 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: > Thanks. It turns out what I needed was actually something different. > I needed the output of the crypt function, and for that, I used perl :-) > > perl -le 'print crypt("password", "ab");' > > where "ab" are any two random characters. > > [veldy@fuggle veldy]$ perl -le 'print crypt("password", "ab");' > abJnggxhB/yWI Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively encrypted output. It seems that your perl command always includes the first two letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "joe");' jobbj4Fd7EAng # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "bob");' boCXLU4aKrJ0Y # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "mary");' maC0ec.kN8AgI That can't be right! Also, I do not find a match between the output of this command, using my password as input, with my line in my /etc/shadow file. I am using Solaris - does it not use the same password encryption as Linux? I don't have read permissions on /etc/shadow on a Linux box, so I can't check. According to "man useradd" on Linux: -p passwd The encrypted password, as returned by crypt(3). The default is to disable the account. I really want to figure out how to generate the correct 'passwd' string for this command. Whatever one enters as 'passwd' is *exactly* what is entered in the password field of /etc/shadow. Thus, it would be really nice for generating new user accounts to have this working. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Tue Oct 26 09:29:41 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively encrypted > output. It seems that your perl command always includes the first two > letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: > *snip* > > That can't be right! Nope, it's exactly right. That's how crypt()-based authentication works, precisely. It needs to know what salt the original password was encrypted with, so it's the first two characters of the encrypted password. It crypt()s the attempted password (from the authentication attempt) with the same salt, and if the two match, the password must be the same (theoretically). Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Tue Oct 26 09:28:58 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: <20041026142858.GA2733@mail.el-swifto.com> On Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 09:10:14AM -0500, Mike Miller wrote: > Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively > encrypted output. It seems that your perl command always includes the > first two letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: [snip] Yep, that's the salt. See perldoc -f crypt and man crypt. > I really want to figure out how to generate the correct 'passwd' > string for this command. Whatever one enters as 'passwd' is *exactly* > what is entered in the password field of /etc/shadow. Thus, it would > be really nice for generating new user accounts to have this working. Why not just use "passwd" to generate passwords for users? -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 09:42:08 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] sources.conf - sources.list for ubuntu In-Reply-To: <417DDA0E.8080208@black-nyx.com> References: <417DDA0E.8080208@black-nyx.com> Message-ID: /etc/apt/sources.list ## Uncomment the following two lines to fetch updated software from the network deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty main restricted deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty main restricted ## Uncomment the following two lines to add software from the 'universe' ## repository. ## N.B. software from this repository is ENTIRELY UNSUPPORTED by the Ubuntu ## team, and may not be under a free licence. Please satisfy yourself as to ## your rights to use the software. Also, please note that software in ## universe WILL NOT receive any review or updates from the Ubuntu security ## team. #deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty universe #deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty universe deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty-security main restricted deb-src http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty-security main restricted -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Tue Oct 26 09:40:39 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: ; from jima@beer.tclug.org on Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 09:29:41AM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> Jima wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > > Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively encrypted > > output. It seems that your perl command always includes the first two > > letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: > > > *snip* > > > > That can't be right! > > Nope, it's exactly right. That's how crypt()-based authentication works, > precisely. It needs to know what salt the original password was encrypted > with, so it's the first two characters of the encrypted password. It > crypt()s the attempted password (from the authentication attempt) with the > same salt, and if the two match, the password must be the same > (theoretically). Would this explain the "$1$" string that starts all md5 password values in /etc/shadow? -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dcoats at heritagemail.org Tue Oct 26 10:01:50 2004 From: dcoats at heritagemail.org (Doug Coats) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Message-ID: <00a501c4bb6c$b8e27f10$7a06a8c0@secondary1> Can someone please a few moments of your time and help resolve a problem for me. I am trying to get Sendmail to work with multiple domains. I have had Sendmail working properly for a number of months with one domain but now I have been asked by a friend to add email and web hosting for their domain. I have tried a number of things with the same result - Sendmail denies relaying for the second domain. All mail is returned to sender. So if someone has this working on your machine and can explain it to me step by step so that I can figure out where I went wrong or which step I missed that would be great. Thanks, Doug _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From MKroska at kdv.com Tue Oct 26 10:14:32 2004 From: MKroska at kdv.com (Mark J. Kroska) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Message-ID: Doug-- Entries need to be made in these files for multiple-domains with Sendmail: (on a RedHat machine, YMMV) /etc/mail/local-host-names [just the domain name here, one per line] /etc/mail/access [if you need to "relay" or "deny" mail to and from the server, domain name 'tab' RELAY or DENY) /etc/mail/virtusertable [this contains a mapping of email addresses to local or remote accounts, i.e.:] email@host1.com 'tab' localaccount email@host2.com 'tab' forwaded@yahoo.com More information available here: http://www.sendmail.org/virtual-hosting.html Regards, Mark Mark J. Kroska Director of Web Services KDV Technology and Consulting Services, Inc. Direct 320-258-6412 Main 320-252-7060 Fax 320-252-9627 mkroska@kdv.com "NOTICE: This E-mail (including attachments) is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited, Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, then delete it. Thank you." ________________________________ From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Doug Coats Sent: Tue 10/26/2004 10:01 AM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Can someone please a few moments of your time and help resolve a problem for me. I am trying to get Sendmail to work with multiple domains. I have had Sendmail working properly for a number of months with one domain but now I have been asked by a friend to add email and web hosting for their domain. I have tried a number of things with the same result - Sendmail denies relaying for the second domain. All mail is returned to sender. So if someone has this working on your machine and can explain it to me step by step so that I can figure out where I went wrong or which step I missed that would be great. Thanks, Doug _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 6695 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20041026/b4c9d949/attachment.bin -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 26 09:52:06 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: > Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively encrypted > output. It seems that your perl command always includes the first two > letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: That's the "salt" - it's used to add a bit more randomness into the resulting password (okay, randomness isn't the right word). When you type your password to login, the system reads the hash for your username from the password file, and extracts the first 2 characters. Then it crypt()'s the password you entered and the salt from the password file, to see if it gets the same hash that's in the password file. Without a salt, if two users both used the same password, they would have identical hashes (so users that can read the password file could easily find anyone else using the same password). There was a time, the dark ages, where systems didn't have shadow, or some other method to hide hashes from the users. Also without the salt, it would be considerably easier to pre-generate hashes for common passwords (like dictionary words), and then look for those hashes in the passwd file. If the box is compromised, the hashes are viewable. There also needs to be some protection from root, in case he gets bored and wants to find out who's system passwords also match their paypal accounts. Consider, without hashes, I could pre-crypt the 235,882 dictionary words from /usr/share/dict/words, and it would take 235,882 crypt operations, and only about 30M to store the results. With the salt, you would have 3.7M crypt operations, and it would take 483M to store (I think - check my math, I did this quickly...) But nowadays either option is trivial on modern machines. But if someone who's stronger in math (and doesn't have fifty frickin' people talking loudly right next to him!) feels like posting the numbers necessary for pre-generating all possible 8-character passwords, with and without salts, the numbers get pretty astronomical. I believe I read something on a security list a few years ago discussing whether it was feasible with current hardware to generate and store every hash for all passwords up to 16 characters, with all salts. Interesting reading, I unfortunately can't remember where I read it or what the findings were. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 26 10:12:24 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mark J. Kroska wrote: > Doug-- > > Entries need to be made in these files for multiple-domains with Sendmail: > (on a RedHat machine, YMMV) > /etc/mail/local-host-names > [just the domain name here, one per line] And if you aren't on Redhat, or are still having problems, send me a copy of your sendmail.cf off-list and I'll help you out privately. The Local Sendmail Bigot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From lcojiml at yahoo.com Tue Oct 26 11:04:38 2004 From: lcojiml at yahoo.com (James Louis) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041026160438.15792.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> Is this still being explored? Jim --- Ben Kochie wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG > Spread Firefox team? > > It would be cool to get our group listed. > > - -ben > > "Unix is user friendly, Its just picky about its > friends." > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFBdWjPflzKmtpiQEMRAqNeAKCYcErS0ZB752x0CFb714/C1LmwpgCeOoiP > SpJxHg92Icg0VlLFOpN1rrI= > =Udeh > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: > http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test > http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From veldy at veldy.net Tue Oct 26 12:11:49 2004 From: veldy at veldy.net (Thomas T. Veldhouse) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: <417E8555.7080801@veldy.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Oct 26 12:19:01 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:45 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help Message-ID: Hey all, I've got a RH9 box (I know), and am using Pine and Sendmail... most of the time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail to. I get messages that DNS has timed out. I have root capability on my box, but I suspect my upstream DNS provider is the real problem. Anyone got some tips for me? Where to start investigating? Many thanks, Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 12:41:37 2004 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2c6699da04102610417dab5628@mail.gmail.com> The basics: ping itasca.net dig itasca.net That will tell you right away if you have DNS problems. -Brian On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 12:19:01 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann wrote: > Hey all, > > I've got a RH9 box (I know), and am using Pine and Sendmail... most of the > time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail to. > > I get messages that DNS has timed out. > > I have root capability on my box, but I suspect my upstream DNS provider > is the real problem. > > Anyone got some tips for me? Where to start investigating? > > Many thanks, > Chris Schumann > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 13:01:20 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <56002.12.47.38.130.1098813680.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Hey, there's nothing wrong with RH9! I run it (among other things) :) I'd try /var/log/messages for a start. Another option is: service named status Thirdly, try "digging" from your box: dig itasca.net Forth: Try on the internet doing a "WhoIS" for itasca.net to be sure it's still active. Fifth: I had an odd (similar) situation once that turned out to be my router. If I rebooted the router, the problem would go away for awhile. It turned out to be a hardware issue which was solved by replacing the router. Good luck! > Hey all, > > I've got a RH9 box (I know), and am using Pine and Sendmail... most of the > time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail to. > > I get messages that DNS has timed out. > > I have root capability on my box, but I suspect my upstream DNS provider > is the real problem. > > Anyone got some tips for me? Where to start investigating? > > Many thanks, > Chris Schumann > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tommyj27 at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 12:46:55 2004 From: tommyj27 at gmail.com (Thomas Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1469cda20410261046ee5607c@mail.gmail.com> You can try changing the DNS server you're trying resolving from. change the nameserver entries in your /etc/resolve.conf to something else like nameserver 128.101.101.101 # UMN DNS server nameserver 209.98.98.98 # visi.com DNS On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 12:19:01 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann wrote: > Hey all, > > I've got a RH9 box (I know), and am using Pine and Sendmail... most of the > time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail to. > > I get messages that DNS has timed out. > > I have root capability on my box, but I suspect my upstream DNS provider > is the real problem. > > Anyone got some tips for me? Where to start investigating? > > Many thanks, > Chris Schumann > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 12:42:42 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: References: <417D0BDC.9030006@veldy.net> <20041025161331.GA1781@mail.el-swifto.com> <417E482E.6000002@veldy.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > Note that "ab" are the first two characters of the putatively encrypted > output. It seems that your perl command always includes the first two > letters of the input as the first two letters of the output: > > # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "joe");' > jobbj4Fd7EAng > # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "bob");' > boCXLU4aKrJ0Y > # perl -le 'print crypt("password", "mary");' > maC0ec.kN8AgI > > That can't be right! Wow. I are dumb. I should have been doing this: perl -le 'print crypt("joe", "ab");' perl -le 'print crypt("bob", "ab");' perl -le 'print crypt("mary", "ab");' I was changing the salt and using the same password. I meant to change the password! Well, what I was doing was so far off that no one probably quite figured out what the heck I was talking about. Now that I understand how it works, I looked at my Solaris /etc/shadow, used the first two characters of my encrypted password as the salt, and, voila, it worked perfectly. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 26 12:41:03 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: itasca.net. 2D IN NS bullwinkle.itasca.net. itasca.net. 2D IN NS rocky.itasca.net. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: bullwinkle.itasca.net. 2D IN A 207.195.213.5 rocky.itasca.net. 2D IN A 207.195.213.6 *blink blink* That netblock sure looks familiar :) When I hear symptoms like this, I immediately think of the WorkAroundBrokenAAAA sendmail option - but these guys appear to be running bind-8 and working correctly, so that probably isn't the issue. Are you running a DNS server on this machine? Do you have a nameserver specified in /etc/resolv.conf? Who's your upstream? What you may want to do is run tcpdump and watch the DNS traffic. See who you are sending the DNS query to, and who is responding back and with what answers. Also, in general, a good DNS test is to just use dig on your local machine and "play computer", like: dig @f.gtld-servers.net itasca.net (returns nameservers for itasca.net) dig @1st-name-server.itasca.net itasca.net mx dig @2nd-name-server.itacsa.net itasca.net mx See if you get the same response from both, and see if both servers return the same NS records in the authority section that came from the root servers (they did when I looked, so if you are able to get responses from both servers, they should be right). This shouldn't be the case here, but I've seen a lot of intermittent DNS problems because the DNS servers for a domain are returning a different set of auth NS servers in the query responses, from those listed in the root, and the different servers are being flakey - typically this is the case of someone updating the root because they decommissioned or renumbered a name server, but didn't change the zone file. On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > Hey all, > > I've got a RH9 box (I know), and am using Pine and Sendmail... most of the > time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail to. > > I get messages that DNS has timed out. > > I have root capability on my box, but I suspect my upstream DNS provider > is the real problem. > > Anyone got some tips for me? Where to start investigating? > > Many thanks, > Chris Schumann > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 13:30:58 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> The biggest two problems HP created a few years back were 1) taking Carly Fiorina as the CEO, and 2) buying/merging with Compaq. HP makes totally excellent printers! For this current day, I'd say that's their n?che -- it's what they do well. In the past (and still in the right "community," they're well known for their scientific instruments). Unfortunately, two rotten apples don't make a sweet tasting pie. Merging Compaq's struggling proprietary computer market with HP's struggling, proprietary computer market gave them one big, way-to-proprietary, struggling computer market. When you think of: Dell you instantly think computers. When you think of: HP you instantly think printers... and then, well, yeah, they do make other stuff too. It's all about marketing and making bad decisions. Why HP thought they should/could compete on the desktop computer front (when IBM couldn't even pull it off), I don't understand. I won't touch their computer stuff though. It's too quirky and too proprietary! You'd even have to totally hack the case just to use if with some other board. > Here is a message from MLUG (Missouri) two months ago: > > http://mlug.missouri.edu/list-archives/discussion/2004-08/msg00138.php3 > > Jon King is really a smart guy - professor with degrees from Yale and CMU > - and I have a high regard for his nonexpert opinions. So of course this > gives me another reason to be concerned about continuing to invest in HP > products such as VMS. > > They have recovered partially from their devastating August nose dive... > > http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=HPQ&t=3m > > ...but the future of any corporation is uncertain. This adds much to the > appeal of open-source software. > > Mike > > -- > Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. > Assistant Professor > Division of Epidemiology and Community Health > and Institute of Human Genetics > University of Minnesota > http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 13:18:55 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> References: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Scot Jenkins wrote: >> Nope, it's exactly right. That's how crypt()-based authentication >> works, precisely. It needs to know what salt the original password was >> encrypted with, so it's the first two characters of the encrypted >> password. It crypt()s the attempted password (from the authentication >> attempt) with the same salt, and if the two match, the password must be >> the same (theoretically). > > Would this explain the "$1$" string that starts all md5 password values > in /etc/shadow? -- scot That's not how it is on my system - every password begins with a different two-character salt string. Does 'crypt' use md5? I think it uses something else, but I'm not 100% on that. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From austad at signal15.com Tue Oct 26 13:31:58 2004 From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] apache/php/mysql installer thingy In-Reply-To: <1094493143.3356.19.camel@thinky> References: <3f0ccce00409031032c952efb@mail.gmail.com> <20040903180246.GA11992@refried.org> <1094237213.3535.15.camel@wkstn1> <20040903191218.GA13463@refried.org> <1094493143.3356.19.camel@thinky> Message-ID: <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> What's the name of that script that installs apache, mysql, and php? I totally forgot the name, the site was apache(something).com or org Any ideas? -jay _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Oct 26 13:32:26 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] IBM ThinkPad X20 for sale Message-ID: I've got a sad X20 and have no use for it. The display is too small for my wife, and it's underpowered for me. I bought it broken off eBay. It had a dark display and was stripped of parts. I replaced the CCFL inverter and the display now works perfectly! In fact, everything I've tested works without fail, and I'll offer an "all features working" guarantee or your money back. I've booted Knoppix from CD (using an X2 media slice that is not for sale), and I booted Fedora Core 2 (using a hard drive that is not included). It's a 2662-34U, so it has these features: - 600MHz Mobile PIII - 64MB RAM and one slot that takes up to 256MB - 12.1" XGA (1024x768) screen - ATI Rage Mobility M with 4MB video RAM - White ThinkLight LED for typing in the dark - 3.5 pound, single spindle ultraportable machine - One CF slot - One CardBus slot - Lucent v.92 modem - Intel 100Mbps NIC - Crystal CS4281/CS4297A audio o Windows 98SE license sticker (which I know none of YOU want) I'm asking $200 for it, but it's missing some parts. You need: o Hard disk o Disk caddy o Disk cover o Disk retention screw o Battery o AC adapter o OS of choice Installing your OS can be tricky. - Booting from supported USB floppy or CD drive works - Booting from optional X2 media slice with CD or DVD drive works - Booting from CF card or USB drive might work - Booting from network might work (it has Intel's Boot Agent) - Copying files onto your hard disk in another machine should work (but ThinkPads do weird things with drive geometry) Free local delivery. If you have interest or questions, let me know. Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Oct 26 13:23:11 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks for all the tips so far, folks. > Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 12:41:37 -0500 > From: Brian Wall > ping itasca.net > dig itasca.net > wrote: > > time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail > > to. ping: [chris@alpha chris]$ ping itasca.net ping: unknown host itasca.net dig: [chris@alpha chris]$ dig itasca.net ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> itasca.net ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: SERVFAIL, id: 20960 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;itasca.net. IN A ;; Query time: 18 msec ;; SERVER: 209.46.63.1#53(209.46.63.1) ;; WHEN: Tue Oct 26 13:14:49 2004 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 28 lynx http://itasca.net: Unable to locate remote host itasca.net. > From: "Garrett Krueger" > I'd try /var/log/messages for a start. Maybe later. > Another option is: service named status No output at all. A clue! It must be using my upstream DNS for everything. And finally (Thanks Adam): [chris@alpha chris]$ cat /etc/resolv.conf nameserver 209.46.63.1 I forget who that is. What's my next step? Thanks again, Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 26 13:31:06 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:46 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 209.46.63.1 is Gofast. su-2.05b# dig @ns.gofast.net itasca.net ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: SERVFAIL, id: 17181 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUERY SECTION: ;; itasca.net, type = A, class = IN Fails! But then, check this out: su-2.05b# dig @ns2.gofast.net itasca.net ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 51264 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUERY SECTION: ;; itasca.net, type = A, class = IN ;; ANSWER SECTION: itasca.net. 1D IN A 207.195.213.6 ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: itasca.net. 1D IN NS bullwinkle.itasca.net. itasca.net. 1D IN NS rocky.itasca.net. ns.gofast.net fails but ns2.gofast.net works. Do you connect to Gofast or Agility? Temporary workaround is to use ns2.gofast.net / 209.46.63.6, but it may be nice to inform Agility of the discrepancy. It's possible that they don't intend you to use ns.gofast.net as a resolver (maybe recursion is off?)...many ISP's have name servers that serve auth information for their domains, and seperate resolvers for customers to use for DNS resolution. I can't say what Agility is doing, but if you're their customer, it may be worth asking their support. On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > Thanks for all the tips so far, folks. > >> Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 12:41:37 -0500 >> From: Brian Wall > >> ping itasca.net >> dig itasca.net > >> wrote: >>> time. There's a set of domains (itasca.net) that I cannot send e-mail >>> to. > > ping: > [chris@alpha chris]$ ping itasca.net > ping: unknown host itasca.net > > dig: > [chris@alpha chris]$ dig itasca.net > > ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> itasca.net > ;; global options: printcmd > ;; Got answer: > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: SERVFAIL, id: 20960 > ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 > > ;; QUESTION SECTION: > ;itasca.net. IN A > > ;; Query time: 18 msec > ;; SERVER: 209.46.63.1#53(209.46.63.1) > ;; WHEN: Tue Oct 26 13:14:49 2004 > ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 28 > > lynx http://itasca.net: > Unable to locate remote host itasca.net. > >> From: "Garrett Krueger" >> I'd try /var/log/messages for a start. > Maybe later. > >> Another option is: service named status > No output at all. A clue! It must be using my upstream DNS for everything. > > And finally (Thanks Adam): > [chris@alpha chris]$ cat /etc/resolv.conf > nameserver 209.46.63.1 > > I forget who that is. > > What's my next step? > > Thanks again, > Chris Schumann > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 13:45:53 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Garrett Krueger wrote: > When you think of: Dell you instantly think computers. > When you think of: HP you instantly think printers... and then, well, > yeah, they do make other stuff too. I guess HP has show fairly good flexibility over the years. Some of you will remember when "Hewlett Packard" made you think immediately of hand-held calculators. Before that, I think it was mainframes and so-called mini-computers. Now, as Garrett suggested, it's printers, but HP has a lot more going on than that. People might not think "printer ink cartridges" but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 26 13:56:47 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <417E9DEF.5030300@visi.com> Garrett Krueger wrote: >HP makes totally excellent printers! For this current day, I'd say that's >their n?che -- it's what they do well. In the past (and still in the >right "community," they're well known for their scientific instruments). > > The instrument and optics guys are now known as Agilent (A) and they haven't been doing quite as well as HP :-( --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dru at druswanderings.net Tue Oct 26 13:43:18 2004 From: dru at druswanderings.net (The Wandering Dru) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] apache/php/mysql installer thingy In-Reply-To: <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> References: <3f0ccce00409031032c952efb@mail.gmail.com> <20040903180246.GA11992@refried.org> <1094237213.3535.15.camel@wkstn1> <20040903191218.GA13463@refried.org> <1094493143.3356.19.camel@thinky> <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> Message-ID: <417E9AC6.50701@druswanderings.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Jay Austad wrote: | What's the name of that script that installs apache, mysql, and php? I | totally forgot the name, the site was apache(something).com or org | | Any ideas? | apt-get install apache mysql php4 *runs for cover* - -- The Wandering Dru GnuPG Key: 0x506A915F http://www.druswanderings.net Get nifty TCLUG merchandise at the TCLUG Store! http://www.cafeshops.com/tclug -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.5 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFBfprGiwhv4FBqkV8RAk7xAJ9RxyL82f9/MXPYUc1LQkxJMhYLTgCcD3ef BR9w4FCft9oPsKw6BBAt90I= =r4R5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 13:59:24 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <32288.12.47.38.130.1098817164.squirrel@12.47.38.130> The default BIND package on RH9 can be finicky. Try this sequence to see if it clear matters up: 1) ps -aux 2) locate the PID for named and do: kill -s 9 ##### where you replace the number signs with the appropriate ID 3) service named start If it starts OK and you can subsequently locate itasca.net, upgrade your DNS server to the most recent stable version of BIND. > >> Another option is: service named status > No output at all. A clue! It must be using my upstream DNS for everything. > > And finally (Thanks Adam): > [chris@alpha chris]$ cat /etc/resolv.conf > nameserver 209.46.63.1 > > I forget who that is. > > What's my next step? > > Thanks again, > Chris Schumann > > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Tue Oct 26 13:56:36 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] apache/php/mysql installer thingy In-Reply-To: <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com>; from austad@signal15.com on Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 01:31:58PM -0500 References: <3f0ccce00409031032c952efb@mail.gmail.com> <20040903180246.GA11992@refried.org> <1094237213.3535.15.camel@wkstn1> <20040903191218.GA13463@refried.org> <1094493143.3356.19.camel@thinky> <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> Message-ID: <20041026135636.B26535@thinkunix.net> Jay Austad wrote: > What's the name of that script that installs apache, mysql, and php? I > totally forgot the name, the site was apache(something).com or org http://www.apachetoolbox.com/ ?? -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 14:12:15 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <40283.12.47.38.130.1098817935.squirrel@12.47.38.130> I think you hit it on the head there. I think they make far more on consumables than on the hardware. I remember those days of HP calculators (my college days when everyone drooled over them) ;) > > I guess HP has show fairly good flexibility over the years. Some of you > will remember when "Hewlett Packard" made you think immediately of > hand-held calculators. Before that, I think it was mainframes and > so-called mini-computers. Now, as Garrett suggested, it's printers, but > HP has a lot more going on than that. People might not think "printer ink > cartridges" but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the > ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Tue Oct 26 13:54:49 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: ; from mbmiller@taxa.epi.umn.edu on Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 01:18:55PM -0500 References: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <20041026135449.A26535@thinkunix.net> Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Scot Jenkins wrote: > > >> Nope, it's exactly right. That's how crypt()-based authentication > >> works, precisely. It needs to know what salt the original password was > >> encrypted with, so it's the first two characters of the encrypted > >> password. It crypt()s the attempted password (from the authentication > >> attempt) with the same salt, and if the two match, the password must be > >> the same (theoretically). > > > > Would this explain the "$1$" string that starts all md5 password values > > in /etc/shadow? -- scot > > That's not how it is on my system - every password begins with a different > two-character salt string. Does 'crypt' use md5? I think it uses > something else, but I'm not 100% on that. md5 passwords start with "$1$", at least they do on Linux (/etc/shadow) and FreeBSD (/etc/master.passwd) systems. crypt passwords would start with the 2 char salt. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 14:05:36 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> > but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the > ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! yeah - I set up direct deposit to HP from my paycheck - as my wife just *loves* printing out photos and mailing the off to relatives.... sigh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 14:12:57 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: > >> but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the >> ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! > > > yeah - I set up direct deposit to HP from my paycheck - as my wife just > *loves* printing out photos and mailing the off to relatives.... I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than to buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale pricing and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that shows you their business model! Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Tue Oct 26 14:05:54 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the ink-jet cartridges > than on the ink-jet printers! No kidding. It's King Gillette's old adage - give away the razor and sell the blades. CompUSA lists a black ink cartridge for an HP printer at $19.99. The cheapest HP inkjet printer is $49.62. AFAIK, every printer manufacturer does this. Geek: Why does the "tub of ink" cost 1/2 the price of the printer?! HP: Because the cartridge has fancy electronics on it Geek: What do those electronics do? HP: You know...stuff. Good stuff. It can tell you when you're out of ink! Geek: Why don't you put that logic into the printer? HP: (Getting nervous) Well, then the printer would cost more Geek: But I only have to buy the printer once, I have to buy Ink cartridges every few months! If you're so concerned about cost, wouldn't you like to offer your customers a non-low-ink-detecting version that's cheaper? I mean, come on, we can tell when we're out of ink... HP: (Blurts out) But then the printer won't be able to tell whether you bought a $3 refilled cartridge, or an overpriced $20 official HP cartridge...SHOOT WAS THAT OUT LOUD? And looking into my "Crystal Ball of Conspiracy Theories", I see the future. I see rfid tags embedded into paper, and I see HP and Epson buying a large number of paper mills. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us Tue Oct 26 14:20:03 2004 From: troy.johnson at health.state.mn.us (Troy.A Johnson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? Message-ID: Oh, and maybe you could donate the used printers as a tax writeoff too... >>> mbmiller@taxa.epi.umn.edu 10/26/04 02:12PM >>> On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: >> but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the >> ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! > yeah - I set up direct deposit to HP from my paycheck - as my wife just > *loves* printing out photos and mailing the off to relatives.... I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than to buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale pricing and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that shows you their business model! _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Oct 26 14:15:49 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: <20041026135449.A26535@thinkunix.net> References: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> <20041026135449.A26535@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Scot Jenkins wrote: > md5 passwords start with "$1$", at least they do on Linux (/etc/shadow) > and FreeBSD (/etc/master.passwd) systems. > crypt passwords would start with the 2 char salt. Does that mean it is possible to configure Linux to use either crypt or md5? Or does the system allow both to be used and determine at login which applies to the user by reading /etc/shadow? (by looking for $1$) Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rwh at visi.com Tue Oct 26 14:39:22 2004 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: > >> >> >>> but I would not be surprised if HP makes more total on the >>> ink-jet cartridges than on the ink-jet printers! >> >> >> >> yeah - I set up direct deposit to HP from my paycheck - as my wife >> just *loves* printing out photos and mailing the off to relatives.... > > > > I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than > to buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale > pricing and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that > shows you their business model! It isn't just HP that uses that strategy on the low-end inkjet market. I recently grabbed a Lexmark on close-out at Target for $18 and paid another $20 to Best Buy for the black cartridge (the printer only came with a color cartridge). And usually the cartridge that comes with the printer is fairly low yield. I think my HP Photosmart printer 3 8x10 photos on the included cartridge but could do 50+ with the refill. This is why Lexmark was suing 3rd party cartridge manufacturers. The 3rd party guys were implementing chips for the cartridges to identify themselves to the Lexmark printers and Lexmark claimed the cartridge->printer interface was covered under DMCA. The money is in the 'usables'. --rick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Tue Oct 26 14:40:10 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Command-line tool to compute MD5 has from text string? In-Reply-To: ; from mbmiller@taxa.epi.umn.edu on Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 02:15:49PM -0500 References: <20041026094039.A16197@thinkunix.net> <20041026135449.A26535@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <20041026144010.A18328@thinkunix.net> Mike Miller wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Scot Jenkins wrote: > > > md5 passwords start with "$1$", at least they do on Linux (/etc/shadow) > > and FreeBSD (/etc/master.passwd) systems. > > crypt passwords would start with the 2 char salt. > > > Does that mean it is possible to configure Linux to use either crypt or > md5? Or does the system allow both to be used and determine at login > which applies to the user by reading /etc/shadow? (by looking for $1$) I believe it does. Why one would want to go back to using crypt vs the more secure md5, I don't know. Debian, Redhat > 6.0 and presumable most other distros ask you during the install if you want to use md5 passwords. You should say yes. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Tue Oct 26 14:37:32 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:47 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <417EA77C.7090906@joshwelch.com> Garrett Krueger wrote: > The biggest two problems HP created a few years back were 1) taking Carly > Fiorina as the CEO, and 2) buying/merging with Compaq. > > HP makes totally excellent printers! For this current day, I'd say that's > their n?che -- it's what they do well. In the past (and still in the > right "community," they're well known for their scientific instruments). > Personally I'm partial to their network gear as well. Fairly reliable, good feature set to price ratio. By the way, there's nothing wrong necessarily with expensive proprietary computers, there is some very cool stuff in that realm, but these days the market only exists on the very high end for that kind of stuff, i.e. their Integrity, Non-Stop, HP-UX and similar lines. Trying to do expensive and proprietary on the x86 level is business suicide. Dell's going to beat you up at one end and a thousand white-box manufacturers are going to be beating you up at the other end. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 15:17:07 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> HP's not the only one with that market corner; I noticed this with Canon too. A few years ago, I bought my kids a cheapo Canon bubblejet for Christmas -- $59 or some such price. Then I discovered each cartridge (Black = $20, Color = $37) summed to the printer price. That printer is now sitting in my junk pile, and they have a totally different printer today! > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: > >> > I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than to > buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale pricing > and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that shows you > their business model! > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 15:23:06 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> Message-ID: <28349.12.47.38.130.1098822186.squirrel@12.47.38.130> I've been using remanufactured cartriges myself (for a number of years now). I try to find the ones where black is about $7-$15 depending upon printer, color is $9-$20 (again, depending upon printer). I don't really care if it voids the warranty since, at that price, I'm screwed either way. I might as well save the cash. > It isn't just HP that uses that strategy on the low-end inkjet market. I > recently grabbed a Lexmark on close-out at Target for $18 and paid > another $20 to Best Buy for the black cartridge (the printer only came > with a color cartridge). And usually the cartridge that comes with the > printer is fairly low yield. I think my HP Photosmart printer 3 8x10 > photos on the included cartridge but could do 50+ with the refill. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From obelin23 at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 15:09:00 2004 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <72278d104102613092623f9b3@mail.gmail.com> What printer did you end up going with? (Linux friendly, I assume.) CO2 On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:17:07 -0500 (CDT), Garrett Krueger wrote: > HP's not the only one with that market corner; I noticed this with Canon > too. A few years ago, I bought my kids a cheapo Canon bubblejet for > Christmas -- $59 or some such price. Then I discovered each cartridge > (Black = $20, Color = $37) summed to the printer price. That printer is > now sitting in my junk pile, and they have a totally different printer > today! > > > > > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: > > > >> > > I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than to > > buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale pricing > > and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that shows you > > their business model! > > > > Mike > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Tue Oct 26 15:18:54 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <20041026201854.GH73710@therub.org> On Tue, Oct 26, 2004 at 03:17:07PM -0500, Garrett Krueger wrote: > HP's not the only one with that market corner; I noticed this with Canon > too. A few years ago, I bought my kids a cheapo Canon bubblejet for > Christmas -- $59 or some such price. Then I discovered each cartridge > (Black = $20, Color = $37) summed to the printer price. That printer is > now sitting in my junk pile, and they have a totally different printer > today! The other big rip off these days is cables. Best Buy, for instance, will sell you a $40 printer, the sales guy will say "oh, you need a cable!" and he'll throw in a $30 parallel/usb cable in your cart (happened to my mom). KVM switches - you can buy them for a song - but cables will cost you $20+ a piece. Gotta love general nano - i needed some just regular power cables a while back. All the stores charge $10+ for them. I /refused/ to pay that for a stupid power cable (i wanted a few, always need them..). Went to general nano systems on university, and they just gave me a handful of them! i didn't even buy anything (on that particular trip). Patch cables - don't get me started. Go to home depot, invest in a crimper and buy a spool. *sigh* maybe i'm in the wrong business :) dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Ryan at ccconsulting.biz Tue Oct 26 15:17:29 2004 From: Ryan at ccconsulting.biz (Ryan@ccconsulting.biz) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS Help Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20041026/d0df094b/attachment.html -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 15:27:51 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] IBM ThinkPad X20 for sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a04102613273f4afc3b@mail.gmail.com> Chris, I think $200 is too much for it. Especially given that a battery is going to cost a fortune. I don't want to low-ball you, but what's the lowest you'll possibly consider for it? On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 13:32:26 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann wrote: > I've got a sad X20 and have no use for it. The display is too small for my > wife, and it's underpowered for me. I bought it broken off eBay. It had a > dark display and was stripped of parts. I replaced the CCFL inverter and > the display now works perfectly! In fact, everything I've tested works > without fail, and I'll offer an "all features working" guarantee or your > money back. > > I've booted Knoppix from CD (using an X2 media slice that is not for > sale), and I booted Fedora Core 2 (using a hard drive that is not > included). > > It's a 2662-34U, so it has these features: > - 600MHz Mobile PIII > - 64MB RAM and one slot that takes up to 256MB > - 12.1" XGA (1024x768) screen > - ATI Rage Mobility M with 4MB video RAM > - White ThinkLight LED for typing in the dark > - 3.5 pound, single spindle ultraportable machine > - One CF slot > - One CardBus slot > - Lucent v.92 modem > - Intel 100Mbps NIC > - Crystal CS4281/CS4297A audio > o Windows 98SE license sticker (which I know none of YOU want) > > I'm asking $200 for it, but it's missing some parts. > > You need: > o Hard disk > o Disk caddy > o Disk cover > o Disk retention screw > o Battery > o AC adapter > o OS of choice > > Installing your OS can be tricky. > > - Booting from supported USB floppy or CD drive works > - Booting from optional X2 media slice with CD or DVD drive works > - Booting from CF card or USB drive might work > - Booting from network might work (it has Intel's Boot Agent) > - Copying files onto your hard disk in another machine should work > (but ThinkPads do weird things with drive geometry) > > Free local delivery. > > If you have interest or questions, let me know. > > Chris Schumann > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From larry.pint at ntuminc.com Tue Oct 26 15:31:20 2004 From: larry.pint at ntuminc.com (Larry Pint) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <28349.12.47.38.130.1098822186.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> <28349.12.47.38.130.1098822186.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <417EB418.4010201@ntuminc.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sk3tch at sk3tch.net Tue Oct 26 15:39:05 2004 From: sk3tch at sk3tch.net (sk3tch@sk3tch.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] IBM ThinkPad X20 for sale Message-ID: >Chris, > I think $200 is too much for it. Especially given that a battery is >going to cost a fortune. I don't want to low-ball you, but what's the >lowest you'll possibly consider for it? Shawn, Perhaps you're not aware of the quality of IBM laptops. For what he is selling, this is a good buy. If I didn't already have a T40 I'd be interested. Nevermind that this is a sub-note, not your average 8+ LB behemouth! You replied to the whole list so I figured you wouldn't mind me butting in. :-D _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 15:45:56 2004 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <417EB418.4010201@ntuminc.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> <28349.12.47.38.130.1098822186.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <417EB418.4010201@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc04102613455ec5f5f5@mail.gmail.com> lasermonks.com ? http://lasermonks.com/ yeah! - free spot in heaven with every purchase.... save them up, share them with family or friends, give them as gifts... the possibilities are endless... On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:31:20 -0500, Larry Pint wrote: > What's a good source for remanufactured cartriges? I bought some that > printed 25 pages and started fading out. That was no deal! > > Larry Pint > > > > > Garrett Krueger wrote: > > I've been using remanufactured cartriges myself (for a number of years > now). I try to find the ones where black is about $7-$15 depending upon > printer, color is $9-$20 (again, depending upon printer). I don't really > care if it voids the warranty since, at that price, I'm screwed either way. > I might as well save the cash. > It isn't just HP that uses that strategy on the low-end inkjet market. I > recently grabbed a Lexmark on close-out at Target for $18 and paid another > $20 to Best Buy for the black cartridge (the printer only came with a color > cartridge). And usually the cartridge that comes with the printer is fairly > low yield. I think my HP Photosmart printer 3 8x10 photos on the included > cartridge but could do 50+ with the refill. > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - > Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: > http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test > http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 15:56:12 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:48 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] apache/php/mysql installer thingy In-Reply-To: <20041026135636.B26535@thinkunix.net> References: <3f0ccce00409031032c952efb@mail.gmail.com> <20040903180246.GA11992@refried.org> <1094237213.3535.15.camel@wkstn1> <20040903191218.GA13463@refried.org> <1094493143.3356.19.camel@thinky> <51D828DB-277D-11D9-8D98-000D933AFC92@signal15.com> <20041026135636.B26535@thinkunix.net> Message-ID: <32fd453704102613563f0c033a@mail.gmail.com> http://www.apachefriends.org? http://www.apachefriends.org/en/ Default site's in german. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 16:26:07 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <72278d104102613092623f9b3@mail.gmail.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <72278d104102613092623f9b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <15502.12.47.38.130.1098825967.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Well, interestingly, I got an HP Deskjet -- the wide carriage model. I think it would work under LINUX just fine (but they use Windows XP). > What printer did you end up going with? (Linux friendly, I assume.) > > CO2 > > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:17:07 -0500 (CDT), Garrett Krueger > wrote: >> HP's not the only one with that market corner; I noticed this with Canon >> too. A few years ago, I bought my kids a cheapo Canon bubblejet for >> Christmas -- $59 or some such price. Then I discovered each cartridge >> (Black = $20, Color = $37) summed to the printer price. That printer is >> now sitting in my junk pile, and they have a totally different printer >> today! >> >> >> >> > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, John Meier wrote: >> > >> >> >> > I've heard that it is sometimes cheaper to buy a new HP printer than >> to >> > buy the HP cartridges for that printer! Could that be true - sale >> pricing >> > and rebates accounted for? I think it might be. If so, that shows >> you >> > their business model! >> > >> > Mike >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> > tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >> Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 16:17:42 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] IBM ThinkPad X20 for sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a04102614172e025855@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:39:05 -0500, sk3tch@sk3tch.net wrote: > Shawn, > > Perhaps you're not aware of the quality of IBM laptops. For what he is > selling, this is a good buy. If I didn't already have a T40 I'd be > interested. > > Nevermind that this is a sub-note, not your average 8+ LB behemouth! > > You replied to the whole list so I figured you wouldn't mind me butting > in. :-D > > Nah, I don't mind. I realized my mistake, but rather than trying to send another "Oops, ignore previous e-mail" figured it would slide. As to the cost, honestly, I think it's too much. $200 for X20 $90 for a battery $46 for the AC adapter $69 for 10GB drive Who knows what the cost of the other parts are going to cost... Add in the specs of the system itself: P3-600 64MB of ram 4MB video It's not worth it for what it would cost to bring it to par for my desires/needs. The costs would take it pretty close to about 2/3 the cost of a new. At which point, I'd rather spend the money and buy a warranty. I'm well aware of the quality of Thinkpads. I've used the 390E, 380 series, 770, and I'm typing this out on an R50. I'm very interested in obtaining an X series due to portability needs primarily, as I ride a motorcycle in the summer time and the weight of all the laptops I've used to date is a killer when it's there for a few hours. I realize the X series isn't meant to the a desktop replacement, but even so, the specs of this one is low. As I said, I don't want to lowball him, but I honestly think he's asking too much. IMO at least. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Oct 26 16:37:47 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] IBM ThinkPad X20 for sale Message-ID: > From: Shawn Fertch > Chris, > I think $200 is too much for it. Especially given that a battery is > going to cost a fortune. I don't want to low-ball you, but what's the > lowest you'll possibly consider for it? You're free to think what you like, especially if you're educated on the topic. $200 is not a great price, but I think it's a fair one. Feel free to check eBay for closed auctions, but this one works and is in town. It's being sold by a long-time member of this community. I can show the machine working with other parts that I have. It's true that batteries can be expensive. IBM charges $159 for theirs, but new third-party batteries can be had for about $55. Then of course, there are used batteries too (the rest of the machine is used, after all). If you're really interested, I've set out an offer. Traditionally, it would be your turn to counter. -- Chris Schumann, Partner Third Wave Partnership, LLC Office 612-920-4364 722 W 66 St, PMB 302 Fax 612-677-3003 Minneapolis, MN 55423 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 21:40:56 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <72278d104102613092623f9b3@mail.gmail.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <21679.12.47.38.130.1098821827.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <72278d104102613092623f9b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67f3084a041026194052707226@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:09:00 -0500, Charlie O wrote: > What printer did you end up going with? (Linux friendly, I assume.) > I have an HP 960c which is Linux and network capable via an HP JetDirect 170x box. I paid $199 for it a few years back, and the cartridges are about $15 for the black (HP #45) and $28 for the color (HP #78). All in all, it's been a better investment thanthe Canon BJC4100 I had a number of years before I bought this one. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Oct 26 22:08:51 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations Message-ID: I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... dunno what. Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. And how about a cheap web host? Thanks, Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Tue Oct 26 22:37:43 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3455.192.168.100.2.1098848263.squirrel@192.168.100.2> I've used DomainMonger for several years now. They're pretty reasonable, but someone was telling me of another place which is, apparently, reputable and a bit cheaper still. I host my sites myself, but I believe DomainMonger (or any other registrar) will let you host for a reasonable rate. > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > dunno what. > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use > from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. > > And how about a cheap web host? > > Thanks, > Chris Schumann > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sfertch at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 22:25:52 2004 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <67f3084a0410262025550918e5@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:08:51 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann wrote: > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > dunno what. > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use > from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. > > And how about a cheap web host? Chris, I used gkg.net to register my domain names. I believe they also do webhosting, webmail and dns now as well. Give them a shot, as I haven't had any problems with them to date. I host from home on a block of static IP's on my qwest line (I know people will boo this, but the price is right). If you want to host from home with dynamic addresses, look in something like dyndns. Will be glad to help out with other questions/etc. -- -Shawn "That which hits the fan, will not be evenly distributed." _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From todd at xnewbie.com Tue Oct 26 22:27:11 2004 From: todd at xnewbie.com (Todd) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations References: Message-ID: <015f01c4bbd4$da4ee180$6600a8c0@baker5> If your going to host the site yourself and you don't have a static IP address I'd recommend no-ip.com if you want to host it somewhere else and just need a cheep domain register I recommend godaddy.com and for a cheep host I use ADThosting.com they are reasonable and reliable. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Schumann" To: "Twin Cities Linux User Group" Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 10:08 PM Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > dunno what. > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use > from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. > > And how about a cheap web host? > > Thanks, > Chris Schumann > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Tue Oct 26 22:34:19 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: <3455.192.168.100.2.1098848263.squirrel@192.168.100.2> References: <3455.192.168.100.2.1098848263.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Message-ID: I am currently using 1afm.com for both my registrar and web host. It is really cheap, has linux web hosting with (almost) all the goodies and has a slick web interface for everything. You have to be pretty good at saying no, though, since they will try to sell you everything under the sun by default. Also no shell access (which kind of sucks) but what do you expect for $8/mo? On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:37:43 -0500 (CDT), Garrett Krueger wrote: > I've used DomainMonger for several years now. They're pretty reasonable, > but someone was telling me of another place which is, apparently, > reputable and a bit cheaper still. > > I host my sites myself, but I believe DomainMonger (or any other > registrar) will let you host for a reasonable rate. > > > > > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > > dunno what. > > > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use > > from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. > > > > And how about a cheap web host? > > > > Thanks, > > Chris Schumann > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Tue Oct 26 22:29:02 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041026222902.00004a16@schubert> On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:08:51 -0500 (CDT) Chris Schumann wrote: > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net > or... dunno what. > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I > can use from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. Even though they are about $5.00 more than the competition at $15.00 per year I use www.dyndns.org (who also does my dynamic DNS) since they have gratiously provided dynamic DNS services to me for free. Even without that though, their registration system is nice and simple and I've had great, almost instant support when I had to ask questions. If you want to save a few more dollars I've liked dotster.com. Make sure you can at least control your name servers easily. > And how about a cheap web host? Yeah, me. :) I host a couple other TCLUG'ers for a discount rate. LAMP setup on a colocated Debian box. Pretty much set you up and leave you alone - no quotas as long as it's within reason. Contact me off list if interested. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kfuchs at winternet.com Tue Oct 26 22:47:59 2004 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: <20041026160438.15792.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> (message from James Louis on Tue, 26 Oct 2004 09:04:38 -0700 (PDT)) References: <20041026160438.15792.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200410270347.i9R3lxu09559@ecstasy1.winternet.com> >ben wrote: >> Does anyone want to join in and create a TCLUG >> Spread Firefox team? >> >> It would be cool to get our group listed. Jim wrote: >Is this still being explored? Yes, 7642 names as of Oct 26, 22:45 CDT. Three more days of registration yet to go. Plenty of time to organize several TCLUG groups! http://www.spreadfirefox.com/ Sincerely, Ken Fuchs _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wilson at visi.com Tue Oct 26 22:56:46 2004 From: wilson at visi.com (Tim Wilson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 10/26/04 10:08 PM, "Chris Schumann" wrote: > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > dunno what. > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can use > from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. The combination of GKG (http://gkg.net/) and DynDNS (http://dyndns.org/) has worked very well for me. I noticed the other day that DynDNS can do registrations now too. I don't know what their pricing is like. -Tim -- Tim Wilson Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA Educational technology guy, Linux and OS X fan, Grad. student, Daddy mailto: wilson@visi.com aim: tis270 public key: 0x8C0F8813 _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Tue Oct 26 23:01:04 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0410262025550918e5@mail.gmail.com> References: <67f3084a0410262025550918e5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200410262301.04051.barnabas@knicknack.net> On Tuesday 26 October 2004 22:25, Shawn Fertch wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:08:51 -0500 (CDT), Chris Schumann > > wrote: > > I want to register a domain for myself and my wife. Probably a .net or... > > dunno what. > > > > Can you recommend a reasonably priced, well-working company? One I can > > use from home if I don't have a fixed IP, etc., etc. > > > > And how about a cheap web host? > > Chris, > I used gkg.net to register my domain names. I believe they also do > webhosting, webmail and dns now as well. Give them a shot, as I > haven't had any problems with them to date. > > I host from home on a block of static IP's on my qwest line (I know > people will boo this, but the price is right). If you want to host > from home with dynamic addresses, look in something like dyndns. > > Will be glad to help out with other questions/etc. I second the recommendation for gkg.net. You can control all aspects of your registration. For DNS, I use zoneedit.com, but that's because I have the luxury of static IPs. Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Wed Oct 27 00:20:31 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <417EA77C.7090906@joshwelch.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <417EA77C.7090906@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Josh Welch wrote: > By the way, there's nothing wrong necessarily with expensive proprietary > computers, there is some very cool stuff in that realm [snip] The thing you have to avoid is vendor lock-in. If you enjoy your expensive proprietary equipment, but if its price doesn't come down (or increases) while the competitors' prices drop, will you be able to easily move away from the expensive machin to the inexpensive machine? Or will you be stuck for years with the high prices? Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Wed Oct 27 01:34:58 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:49 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: <200410262301.04051.barnabas@knicknack.net> References: <67f3084a0410262025550918e5@mail.gmail.com> <200410262301.04051.barnabas@knicknack.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 23:01:04 -0500, Eric Stanley wrote: > On Tuesday 26 October 2004 22:25, Shawn Fertch wrote: > > I second the recommendation for gkg.net. You can control all aspects of your > registration. For DNS, I use zoneedit.com, but that's because I have the > luxury of static IPs. > You can use zoneedit.com for dynamic dns as well. That is who I use as well for my home network. My SmoothWall updates Zoneedit for me. -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Wed Oct 27 05:55:07 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: References: <200410262301.04051.barnabas@knicknack.net> Message-ID: <200410270555.07969.barnabas@knicknack.net> On Wednesday 27 October 2004 01:34, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 23:01:04 -0500, Eric Stanley wrote: > > On Tuesday 26 October 2004 22:25, Shawn Fertch wrote: > > > > I second the recommendation for gkg.net. You can control all aspects of > > your registration. For DNS, I use zoneedit.com, but that's because I > > have the luxury of static IPs. > > You can use zoneedit.com for dynamic dns as well. That is who I use as > well for my home network. My SmoothWall updates Zoneedit for me. Cool! I'll have to take a closer look at that. Eric _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Wed Oct 27 07:32:22 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Lexmark Lawsuit Decision (was: HP - done as a company?) In-Reply-To: <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> Message-ID: <417F9556.4020407@joshwelch.com> Richard Hoffbeck wrote: > It isn't just HP that uses that strategy on the low-end inkjet market. I > recently grabbed a Lexmark on close-out at Target for $18 and paid > another $20 to Best Buy for the black cartridge (the printer only came > with a color cartridge). And usually the cartridge that comes with the > printer is fairly low yield. I think my HP Photosmart printer 3 8x10 > photos on the included cartridge but could do 50+ with the refill. > > This is why Lexmark was suing 3rd party cartridge manufacturers. The 3rd > party guys were implementing chips for the cartridges to identify > themselves to the Lexmark printers and Lexmark claimed the > cartridge->printer interface was covered under DMCA. The money is in the > 'usables'. > > --rick > > Interestingly enough I just saw good news today on this front on Cyberia-L. Apparently the decision in favor of Lexmark was struck down on appeal. This means good things not only for the printer cartridge market but for technology in general. One more chink in the armor for the DMCA. Subject:[CYBERIA] Favorable Decision in Lexmark v. Static Control From: Andrew Sitzer Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:52:19 -0700 To: CYBERIA-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Hey All, Happy Day! Static Control has won its appeal against Lexmark, allowing them once again to sell their printer-cartridge chips... Interesting reasoning -- most of note is that the DMCA "does not apply" because "Lexmark's authentication sequence does not restrict access to [the] literal code." http://lawgeek.typepad.com/04a0364p-06.pdf Also, great concurrence, "We should make clear that in the future companies like Lexmark cannot use the DMCA in conjunction with copyright law to create monopolies of manufactured goods for themselves just by tweaking the facts of this case: by, for example, creating a Toner Loading Program that is more complex and .creative. than the one here, or by cutting off other access to the Printer Engine Program." Also cited Larry Lessig in his analysis of fair use, insofar as it simply means the right to hire a lawyer to defend your right to create." :) How True! -Andrew Sitzer _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Wed Oct 27 07:51:10 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <67f3084a041026194052707226@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Shawn Fertch wrote: > I have an HP 960c which is Linux and network capable via an HP > JetDirect 170x box. I'll vouch for this setup. At my work we have a 960c on a JetDirect EX Plus3. Mostly reliable, aside from when it randomly refuses to print (unplug power and parallel, wait 15 seconds, plug back in). > I paid $199 for it a few years back, and the cartridges are about $15 > for the black (HP #45) and $28 for the color (HP #78). Ah, good to know. I'm not sure we've had to replace the cartridges yet (it's our color-only printer, B&W is done on a LaserJet 8000). Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Wed Oct 27 08:07:07 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] [OT] Seeking Domain Registrar Recommendations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > And how about a cheap web host? Doesn't your ISP offer personal web hosting? Most of the local ISP's will let you host a non-business domain on their servers, either included in the monthly fee or for a small additional fee. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Oct 27 09:55:49 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Reverse/Forward DNS Mismatch Message-ID: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> Hi, I'm having a little bit of a DNS problem that I'd like some advice on. I have 10 static IP's 65.17.208.220-229 and I'm having the ISP do the reverse DNS. I told them to set it up like so: 65.17.208.220-224 point to fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.225-229 point to netbits.us fastconcepts.net resolves to the .220 and netbits.us resolves to the .225. At the time this seemed reasonable. But a problem arises when a few (but probably more in the future) mail servers receive mail from say 65.17.208.228 and they do a reverse query and find that points to netbits.us and then they do a forward DNS query on netbits.us and find that netbits.us resolves to 65.17.208.225, the message is blocked because of the mismatch. In my mind the best way to fix this is to have a unique resolution in reverse dns for each of my IP addresses. I was thinking something along the lines of: 65.17.208.220 -> mail1.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.221 -> mail2.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.222 -> mail3.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.223 -> mail4.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.224 -> mail5.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.225 -> mail1.netbits.us 65.17.208.226 -> mail2.netbits.us 65.17.208.227 -> mail3.netbits.us 65.17.208.228 -> mail4.netbits.us 65.17.208.229 -> mail5.netbits.us That way if a message has headers that show the message is originating from 65.17.208.228 and they do reverse dns they find mail4.netbits.us - when they resolve mail4.netbits.us they find 65.17.208.228 and all is well. Does this seem like a reasonable solution? Thanks, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From chewie at wookimus.net Wed Oct 27 10:05:58 2004 From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: <200410270347.i9R3lxu09559@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <20041026160438.15792.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> <200410270347.i9R3lxu09559@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: <20041027150558.GB14625@wookimus.net> Skipped content of type multipart/signed-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Wed Oct 27 10:06:09 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:50 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <417EA77C.7090906@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <417FB961.4070107@joshwelch.com> Mike Miller wrote: > [snip] > > The thing you have to avoid is vendor lock-in. If you enjoy your > expensive proprietary equipment, but if its price doesn't come down (or > increases) while the competitors' prices drop, will you be able to > easily move away from the expensive machin to the inexpensive machine? > Or will you be stuck for years with the high prices? > > Mike > Odds are good that if you went with a large proprietary system to begin with, there was something that system offered that you could not replicate by throwing together a bunch of smaller cheaper systems, assuming the acquisition was the result of competent people with a business case and not the result of a salesman with a generous expense acount :) If you need that level of performance and reliability, then yes you will be locked into that vendor. Vendor portability is not something offered at that end of the spectrum. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dcoats at heritagemail.org Wed Oct 27 10:17:22 2004 From: dcoats at heritagemail.org (Doug Coats) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:51 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00bc01c4bc38$0f450af0$7a06a8c0@secondary1> Mark, Thanks for the input. I tried following the virtual-hosting.html that you suggested before contacting the list to no avail. The tried multiple configurations and many stopping and starting Sendmail with the same results. To make a long story short I finally restarted my server out of frustration and now it works. I am happy that it now works but wonder what things were actually necessary for it to work. I guess I will remove all the changes and document the results of adding each one back into the mix (probably I will just let it work until it breaks and think about it then) Anyway, I was wondering do I really need a virtusertable? I my situation the users are only active under one domain and none are relayed off the machine to another mail account. Does it still apply to what I am doing? Thanks again for your help, Doug -----Original Message----- From: Mark J. Kroska [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Mark J. Kroska Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 10:15 AM To: dcoats@heritagemail.org; TCLUG Mailing List Subject: RE: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Doug-- Entries need to be made in these files for multiple-domains with Sendmail: (on a RedHat machine, YMMV) /etc/mail/local-host-names [just the domain name here, one per line] /etc/mail/access [if you need to "relay" or "deny" mail to and from the server, domain name 'tab' RELAY or DENY) /etc/mail/virtusertable [this contains a mapping of email addresses to local or remote accounts, i.e.:] email@host1.com 'tab' localaccount email@host2.com 'tab' forwaded@yahoo.com More information available here: http://www.sendmail.org/virtual-hosting.html Regards, Mark Mark J. Kroska Director of Web Services KDV Technology and Consulting Services, Inc. Direct 320-258-6412 Main 320-252-7060 Fax 320-252-9627 mkroska@kdv.com "NOTICE: This E-mail (including attachments) is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited, Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, then delete it. Thank you." _____ From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Doug Coats Sent: Tue 10/26/2004 10:01 AM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Can someone please a few moments of your time and help resolve a problem for me. I am trying to get Sendmail to work with multiple domains. I have had Sendmail working properly for a number of months with one domain but now I have been asked by a friend to add email and web hosting for their domain. I have tried a number of things with the same result - Sendmail denies relaying for the second domain. All mail is returned to sender. So if someone has this working on your machine and can explain it to me step by step so that I can figure out where I went wrong or which step I missed that would be great. Thanks, Doug _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 8084 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20041027/3c4d12f2/winmail.bin -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Wed Oct 27 10:18:16 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:51 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Reverse/Forward DNS Mismatch In-Reply-To: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> References: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> Message-ID: <417FBC38.70004@joshwelch.com> Josh Trutwin wrote: > Hi, > > I'm having a little bit of a DNS problem that I'd like some advice on. > > I have 10 static IP's 65.17.208.220-229 and I'm having the ISP do the reverse DNS. I told them to set it up like so: > > 65.17.208.220-224 point to fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.225-229 point to netbits.us > > fastconcepts.net resolves to the .220 and netbits.us resolves to the .225. > > At the time this seemed reasonable. But a problem arises when a few (but probably more in the future) mail servers receive mail from say 65.17.208.228 and they do a reverse query and find that points to netbits.us and then they do a forward DNS query on netbits.us and find that netbits.us resolves to 65.17.208.225, the message is blocked because of the mismatch. > > In my mind the best way to fix this is to have a unique resolution in reverse dns for each of my IP addresses. I was thinking something along the lines of: > > 65.17.208.220 -> mail1.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.221 -> mail2.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.222 -> mail3.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.223 -> mail4.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.224 -> mail5.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.225 -> mail1.netbits.us > 65.17.208.226 -> mail2.netbits.us > 65.17.208.227 -> mail3.netbits.us > 65.17.208.228 -> mail4.netbits.us > 65.17.208.229 -> mail5.netbits.us > > That way if a message has headers that show the message is originating from 65.17.208.228 and they do reverse dns they find mail4.netbits.us - when they resolve mail4.netbits.us they find 65.17.208.228 and all is well. > > Does this seem like a reasonable solution? > > Thanks, > > Josh > Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. I'm surprised your ISP set up reverse records for different IPs to the same FQDN, that is not typically considered good form. Alternatively you could do something like 65.17.208.229 -> ptr-229.netbits.us if you did not want that address to always look like a mail host in RDNS lookups. Josh W _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nassarmu at redconcepts.net Wed Oct 27 10:14:12 2004 From: nassarmu at redconcepts.net (Munir Nassar) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Reverse/Forward DNS Mismatch In-Reply-To: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> References: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> Message-ID: <417FBB44.6080204@redconcepts.net> Josh Trutwin wrote: > That way if a message has headers that show the message is originating from 65.17.208.228 and they do reverse dns they find mail4.netbits.us - when they resolve mail4.netbits.us they find 65.17.208.228 and all is well. why dont you use a smarthost for your emailing needs? setup 1.2.3.4 to point to mail.fastconcepts.net, and mail.fastconcepts.net to point to 1.2.3.4 now make all your computers send mail using that computer. use nullmailder/ssmtp on the servers and all fully functional MUAs have smtp support. -- Munir Nassar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From larry.pint at ntuminc.com Wed Oct 27 10:28:17 2004 From: larry.pint at ntuminc.com (Larry Pint) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc04102613455ec5f5f5@mail.gmail.com> References: <13166.12.47.38.130.1098815458.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <65293fcc04102612055058aed9@mail.gmail.com> <417EA7EA.6020501@visi.com> <28349.12.47.38.130.1098822186.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <417EB418.4010201@ntuminc.com> <65293fcc04102613455ec5f5f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Ben.Neigebauer at compellent.com Wed Oct 27 10:27:16 2004 From: Ben.Neigebauer at compellent.com (Ben Neigebauer) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sceptre Touch Screen Display Message-ID: <3F7813665506CA479E7B48DA0DA829BD743225@owa.compellent.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From MKroska at kdv.com Wed Oct 27 10:26:44 2004 From: MKroska at kdv.com (Mark J. Kroska) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Message-ID: Doug-- Did you run a "make" in the /etc/mail directory before restarting Sendmail? I forgot to mention that those plaintext databases need to be hashed with a "make" and Sendmail restarted for them to take affect. I bet when the box reboots, it rehashes everything. No, in the strictest sense the virtusertable is not needed, but if you have multiple users that may want the same email address you may run into problems. Not using the virtusertable assumes all names to the left of the @ are unique and mark@domain1 and mark@domain2 is not 'easily' possible. Virtusertable allows you to create a mapping of mark@domain1 to 1 system account such as mark.domain1 and mark@domain2 to mark.domain2; thus making them distinct. With a handful of domains, it probably isn't a big deal, but often small servers have a tendency of growing! Does that help? MK Mark J. Kroska Director of Web Services KDV Technology and Consulting Services, Inc. Direct 320-258-6412 Main 320-252-7060 Fax 320-252-9627 mkroska@kdv.com "NOTICE: This E-mail (including attachments) is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited, Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, then delete it. Thank you." ________________________________ From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Doug Coats Sent: Wed 10/27/2004 10:17 AM To: 'TCLUG Mailing List' Subject: RE: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Mark, Thanks for the input. I tried following the virtual-hosting.html that you suggested before contacting the list to no avail. The tried multiple configurations and many stopping and starting Sendmail with the same results. To make a long story short I finally restarted my server out of frustration and now it works. I am happy that it now works but wonder what things were actually necessary for it to work. I guess I will remove all the changes and document the results of adding each one back into the mix (probably I will just let it work until it breaks and think about it then) Anyway, I was wondering do I really need a virtusertable? I my situation the users are only active under one domain and none are relayed off the machine to another mail account. Does it still apply to what I am doing? Thanks again for your help, Doug -----Original Message----- From: Mark J. Kroska [mailto:tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Mark J. Kroska Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 10:15 AM To: dcoats@heritagemail.org; TCLUG Mailing List Subject: RE: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Doug-- Entries need to be made in these files for multiple-domains with Sendmail: (on a RedHat machine, YMMV) /etc/mail/local-host-names [just the domain name here, one per line] /etc/mail/access [if you need to "relay" or "deny" mail to and from the server, domain name 'tab' RELAY or DENY) /etc/mail/virtusertable [this contains a mapping of email addresses to local or remote accounts, i.e.:] email@host1.com 'tab' localaccount email@host2.com 'tab' forwaded@yahoo.com More information available here: http://www.sendmail.org/virtual-hosting.html Regards, Mark Mark J. Kroska Director of Web Services KDV Technology and Consulting Services, Inc. Direct 320-258-6412 Main 320-252-7060 Fax 320-252-9627 mkroska@kdv.com "NOTICE: This E-mail (including attachments) is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited, Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, then delete it. Thank you." ________________________________ From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Doug Coats Sent: Tue 10/26/2004 10:01 AM To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org Subject: [TCLUG] Sendmail with multiple domains Can someone please a few moments of your time and help resolve a problem for me. I am trying to get Sendmail to work with multiple domains. I have had Sendmail working properly for a number of months with one domain but now I have been asked by a friend to add email and web hosting for their domain. I have tried a number of things with the same result - Sendmail denies relaying for the second domain. All mail is returned to sender. So if someone has this working on your machine and can explain it to me step by step so that I can figure out where I went wrong or which step I missed that would be great. Thanks, Doug _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Wed Oct 27 10:34:41 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Reverse/Forward DNS Mismatch In-Reply-To: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> References: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> Message-ID: <20041027153441.GD19955@therub.org> On Wed, Oct 27, 2004 at 09:55:49AM -0500, Josh Trutwin wrote: > 65.17.208.220 -> mail1.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.221 -> mail2.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.222 -> mail3.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.223 -> mail4.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.224 -> mail5.fastconcepts.net > 65.17.208.225 -> mail1.netbits.us > 65.17.208.226 -> mail2.netbits.us > 65.17.208.227 -> mail3.netbits.us > 65.17.208.228 -> mail4.netbits.us > 65.17.208.229 -> mail5.netbits.us At work, we set it up like this: 65.17.208.220 -> fastconcepts.net (assuming this is the main server) 65.17.208.221 -> hostname.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.222 -> hostname2.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.223 -> hostname3.fastconcepts.net 65.17.208.224 -> hostname4.fastconcepts.net ... Where hostname is the hostname of the particular server. I like that approach because then you get meaningful rdns records. Dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Oct 27 10:42:58 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Reverse/Forward DNS Mismatch In-Reply-To: <417FBC38.70004@joshwelch.com> References: <20041027095549.00002f87@schubert> <417FBC38.70004@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20041027104258.00005a16@beethoven> On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 10:18:16 -0500 Josh Welch wrote: > Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. I'm surprised your ISP set up > reverse records for different IPs to the same FQDN, that is not > typically considered good form. Alternatively you could do something > like 65.17.208.229 -> ptr-229.netbits.us if you did not want that > address to always look like a mail host in RDNS lookups. Yeah, that looks a little nicer. In hindsight I should have realized this would cause problems when I requested it. The ISP (DataPipe) never really questioned my request. I've sent in a support request, see what happens. Thanks, Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From crumley at belka.space.umn.edu Wed Oct 27 11:25:29 2004 From: crumley at belka.space.umn.edu (Jim Crumley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] TCLUG Spread Firefox ad team In-Reply-To: <20041027150558.GB14625@wookimus.net> References: <20041026160438.15792.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> <200410270347.i9R3lxu09559@ecstasy1.winternet.com> <20041027150558.GB14625@wookimus.net> Message-ID: <20041027112529.A23096@pchelka.space.umn.edu> On Wed, Oct 27, 2004 at 10:05:58AM -0500, Chad Walstrom wrote: > I see the "Spread Firefox" project as evangelism rather than advocacy, > but perhaps that's a bit harsh. If all $30 of my contribution does go > to promotion rather than development, I would certainly interpret it as > evangelism. If only a portion of that money went to promotion and the > rest went to development, I'd be more open to the idea of contributing. > However, that is not the impression I get from the "Spread Firefox" > site. So then donate directly to the Mozilla project http://www.mozilla.org/foundation/donate.html . -- Jim Crumley |Twin Cities Linux Users Group Mailing List (TCLUG) Ruthless Debian Zealot |http://www.mn-linux.org/ Never laugh at live dragons | _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bhurt at spnz.org Wed Oct 27 12:31:32 2004 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: Speaking as "is HP dead as a company?": http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=19297 I comment that Dell doesn't have a line of printers... -- "Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." - Gene Spafford Brian _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Wed Oct 27 13:04:43 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:52 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> Message-ID: <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Actually, Dell DOES market a line of printers (though they're manufactured by someone else as I understand). Again though, people really don't think "printer" when they think Dell nor do they think "PC's" when they think HP. Personally, I feel of Dell marketing printers the same way I feel of HP marketing PC's -- poor marketing choice. The difference is that Dell is just marketing the printers as an "add-on convenience." HP's really been trying to make their PC's a viable market force. > > Speaking as "is HP dead as a company?": > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=19297 > > I comment that Dell doesn't have a line of printers... > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Wed Oct 27 13:06:50 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <417FE3BA.4070409@joshwelch.com> Garrett Krueger wrote: > Actually, Dell DOES market a line of printers (though they're manufactured > by someone else as I understand). Again though, people really don't think > "printer" when they think Dell nor do they think "PC's" when they think > HP. > > Personally, I feel of Dell marketing printers the same way I feel of HP > marketing PC's -- poor marketing choice. The difference is that Dell is > just marketing the printers as an "add-on convenience." HP's really been > trying to make their PC's a viable market force. > My understanding was that they were a rebranding of Lexmark printers. However, recent conversations with a Dell person would have me believe that they acquire the core technology from Lexmark, but the printers are then manufactured with additional Dell features to Dell spec by a third party manufacturer. I don't know how much of this is fact. The fact is that Dell does not innovate, never has and never will. Their specialty is taking someone else's idea and wringing the last screaming penny out of the production process so that they can beat you up on price. This is all well and good, but what happens when the last company with an R&D budget gets run into the ground? Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Oct 27 13:50:44 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <417FE3BA.4070409@joshwelch.com> References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> <417FE3BA.4070409@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: > The fact is that Dell does not innovate, never has and never will. Their > specialty is taking someone else's idea and wringing the last screaming > penny out of the production process so that they can beat you up on > price. This is all well and good, but what happens when the last company > with an R&D budget gets run into the ground? Patents, patents, patents. Dell has to pay Lexmark/HP/whomever for whatever they rebrand as Dell. My guess is the Dell and HP break was because HP had a better understading of the value of their IP than Lexmark. ;-) -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From andyzib at gmail.com Wed Oct 27 13:45:52 2004 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: I'm pretty sure most Dell printers are rebranded Lexmarks. Every instance of Lexmark is replaced with Dell...even in the embedded code. I know there is at least on printer out there that has a Dell version and a Lexmark version...same exact printer except for the vendor name, but windows insists they are different because one is a Dell XYZ and the other is a Lexmark XYZ. Fun stuff. Thankfully it's one of those Windows only printers that doens't even know how to talk PCL without the host software on Windows. For me, you can't beat a good laser printer. I had (still have) a LaserJet 6L that I got new in 1998. The toner cartridge it came with lasted me 6 years. Hell, the thing is probally not even empty but the printers fusor has gone bad. A couple months back I picked up a used Lexmark E322 (A personal printer that speaks Post Script!) at MPC in Eagan for $50. Cheaper than replacing the HPs fusor I guess. Lexmark may want to lock out other vendors from selling toner cartridges for their printers, but you have to give them some credit for their pre-bate program where they include a UPS shipping label in the box of your new cartridge so that you can ship the used cartridge back to them free of charge for recycling. If I want to print photos...the Wal-Mart down the street has one of those Kodak stations and the prints are like 15 cents...or something...whatever they charge it's about the same cost per print as developing a roll of film. And it's a 24-hour Wal-Mart too. In short, my experience tells me InkJet printers from any vendor are just horrible horrible money sinks. Up front costs of a laser printer are more, but over time it seems to work out in favor of my wallet. ;-) I've seen one HP that I liked. It was a small persario or something that is about the same size (or smaller) as Dell's current OptiPlex small form factor boxes. It was a P166, so HP had the small form factor thing going quite early. The thing ran for 3 or 4 years 24/7 as a Linux firewall/TiVo router, power supply finially died though. HP put out solid systems until the Compaq merger...but I've never met a Compaq home user type machine that I liked...and now that goes for HP too. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us A password is like your underwear; Change it frequently, don't share it with others, and don't ask to borrow someone else's. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Wed Oct 27 14:25:55 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <25296.12.47.38.130.1098900283.squirrel@12.47.38.130> Message-ID: <29961.12.47.38.130.1098905155.squirrel@12.47.38.130> I'm totally with you on that Compaq thing. I've worked on Compaqs on and off sice 1991 -- several clients swore by them. I never liked them, and I still don't! On the Laser printer front, I too have an old Laserjet. It's an old IIP-plus workhorse. It just keeps cranking out the pages. I have several printers now (modern ones even), but this one's my favorite because it just never quits! It prints fine through Linux too. ;) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From markdeb.browne at comcast.net Wed Oct 27 19:58:19 2004 From: markdeb.browne at comcast.net (Mark Browne) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Oct 27 20:39:53 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 19:58:19 -0500 "Mark Browne" wrote: Interesting read... > Yankee's study concluded that, in large enterprises, a significant > Linux deployment or total switch from Windows to Linux would be > three to four times more expensive - and take three times as long to > deploy - as an upgrade from one version of Windows to a newer > release. And nine out of 10 enterprise customers said that such a > change wouldn't provide any tangible business gains. I can only shake my head and try not to laugh. I just spent my ENTIRE weekend rebuilding f'in Windows 2000 machines because of stupid $hit that doesn't work. I seem to be on a 1-2 year cycle of rebuilding Windows PC's. Now other people that know I do this suddenly want me to do it for them as if I enjoyed it. I've NEVER had to re-install a Unix/Linux OS because it was in operation for more than a year. Is that factored into your TCO MS? > All 14 companies said it was difficult finding qualified Linux > personnel in the marketplace to support their Linux projects. When > they did find third-party help, they had less leverage negotiating > hourly rates than with Windows consulting resources. Really? Where the $#@$ are these job postings then? I personally think Linux is approaching a stage where enough "tech" people are getting excited about it that they are dangerous and stupid enough to give Linux a bad name. My $0.02 Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tclug at joshwelch.com Wed Oct 27 21:16:22 2004 From: tclug at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> References: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> Message-ID: <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> Josh Trutwin wrote: > On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 19:58:19 -0500 > "Mark Browne" wrote: > > Interesting read... > > >>Yankee's study concluded that, in large enterprises, a significant >>Linux deployment or total switch from Windows to Linux would be >>three to four times more expensive - and take three times as long to >>deploy - as an upgrade from one version of Windows to a newer >>release. And nine out of 10 enterprise customers said that such a >>change wouldn't provide any tangible business gains. > > > I can only shake my head and try not to laugh. I just spent my ENTIRE FWIW, I've never had to reload a Windows server just because it had been running awhile, there are a couple I've had running for 2+ years that are still fairly solid, though they still like a weekly reboot. 12-18 months for a Windows workstation is about the limit as I've seen before needing a reload, but its mostly because of the innstall/uninstall cylce your average workstations sees. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Wed Oct 27 21:52:33 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> References: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Oct 2004, Josh Welch wrote: > FWIW, I've never had to reload a Windows server just because it had been > running awhile, there are a couple I've had running for 2+ years that > are still fairly solid, though they still like a weekly reboot. 12-18 > months for a Windows workstation is about the limit as I've seen before > needing a reload, but its mostly because of the innstall/uninstall cylce > your average workstations sees. That is a great advantage of Linux - the kernel seems to be protected from the software programs. One program's effect on memory doesn't seem to damage the functioning of other programs. We can kill a program and get back to work. Windows has improved over the years, but it is still very far from Linux in stability. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Oct 27 21:52:52 2004 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> References: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 21:16:22 -0500, Josh Welch wrote: > FWIW, I've never had to reload a Windows server just because it had been > running awhile, there are a couple I've had running for 2+ years that > are still fairly solid, though they still like a weekly reboot. 12-18 > months for a Windows workstation is about the limit as I've seen before > needing a reload, but its mostly because of the innstall/uninstall cylce > your average workstations sees. I can say the same. Windows boxes that serve in "traditional" server roles (file/print/etc) seem to be fairly stable if you just set 'em up and don't touch them. My windows servers at work usually have uptimes of 4-5 months...and usually then they're rebooted not because they need it, but because we're changing around UPS's or something else that necessitates power shut-off. On the other hand, windows boxes that have shoddy pieces of software on them (older versions of exchange is an example) can get _very_ unstable...to the point Josh mentioned of them needing weekly reboots to keep things happy. My linux boxes at work (we're about half linux and half windows) are very stable, as you may expect. With these, reboots only happen if there's a very long power outage or if a new kernel needs to be put in place. -Erik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From Ryan at ccconsulting.biz Wed Oct 27 22:54:16 2004 From: Ryan at ccconsulting.biz (Ryan@ccconsulting.biz) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:53 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jack at jacku.com Wed Oct 27 23:48:12 2004 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <417FE3BA.4070409@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <200410272348.12865.jack@jacku.com> On Wednesday 27 October 2004 01:50 pm, Andrew Zbikowski wrote: > > The fact is that Dell does not innovate, never has and never will. Their > > specialty is taking someone else's idea and wringing the last screaming > > penny out of the production process so that they can beat you up on > > price. This is all well and good, but what happens when the last company > > with an R&D budget gets run into the ground? > > Patents, patents, patents. Dell has to pay Lexmark/HP/whomever for > whatever they rebrand as Dell. My guess is the Dell and HP break was > because HP had a better understading of the value of their IP than > Lexmark. ;-) Or if your Lexmark and you're running a distant 2nd or 3rd to HP you take any channel you can get. -- Jack Ungerleider jack@jacku.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 00:41:24 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the OS did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as well as all the files with source code extensions. Hence, we avoid SP2 like the plague. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 00:54:24 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] HP - done as a company? In-Reply-To: <200410272348.12865.jack@jacku.com> References: <417FBE91.90205@ntuminc.com> <417FE3BA.4070409@joshwelch.com> <200410272348.12865.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <32fd453704102722546c1f8a2d@mail.gmail.com> I say this when it comes to Compaq and HP computers: Compaq, pre-Windows 98 (think 486, first line or two of Pentiums) were great. I worked on a whole slew of machines at my high school, as we recieved tons of various machines from CFS (Computers For Schools Refurbishing Program - Inmates Making A Difference For Kids) damn...sad that I can recite those incepid stickers still today....and the Compaq 486s and Pentium 1s that we worked on, when it wasn't a hardware failure (which was rare in and of itself - as long as you didn't touch ANY 850MB HD - especially Seagates, but any 850 was liable to fall over dead if you so much as looked at it funny) HP's early ones were okay, for the dozen or so we had. They overclocked nicely, from 75 to 100MHz. Gave that portion of the lab a small performance boost, anyway. Once the PII era hit, and we got the new models...the towers...that's when they both went sour. I've worked on a handful of those HP towers...you know the ones...that you can't get the HD rack out, I even ended up leaving the old drive IN the machine (which is still there, to this day, dead) because I couldn't remove it. I'd been told how to get in there - but this one they'd rivited the whole assembly together. Compaqs newer machines - We've got an old PIII Presario. First PIII machine they made. Ran well, and still does, as long as you don't count the copy of Chernobyl that they included in the autorun executable on their Home Networking CD, that they later refuted even EXISTED. Heh. That's when I learned TCP/IP. 1998...age of 13, did my first networking project. The CPQ towers are nice as in access, but a PITA to work with software wise. Oddball drivers, etc. Same with HP. But I digress. HP Printers - Laserjets worked great. In fact, I've got a CalComp 600 sitting not 5 feet from me - running an HP4 engine. Same with Apple's LaserWriters - HP guts. Good, solid printers. I don't see myself ever getting a non-behemoth printer, when I can drop 100-300 for one (used or new) and buy myself one toner cartridge that'll set me back the cost of a inkjet printer and one refill on ink. Besides, the CalComp I got for free. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Thu Oct 28 01:14:55 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2669.192.168.100.2.1098944095.squirrel@192.168.100.2> So far, everyone I have run into (including a tech support call I had to make a week ago for a dental client of mine) has had significant problems with SP2 > I hate to even bring this up but.... At the last installfest there was a > guy there stating that after installing SP2 he could not play his > pre-existing mp3's that were on an external USB drive. I'm just wondering > if any one else has had any problems with mp3's after SP2. > > I have been running sp2 for about 3 weeks now and I'm still able to play > mp3 files. > > Ryan Cooper_______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 01:15:21 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I assume that this will only happen if you launch windows media player and it has your mp3 directory in its library. I have not noticed any problem at all with mp3s post sp2. Then again I use foobar2000 to play my mp3s, oggs, mpcs, et cetera while on windows. On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 00:41:24 -0500, Keith Bachman wrote: > I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it > for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the > OS did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as > well as all the files with source code extensions. > > Hence, we avoid SP2 like the plague. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Thu Oct 28 07:45:04 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: If the MP3 files were on a USB drive - is the problem with XP reading from the drive? I seem to recall hearing something about some removable media being broken with SP2 - presumably for security reasons. As usual, I can't cite anything specific :) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From obelin23 at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 08:17:59 2004 From: obelin23 at gmail.com (Charlie O) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <72278d10410280617515cf36e@mail.gmail.com> I talked to a gentleman for about a half-hour when I first got to the installfest. He had problems with mp3 files on a USB drive not showing up after general nanosys installed xp sp2 on one of his machines. He had a big collection of old music. It was unclear to me whether the files were permanently deleted, or if they just didn't show up when he tried to access them from the xp machine. He definitely said that when he read the USB files from the xp machine they just didn't show up. I gave him a copy of Mepis (Debian based, like Knoppix, runs off a CD, good hardware detection) and suggested he read the USB drive from there. Cheers, CO2 On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 07:45:04 -0500 (CDT), Adam Maloney wrote: > If the MP3 files were on a USB drive - is the problem with XP reading from > the drive? I seem to recall hearing something about some removable media > being broken with SP2 - presumably for security reasons. As usual, I > can't cite anything specific :) > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From twakefield at stcloudstate.edu Thu Oct 28 08:20:20 2004 From: twakefield at stcloudstate.edu (Wakefield, Thad M.) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo xinetd tftpd problem Message-ID: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6C07@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> Xinetd starts tftpd but doesn't stop it after file transfers which then allows unrestricted access to tftp. I've tried an assortment of changes to /etc/conf.d/in.tftpd, /etc/xinetd.d /tftp and /etc/init.d/xinetd without any success. Xinetd and tftp-hpa were installed by emerge. Thanks _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Thu Oct 28 09:15:17 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Keith Bachman wrote: > I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it > for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the OS > did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as well as > all the files with source code extensions. You say "manhandled" - do you know what it was doing? (I assume that "manhandled" isn't a technical term. If it is, I don't know it.) Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From larry.pint at ntuminc.com Thu Oct 28 09:28:35 2004 From: larry.pint at ntuminc.com (Larry Pint) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <41810213.20302@ntuminc.com> This is the kind of thing that scares me! Windows doing things in the background without my knowledge or permission. Where I'm working none of our source code is on a windows machine (it's on the Linux machine), and windows probably wouldn't recognize our source code as source code (it's in a programming language that's not commonly used i.e. not a MicroSoft product), I'm pretty sure we're safe from this. But what else is Microsoft doing "on our behalf" without our knowledge? MicroSoft is getting more and more like the government ... trying to protect us from ourselves. Larry Keith Bachman wrote: >I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it >for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the >OS did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as >well as all the files with source code extensions. > >Hence, we avoid SP2 like the plague. > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org >Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From smac at visi.com Thu Oct 28 10:05:24 2004 From: smac at visi.com (smac@visi.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1098975924.41810ab42861f@my.visi.com> Not to be a pain or nasty but is this the correct forum for M$ stuff. Sam. Quoting Mike Miller : > On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Keith Bachman wrote: > > > I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it > > for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the OS > > did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as well as > > all the files with source code extensions. > > You say "manhandled" - do you know what it was doing? > (I assume that "manhandled" isn't a technical term. If it is, I don't > know it.) > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Oct 28 10:10:38 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410281510.i9SFAcR25588@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Dell PowerEdge 2400, dual PIII 500MHz 1.5gig ram Dell PowerEdge dual PIII 500MHz with 1.5gig ram *ServerWorks chipset *Intel 82557/8/9 dual port ethernet controller *Intel 82557/8/9 onboard ethernet *ATI 3D Rage (Mach 64) video *Adaptec AIC-7861 scsi controller *Dell PowerEdge Expandable RAID controller *3x IBM 18gig SCSI LVD/SE drives *3x Seagate Cheetah ST336704LC 36.4gig SCSI drives *SCSI CDROM *Floppy *Chassis is lockable and comes with 2 keys *Charcoal Black Currently has Fedora Core 3 Test 1 installed $350, I will deliver anywhere in the metro Add $15 for matching 17" Dell monitor Seller Email address: rudie at rudie dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From sraun at fireopal.org Thu Oct 28 12:06:16 2004 From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: References: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <20041028170616.GA1921@fireopal.org> On Wed, Oct 27, 2004 at 09:52:52PM -0500, Erik Anderson wrote: > My windows servers at work usually have uptimes of 4-5 months...and > usually then they're rebooted not because they need it, but because > we're changing around UPS's or something else that necessitates > power shut-off. That's into the range that makes me nervous - enough MS patches need reboots nowadays that anything over 4-6 weeks is probably out-of-date on patches, and susceptible to some nasty coming along. My current employer got caught by that BIG time by ... Sasser, I think it was? One of the big worms at about that time. The patch from MS had been available for 'a long time' - but our Exchange servers had uptimes of over a year, and our IT Director was very proud of that fact (and he really should have known better). They have since scheduled a monthly reboot to make certain the patches are at least moderately current. -- Scott Raun sraun@fireopal.org _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From ryan at wateroflife.cc Wed Oct 27 22:36:58 2004 From: ryan at wateroflife.cc (ryan@wateroflife.cc) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:54 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 13:25:52 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo xinetd tftpd problem In-Reply-To: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6C07@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> References: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6C07@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> Message-ID: Why not just use the tcp wrapper for stuff in your xinetd which would allow only traffic from specific locations? On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 08:20:20 -0500, Wakefield, Thad M. wrote: > Xinetd starts tftpd but doesn't stop it after file transfers > which then allows unrestricted access to tftp. I've tried an > assortment of changes to /etc/conf.d/in.tftpd, /etc/xinetd.d > /tftp and /etc/init.d/xinetd without any success. Xinetd and > tftp-hpa were installed by emerge. > > Thanks > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From kcbnac at gmail.com Thu Oct 28 13:49:08 2004 From: kcbnac at gmail.com (Keith Bachman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Windows XP SP2 and MP3's In-Reply-To: References: <32fd453704102722411dfa7f5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <32fd453704102811491e6cd642@mail.gmail.com> It was tagging the files...I just felt like saying "manhandled." Not quite sure what all it did, but it modified those specific files, we figure tagging them to potentially phone home with hashes or file information, perhaps. On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:15:17 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Keith Bachman wrote: > > > I didn't hit any problems when I ran it...but a friend of mine ran it > > for a total of a few hours...wrote a little program to watch what the OS > > did...and it silently manhandled all the mp3s on his system, as well as > > all the files with source code extensions. > > You say "manhandled" - do you know what it was doing? > (I assume that "manhandled" isn't a technical term. If it is, I don't > know it.) > > Mike > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From twakefield at stcloudstate.edu Thu Oct 28 13:52:52 2004 From: twakefield at stcloudstate.edu (Wakefield, Thad M.) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Gentoo xinetd tftpd problem Message-ID: <4F752E686C8E04449DCB9FA7C3BD96747A6C0A@EXCHANGE.campus.stcloudstate.edu> Thanks for the suggestion. That's what I ended up doing. It's actually probably easier this way because I can restrict access by changing hosts.allow rather than a -HUP on xinetd. > > Why not just use the tcp wrapper for stuff in your xinetd which would > allow only traffic from specific locations? > > > On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 08:20:20 -0500, Wakefield, Thad M. > wrote: > > Xinetd starts tftpd but doesn't stop it after file transfers > > which then allows unrestricted access to tftp. I've tried an > > assortment of changes to /etc/conf.d/in.tftpd, /etc/xinetd.d > > /tftp and /etc/init.d/xinetd without any success. Xinetd and > > tftp-hpa were installed by emerge. > > > > Thanks > > > -- > Loren H. Burlingame > GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F > "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." > -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Oct 28 20:50:23 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410290150.i9T1oNw09133@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: 533mhz Laptop I have a ECS Elightgroup A907 for sale. System Specs: 533mhz Transmeta 'crusoe' processor 128mb Ram 20gb HDD Cd-Rom drive 4 Usb 1 ports Built in sound,mic,56k modem, and 10/100 ethernet jack. 14in screen No Floppy External Battery Asking for $475.00 or obo Seller Email address: blacknight_709 at hotmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Oct 28 21:20:43 2004 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200410290220.i9T2Khb11577@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: cx5200 3-in-1 excellent linux compatibilty for both printing and scanning But that model of printer has a clogging problem with infrequeny use. http:// fixyourownprinter.com/ printer/new/23702.html It sounds easy to fix, but I want one that will always work with infrequent use http:// epsonhelp.freehttp.com/ Printheadtext.html $25 Seller Email address: crc1021 at myrealbox dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Thu Oct 28 22:01:52 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (josh@trutwins.homeip.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] swatch help Message-ID: <1099018912.4181b2a07daf2@trutwins.homeip.net> I'm trying to do something very simple in swatch (3.1.1) and it's making me angry. I want to watch a log in one file and based on a regex dump the same lines to another file (maybe there's a better tool than swatch?) I'm using a swatchrc like follows (replacing my regex with .* for now): watchfor = /.*/ echo exec echo $0 >> /var/log/cleanlog When I run swatch though and generate events in the logfile that it's tailing, I get corresponding rows in /var/log/cleanlog, but instead of having the line copied into the cleanlog, I get the name of the tmp script, for example: /etc/swatch/tmp/.swatch_script.26403 /etc/swatch/tmp/.swatch_script.26689 /etc/swatch/tmp/.swatch_script.26724 So, $0 is not being replaced with the actual line and instead with the name of the tmp script. Examples I've found on the net like this: (http://www.spitzner.net/swatchrc.txt) look pretty much the same. Any thoughts? Josh ---------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From bruce.broecker at toro.com Fri Oct 29 08:30:38 2004 From: bruce.broecker at toro.com (Bruce Broecker) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] swatch help Message-ID: >>> josh@trutwins.homeip.net 10/28/04 10:01PM >>> >I'm trying to do something very simple in swatch (3.1.1) and it's making >me angry. I'm not a swatch user (yet) so I can't comment on that. >I want to watch a log in one file and based on a regex dump the same >lines to another file (maybe there's a better tool than swatch?) I don't know how complex your regex is, but Syslog-ng may be able to select on it and dump the log records directly to the new log file. I guess that assumes that you are logging to syslog, and not directly to the file. Bruce _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 29 09:02:58 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] swatch help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041029090258.000072ab@beethoven> On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 08:30:38 -0500 "Bruce Broecker" wrote: > I don't know how complex your regex is, but Syslog-ng may be able > to select on it and dump the log records directly to the new log > file. I guess that assumes that you are logging to syslog, and not > directly to the file. Unfortunately it's not a file that's getting written by syslog, thanks though. Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tim at urberg.net Fri Oct 29 09:30:29 2004 From: tim at urberg.net (Tim Urberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Security Report: Windows vs Linux [The Register] Message-ID: Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tim at urberg.net Fri Oct 29 09:35:50 2004 From: tim at urberg.net (Tim Urberg) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FYI -What Microsoft says about comparing Windows with Linux and UNIX In-Reply-To: <20041028170616.GA1921@fireopal.org> References: <20041027203953.000050be@schubert> <41805676.1060802@joshwelch.com> <20041028170616.GA1921@fireopal.org> Message-ID: <41825546.2080107@urberg.net> Here's a more unbiased article about the above http://www.theregister.co.uk/security/security_report_windows_vs_linux/ -- Reclaim Your Inbox! http://www.mozilla.org/products/thunderbird _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Oct 29 10:45:31 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:55 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue Message-ID: Again, thanks for all the help so far. The thing that I keep coming to is that it appears named is not running on this machine. "service named xxx", where xxx is anything gives me no output. /etc/init.d/named xxx gives no output. GoFast is my provider, and /etc/resolv.conf contains just the one nameserver for them: 209.46.63.1. Since I'm not running named (or am I?) I can't imagine the content of that file matters. ps gives no named, pidof named returns nothing. Here's the beginning of /etc/init.d/named, where it apparently just quits: #!/bin/bash # # named This shell script takes care of starting and stopping # named (BIND DNS server). # # chkconfig: - 55 45 # description: named (BIND) is a Domain Name Server (DNS) \ # that is used to resolve host names to IP addresses. # probe: true # Source function library. . /etc/rc.d/init.d/functions # Source networking configuration. . /etc/sysconfig/network RETVAL=0 prog="named" # Check that networking is up. [ "${NETWORKING}" = "no" ] && exit 0 [ -r /etc/sysconfig/named ] && . /etc/sysconfig/named [ -x /usr/sbin/named ] || exit 0 [ -r ${ROOTDIR}/etc/named.conf ] || exit 0 start() { <<< end of excerpt It should be standard Red Hat issue. /etc/sysconfig/named exists and has only comments. /usr/sbin/named exists and is executable. Aha. /etc/named.conf did not exist. I made a blank file, and service named now prints "rndc: connect failed: connection refused". I'd appreciate a pointer to a quick and dirty HOWTO on DNS. I've looked at one pretty bad page, so pointers to a good one would be nice. Once I get named running, I can add GoFasts second DNS machine to the resolv.conf file, and see how that goes. Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Fri Oct 29 11:07:17 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041029160717.GB73668@therub.org> I think there is massive confusion going on here. >From what I can remember of your thread, I don't know why someone recommended that you run named (bind). I don't think you need it. /etc/resolv.conf is used for when you try to resolve a name. that is necessary on any computer connected to the internet. It has nothing to do with named. named is for if you want to run a name server, to serve requests for a particular domain (or a caching name server) - you don't need it! It's a pita to set up if you're not familiar with it, anyway. All you should need to do is put a good name server in /etc/resolv.conf - usually your ISP's. You can test your name server by doing (dig does the same thing, but it's output is a bit more complicated) $> host google.com 209.46.63.1 If it returns addresses, it's working (works for me). Throw that IP of your name server in /etc/resolv.conf, and you're good to go. If i'm misunderstanding your problem, let me know. It sounds to me that you're making it much more difficult than it is. > Once I get named running, I can add GoFasts second DNS machine to the > resolv.conf file, and see how that goes. What? You can add a second DNS server to resolv.conf anytime. What exactly is not working? Dan On Fri, Oct 29, 2004 at 10:45:31AM -0500, Chris Schumann wrote: > Again, thanks for all the help so far. > > The thing that I keep coming to is that it appears named is not running on > this machine. > > "service named xxx", where xxx is anything gives me no output. > /etc/init.d/named xxx gives no output. > > GoFast is my provider, and /etc/resolv.conf contains just the one > nameserver for them: 209.46.63.1. Since I'm not running named (or am I?) I > can't imagine the content of that file matters. > > ps gives no named, pidof named returns nothing. > > Here's the beginning of /etc/init.d/named, where it apparently just quits: > #!/bin/bash > # > # named This shell script takes care of starting and stopping > # named (BIND DNS server). > # > # chkconfig: - 55 45 > # description: named (BIND) is a Domain Name Server (DNS) \ > # that is used to resolve host names to IP addresses. > # probe: true > > # Source function library. > . /etc/rc.d/init.d/functions > > # Source networking configuration. > . /etc/sysconfig/network > > RETVAL=0 > prog="named" > > # Check that networking is up. > [ "${NETWORKING}" = "no" ] && exit 0 > > [ -r /etc/sysconfig/named ] && . /etc/sysconfig/named > > [ -x /usr/sbin/named ] || exit 0 > > [ -r ${ROOTDIR}/etc/named.conf ] || exit 0 > > > start() { > > <<< end of excerpt > > It should be standard Red Hat issue. > /etc/sysconfig/named exists and has only comments. > /usr/sbin/named exists and is executable. > > Aha. /etc/named.conf did not exist. I made a blank file, and service named > now prints "rndc: connect failed: connection refused". > > I'd appreciate a pointer to a quick and dirty HOWTO on DNS. I've looked at > one pretty bad page, so pointers to a good one would be nice. > > Once I get named running, I can add GoFasts second DNS machine to the > resolv.conf file, and see how that goes. > > Chris Schumann > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Fri Oct 29 10:50:20 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > GoFast is my provider, and /etc/resolv.conf contains just the one > nameserver for them: 209.46.63.1. Since I'm not running named (or am I?) I > can't imagine the content of that file matters. If you have a nameserver defined in resolv.conf - that's where the computer will send it's DNS requests, regardless of if named is running on your computer or not. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Oct 29 11:20:53 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] swatch help In-Reply-To: <20041029090258.000072ab@beethoven> References: <20041029090258.000072ab@beethoven> Message-ID: On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Josh Trutwin wrote: > On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 08:30:38 -0500 > "Bruce Broecker" wrote: > >> I don't know how complex your regex is, but Syslog-ng may be able to >> select on it and dump the log records directly to the new log file. I >> guess that assumes that you are logging to syslog, and not directly to >> the file. > > Unfortunately it's not a file that's getting written by syslog, thanks > though. I hope this isn't too obvious... I know nothing about swatch, but what is calling swatch? How does swatch process the script? In at least some scripting languages, $0 refers to the first item on the command line, which is generally the command name. If you are having a different shell execute the script than other people are using, or swatch is relying on some environment variables, like $SHELL to decide what to do, that might affect its functioning. I'm probably not helping, but I thought I'd say that anyway! ;-) Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Fri Oct 29 11:09:39 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: <20041029160717.GB73668@therub.org> References: <20041029160717.GB73668@therub.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Dan Rue wrote: > What exactly is not working? Initial problem was that he was having mail issues to itasca.net When he said he was using ns.gofast.net and ns2.gofast.net, I asked both servers and got different answers (ns.gofast.net failed for itasca.net, but ns2.gofast.net worked correctly.) Try it: dig @ns.gofast.net itasca.net I get a SERVFAIL. But asking ns2 I get the correct answer. I (hesitantly) say it's an issue with ns.gofast.net, and pulling that out of resolv.conf and using just ns2 should fix it. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Oct 29 11:49:25 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 11:07:17 -0500 > From: Dan Rue > I think there is massive confusion going on here. Sadly, yes. I'm confused, but the fog is clearing. > >From what I can remember of your thread, I don't know why someone > recommended that you run named (bind). I don't think you need it. No one here recommended my running named. Someone did recommend that I check its status. In any case, I can't start, stop or check the status of named. I would like to resolve that even if I don't use it... but it can wait. > /etc/resolv.conf is used for when you try to resolve a name. that is > necessary on any computer connected to the internet. It has nothing to > do with named. I now see that any resolution immediately uses the new contents. > named is for if you want to run a name server, to serve requests for a > particular domain (or a caching name server) - you don't need it! It's > a pita to set up if you're not familiar with it, anyway. My lesson for the day. That's good to know. I thought named might give some benefit like faster lookups, but that benefit will be small. > What? You can add a second DNS server to resolv.conf anytime. > > What exactly is not working? $ping itasca.net ping: unknown host itasca.net That comes back immediately with just 209.46.63.1 in my resolv.conf (ns.gofast.net). If I add 207.195.213.5 and -.6, it takes a while longer but returns the same result. (Those two IP's are listed as the domain hosts in whois itasca.net.) Adding 209.46.63.6 (ns2.gofast.net) makes it take longer but still fails. If I dig itasca.net, I get SERVFAIL with 209.46.63.1. If I use any of the other three IP's, I get timeouts. Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Fri Oct 29 12:16:23 2004 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9d6c825304102910166a982264@mail.gmail.com> Can you ping all of the DNS servers (209.46.63.1)? You might have a firewall issue if you can ping but not resolve names. The host program allows you to resolve DNS names using any DNS server you want. Usage: host DNS.name.to.lookup DNS.server.to.use -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jim at herrick.net Fri Oct 29 12:37:41 2004 From: jim at herrick.net (Jim Herrick) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue References: <9d6c825304102910166a982264@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002a01c4bddd$fe7f3c70$c500a8c0@JHERRICK> And vice versa. Some DNS servers don't allow pings (or ICMP traffic) but *do* (obviously) allow DNS traffic via TCP (transfers) or UDP (queries)... Using a NS query tool (like host, dig or nslookup) is a good idea, like Jeff suggests. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Rasmussen" To: "TCLUG Mailing List" Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 12:16 PM Subject: Re: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue > Can you ping all of the DNS servers (209.46.63.1)? You might have a > firewall issue if you can ping but not resolve names. > > The host program allows you to resolve DNS names using any DNS server you > want. > > Usage: host DNS.name.to.lookup DNS.server.to.use > > > -- > Jeff Rasmussen > GPG public key 0x9686C12F > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Fri Oct 29 12:44:21 2004 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] swatch help In-Reply-To: References: <20041029090258.000072ab@beethoven> Message-ID: <20041029124421.00003d2a@beethoven> On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 11:20:53 -0500 (CDT) Mike Miller wrote: > I hope this isn't too obvious... Swatch is kind of an oddball so I cannot really answer your questions. It's one of those tools that works great once you get it working, but can be a real pain at times to get to that stage. If you are following the thread I just found the answer buried on one of the swatch support forums on sourceforge. Need to user $_ instead of $0. http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=1139003&forum_id=233304 My config file is now: watchfor = /.*/ exec echo $_ >> /var/log/cleanlog Josh _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Fri Oct 29 12:42:53 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: <20041029160717.GB73668@therub.org> Message-ID: <20041029174253.GC73668@therub.org> On Fri, Oct 29, 2004 at 11:09:39AM -0500, Adam Maloney wrote: > On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Dan Rue wrote: > > >What exactly is not working? > > Initial problem was that he was having mail issues to itasca.net When he > said he was using ns.gofast.net and ns2.gofast.net, I asked both servers > and got different answers (ns.gofast.net failed for itasca.net, but > ns2.gofast.net worked correctly.) > > Try it: > > dig @ns.gofast.net itasca.net > > I get a SERVFAIL. But asking ns2 I get the correct answer. > > I (hesitantly) say it's an issue with ns.gofast.net, and pulling that out > of resolv.conf and using just ns2 should fix it. Yeah, it seems like it's a gofast.net problem - i ran doc (great dns utility) against itasca.net and it came up with 0 problems. Umm.. For a temporary fix, just use someone else's name server. Visi's are 209.98.98.98 and 208.42.42.42 It looks like they work from outside of visi.. And from Chris' mail: >My lesson for the day. That's good to know. I thought named might give >some benefit like faster lookups, but that benefit will be small. That's true - but it's usually a bad idea to compound problems by adding more variables :) Once you get this working, though, running a local bind will cache your dns for you, and in that configuration the setup is pretty easy. Tutorials exist everywhere.. dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Fri Oct 29 12:43:49 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Chris, Put just ns2.gofast.net's IP in resolv.conf - it should start working immediately. As I stated, ns.gofast.net is returning SERVFAIL for itasca.net. ns2 is not. Just use ns2. Then maybe e-mail GoFast's support and ask if they can look into the issue. On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > > That comes back immediately with just 209.46.63.1 in my resolv.conf > (ns.gofast.net). If I add 207.195.213.5 and -.6, it takes a while longer > but returns the same result. (Those two IP's are listed as the domain > hosts in whois itasca.net.) > > Adding 209.46.63.6 (ns2.gofast.net) makes it take longer but still fails. > > If I dig itasca.net, I get SERVFAIL with 209.46.63.1. If I use any of the > other three IP's, I get timeouts. > > Chris Schumann > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Oct 29 13:45:43 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > From: Adam Maloney > Put just ns2.gofast.net's IP in resolv.conf - it should start working > immediately. Yeah. It should, but doesn't. > As I stated, ns.gofast.net is returning SERVFAIL for itasca.net. ns2 is > not. Just use ns2. Then maybe e-mail GoFast's support and ask if they > can look into the issue. ns1.gofast.net does indeed return SERVFAIL here. ns2 is not returning SERVFAIL here. It times out, as does rocky and bullwinkle (DNS of record for Itasca) as does Visi's DNS. My ISP is iagmn.net who uses gofast (I'm four hops to ns.gofast.net). Other ideas? Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From adam at whee.org Fri Oct 29 13:39:19 2004 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 29 Oct 2004, Chris Schumann wrote: > ns1.gofast.net does indeed return SERVFAIL here. > > ns2 is not returning SERVFAIL here. It times out, as does rocky and > bullwinkle (DNS of record for Itasca) as does Visi's DNS. > > My ISP is iagmn.net who uses gofast (I'm four hops to ns.gofast.net). > > Other ideas? > > Chris Schumann What DNS resolvers does your ISP say you should be using? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From drue at therub.org Fri Oct 29 14:14:46 2004 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041029191446.GD73668@therub.org> On Fri, Oct 29, 2004 at 01:45:43PM -0500, Chris Schumann wrote: > > As I stated, ns.gofast.net is returning SERVFAIL for itasca.net. ns2 is > > not. Just use ns2. Then maybe e-mail GoFast's support and ask if they > > can look into the issue. > > ns1.gofast.net does indeed return SERVFAIL here. > > ns2 is not returning SERVFAIL here. It times out, as does rocky and > bullwinkle (DNS of record for Itasca) as does Visi's DNS. > > My ISP is iagmn.net who uses gofast (I'm four hops to ns.gofast.net). > > Other ideas? They /all/ timeout? Sure it's not a firewall issue (you are passing out UDP, aren't you)? dan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Fri Oct 29 15:08:16 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (Garrett Krueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes continue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4532.192.168.100.2.1099080496.squirrel@192.168.100.2> Alright, what's going on here? Is there a router between your machine and itasca.net that could be filtering out that specific network prefix? Why not try adding a specific entry to your router's routing table? For example: ip route add 207.195.213.6/24 dev eth0 >> From: Adam Maloney > >> Put just ns2.gofast.net's IP in resolv.conf - it should start working >> immediately. > > Yeah. It should, but doesn't. > >> As I stated, ns.gofast.net is returning SERVFAIL for itasca.net. ns2 is >> not. Just use ns2. Then maybe e-mail GoFast's support and ask if they >> can look into the issue. > > ns1.gofast.net does indeed return SERVFAIL here. > > ns2 is not returning SERVFAIL here. It times out, as does rocky and > bullwinkle (DNS of record for Itasca) as does Visi's DNS. > > My ISP is iagmn.net who uses gofast (I'm four hops to ns.gofast.net). > > Other ideas? > > Chris Schumann > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From cschumann at twp-llc.com Fri Oct 29 15:05:08 2004 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:56 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] DNS woes fixed Message-ID: Thank you to all who helped and made suggestions. It turns out that I had firewalled all traffic on port 53 except to ns.gofast.net. Fixing the iptables file and restarting iptables cleared up the issue. skulking away in shame, but more knowledgable about dns, Chris Schumann _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From dd-tclug at davedash.com Sat Oct 30 07:44:11 2004 From: dd-tclug at davedash.com (Dave Dash) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] (no subject) Message-ID: <6636B06E-2A71-11D9-8342-00039397F470@davedash.com> I am setting up a small web service that will need a lot of disk space. So I have two choices, either a, host it at home, using some sort of dedicated connection (e.g. SpeakEasy DSL) and maybe run a small UPS system for the occasional power outage. or 2, collocate. Right now I'm inclined to host it, until it becomes too much of a pain to take care of and then migrate it to a collocation facility. However, I'm looking for other peoples suggestions, and recommendations for co-locators and/or broadband providers. Thanks :) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From barnabas at knicknack.net Sat Oct 30 08:32:53 2004 From: barnabas at knicknack.net (Eric Stanley) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <6636B06E-2A71-11D9-8342-00039397F470@davedash.com> References: <6636B06E-2A71-11D9-8342-00039397F470@davedash.com> Message-ID: <200410300832.53846.barnabas@knicknack.net> Dave, What order of magnitude do you mean by "a lot of disk space?" 1GB, 100GB? Have you considered hosting on a virtual machine? I know that Real-Time is rolling something like that out. I've also looked at Linode (http://www.linode.com) and that looks like a good option as well. HTH, Eric On Saturday 30 October 2004 07:44, Dave Dash wrote: > I am setting up a small web service that will need a lot of disk space. > So I have two choices, either > > a, host it at home, using some sort of dedicated connection (e.g. > SpeakEasy DSL) and maybe run a small UPS system for the occasional > power outage. > > or > > 2, collocate. > > Right now I'm inclined to host it, until it becomes too much of a pain > to take care of and then migrate it to a collocation facility. > > However, I'm looking for other peoples suggestions, and recommendations > for co-locators and/or broadband providers. > > Thanks :) > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org > Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From gkrueger at cleosci.com Sat Oct 30 09:46:18 2004 From: gkrueger at cleosci.com (gkrueger) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <6636B06E-2A71-11D9-8342-00039397F470@davedash.com> References: <6636B06E-2A71-11D9-8342-00039397F470@davedash.com> Message-ID: <4183A93A.9030406@cleosci.com> Can you estimate how much activity (how many hits per day) this website will receive? Dave Dash wrote: > I am setting up a small web service that will need a lot of disk > space. So I have two choices, either > > a, host it at home, using some sort of dedicated connection (e.g. > SpeakEasy DSL) and maybe run a small UPS system for the occasional > power outage. > > or > > 2, collocate. > > Right now I'm inclined to host it, until it becomes too much of a pain > to take care of and then migrate it to a collocation facility. > > However, I'm looking for other peoples suggestions, and > recommendations for co-locators and/or broadband providers. > > Thanks :) > _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From silwenae at silwenae.com Sat Oct 30 14:16:12 2004 From: silwenae at silwenae.com (Paul Cutler) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Ubuntu lock-ups Message-ID: <1099163772.5327.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> I recently installed Ubuntu on my laptop and my desktop, and like it quite a bit. The only catch is, on my desktop, it's locking up quite a bit requiring hard reboots. It seems to have something to do with the screensaver, but I'm not sure where to start looking. It was locking up before and after I installed the Nvidia drivers, I installed the Nvidia debs hoping it might fix it, but no such luck. My desktop machine is a mini-ATX Intel 865 board, that ran Fedora Core 1 & 2 flawlessly for quite a long time, which is one reason I'm so confused as to what it may be. Any suggestions or pointers on where to start looking to troubleshoot? Any specific log files that may have the answer? Thanks. --paul silwenae@silwenae.com _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sat Oct 30 15:01:14 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? Message-ID: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> I am currently emerging KDE on gentoo, and am enabling Java. In order to continue the emerge process, I have to download a zipped set of documents from sun.com, put them into the path of portage, and then continue the emerge, all to satisfy an EULA. Bah. This would be no problem at all except that once lynx downloads the zipfile, I have absolutely no idea where it goes. I've run slocate -u to update the slocate database, slocate doesn't find anything then. I've found nothing in the manpages that addresses this issue. When I start the download, lynx doesn't show a URL that I might try to use wget on. My feeble brain has hit a wall, and I would appreciate any replies. Thanks! -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 30 15:15:10 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > I am currently emerging KDE on gentoo, and am enabling Java. Can anyone tell me what it means to "emerge KDE"? Sounds interesting. > In order to continue the emerge process, I have to download a zipped set > of documents from sun.com, put them into the path of portage, and then > continue the emerge, all to satisfy an EULA. Bah. That must be for Java, right? Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Sat Oct 30 15:34:13 2004 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004 15:15:10 -0500 (CDT), Mike Miller wrote: > > Can anyone tell me what it means to "emerge KDE"? Sounds interesting. it is the Gentoo command to get and/or install a package. Works sort of like apt-get for Debian. > > > > In order to continue the emerge process, I have to download a zipped set > > of documents from sun.com, put them into the path of portage, and then > > continue the emerge, all to satisfy an EULA. Bah. > I am fairly certain that when lynx encounters a non HTML file it will prompt you first with do you want to save it to disk and then the second prompt is where do you want to save it to. I am assuming it will default to either your home directory or your current working directory (the dir you are in when you launch lynx). -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sat Oct 30 15:46:27 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> "I am fairly certain that when lynx encounters a non HTML file it will prompt you first with do you want to save it to disk and then the second prompt is where do you want to save it to. I am assuming it will default to either your home directory or your current working directory (the dir you are in when you launch lynx)." I get the first prompt, but not the second. It just starts downloading and doesn't seem to end up anywhere, either the home directory or current working directory. Maybe lynx is just b0rked? -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sat Oct 30 16:18:38 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > I get the first prompt, but not the second. It just starts downloading > and doesn't seem to end up anywhere, either the home directory or > current working directory. Maybe lynx is just b0rked? After it downloads, you have to hit "enter" again to "save file." If you don't do that, and give the file a name, it isn't saved. I usually do it this way: lynx -source URL_to_file > filename I'll get the URL in a typical browser and paste it onto the command line for Lynx. It has to be put in quotes if there are certain characters in the URL, e.g., question marks. Mike -- Michael B. Miller, Ph.D. Assistant Professor Division of Epidemiology and Community Health and Institute of Human Genetics University of Minnesota http://taxa.epi.umn.edu/~mbmiller/ _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sat Oct 30 19:16:54 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> > After it downloads, you have to hit "enter" again to "save file." If you > don't do that, and give the file a name, it isn't saved. > > I usually do it this way: > > lynx -source URL_to_file > filename > > I'll get the URL in a typical browser and paste it onto the command line > for Lynx. It has to be put in quotes if there are certain characters in > the URL, e.g., question marks. This didn't work either. The file produced a different hash than portage (Gentoo's package-management system) was expecting. For now I'll just compile it without java support, but I would welcome any other suggestions. Thanks for all the help so far! -Patrick _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nassarmu at redconcepts.net Sat Oct 30 19:55:25 2004 From: nassarmu at redconcepts.net (nassarmu@redconcepts.net) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Re: To where does Lynx download a file? References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Patrick Hawkins writes: > This didn't work either. The file produced a different hash than > portage (Gentoo's package-management system) was expecting. For now > I'll just compile it without java support, but I would welcome any > other suggestions. Thanks for all the help so far! strange that gentoo wants you to download stuff from sun, by default it uses the blackdown jdk -- Munir Nassar _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Sat Oct 30 21:10:19 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From thurianknight at gmail.com Sat Oct 30 22:12:20 2004 From: thurianknight at gmail.com (Dave Sherman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7bdea6e3041030201238679c12@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 30 Oct 2004 19:10:19 -0700 (PDT), Paul Schumacher wrote: > > > > > Has anybody tried FireFox on Fedora Core 2? > > > > Install problems? Howto? I've been using it exclusively with both Fedora Core 1 and 2. Works great. I am running the latest binary build (tarball) available at mozilla.org, not an rpm. Install is simple, untar the download file, go into the directory and run the installer. A graphical install wizard takes over from there, walks you right through the process. I install into my own home directory. -- Dave Sherman MCSA, MCSE, CCNA [Insert witty .sig here.] _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Sat Oct 30 22:50:34 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:57 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041031035034.GA10673@mail.el-swifto.com> On Sat, Oct 30, 2004 at 07:16:54PM -0500, Patrick Hawkins wrote: > > After it downloads, you have to hit "enter" again to "save file." > > If you don't do that, and give the file a name, it isn't saved. > > > > I usually do it this way: > > > > lynx -source URL_to_file > filename > > > > I'll get the URL in a typical browser and paste it onto the command > > line for Lynx. It has to be put in quotes if there are certain > > characters in the URL, e.g., question marks. > > This didn't work either. The file produced a different hash than > portage (Gentoo's package-management system) was expecting. For now > I'll just compile it without java support, but I would welcome any > other suggestions. Thanks for all the help so far! Have you tried wget? I've never had a problem with it. -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Oct 31 00:11:51 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, Patrick Hawkins wrote: >> lynx -source URL_to_file > filename >> >> I'll get the URL in a typical browser and paste it onto the command >> line for Lynx. It has to be put in quotes if there are certain >> characters in the URL, e.g., question marks. > > This didn't work either. The file produced a different hash than portage > (Gentoo's package-management system) was expecting. In other words, the method I recommended (and use almost daily) worked fine, but the file you were downloading wasn't the one gentoo was expecting. Right? I just don't want people to get the impression that lynx -source doesn't work. It has worked for me hundreds of times. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Oct 31 00:18:09 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <20041031035034.GA10673@mail.el-swifto.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> <20041031035034.GA10673@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, John J. Trammell wrote: > Have you tried wget? I've never had a problem with it. lynx -source works great for a single file. wget is great for collections of files. His problem was not with "lynx -source", it was with downloading a file from the "wrong" URL. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Sun Oct 31 09:48:18 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: > On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, John J. Trammell wrote: > > Have you tried wget? I've never had a problem with it. > > lynx -source works great for a single file. > wget is great for collections of files. wget is great for either, actually, especially with its download resuming capabilities. (Ever have an ISO download die halfway through?) To (again) quote someone from the UCLA LUG, "wget is my tiny little god." Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From jima at beer.tclug.org Sun Oct 31 09:50:50 2004 From: jima at beer.tclug.org (Jima) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, Paul Schumacher wrote: > Has anybody tried FireFox on Fedora Core 2? Sure, all the time. > Install problems? Howto? I've seemed to have some problems importing profiles from Mozilla. Aside from that, Dag Wieers has some nice RPMs available at http://dag.wieers.com/packages/firefox/ . Jima _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From phawk42 at gmail.com Sun Oct 31 10:07:01 2004 From: phawk42 at gmail.com (Patrick Hawkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> <20041031035034.GA10673@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <68a256c04103108074b31099a@mail.gmail.com> > His problem was not with "lynx -source", it was with downloading a file > from the "wrong" URL. Exactly. When I did lynx -source, I misspelled the URL. *hangs head in shame* _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Oct 31 10:24:04 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Oct 2004, Jima wrote: > On Sun, 31 Oct 2004, Mike Miller wrote: >> On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, John J. Trammell wrote: >>> Have you tried wget? I've never had a problem with it. >> >> lynx -source works great for a single file. >> wget is great for collections of files. > > wget is great for either, actually, especially with its download resuming > capabilities. (Ever have an ISO download die halfway through?) To > (again) quote someone from the UCLA LUG, "wget is my tiny little god." Nice. I'm quite sure that lynx does not do that. I mostly use "lynx -source" for downloading journal articles in PDF format. They always complete. For bigger files, it sounds like wget has a substantial advantage. Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Sun Oct 31 10:22:14 2004 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] To where does Lynx download a file? In-Reply-To: <68a256c04103108074b31099a@mail.gmail.com> References: <68a256c04103013011cffad62@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c04103013462100567e@mail.gmail.com> <68a256c041030171673984359@mail.gmail.com> <20041031035034.GA10673@mail.el-swifto.com> <68a256c04103108074b31099a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Oct 2004, Patrick Hawkins wrote: >> His problem was not with "lynx -source", it was with downloading a file >> from the "wrong" URL. > > Exactly. When I did lynx -source, I misspelled the URL. *hangs head in shame* It's not that bad! ;-) Mike _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From wnpauls2 at yahoo.com Sun Oct 31 12:12:15 2004 From: wnpauls2 at yahoo.com (Paul Schumacher) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041031181215.58511.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From rpgoldman at real-time.com Sun Oct 31 14:15:50 2004 From: rpgoldman at real-time.com (rpgoldman@real-time.com) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> >>>>> "jima" == jima writes: jima> On Sat, 30 Oct 2004, Paul Schumacher wrote: >> Has anybody tried FireFox on Fedora Core 2? jima> Sure, all the time. >> Install problems? Howto? jima> I've seemed to have some problems importing profiles from jima> Mozilla. Aside jima> from that, Dag Wieers has some nice RPMs available at jima> http://dag.wieers.com/packages/firefox/ . I was wondering if anyone could follow up with reasons to move to FireFox from Mozilla or reasons not to. I've been reasonably happy with Mozilla, which I use on both Linux and XP. Any compelling reason to change? Jima's comments address my big worry --- would I be losing too much of my personal customization if I moved to FireFox? Thanks! robert _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From thurianknight at gmail.com Sun Oct 31 14:39:26 2004 From: thurianknight at gmail.com (Dave Sherman) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <7bdea6e30410311239997714f@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 14:15:50 -0600, rpgoldman@real-time.com > > I was wondering if anyone could follow up with reasons to move to > FireFox from Mozilla or reasons not to. I've been reasonably happy > with Mozilla, which I use on both Linux and XP. Any compelling reason > to change? Jima's comments address my big worry --- would I be losing > too much of my personal customization if I moved to FireFox? > > Thanks! > robert I originally switched to Firefox because I preferred to use Evolution for a mail client, so I had no need of Mozilla for email. It's been so long since I used Mozilla, I really don't know where the two browsers' features are similar or different. I know that my bookmarks transferred no problem, but I'm not sure about anything else. -- Dave Sherman MCSA, MCSE, CCNA [Insert witty .sig here.] _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sun Oct 31 15:05:04 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <41855380.1080605@comcast.net> > >I was wondering if anyone could follow up with reasons to move to >FireFox from Mozilla or reasons not to. I've been reasonably happy >with Mozilla, which I use on both Linux and XP. Any compelling reason >to change? Jima's comments address my big worry --- would I be losing >too much of my personal customization if I moved to FireFox? > >Thanks! >robert > > > > robert, All your Mozilla customization will transfer over to FireFox. FireFox is still "Mozilla" but "leaner" and of course the email client is not part of FireFox. Guess best to read the information on the FireFox web page for all the features and why they think it is 'The Best" browser out ;-) Have not tried Thunderbird (email) on any Linux distro yet, but like the way it handles email on Windoz. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From strayf at freeshell.org Sun Oct 31 19:12:43 2004 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> Message-ID: <20041101011243.GA23240@crito> On Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 02:15:50PM -0600, rpgoldman@real-time.com wrote: > >>>>> "jima" == jima writes: > > I was wondering if anyone could follow up with reasons to move to > FireFox from Mozilla or reasons not to. I've been reasonably happy > with Mozilla, which I use on both Linux and XP. Any compelling reason > to change? Jima's comments address my big worry --- would I be losing > too much of my personal customization if I moved to FireFox? The last time I tried FireFox I couldn't find a way to globally turn off the automatic form and password saving feature, but had to say "not for this site" every time it offered. A small point, but irritating nonetheless. And I like Mozilla, so... -Steve _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Sun Oct 31 19:18:07 2004 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox on Debian unstable? [hijack] In-Reply-To: <20041031181215.58511.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041031181215.58511.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041101011807.GA8227@mail.el-swifto.com> On Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 10:12:15AM -0800, Paul Schumacher wrote: [snip] Sorry to hijack, but I'm curious about what other Debianites use on their unstable desktops. I've gotten nothing but pain from Firefox, so I've stuck with Opera and Mozilla Navigator. JT -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sun Oct 31 19:47:43 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:58 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <20041101011243.GA23240@crito> References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041101011243.GA23240@crito> Message-ID: <418595BF.4040705@comcast.net> Steven Cayford wrote: > >The last time I tried FireFox I couldn't find a way to globally turn off >the automatic form and password saving feature, but had to say "not for this >site" every time it offered. A small point, but irritating nonetheless. And >I like Mozilla, so... > >-Steve > Steve, FireFox password and form settings are located under Tools, select the "padlock" icon, expand Saved Form Information, then remove the check tic by "Save information I enter in web page forms and the Search Bar". Expand Saved Passwords, remove the check tic by "Remember Passwords". Restart FireFox to remember the new settings. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From scot at thinkunix.net Sun Oct 31 19:42:28 2004 From: scot at thinkunix.net (Scot Jenkins) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:59 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox on Debian unstable? [hijack] In-Reply-To: <20041101011807.GA8227@mail.el-swifto.com>; from trammell+tclug@el-swifto.com on Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 07:18:07PM -0600 References: <20041031181215.58511.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> <20041101011807.GA8227@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <20041031194228.A17405@thinkunix.net> John J. Trammell wrote: > On Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 10:12:15AM -0800, Paul Schumacher wrote: > [snip] > > Sorry to hijack, but I'm curious about what other Debianites use on > their unstable desktops. I've gotten nothing but pain from Firefox, > so I've stuck with Opera and Mozilla Navigator. running Debian stable and mozilla 1.7.3 using tarball from mozilla.org; is very stable and works for me. I sometimes need the mail client for testing customer mailserver setups, thus the bloat. -- scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From nate at refried.org Sun Oct 31 21:01:10 2004 From: nate at refried.org (nate@refried.org) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:59 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox on Debian unstable? [hijack] In-Reply-To: <20041101011807.GA8227@mail.el-swifto.com> References: <20041031181215.58511.qmail@web60003.mail.yahoo.com> <20041101011807.GA8227@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <20041101030110.GA30438@refried.org> On Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 07:18:07PM -0600, John J. Trammell wrote: > Sorry to hijack, but I'm curious about what other Debianites use on > their unstable desktops. I've gotten nothing but pain from Firefox, > so I've stuck with Opera and Mozilla Navigator. I've been using it for months now and I love it. There was some trouble early on with extensions, but those were fixed by the time 0.9 was packaged. I'm now running 1.0PR and it looks really nice. Nate _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From j_wrocky at comcast.net Sun Oct 31 21:22:39 2004 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry W) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:59 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] FireFox Settings Message-ID: <4185ABFF.5090707@comcast.net> Forgot one step, after Tools, then the Options icon Then Form and Password settings from the "padlock" icon. Jerry _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From strayf at freeshell.org Sun Oct 31 22:17:37 2004 From: strayf at freeshell.org (Steven Cayford) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:54:59 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] Anybody try FireFox? In-Reply-To: <418595BF.4040705@comcast.net> References: <20041031021019.10658.qmail@web60006.mail.yahoo.com> <16773.18422.337530.25103@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <20041101011243.GA23240@crito> <418595BF.4040705@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20041101041737.GA4969@crito> On Sun, Oct 31, 2004 at 07:47:43PM -0600, Jerry W wrote: > Steve, > FireFox password and form settings are located under Tools, > select the "padlock" icon, expand Saved Form Information, > then remove the check tic by "Save information I enter in web page forms > and the Search Bar". Expand Saved Passwords, remove the check tic by > "Remember Passwords". Restart FireFox to remember the new settings. > Jerry I stand corrected. Thanks. I guess I haven't used it in while. -Steve _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From tmarble at info9.net Thu Oct 28 15:23:39 2004 From: tmarble at info9.net (Tom Marble) Date: Mon Jan 17 12:55:00 2005 Subject: [TCLUG] debian postfix amavisd-new clamav spamassassin Message-ID: <4181554B.8010005@info9.net> All: I've been running this combination successfully (unstable, 2.4 kernel) for a while (thanks to support from several of you!) Today I upgraded the following packages: clamav clamav-base clamav-daemon clamav-freshclam libclamav1 from 0.75.1-4 to 0.80-2 and mail stopped getting delivered! I tried... 1. ucf -p /etc/clamav/clamd.conf;dpkg-reconfigure clamav-daemon but that didn't work 2. downgrading the above packages to 0.75.1-4 but that didn't work 3. disabling content filtering alltogether in /etc/postfix/main.cf # content_filter = smtp-amavis:[127.0.0.1]:10024 And at least now NEW mail is getting through. Ideally I'd like to figure out what's borked with 0.80-2 and get that to go.. I've turned up various debugging but haven't found anything yet. The thing I'm most concerned about is mail that is in Postfix waiting for content filtering, but is still stuck???? In other words I have several messages in /var/spool/postfix/{incoming,active/?/* And they are (I believe) still queued to go to localhost:10024 but they are still stuck (i.e. postfix flush does not get them on their way). Does anyone have strategies for debugging this (ideally to clear out these queues before turning content filtering back on)??? TIA, --Tom _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota Help beta test TCLUG's potential new home: http://plone.mn-linux.org Got pictures for TCLUG? Beta test http://plone.mn-linux.org/gallery tclug-list@mn-linux.org https://mailman.real-time.com/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list