From admin at lctn.org Thu Dec 1 15:41:52 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Thu Dec 1 15:39:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network Message-ID: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> We are experiencing a serious network slowdown at a school for about an hour every day. They are all on Remote Desktop, so in theory, there is not much bandwidth being used. I have used Ntop to try an diagnose things, and it shows there is very little network activity, far from bottlenecking the LAN. Is there a better tool for diagnosing this type of network problem? Raymond From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 15:54:58 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Thu Dec 1 15:57:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> References: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> Message-ID: On 12/1/05, Raymond Norton wrote: > We are experiencing a serious network slowdown at a school for about an hour > every day. They are all on Remote Desktop, so in theory, there is not much > bandwidth being used. I have used Ntop to try an diagnose things, and it > shows there is very little network activity, far from bottlenecking the LAN. > Is there a better tool for diagnosing this type of network problem? Ntop gives you a good high-level view of what's going on, but for a more detailed look at things, nothing beats tcpdump and/or ethereal. There's a windows port of ethereal, which I use on a daily basis. It's quite nice. From lcojiml at yahoo.com Thu Dec 1 15:55:13 2005 From: lcojiml at yahoo.com (Jim Louis) Date: Thu Dec 1 15:57:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> Message-ID: <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I was unable to research the email archives to see what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? Jim --- Raymond Norton wrote: > We are experiencing a serious network slowdown at a > school for about an hour > every day. They are all on Remote Desktop, so in > theory, there is not much > bandwidth being used. I have used Ntop to try an > diagnose things, and it > shows there is very little network activity, far > from bottlenecking the LAN. > Is there a better tool for diagnosing this type of > network problem? > > > Raymond > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > ///, //// \ /, / >. \ /, _/ /. James Louis \_ /_/ /. Tech Warrior \__/_ < http://tecnogichida.endoftheinternet.org /<<< \_\_ 612.203.2631 /,)^>>_._ \ lcojiml@yahoo.com (/ \\ /\\\ jglouisjr@gmail.com // ```` ======((`=======[when weather means business]======================= "I am an idealist. I don't know where I'm going but I'm on my way." - Carl Sandburg __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 16:15:15 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Thu Dec 1 16:15:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: > I was unable to research the email archives to see > what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a > problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug -Erik From scotjenkins at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:01:33 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:03:27 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: References: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/1/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: > > I was unable to research the email archives to see > > what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a > > problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? > > I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: > > http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug > cool! I wasn't aware that existed. Could some with appropriate access on the tclug.org webserver add this link? It might also be useful in the mailing list signature that is appended to every post. scot From andyzib at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:17:28 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:19:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] File system for squid cache In-Reply-To: <20051124023939.GA6412@refried.org> References: <2c6699da0511231210q4bad244crf756aa618d4ab0a@mail.gmail.com> <20051124023939.GA6412@refried.org> Message-ID: > I also just had a thought. A proxy cache is just a cache for temporary > files. They help speed up web access, but they really aren't all that > important. So if the file system corrupts itself, you can really > just mkfs the partition and start over. So the main benefit of a > journaled file system, quick recovery, is negated. So unless there is a > performance difference, why not stick with ext2 for the proxy cache file > system? > > Does this make sense to anyone that admins a squid proxy? I have no > experience in this area. If you are using a squid server and are forcing everyone to use it, then the journaled file system helps to get things up and running again after a power outage or other events that require a fsck on the volume. fsck on a large ext2 volume can keep your server tied up long enough for mutiple users to knock on your door mutiple times. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0; 0 rows returned From sulrich at botwerks.org Thu Dec 1 17:19:34 2005 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:23:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: References: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: call me inordinately tied to google, but ... a google query string with a directive specifying site:shadowknight.real-time.com seems to do a really good job for me in the off chance i need to search the archives. On Dec 1, 2005, at 5:01 PM, Scot Jenkins wrote: > On 12/1/05, Erik Anderson wrote: >> On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: >>> I was unable to research the email archives to see >>> what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a >>> problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? >> >> I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: >> >> http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug >> > > cool! I wasn't aware that existed. Could some with appropriate > access on the tclug.org webserver add this link? > > It might also be useful in the mailing list signature that is > appended to every post. { snipped - misc. signatures } -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC From stutterstutt at comcast.net Thu Dec 1 17:24:03 2005 From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:27:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Backup options for lots of data / Managing LVG when switching Distributions Message-ID: <438F8613.9020309@comcast.net> I'm considering swapping out SuSE 9.2 for Ubuntu (Breezy). What's stopping me is that I have a multi-disk logical volume group. I've looked at the LVG HOWTO at tldp.org and it seems that I should first export the LVG and then import it when the new distribution is up and running. The data are not backed up and I'm nervous about making a mistake. I'd back it up if I knew of a reasonably-priced archive option that worked on Linux that could handle 500GB of data (it could easily double in the next year). That rules out popping over to the local store to pick up a dual-layer DVD-RW. The data are already compressed so I do not expect to achieve much by compressing while writing to tape, either. Now's your chance to offer advice. If you were me what would you do? Should I just trust the LVG export/import capabilities? I plan to keep the SuSE distribution available while I switch to Ubuntu, so hopefully I could revert back if things go wrong. Personal replies will be summarized back to the list if you'd rather send to me directly rather than the whole list. Thanks. -Jeff From bhartm at visi.com Thu Dec 1 17:36:34 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:33:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug In-Reply-To: References: <00ca01c5f6c0$0abc8d50$1e940840@LCTN.local> <20051201215513.59868.qmail@web35415.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <438F8902.7030300@visi.com> Scot Jenkins wrote: >On 12/1/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > > >>On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: >> >> >>>I was unable to research the email archives to see >>>what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a >>>problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? >>> >>> >>I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: >> >>http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug >> >> >> > >cool! I wasn't aware that existed. Could some with appropriate >access on the tclug.org webserver add this link? > >It might also be useful in the mailing list signature that is >appended to every post. > >scot > > > /*cool!*/ I had no idea there was such a thing. sweet. I hereby second for linking/sig'ing. I've got great info from this list, but I only have a year or so saved in my T-bird. From erikerik at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:31:33 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:33:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] File system for squid cache In-Reply-To: <2c6699da0511231210q4bad244crf756aa618d4ab0a@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da0511231210q4bad244crf756aa618d4ab0a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 11/23/05, Brian Wall wrote: > I'm building a new squid proxy server. I'd like to put the proxy > cache on its own partition. Is ther a file system that would be > better optimized for proxy cache? I'm not a fan of Ext2/3, but I'm > not familiar enough with Reiser, JFS, XFS, etc to know which is best > for handling a large amount of small files. You might have already thought of this and turned the idea down, but how about using tmpfs for this to keep the cache in RAM? Do you know how large of a cache you'll be keeping? If it's not too large, say under a gig or two, you might consider this, because no disk filesystem will beat the performance of RAM. From lcojiml at yahoo.com Thu Dec 1 17:34:24 2005 From: lcojiml at yahoo.com (Jim Louis) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:40:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051201233424.43562.qmail@web35414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> most excellent! jim --- Erik Anderson wrote: > On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: > > I was unable to research the email archives to see > > what it held for this question. Anyone else notice > a > > problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? > > I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: > > http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug > > -Erik > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > ///, //// \ /, / >. \ /, _/ /. James Louis \_ /_/ /. Tech Warrior \__/_ < http://tecnogichida.endoftheinternet.org /<<< \_\_ 612.203.2631 /,)^>>_._ \ lcojiml@yahoo.com (/ \\ /\\\ jglouisjr@gmail.com // ```` ======((`=======[when weather means business]======================= "I am an idealist. I don't know where I'm going but I'm on my way." - Carl Sandburg __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From drue at therub.org Thu Dec 1 17:44:16 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:49:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Backup options for lots of data / Managing LVG when switching Distributions In-Reply-To: <438F8613.9020309@comcast.net> References: <438F8613.9020309@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20051201234416.GU29291@therub.org> On Thu, Dec 01, 2005 at 05:24:03PM -0600, Jeff Nelson wrote: > I'm considering swapping out SuSE 9.2 for Ubuntu (Breezy). What's > stopping me is that I have a multi-disk logical volume group. I've > looked at the LVG HOWTO at tldp.org and it seems that I should first > export the LVG and then import it when the new distribution is up and > running. > > The data are not backed up and I'm nervous about making a mistake. I'd > back it up if I knew of a reasonably-priced archive option that worked > on Linux that could handle 500GB of data (it could easily double in the > next year). That rules out popping over to the local store to pick up a > dual-layer DVD-RW. The data are already compressed so I do not expect to > achieve much by compressing while writing to tape, either. > > Now's your chance to offer advice. If you were me what would you do? > Should I just trust the LVG export/import capabilities? I plan to keep > the SuSE distribution available while I switch to Ubuntu, so hopefully I > could revert back if things go wrong. > > Personal replies will be summarized back to the list if you'd rather > send to me directly rather than the whole list. The cheapest way that i'm aware of for that much data is just more disks. Make sure everythign exists in two places (and i'm not just talking about a raid). Personally, I have a box that is just for backups, with sufficient hard drive space to back up the important things. I use rsnapshot to do the automated backups.. This means that disks cost me twice as much roughly becuase I have to be sure I have enough space for my backup - but I sort of prioritize my data and am sure to have backed up what i don't want to lose. Dan From sfertch at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:49:58 2005 From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:50:52 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Backup options for lots of data / Managing LVG when switching Distributions In-Reply-To: <438F8613.9020309@comcast.net> References: <438F8613.9020309@comcast.net> Message-ID: <67f3084a0512011549h6c125718s4342aa5d9a27767a@mail.gmail.com> On 12/1/05, Jeff Nelson wrote: > > I'm considering swapping out SuSE 9.2 for Ubuntu (Breezy). What's > stopping me is that I have a multi-disk logical volume group. I've > looked at the LVG HOWTO at tldp.org and it seems that I should first > export the LVG and then import it when the new distribution is up and > running. > > The data are not backed up and I'm nervous about making a mistake. I'd > back it up if I knew of a reasonably-priced archive option that worked > on Linux that could handle 500GB of data (it could easily double in the > next year). That rules out popping over to the local store to pick up a > dual-layer DVD-RW. The data are already compressed so I do not expect to > achieve much by compressing while writing to tape, either. > > Now's your chance to offer advice. If you were me what would you do? > Should I just trust the LVG export/import capabilities? I plan to keep > the SuSE distribution available while I switch to Ubuntu, so hopefully I > could revert back if things go wrong. > > Personal replies will be summarized back to the list if you'd rather > send to me directly rather than the whole list. > You have 500GB of data that you're concerned about, and it's not backed up? Something wrong with that picture... Honestly, the whole process should be relatively painless if the data resides on disks/partitions and volume groups outside of your OS. -print out your /etc/fstab -run a vgcfgbackup /de/vgXX (VG you are backing up) and store it to a safe place such as a floppy, cdrom or network share -Install your OS -Modify your /etc/fstab to add in the VG/LV info from the other data -vgscan -mount -a There are a couple of caveats: 1) LVM2 is backwards compatible with LVM1, however LVM1 does not work with LVM2 2) Backups are critical. I'd suggest a disk to disk copy backup at least and a tape drive if you can. I have yet to really need to run a vgcfgrestore when swapping disks to another system if they are the only parts of the VG. Or, when reinstalling an OS. vgscan and the fstab modifications typically work. -- -Shawn -Nemo me impune lacessit. Ne Obliviscaris.. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051201/81b8942b/attachment.htm From kc0iog at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:59:59 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Thu Dec 1 18:01:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] File system for squid cache In-Reply-To: References: <2c6699da0511231210q4bad244crf756aa618d4ab0a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2c6699da0512011559m46201d95r6d94cd340194b9a6@mail.gmail.com> On 12/1/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > You might have already thought of this and turned the idea down, but > how about using tmpfs for this to keep the cache in RAM? Do you know > how large of a cache you'll be keeping? If it's not too large, say > under a gig or two, you might consider this, because no disk > filesystem will beat the performance of RAM. Unfortunately my needs exceed the RAM of the machine. I'm caching data for 500 people, so a couple of GB will fill up awrfully fast. Good thought though, for a smaller box that would be the optimal solution. From florin at iucha.net Thu Dec 1 18:14:47 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Thu Dec 1 18:15:28 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] File system for squid cache In-Reply-To: References: <2c6699da0511231210q4bad244crf756aa618d4ab0a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051202001447.GH13079@iucha.net> On Thu, Dec 01, 2005 at 05:31:33PM -0600, Erik Anderson wrote: > On 11/23/05, Brian Wall wrote: > > I'm building a new squid proxy server. I'd like to put the proxy > > cache on its own partition. Is ther a file system that would be > > better optimized for proxy cache? I'm not a fan of Ext2/3, but I'm > > not familiar enough with Reiser, JFS, XFS, etc to know which is best > > for handling a large amount of small files. > > You might have already thought of this and turned the idea down, but > how about using tmpfs for this to keep the cache in RAM? Do you know > how large of a cache you'll be keeping? If it's not too large, say > under a gig or two, you might consider this, because no disk > filesystem will beat the performance of RAM. Huh? In that case, give the RAM directly to squid and cut the middle man. florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051201/f7e05211/attachment-0001.pgp From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 1 18:53:25 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Thu Dec 1 18:55:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] troubleshooting network In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051202005325.48637.qmail@web35912.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I guess my question is why are you searching the archives for the answer to something you do not have, there are plenty of people, not as many as in the past, but enough that can answer questions posted. The archives have been "un-searchable" for a long time if my memory serves me right and the list/software is maintained for FREE by a local company and I would guess that updating/fixing the software or the sig. is not top priority. If you are that concerned with helping somone and you do not have the answer, let someone else respond or go to the IRC #linux (and yes I have not been on that channel since '99, but when you ask a stupid question you get booted) and get the answer and learn the hard way by doing exactly what you did. Scot Jenkins wrote: On 12/1/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > On 12/1/05, Jim Louis wrote: > > I was unable to research the email archives to see > > what it held for this question. Anyone else notice a > > problem with the search function of mn-linux.org? > > I think the preferred search method is to use gmane: > > http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.user-groups.linux.tclug > cool! I wasn't aware that existed. Could some with appropriate access on the tclug.org webserver add this link? It might also be useful in the mailing list signature that is appended to every post. scot _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051201/acd90ef2/attachment.htm From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com Fri Dec 2 20:00:18 2005 From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock) Date: Fri Dec 2 20:01:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping Message-ID: Hello I'm new to the group/list/state/country, having moved to Minneapolis from Kuwait last night. I'm Canadian and my wife's a local here, and I'll be wanting to build a computer soon. Apart from your Best Buy/Dell/etc, do you have any independant computer sales companies, or wholesale parts or just your preferred places for hardware shopping in and around the twin cities? I'm in Lakeville, down south a bit. Thanks in advance, and God bless -jordan From kc0iog at gmail.com Fri Dec 2 20:16:21 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Fri Dec 2 20:17:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2c6699da0512021816o1c9ff811n6dc752f11adbc310@mail.gmail.com> On 12/2/05, Jordan Peacock wrote: > I'm new to the group/list/state/country, having moved to Minneapolis > from Kuwait last night. There's a statement I don't hear every day. Welcome! > I'm Canadian and my wife's a local here, and > I'll be wanting to build a computer soon. Apart from your Best > Buy/Dell/etc, do you have any independant computer sales companies, or > wholesale parts or just your preferred places for hardware shopping in > and around the twin cities? Tran Micro and General Nanosystems are good places to start. Both are located on University Ave in St. Paul. If you need a wider selection, Microcenter over in St. Louis Park has just about everything. There's plenty of mom and pop shops around, but those are the biggies. -Brian From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Fri Dec 2 21:27:47 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Fri Dec 2 21:29:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <2c6699da0512021816o1c9ff811n6dc752f11adbc310@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da0512021816o1c9ff811n6dc752f11adbc310@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 2 Dec 2005, Brian Wall wrote: > Tran Micro and General Nanosystems are good places to start. Both are > located on University Ave in St. Paul. If you need a wider selection, > Microcenter over in St. Louis Park has just about everything. There's > plenty of mom and pop shops around, but those are the biggies. I'll second General Nanosystems. I guess they are really in Minneapolis, but it is near St. Paul: General Nanosystems Inc 3014 University Ave Se, Minneapolis, MN (612) 331-3690 http://www.nanosys1.com/ I have no affiliation with them, but I spent about $2000 last summer on a bunch of different things and I liked their prices. Some of the guys know a lot and some of them don't know so much, so check what they tell you if it seems questionable. I liked the used monitors I bought here: Midwest Surplus & Electronics 124 12th Ave S, Minneapolis, MN (612) 339-9533 Sometimes I buy miscellaneous items, maybe DVD-Rs or a keyboard, or something I can't get elsewhere at that moment at CompUSA - Roseville 2480 Fairview Ave N, Roseville, MN (651) 635-4098 Mike From kfuchs at winternet.com Sat Dec 3 02:11:01 2005 From: kfuchs at winternet.com (Ken Fuchs) Date: Sat Dec 3 02:13:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: (message from Jordan Peacock on Sat, 3 Dec 2005 05:00:18 +0300) References: Message-ID: <200512030811.jB38B1Y17715@ecstasy1.winternet.com> jordan wrote: >I'm new to the group/list/state/country, having moved to Minneapolis >from Kuwait last night. I'm Canadian and my wife's a local here, and >I'll be wanting to build a computer soon. Apart from your Best >Buy/Dell/etc, do you have any independant computer sales companies, or >wholesale parts or just your preferred places for hardware shopping in >and around the twin cities? I'm in Lakeville, down south a bit. For new x86 or AMD64, I prefer to buy all components on-line from one reseller. I think Monarch Computers is a very Linux friendly place to buy parts and they will assemble the machine for a modest price as well. For new machines at local shops, some people like General Nanosystems (http://www.nanosys1.com/) in Minneapolis, but I prefer Tran Micro (http://www.tranmicro.com/) which is just a bit west of General Nano on University Ave. For used machines, including Macs, I prefer Que Computers in Minneapolis (http://www.quecomputers.com/). They moved recently and haven't been to their new store at 26th Ave S & 26st St E. Midwest Surplus & Elect. http://twincities.citysearch.com/profile/5589359/minneapolis_mn/midwest_surplus_electronics.html has nice machines sometimes as well. The Box Shop http://twincities.citysearch.com/profile/36338454/st_paul_mn/box_shop_dirt_cheap_computers.html in St. Paul has some very good deals on used computers, but they seemed to have mostly Compaqs which I'm not interested in at all. They do have the occasional somewhat rare part though. Materials Processing Corporation (http://www.materialsprocessing.com/surplus.html) in Eagan has something of everything, but I haven't been there in years and they are now only open Thu & Fri 11-5. That should keep ya busy! Sincerely, Ken Fuchs From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 02:27:01 2005 From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock) Date: Sat Dec 3 02:27:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <200512030811.jB38B1Y17715@ecstasy1.winternet.com> References: <200512030811.jB38B1Y17715@ecstasy1.winternet.com> Message-ID: Wow, thanks. I'll start checking things out from there than. Thanks a lot for the leads - it's easy to find stores and companies, but it's harder to gauge customer experiences. I'll give them a look. Thank you -jordan From jus at krytosvirus.com Sat Dec 3 13:39:43 2005 From: jus at krytosvirus.com (Justin Krejci) Date: Sat Dec 3 13:41:29 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <10829409.1133580710594.JavaMail.root@sniper12> References: <2c6699da0512021816o1c9ff811n6dc752f11adbc310@mail.gmail.com> <10829409.1133580710594.JavaMail.root@sniper12> Message-ID: <200512031339.44699.jus@krytosvirus.com> On Friday 02 December 2005 09:27 pm, Mike Miller wrote: > On Fri, 2 Dec 2005, Brian Wall wrote: > > Tran Micro and General Nanosystems are good places to start. Both are > > located on University Ave in St. Paul. If you need a wider selection, > > Microcenter over in St. Louis Park has just about everything. There's > > plenty of mom and pop shops around, but those are the biggies. > > I'll second General Nanosystems. I guess they are really in Minneapolis, > but it is near St. Paul: > > General Nanosystems Inc > 3014 University Ave Se, Minneapolis, MN > (612) 331-3690 > http://www.nanosys1.com/ > > I have no affiliation with them, but I spent about $2000 last summer on a > bunch of different things and I liked their prices. Some of the guys know > a lot and some of them don't know so much, so check what they tell you if > it seems questionable. > My personal experience tells me to never ever buy another part from General Nano ever again. Multiple issues with parts and personnel at the store and asshole attitudes. Tran Micro is awesome but they dont carry older stuff... mostly just newer stuff. Too bad they are moving away soon (to Boston I believe). There is the Box Shop on University (in St. Paul) near Snelling Ave. They are a used parts junkie store. From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Sat Dec 3 15:45:49 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (Dave Alanis) Date: Sat Dec 3 15:47:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation Message-ID: <2005120321454984cd29b7e9@mail.smumn.edu> I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may help? I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. Thank you, Dave Why does the Air Force need expensive new bombers? Have the people we've been bombing over the years been complaining? -George Wallace "Cuanta estupidez en tan poco cerebro!" From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 18:09:16 2005 From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock) Date: Sat Dec 3 18:09:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation In-Reply-To: <2005120321454984cd29b7e9@mail.smumn.edu> References: <2005120321454984cd29b7e9@mail.smumn.edu> Message-ID: First thing that comes to mind is layered images (a la Photoshop or GIMP). Create each layer separately, and export one at a time, and you can add them up however you want, import into a presentation, whatever. I have no CAD experience, so I can't compare with that, it may make more sense to use it. Hope that helps a little. God bless -jordan On 12/3/05, Dave Alanis wrote: > I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may help? > > I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. > > > Thank you, > > Dave > > > Why does the Air Force need expensive new bombers? Have the people we've been bombing over the years been complaining? -George Wallace > > "Cuanta estupidez en tan poco cerebro!" > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From jkjones at tcq.net Sat Dec 3 20:03:46 2005 From: jkjones at tcq.net (Kraig Jones) Date: Sat Dec 3 20:05:30 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation In-Reply-To: <2005120321454984cd29b7e9@mail.smumn.edu> References: <2005120321454984cd29b7e9@mail.smumn.edu> Message-ID: <43924E82.1040604@tcq.net> Dave Alanis wrote: >I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may help? > >I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. > > >Thank you, > >Dave > > > Hi Dave, Since you asked on the TC-LUG list, I assume you're looking for Linux and open-source software? You mention Visio and Powerpoint -- you may be interested in OpenOffice (www.openoffice.org). OpenOffice.org's "Impress" is a presentation program like Powerpoint. You could use it to put together a slide presentation. You can add the graphics for your slides with the few simple drawing tools in Impress. And you can use the OpenOffice "Draw" for more powerful tools and special effects. For photographic images, and layered images, you could use The GIMP, an image manipulation program. It's a little harder to learn than OpenOffice's drawing program, but it's powerful and has tools for lots of special effects. If you're making your own graphics by drawing, there's Inkscape (www.inkscape.org). It's a lot like the OpenOffice Draw, but maybe a little easier to use for some kinds of drawings. If you're really ambitious, there are programs like Blender (www.blender3d.org). With Blender, you can make realistic, animated 3-D graphics. But it has quite a steep learning curve -- not recommended if your project is due Monday. Kraig From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 4 00:20:46 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Sun Dec 4 00:21:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051204062046.69344.qmail@web35905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Right there in Lakeville is Alex Pc Tech, www.alexpctech.com, not the most competitive in price, but way better than Best Buy and the other monsters. Small shop, somewhat knowledgeable. Jordan Peacock wrote: Wow, thanks. I'll start checking things out from there than. Thanks a lot for the leads - it's easy to find stores and companies, but it's harder to gauge customer experiences. I'll give them a look. Thank you -jordan _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051203/f5306844/attachment.htm From jimdscott at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 10:07:21 2005 From: jimdscott at gmail.com (jim scott) Date: Sun Dec 4 10:07:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <20051204062046.69344.qmail@web35905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051204062046.69344.qmail@web35905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Alex PC Tech just expanded quite a bit, too. They took over the office space next door. On 12/5/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > Right there in Lakeville is Alex Pc Tech, www.alexpctech.com, not the most > competitive in price, but way better than Best Buy and the other monsters. > Small shop, somewhat knowledgeable. > > *Jordan Peacock * wrote: > > Wow, thanks. I'll start checking things out from there than. Thanks a > lot for the leads - it's easy to find stores and companies, but it's > harder to gauge customer experiences. I'll give them a look. Thank you > > -jordan > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > ------------------------------ > Yahoo! DSLSomething to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > -- http://ThreeWayNews.blogspot.com Your source. For everything. Really. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051205/54e8ff0a/attachment-0001.htm From srcfoo at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 11:43:34 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Sun Dec 4 11:48:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: References: <20051204062046.69344.qmail@web35905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <579c6fd30512040943i154407b0y8c13017a65bab96a@mail.gmail.com> I also have had a bad experience with General Nano... I bought a part on their website and went through the entire purchase and had a receipt. A couple of days later I received a call and was told that the item was priced wrong on the website and that I would have to place my order again at the now significantly higher price. That little bit of dishonest business was enough for me to never step foot in their store again. On 12/4/05, jim scott wrote: > > Alex PC Tech just expanded quite a bit, too. They took over the office > space next door. > > On 12/5/05, Erick Stohr < evisuale007@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > Right there in Lakeville is Alex Pc Tech, www.alexpctech.com, not the > > most competitive in price, but way better than Best Buy and the other > > monsters. Small shop, somewhat knowledgeable. > > > > *Jordan Peacock < hewhocutsdown@gmail.com>* wrote: > > > > Wow, thanks. I'll start checking things out from there than. Thanks a > > lot for the leads - it's easy to find stores and companies, but it's > > harder to gauge customer experiences. I'll give them a look. Thank you > > > > -jordan > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Yahoo! DSLSomething to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > > > -- > http://ThreeWayNews.blogspot.com > Your source. For everything. Really. > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051204/570fae7b/attachment.htm From jwreese0 at comcast.net Sun Dec 4 12:48:00 2005 From: jwreese0 at comcast.net (John Reese) Date: Sun Dec 4 12:49:31 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Hardware shopping Message-ID: <1133722080.5067.17.camel@jupiter.lowbrau.net> I'd recommend: Que Computers 2323 Hennepin Av E Minneapolis The store is cramped but well-organized, computers have a short warranty, and their call-up support staff is efficient and knowledgable. I have also shopped at The Box Shop near University and Fairview. Larger shop, a little less organized. I have had very good experiences shopping at both. For legacy hardware and aftermarket parts they're on par. For deals on boxes you'll find big differences between them, and it will vary quite a bit from month to month. I'm only a customer -- I have no other relationship with either company. John Reese From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 4 17:42:58 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Sun Dec 4 17:43:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation In-Reply-To: <43924E82.1040604@tcq.net> Message-ID: <20051204234258.87492.qmail@web35902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Are you running Linux? I would assume you are because like Kraig said you posted this to the TCLUG, which is a Linux list, not a Windows OT recommendation list. I believe Kraig covered the topic well, OpenOffice is a good option for a slide show type presentation, although somewhat resource intensive on your system, once up and running can do pretty much along with The GIMP what you are looking for. If you check out Freshmeat I remember seeing an interface implemented much like Adobe PhotoShop, or more like it if you are not comfortable with The GIMP straight up. Kraig Jones wrote: Dave Alanis wrote: >I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may help? > >I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. > > >Thank you, > >Dave > > > Hi Dave, Since you asked on the TC-LUG list, I assume you're looking for Linux and open-source software? You mention Visio and Powerpoint -- you may be interested in OpenOffice (www.openoffice.org). OpenOffice.org's "Impress" is a presentation program like Powerpoint. You could use it to put together a slide presentation. You can add the graphics for your slides with the few simple drawing tools in Impress. And you can use the OpenOffice "Draw" for more powerful tools and special effects. For photographic images, and layered images, you could use The GIMP, an image manipulation program. It's a little harder to learn than OpenOffice's drawing program, but it's powerful and has tools for lots of special effects. If you're making your own graphics by drawing, there's Inkscape (www.inkscape.org). It's a lot like the OpenOffice Draw, but maybe a little easier to use for some kinds of drawings. If you're really ambitious, there are programs like Blender (www.blender3d.org). With Blender, you can make realistic, animated 3-D graphics. But it has quite a steep learning curve -- not recommended if your project is due Monday. Kraig _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051204/0dc2c388/attachment.htm From donatella.debian at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 21:10:48 2005 From: donatella.debian at gmail.com (Donatella) Date: Sun Dec 4 21:11:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: OT: Software recommendation (Tatiana Canales) Message-ID: <4b2d92c20512041910u4cdec48fl1df399816ad808bd@mail.gmail.com> > > I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual > image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of > imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The > first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some > type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with > this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may > help? > > I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. > > > Thank you, > > Dave If you are looking to do something like M$ Project, I would recommend Gant Project.... http://ganttproject.sourceforge.net/ which does the same things that the M$ soft. Good luck! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051204/dc533913/attachment.htm From cschumann at twp-llc.com Mon Dec 5 09:30:49 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Mon Dec 5 09:31:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <200512041808.jB4I81HE019353@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200512041808.jB4I81HE019353@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <47045.192.28.2.52.1133796649.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 11:43:34 -0600 > From: EP > I also have had a bad experience with General Nano... > > I bought a part on their website and went through the entire purchase > and had a receipt. A couple of days later I received a call and was > told that the item was priced wrong on the website and that I would have > to place my order again at the now significantly higher price. > > That little bit of dishonest business was enough for me to never step > foot in their store again. Of course, it simply could not have happened that a small local business actually made a slip-up and put the wrong price on their site, so they have to be a pack of crooks. I'm no shill, and I don't shop there much, but to me, local shops are leaps and bounds over any Best Buy any day, and I give them my business when I have some to give. Except of course for the local parts shop by my home. :) (The owner said the 50-ft Cat5 cable was good because his continuity tester showed it was. Never mind that it was slow as molasses and he couldn't test its performance, and he wouldn't take a return because he cut it to length from bulk.) Chris From SDALAN04 at smumn.edu Mon Dec 5 10:45:30 2005 From: SDALAN04 at smumn.edu (Dave Alanis) Date: Mon Dec 5 10:45:33 2005 Subject: cc: Re: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation Message-ID: <2005120516453079cd2a0fa4@mail.smumn.edu> Thank you all for your great suggestions. I mentioned MS due to the fact that this is what I would have available for my project through school. On the other hand, I am running Gentoo on my home system, yet, I don't have any experience with the tools recommended. I am looking forward working with Gimp. I do have another small question, do these tools (GIMP etc..) interact with any Windows based programs (alike OpenOffice)? Dave On Sunday, December 04, 2005 5:42 PM, Erick Stohr wrote: > >Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 15:42:58 -0800 (PST) >From: Erick Stohr >To: Kraig Jones , tclug-list@mn-linux.org >Subject: Re: [tclug-list] OT: Software recommendation > >Are you running Linux? I would assume you are because like Kraig said you posted this to the TCLUG, which is a Linux list, not a Windows OT recommendation list. I believe Kraig covered the topic well, OpenOffice is a good option for a slide show type presentation, although somewhat resource intensive on your system, once up and running can do pretty much along with The GIMP what you are looking for. If you check out Freshmeat I remember seeing an interface implemented much like Adobe PhotoShop, or more like it if you are not comfortable with The GIMP straight up. > >Kraig Jones wrote: Dave Alanis wrote: > >>I am involved in a school project that it will involve creating a virtual image (or projection). It will involve having several layers or pieces of imagery. It will actually be putting together a data-center structure. The first thing that comes to mind is utilizing (MS Project and or VISIO) some type of autocad program, even Powerpoint. I don't have much experience with this type of software, is there any recommendations out there, that may help? >> >>I would like to make a presentation as realistic as possible. >> >> >>Thank you, >> >>Dave >> >> >> >Hi Dave, > >Since you asked on the TC-LUG list, I assume you're looking for Linux >and open-source software? You mention Visio and Powerpoint -- you may >be interested in OpenOffice (www.openoffice.org). OpenOffice.org's >"Impress" is a presentation program like Powerpoint. You could use it >to put together a slide presentation. You can add the graphics for your >slides with the few simple drawing tools in Impress. And you can use >the OpenOffice "Draw" for more powerful tools and special effects. > >For photographic images, and layered images, you could use The GIMP, an >image manipulation program. It's a little harder to learn than >OpenOffice's drawing program, but it's powerful and has tools for lots >of special effects. > >If you're making your own graphics by drawing, there's Inkscape >(www.inkscape.org). It's a lot like the OpenOffice Draw, but maybe a >little easier to use for some kinds of drawings. > >If you're really ambitious, there are programs like Blender >(www.blender3d.org). With Blender, you can make realistic, animated 3-D >graphics. But it has quite a steep learning curve -- not recommended if >your project is due Monday. > >Kraig > > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > >--------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals Why does the Air Force need expensive new bombers? Have the people we've been bombing over the years been complaining? -George Wallace "Cuanta estupidez en tan poco cerebro!" From john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 11:07:59 2005 From: john.t.hoffoss at gmail.com (John T. Hoffoss) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:09:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <47045.192.28.2.52.1133796649.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200512041808.jB4I81HE019353@delta.twp-llc.com> <47045.192.28.2.52.1133796649.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <914f813c0512050907q3b1a0ed5sa7546ffc612d6b14@mail.gmail.com> On 12/5/05, Chris Schumann wrote: > > > > Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 11:43:34 -0600 > > From: EP > > I also have had a bad experience with General Nano... > > > > Of course, it simply could not have happened that a small local business > actually made a slip-up and put the wrong price on their site, so they > have to be a pack of crooks. Pretty much anyone I've ever talked to who has shopped there indicated GNS is very inconsistent in terms of customer service. Certain guys there are great, helpful, knowledgable. Other guys I've encountered there have an elitist attitude and challenge everything you say...I don't care who you are, if I come in with a parts list with specifics that total $2300 for one system, don't tell me I don't need that much RAM, or that I couldn't possibly use that much hard drive space, just STFU and get my parts. After spending over $4K there this summer, and dealing with a wide variety of their techs, I've decided I'm through with `em. But as with any business performance, YMMV. From donatella.debian at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 13:12:37 2005 From: donatella.debian at gmail.com (Donatella) Date: Mon Dec 5 13:13:32 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Software recommendation Message-ID: <4b2d92c20512051112q20eae0c0n8be7a45c169f75c4@mail.gmail.com> Dave, although it's not necessary to have proprietary compatibility to be a good piece of soft, the programs that we have all suggested have a great deal of shared formats for you to work between Win and Linux the gimp handles: File formats supported include bmp, gif, jpeg, mng, pcx, pdf, png, ps, psd, svg, tiff, tga, xpm, and many others Load, display, convert, save to many file formats SVG path import/export OpenOffice Handles it's own format, plus .doc, .xls, .ppt and all the other M$ formats, in most of their versions. I personally use OOo in windows and linux and the only problem that I'm aware of it's with the formulas written in OOo, which don't appear correctly on M$ (although the formulas written in M$ are read by OOo). Generally speaking, most of the GPL soft would have at least one kind of output that is universal in it's final form. I can't guarantee that you could work a little bit on GPL, change to proprietary and then come back again to GPL with 100% compatibility, but you could always have a product that would be readable in a platform-independent format. Greetings -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051205/00854a20/attachment.htm From bwilinski at iexposure.com Mon Dec 5 15:21:33 2005 From: bwilinski at iexposure.com (Ben Wilinski) Date: Mon Dec 5 15:23:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] e1000 not loading properly? Message-ID: <200512051521.33300.bwilinski@iexposure.com> I'm having trouble getting an intelPro1000 gt to work on Debian 3.0. So far I've done: modprobe e1000 Which gives me this in dmesg: e1000: Ignoring new-style parameters in presence of obsolete ones Intel(R) PRO/1000 Network Driver - version 5.2.52-k4 Copyright (c) 1999-2004 Intel Corporation. and that looks good, but when I added the interface in /etc/network/interfaces as eth2 and run ifup eth2 I get this: SIOCSIFADDR: No such device eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device SIOCSIFBRDADDR: No such device eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device any help is appreciated. Ben -- From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Dec 5 15:40:58 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Dec 5 15:41:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: <914f813c0512050907q3b1a0ed5sa7546ffc612d6b14@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512041808.jB4I81HE019353@delta.twp-llc.com> <47045.192.28.2.52.1133796649.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <914f813c0512050907q3b1a0ed5sa7546ffc612d6b14@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 5 Dec 2005, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > Pretty much anyone I've ever talked to who has shopped there indicated > GNS is very inconsistent in terms of customer service. Certain guys > there are great, helpful, knowledgable. Other guys I've encountered > there have an elitist attitude and challenge everything you say... I agree with this. One guy told me several things that were not true. He was inexperienced and would have done better by admitting that he didn't know. He was a nice guy though. A second guy had such a snobby, superior and unfriendly attitude that I wanted to report him to his supervisor. But he might have had his facts straight. A third guy was very helpful and actually managed to find a very clever and sneaky way to get me a driver that worked for a wireless card under XP x64. He had to work to dig that up and I really appreciated his effort. So, as John said, YMMV. But, if you want good prices, I would say that GNS has good prices for a local shop. I don't know if others are cheaper. How does Tran Micro compare? It would be easy to make a comparison because Tran is almost nextdoor. I have the impression that GNS has more in stock than Tran does. Mike From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 16:19:59 2005 From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock) Date: Mon Dec 5 16:21:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Hardware shopping In-Reply-To: References: <200512041808.jB4I81HE019353@delta.twp-llc.com> <47045.192.28.2.52.1133796649.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <914f813c0512050907q3b1a0ed5sa7546ffc612d6b14@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah, I've been looking up stuff online, and went to Alex PC this morning, and get the general idea that GNS has the variety of parts (and some good deals), but I'll probably do the bulk of my purchases through Alex and supplement them with Tran or GNS. Thanks for everyone who's written in with their suggestions, experiences and aids. God bless -jordan On 12/5/05, Mike Miller wrote: > On Mon, 5 Dec 2005, John T. Hoffoss wrote: > > > Pretty much anyone I've ever talked to who has shopped there indicated > > GNS is very inconsistent in terms of customer service. Certain guys > > there are great, helpful, knowledgable. Other guys I've encountered > > there have an elitist attitude and challenge everything you say... > > I agree with this. One guy told me several things that were not true. > He was inexperienced and would have done better by admitting that he > didn't know. He was a nice guy though. A second guy had such a snobby, > superior and unfriendly attitude that I wanted to report him to his > supervisor. But he might have had his facts straight. A third guy was > very helpful and actually managed to find a very clever and sneaky way to > get me a driver that worked for a wireless card under XP x64. He had to > work to dig that up and I really appreciated his effort. > > So, as John said, YMMV. > > But, if you want good prices, I would say that GNS has good prices for a > local shop. I don't know if others are cheaper. How does Tran Micro > compare? It would be easy to make a comparison because Tran is almost > nextdoor. I have the impression that GNS has more in stock than Tran > does. > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Dec 6 07:46:41 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Dec 6 07:49:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk Message-ID: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> Is anybody on the list (Nate?) terminating Vonage on an Asterisk box? According to what I see on the web it is doable, curious to see if it works well or is more of a hassle than it is worth. Josh From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Dec 6 07:54:38 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Dec 6 07:55:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk In-Reply-To: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> References: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 6 Dec 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Is anybody on the list (Nate?) terminating Vonage on an Asterisk box? > According to what I see on the web it is doable, curious to see if it > works well or is more of a hassle than it is worth. With Vonage, you have to plug an analog card into your Asterisk box, and plug the ATA into that - lame. Better to get a DID from a VoIP provider with local numbers (txlink.net for "volume" accounts with a $50/mo min; otherwise Junction Networks has reasonable pay-as-you-go rates). That way you can configure all the features you want on your Asterisk box, too, instead of using Vonage's features. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From josh at joshwelch.com Tue Dec 6 07:59:32 2005 From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:03:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk In-Reply-To: References: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <43959944.8090406@joshwelch.com> Nate Carlson wrote: > > With Vonage, you have to plug an analog card into your Asterisk box, and > plug the ATA into that - lame. > > Better to get a DID from a VoIP provider with local numbers (txlink.net > for "volume" accounts with a $50/mo min; otherwise Junction Networks has > reasonable pay-as-you-go rates). That way you can configure all the > features you want on your Asterisk box, too, instead of using Vonage's > features. > Hmm, bummer. I saw a blurb out on the net that seems to allege you can do a SIP connection to Vonage from Asterisk. Must have been off base. From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Dec 6 08:38:21 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:39:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk In-Reply-To: <43959944.8090406@joshwelch.com> References: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> <43959944.8090406@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 6 Dec 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > Hmm, bummer. I saw a blurb out on the net that seems to allege you can > do a SIP connection to Vonage from Asterisk. Must have been off base. Well, it's theoretically possible with their soft-phone service, but you need an additional ATA-based service from them to be able to get the soft-phone service. I wasn't ever able to get two-way calling working on the soft-phone service, either. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From slushpupie at gmail.com Tue Dec 6 08:52:14 2005 From: slushpupie at gmail.com (slushpupie@gmail.com) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:53:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] e1000 not loading properly? In-Reply-To: <200512051521.33300.bwilinski@iexposure.com> References: <200512051521.33300.bwilinski@iexposure.com> Message-ID: On 12/5/05, Ben Wilinski wrote: > I'm having trouble getting an intelPro1000 gt to work on Debian > 3.0. > > So far I've done: > > modprobe e1000 > Which gives me this in dmesg: > e1000: Ignoring new-style parameters in presence of obsolete ones > Intel(R) PRO/1000 Network Driver - version 5.2.52-k4 > Copyright (c) 1999-2004 Intel Corporation. Right about here it should tell you what interfaces it found, like this: e1000: eth0 NIC Link is Up 1000 Mbps Full Duplex It might be later on, if the cable is not plugged in, but somewhere it should tell you that. > and that looks good, but when I added the interface > in /etc/network/interfaces as eth2 and run ifup eth2 I get this: > > SIOCSIFADDR: No such device > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device > SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device > SIOCSIFBRDADDR: No such device > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device Are you sure this is eth2? Does 'ifconfig -a' show eth0 eth1 and eth2? Also, I ran into a problem where Dell packaged intel cards had the wrong PCI id's (they were Dell branded) and thus the modules never worked. I needed to add the PCI ids into the source and recompile the module. Not hard, but kind of frustrating. You might double check that too. Jay -- Jay Kline http://www.slushpupie.com/ From cykyc at yahoo.com Sun Dec 4 14:45:56 2005 From: cykyc at yahoo.com (Jon Passki) Date: Tue Dec 6 09:31:56 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Free items on Craigs List I'm posting Message-ID: <20051204204556.92869.qmail@web50313.mail.yahoo.com> Free Stuff Yah! Viewsonic 19" Monitor: http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/zip/115730569.html I'll be posting a couple more free items (SPARCStations 2-5, old x86's, HDD's, etc) once the HDD's have been DBAN'd. Preference given to TC*UGs versus Craigs list. All pickups, by appointment (duh). I live in So. Mpls btw [1]. Jon [1] whois caffsys.com | grep owner-address __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From bhurt at spnz.org Tue Dec 6 09:54:31 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Tue Dec 6 09:49:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Free items on Craigs List I'm posting In-Reply-To: <20051204204556.92869.qmail@web50313.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051204204556.92869.qmail@web50313.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I'll take that monitor, if it's still available. When/where can I pick it up? On Sun, 4 Dec 2005, Jon Passki wrote: > Free Stuff Yah! > > Viewsonic 19" Monitor: > http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/zip/115730569.html > > I'll be posting a couple more free items (SPARCStations 2-5, old > x86's, HDD's, etc) once the HDD's have been DBAN'd. Preference > given to TC*UGs versus Craigs list. All pickups, by appointment > (duh). I live in So. Mpls btw [1]. > > Jon > > > [1] whois caffsys.com | grep owner-address > > > > __________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From bhurt at spnz.org Tue Dec 6 10:07:58 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Tue Dec 6 10:03:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Free items on Craigs List I'm posting In-Reply-To: References: <20051204204556.92869.qmail@web50313.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Ugh- I need to watch my reply-alls. Apologies. Brian On Tue, 6 Dec 2005, Brian Hurt wrote: > > I'll take that monitor, if it's still available. When/where can I pick it > up? > > On Sun, 4 Dec 2005, Jon Passki wrote: > >> Free Stuff Yah! >> >> Viewsonic 19" Monitor: >> http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/zip/115730569.html >> >> I'll be posting a couple more free items (SPARCStations 2-5, old >> x86's, HDD's, etc) once the HDD's have been DBAN'd. Preference >> given to TC*UGs versus Craigs list. All pickups, by appointment >> (duh). I live in So. Mpls btw [1]. >> >> Jon >> >> >> [1] whois caffsys.com | grep owner-address >> >> >> >> __________________________________ >> Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! >> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From scheides at iexposure.com Tue Dec 6 15:20:47 2005 From: scheides at iexposure.com (Chris Scheidecker) Date: Tue Dec 6 15:21:34 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk In-Reply-To: References: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> <43959944.8090406@joshwelch.com> Message-ID: <200512061520.47713.scheides@iexposure.com> On Tuesday 06 December 2005 08:38 am, Nate Carlson wrote: > On Tue, 6 Dec 2005, Josh Welch wrote: > > Hmm, bummer. I saw a blurb out on the net that seems to allege you can > > do a SIP connection to Vonage from Asterisk. Must have been off base. > > Well, it's theoretically possible with their soft-phone service, but you > need an additional ATA-based service from them to be able to get the > soft-phone service. I wasn't ever able to get two-way calling working on > the soft-phone service, either. Some have reported that they had success with the softphone service. I have had no luck getting it to work. I could authenticate correctly, but never got calling to actually work. I am now using Voice Pulse's Connect service (connect.voicepulse.com) for IAX2 trunking and it works well! -- Chris Scheidecker Associate Systems Administrator cscheidecker@iexposure.com Internet Exposure, Inc. http://www.iexposure.com 612.676.1946 x33 Web Development-Web Marketing-ISP Services ------------------------------------------ From tclug at natecarlson.com Tue Dec 6 16:13:22 2005 From: tclug at natecarlson.com (Nate Carlson) Date: Tue Dec 6 16:15:33 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Asterisk In-Reply-To: <200512061520.47713.scheides@iexposure.com> References: <43959641.6070701@joshwelch.com> <43959944.8090406@joshwelch.com> <200512061520.47713.scheides@iexposure.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 6 Dec 2005, Chris Scheidecker wrote: > Some have reported that they had success with the softphone service. I > have had no luck getting it to work. I could authenticate correctly, > but never got calling to actually work. I am now using Voice Pulse's > Connect service (connect.voicepulse.com) for IAX2 trunking and it works > well! Junction Networks is also very good. Pay-as-you-go, besides a $2/mo charge per DID. I'd like to get an account with TxLink at some point, but they have a $100/mo minimum - not sure if I'll get there.. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | nate carlson | natecars@natecarlson.com | http://www.natecarlson.com | | depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981 | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From swaite at sbn-services.com Wed Dec 7 12:01:53 2005 From: swaite at sbn-services.com (Sean Waite) Date: Wed Dec 7 12:05:36 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Cisco ACNS (Linux) and other uses Message-ID: Has anyone worked with Cisco ACNS devices, specifically versions of ACNS 5+ that had Samba? I have some CE-560s that I upgraded the software to the latest build, some time back, and noticed in a post on Cisco.com discussion board a topic on Samba. I looked a little further in the CE device and sure enough Samba was installed. But in the brief time I had looking in to this it seemed that all I could share was the cache of a FQDN site. I found this out after trying to create a basic Samba share failed. Since that time I have had numerous other projects to deal with and have just not had the time to mess with this anymore. It has been a few months so I am sure a newer version of ACNS is available. What I am curious to know is it possible to get just a basic directory shared on an ACNS? The one I have available I do not intend at all to use as any type of content or proxy. Any other uses that people have found for these? I figured since they do have Linux installed someone must have been a bit curious to see how much they could be altered for other uses. Sean Waite SBN Services 314 Clifton Avenue, Suite C201 Minneapolis, MN 55403 Office: (612) 871-8774 Mobile: (612) 669-8858 From bwilinski at iexposure.com Wed Dec 7 16:33:41 2005 From: bwilinski at iexposure.com (Ben Wilinski) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:35:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] e1000 not loading properly? In-Reply-To: References: <200512051521.33300.bwilinski@iexposure.com> Message-ID: <200512071633.41859.bwilinski@iexposure.com> Thanks, Jay. I think we're going just try another nic, however. Peace, B On Tuesday 06 December 2005 08:52 am, slushpupie@gmail.com wrote: > On 12/5/05, Ben Wilinski wrote: > > I'm having trouble getting an intelPro1000 gt to work on > > Debian 3.0. > > > > So far I've done: > > > > modprobe e1000 > > Which gives me this in dmesg: > > e1000: Ignoring new-style parameters in presence of obsolete > > ones Intel(R) PRO/1000 Network Driver - version 5.2.52-k4 > > Copyright (c) 1999-2004 Intel Corporation. > > Right about here it should tell you what interfaces it found, > like this: > > e1000: eth0 NIC Link is Up 1000 Mbps Full Duplex > > It might be later on, if the cable is not plugged in, but > somewhere it should tell you that. > > > and that looks good, but when I added the interface > > in /etc/network/interfaces as eth2 and run ifup eth2 I get > > this: > > > > SIOCSIFADDR: No such device > > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device > > SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device > > SIOCSIFBRDADDR: No such device > > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device > > eth2: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device > > Are you sure this is eth2? Does 'ifconfig -a' show eth0 eth1 > and eth2? Also, I ran into a problem where Dell packaged > intel cards had the wrong PCI id's (they were Dell branded) > and thus the modules never worked. I needed to add the PCI ids > into the source and recompile the module. Not hard, but kind > of frustrating. You might double check that too. > > Jay > > > -- > Jay Kline > http://www.slushpupie.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Ben Wilinski bwilinski@iexposure.com Internet Exposure, Inc. http://www.iexposure.com 612.676.1946 x34 Web Development | Web Marketing | ISP | Network Services From joey.rockhold at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:00:24 2005 From: joey.rockhold at gmail.com (Joey Rockhold) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:01:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Modulated Linux Message-ID: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long time ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just basics of linux. After that point, I would like to install programs as I need them. For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at that point would I download and install KDE. Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want them. Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any distribution that anyone thinks would be better at this also. Thanks. - Joey -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051207/25ac458c/attachment.htm From scotjenkins at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:16:00 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:17:35 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> References: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/7/05, Joey Rockhold wrote: > I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long time > ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just basics of > linux. After that point, I would like to install programs as I need them. > For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at that point would I > download and install KDE. > > Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora > Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want them. > Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any distribution > that anyone thinks would be better at this also. Slackware is a pretty minimalist type of distro and doesn't provide too much in the way of "I'll configure everything for you so you don't have to edit config files" mentality. http://www.slackware.com/ Or if you really want to learn how it all goes together, you could build your own via LFS (Linux From Scratch): http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/ Scot From john.meier at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:16:13 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:17:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> References: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc0512071516n7e1fabfbq86307d0d8630e5f3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Joey Rockhold wrote: > > > Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora > Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want them. > Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any distribution > that anyone thinks would be better at this also. Have you looked at Gentoo or Debian? Gentoo is a compile from source distro - t takes a bit of compiling time before you're up and running - I learned a lot about linux installing it. Deb is an excellent precompiled distro which will get you going with a basic system - but it's been a while since I've played with it so I can't say much more. Thanks. > - Joey > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051207/0baf8877/attachment.htm From rhubarbpie at poetworld.net Wed Dec 7 20:38:28 2005 From: rhubarbpie at poetworld.net (rhubarbpie@poetworld.net) Date: Wed Dec 7 20:39:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> References: <101e49ea0512071500x2c8afbafpd7d5dccafc61ca0d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43979CA4.2050708@poetworld.net> Joey Rockhold wrote: > I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long > time ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just > basics of linux. After that point, I would like to install programs > as I need them. For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at > that point would I download and install KDE. > > Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat > Fedora Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I > want them. Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to > any distribution that anyone thinks would be better at this also. > > Thanks. > - Joey > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > I'd like to second the Linux From Scratch (linuxfromscratch.org) idea. I'm basically self taught and it did take time, but I run LFS 6.1. LFS is command line and Beyond Linux From Scratch helps you install X and whatever programs you choose. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051207/ac2cb2e4/attachment-0001.htm From cschumann at twp-llc.com Thu Dec 8 09:06:11 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Thu Dec 8 09:07:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <200512080254.jB82sAGt027818@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200512080254.jB82sAGt027818@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <46202.192.28.2.52.1134054371.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 17:00:24 -0600 > From: Joey Rockhold > I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long time > ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just basics > of linux. After that point, I would like to install programs as I need > them. For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at that point would > I download and install KDE. > > Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora > Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want > them. Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any > distribution that anyone thinks would be better at this also. > > Thanks. > - Joey I think it depends on your goals. If you want to learn to *use* Linux (some administration, configuring packages, get work done), then Fedora is a great choice. I've stuck with Red Hat and Fedora for no good reason other than I know them, and they take care of a lot of things for me, so I can get to work. (Also, if I have a problem with Fedora, I can use Google to find a hundred other people who've had the same problem, and five or six who actually bother to write down how they fixed it.) If you want a deeper understanding, or a more generic approach (not so Red-Hat-centric) then you want one of the many other fine distros. I've installed Gentoo, Debian and Slackware, and each has its own strengths... and weaknesses, and it depends on what you want to get out of it and what you want to put into it that will determine your best fit. Chris From jkjones at tcq.net Thu Dec 8 09:26:38 2005 From: jkjones at tcq.net (Kraig Jones) Date: Thu Dec 8 09:27:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <46202.192.28.2.52.1134054371.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200512080254.jB82sAGt027818@delta.twp-llc.com> <46202.192.28.2.52.1134054371.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <439850AE.3030200@tcq.net> Chris Schumann wrote: >>Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 17:00:24 -0600 >>From: Joey Rockhold >> >> > > > >>I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long time >>ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just basics >>of linux. After that point, I would like to install programs as I need >>them. For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at that point would >>I download and install KDE. >> >>Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora >>Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want >>them. Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any >>distribution that anyone thinks would be better at this also. >> >>Thanks. >>- Joey >> >> > >I think it depends on your goals. If you want to learn to *use* Linux >(some administration, configuring packages, get work done), then Fedora is >a great choice. I've stuck with Red Hat and Fedora for no good reason >other than I know them, and they take care of a lot of things for me, so I >can get to work. (Also, if I have a problem with Fedora, I can use Google >to find a hundred other people who've had the same problem, and five or >six who actually bother to write down how they fixed it.) > >If you want a deeper understanding, or a more generic approach (not so >Red-Hat-centric) then you want one of the many other fine distros. > >I've installed Gentoo, Debian and Slackware, and each has its own >strengths... and weaknesses, and it depends on what you want to get out of >it and what you want to put into it that will determine your best fit. > >Chris > > > > Right. How about adding an extra partition, or another disk? One for a working installation, one for tinkering. Kraig From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Dec 8 17:46:04 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:47:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512082346.jB8Nk4N21509@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: HP NetServer 4d/66 LM I have an old server that is looking for new home. I was going to scrap it, but I thought that someone on the list may want it for some something. It has been running as a production server until about 1 month ago. - The server is an HP NetServer 4d/66 LM (Purchased in 1993, yep 12 years old) - Intel 486/66 DX - 180 Megs of ram (I don't know how you get 180, but thats what is says) - Five 2GB hot-swap SCSI drives - One 2GB SCSI drive - Adaptec RAID controller. The drives are currently configured as a RAID 5 array. You must pick-up (Edina area) Seller Email address: jimstreit at northlans dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From admin at lctn.org Fri Dec 9 10:04:39 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Fri Dec 9 10:05:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio Message-ID: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> I need to set up a box for recording and editing 1-2 hour long programs. Once done we need to burn the file to a CD. What program(s) would be best that has a gui and would render the final project quickly? Raymond From rwh at visi.com Fri Dec 9 10:37:26 2005 From: rwh at visi.com (Richard Hoffbeck) Date: Fri Dec 9 10:39:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio In-Reply-To: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> References: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: <4399B2C6.7010808@visi.com> Audacity (http://audacity.sourceforge.net/) does a nice job for basic editing. I think the beta 2.0 version can do more than 2 tracks if your needs are more sophisticated. I use it for cleaning up and editing .mp3 files so my experience is pretty basic. A while back Linux Journal had an issue devoted to audio including an article on setting up a home studio, http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/4814 if your needs are more extensive. --rick Raymond Norton wrote: > I need to set up a box for recording and editing 1-2 hour long programs. > Once done we need to burn the file to a CD. What program(s) would be best > that has a gui and would render the final project quickly? > > > Raymond > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list From srcfoo at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 10:50:54 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Fri Dec 9 10:51:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? Message-ID: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> I've been looking for a good way to handle our company's documentation. I've looked at and used mediawiki, plone, and mambo/joomla but nothing seems to do what I think it needs to do. This is what I need: 1. We sell our own software so we need to be able to publish user manuals. 2. We need to document our own company procedures, policies, etc. 3. We need revision control so if someone wipes out a document we know what we need to fix. 4. We need version control so we know what version of our document our clients or employees are using (Pointing everyone at the web may mitigate this need). 5. We need access control. Obviously everyone should not have access to everything. 6. Easy enough to create/edit/delete/view a document so that our non-technical users and employees can handle it. These are additional features that should be available: 1. Use Word or OpenOffice and import the documents into the document tool 2. Should be able to get a PDF version of the same document on the fly (i.e. I don't want to store two copies of each document) 3. Client access portal so we know who's accessing our documents This seems reasonable to me so maybe I'm looking in the wrong places or maybe I'm too picky. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051209/f2a2beac/attachment.htm From drue at therub.org Fri Dec 9 11:02:35 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:07:22 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051209170235.GE29291@therub.org> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 10:50:54AM -0600, EP wrote: > > I've been looking for a good way to handle our company's > documentation. I've looked at and used mediawiki, plone, and > mambo/joomla but nothing seems to do what I think it needs to do. > This is what I need: > 1. We sell our own software so we need to be able to publish user > manuals. > 2. We need to document our own company procedures, policies, etc. > 3. We need revision control so if someone wipes out a document we know > what we need to fix. > 4. We need version control so we know what version of our document our > clients or employees are using (Pointing everyone at the web may > mitigate this need). > 5. We need access control. Obviously everyone should not have access > to everything. > 6. Easy enough to create/edit/delete/view a document so that our > non-technical users and employees can handle it. > These are additional features that should be available: > 1. Use Word or OpenOffice and import the documents into the document > tool > 2. Should be able to get a PDF version of the same document on the fly > (i.e. I don't want to store two copies of each document) > 3. Client access portal so we know who's accessing our documents > This seems reasonable to me so maybe I'm looking in the wrong places > or maybe I'm too picky. I really like wiki's for this type of thing. I havn't used it yet, but I think dokuwiki may meet your needs. Dan From tclug at freakzilla.com Fri Dec 9 11:49:14 2005 From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:49:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio In-Reply-To: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> References: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: Another vote for Audacity. I've used it to do multitrack recording and editing of live material. On Fri, 9 Dec 2005, Raymond Norton wrote: > I need to set up a box for recording and editing 1-2 hour long programs. > Once done we need to burn the file to a CD. What program(s) would be best > that has a gui and would render the final project quickly? > > > Raymond > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -Yaron -- From erikerik at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 11:59:03 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:59:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio In-Reply-To: References: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: On 12/9/05, Yaron wrote: > Another vote for Audacity. I've used it to do multitrack recording and > editing of live material. Ditto - vote #3 for audacity. -Erik From scotjenkins at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 12:30:54 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:31:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/9/05, EP wrote: > I've been looking for a good way to handle our company's documentation. > I've looked at and used mediawiki, plone, and mambo/joomla but nothing seems > to do what I think it needs to do. > > This is what I need: > 1. We sell our own software so we need to be able to publish user manuals. > 2. We need to document our own company procedures, policies, etc. > 3. We need revision control so if someone wipes out a document we know what > we need to fix. > 4. We need version control so we know what version of our document our > clients or employees are using (Pointing everyone at the web may mitigate > this need). > 5. We need access control. Obviously everyone should not have access to > everything. > 6. Easy enough to create/edit/delete/view a document so that our > non-technical users and employees can handle it. > > These are additional features that should be available: > 1. Use Word or OpenOffice and import the documents into the document tool > 2. Should be able to get a PDF version of the same document on the fly > (i.e. I don't want to store two copies of each document) > 3. Client access portal so we know who's accessing our documents > > This seems reasonable to me so maybe I'm looking in the wrong places or > maybe I'm too picky. Where I'm working, we're using a combination of DocBook [1] and Subversion[2] (for version control). It's a bit of a complicated initial setup but for a larger project with multiple folks creating/editing documentation, I think it's the best route to go. We use XMLmind[3] as an editor (Windows and UNIX versions available) to create the DocBook source. XMLmind really makes creating the XML source easy. The nice part about having a document as docbook source is that you can generate whatever format you need (txt, html, pdf, etc...) [1] http://www.docbook.org/ [2] http://subversion.tigris.org/ [3] http://www.xmlmind.com/xmleditor/ scot From scotjenkins at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 12:35:17 2005 From: scotjenkins at gmail.com (Scot Jenkins) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:35:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio In-Reply-To: References: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: On 12/9/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > On 12/9/05, Yaron wrote: > > Another vote for Audacity. I've used it to do multitrack recording and > > editing of live material. > > Ditto - vote #3 for audacity. > vote #4. Only been using it a few weeks but works great on Linux and Windows. Extremely easy to learn to use. A couple quick tips: 1. You have to select a section of audio before you can apply any of the effects. This wasn't obvious (to me) at first. 2. You'll also want to install the lame library to export files/sections as MP3's. Just google for the library name audacity tells you it wants. scot From florin at iucha.net Fri Dec 9 13:26:44 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Fri Dec 9 13:27:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051209192643.GA17369@iucha.net> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 10:50:54AM -0600, EP wrote: > I've been looking for a good way to handle our company's documentation. > I've looked at and used mediawiki, plone, and mambo/joomla but nothing seems > to do what I think it needs to do. Seach for a "document management" or "product data management" solution. The good ones cost real money, but let us know if you find a free one that meets your needs. Be sure to plan ahead and estimate how much your custom implementation of wiki/subversion/docbook/etc will cost vs. commerical software. florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051209/07c3356c/attachment.pgp From tringer at consumption.net Fri Dec 9 14:30:07 2005 From: tringer at consumption.net (Torleiv Ringer) Date: Fri Dec 9 15:18:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: tclug-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 14 In-Reply-To: <20051209182909.A53159154@heyzeus.consumption.net> References: <20051209182909.A53159154@heyzeus.consumption.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 9 Dec 2005 tclug-list-request@mn-linux.org wrote: > Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 10:04:39 -0600 (CST) > From: Raymond Norton > Subject: [tclug-list] solution for recording and editing audio > To: tclug-list@mn-linux.org > Message-ID: <43300.64.8.148.14.1134144279.squirrel@lctn.org> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 > > I need to set up a box for recording and editing 1-2 hour long programs. > Once done we need to burn the file to a CD. What program(s) would be best > that has a gui and would render the final project quickly? Use gcdmaster. It is a front-end to cdrdao and allows for basic track layouts and editing. You will have to compile cdrdao to get this program, but it's worth it. -- As fast as it ever got, it never got fast enough for me. Hunter S. Thompson From srcfoo at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 15:46:24 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (EP) Date: Fri Dec 9 15:47:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <579c6fd30512091346v122af96at90489d9e130f3800@mail.gmail.com> On 12/9/05, Scot Jenkins wrote: > > Where I'm working, we're using a combination of DocBook [1] and > Subversion[2] (for version control). It's a bit of a complicated > initial setup but for a larger project with multiple folks > creating/editing documentation, I think it's the best route to go. We > use XMLmind[3] as an editor (Windows and UNIX versions available) to > create the DocBook source. XMLmind really makes creating the XML > source easy. The nice part about having a document as docbook source > is that you can generate whatever format you need (txt, html, pdf, > etc...) > > [1] http://www.docbook.org/ > [2] http://subversion.tigris.org/ > [3] http://www.xmlmind.com/xmleditor/ I think docbook is a good option with a lot of flexibility and as you pointed out we can use it with our current subversion setup that we use to handle our code. Did you create your own software to handle publishing it on the web? I think I'll look into OpenOffice as a DocBook editor. There has been some progress on this plug-in[ indesk.com] that may make it a viable solution. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051209/703b742b/attachment.htm From kc0iog at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 16:10:15 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Fri Dec 9 16:11:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] setting up TFTP Message-ID: <2c6699da0512091410j7071a669s15d317287ec72f88@mail.gmail.com> After avoiding it for many years, it's finally come time to set up a TFTP server. My gut reaction to setting up TFTP is "security, security, security". The primary purpose of the server will be to store config files for various devices (router and switches mostly). TFTP sounds insecure from the very conception. Are there any guides to setting up a sane, secure TFTP environment? -Brian From erikerik at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 16:21:04 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Fri Dec 9 16:21:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] setting up TFTP In-Reply-To: <2c6699da0512091410j7071a669s15d317287ec72f88@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da0512091410j7071a669s15d317287ec72f88@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/9/05, Brian Wall wrote: > After avoiding it for many years, it's finally come time to set up a > TFTP server. > > My gut reaction to setting up TFTP is "security, security, security". > The primary purpose of the server will be to store config files for > various devices (router and switches mostly). TFTP sounds insecure > from the very conception. Are there any guides to setting up a sane, > secure TFTP environment? You probably already know this, but TFTP, by its very nature is insecure. It doesn't have the concept of logins or other type of authentication. I'd say there are three basic things you could do to "secure" your TFTP install. 1. Make all the files in the TFTP root dir read-only. 2. Do *not* allow access to TFTP from the internet. 3. Limit access to the TFTP port to the hosts that need it. This would be quite easy w/ iptables. From jack at jacku.com Fri Dec 9 23:19:22 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Fri Dec 9 23:19:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> On Friday 09 December 2005 10:50 am, EP wrote: > I've been looking for a good way to handle our company's documentation. > I've looked at and used mediawiki, plone, and mambo/joomla but nothing > seems to do what I think it needs to do. > > This is what I need: > 1. We sell our own software so we need to be able to publish user manuals. > 2. We need to document our own company procedures, policies, etc. > 3. We need revision control so if someone wipes out a document we know what > we need to fix. > 4. We need version control so we know what version of our document our > clients or employees are using (Pointing everyone at the web may mitigate > this need). > 5. We need access control. Obviously everyone should not have access to > everything. > 6. Easy enough to create/edit/delete/view a document so that our > non-technical users and employees can handle it. > > These are additional features that should be available: > 1. Use Word or OpenOffice and import the documents into the document tool > 2. Should be able to get a PDF version of the same document on the fly > (i.e. I don't want to store two copies of each document) > 3. Client access portal so we know who's accessing our documents > > This seems reasonable to me so maybe I'm looking in the wrong places or > maybe I'm too picky. You might want to look at another Zope based CMS called Silva. I haven't used it myself but its been around almost as long as Plone. It was designed from the ground up to use XML for storage and provide the ability to publish the XML documents to multiple formats. I believe they have support for HTML, Word and PDF at this time. You can find the details at: http://www.infrae.com/products/silva -- Jack Ungerleider The Ungerleider Group jack@jacku.com http://www.jacku.com From kelly.black at penguinpackets.com Sat Dec 10 00:59:30 2005 From: kelly.black at penguinpackets.com (Kelly Black) Date: Sat Dec 10 01:03:38 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Company Documentation -- How do you handle it? In-Reply-To: <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <20051210065930.GA1886@mail.penguinpackets.com> Not sure if this does what you want, but I just saw it on freshmeat.net after reading your post. http://contineo.sourceforge.net/ Looks like it can do versions and some other strange features that would probably not be often used. Kelly Black From rclark at lakesplus.com Sat Dec 10 17:16:55 2005 From: rclark at lakesplus.com (Randy Clarksean) Date: Sat Dec 10 17:17:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> Message-ID: <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some suggestions. Thanks in advance. Randy From bhurt at spnz.org Sat Dec 10 19:23:56 2005 From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt) Date: Sat Dec 10 19:17:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Message-ID: Or suggestions as to which one to buy to avoid having problems would be appreciated. I'm looking to buy one in about a month or so, that will need to work with linux. On Sat, 10 Dec 2005, Randy Clarksean wrote: > > Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner > with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed > scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > > I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some > suggestions. > > Thanks in advance. > > Randy > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From kevin.lombardo at gmail.com Sat Dec 10 20:01:20 2005 From: kevin.lombardo at gmail.com (Kevin Lombardo) Date: Sat Dec 10 20:01:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] uninstall grub Message-ID: Hello- I was installing Suse to a USB drive, just to see how/if it would work. I was just taking a default install and not really paying attention. Apparently the defaults will install GRUB on the MBR. The problem is that I was using 3rd party disk encryption software, and now windows will not boot. Is there any way to recover my old MBR that included the disk encryption software boot loader? Otherwise, I believe I am screwed..... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051210/e476c3d6/attachment.htm From dan at dandrake.org Sat Dec 10 21:02:12 2005 From: dan at dandrake.org (Dan) Date: Sat Dec 10 21:03:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] old Apple computers for sale Message-ID: <20051211030211.GA6313@dandrake.org> The classified ad system on the TCLUG website isn't working, so I'm just posting this to the list: I'm selling two Mac Classic II's and an Apple IIGS, Woz Edition, plus a couple other bits of old Apple stuff. The Mac Classics have 40 meg hard drives (that's forty MILLION bytes!) and B&W screens. I have one keyboard and mouse for the two of them. I'd like $20 each. The IIGS says "Woz special edition" and includes *all* the original documentation, including the sales receipt! It has a 3.5 and 5.25 floppy drive. There's also some software too. I have the keyboard and mouse for this. I would like to get some money for this, but I got it for free from another TCLUGer, so it's free. I also have a SCSI-to-ethernet adapter so you can attach one of these guys to a regular network. I'll give it up for ten bucks. Pictures: http://dandrake.org/images/img_2745.jpg http://dandrake.org/images/img_2746.jpg http://dandrake.org/images/img_2747.jpg All these are in good working condition. I originally wanted to do something cool and retro with these guys, but never got around to it. Prices are negotiable. Let me know if you have questions. Dan -- Ceci n'est pas une .signature. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051210/8f90f46c/attachment.pgp From jack at jacku.com Sat Dec 10 23:02:49 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Sat Dec 10 23:03:39 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] uninstall grub In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200512102302.49403.jack@jacku.com> On Saturday 10 December 2005 08:01 pm, Kevin Lombardo wrote: > Hello- > > I was installing Suse to a USB drive, just to see how/if it would work. I > was just taking a default install and not really paying attention. > Apparently the defaults will install GRUB on the MBR. The problem is that I > was using 3rd party disk encryption software, and now windows will not > boot. > > Is there any way to recover my old MBR that included the disk encryption > software boot loader? Otherwise, I believe I am screwed..... You might try this: http://www.linuxgazette.com/node/9944 -- Jack Ungerleider The Ungerleider Group jack@jacku.com http://www.jacku.com From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 17:15:03 2005 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:15:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Message-ID: <307a337f0512111515rd6f6659u1314e0121ed016cc@mail.gmail.com> On 12/10/05, Randy Clarksean wrote: > > Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner > with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed > scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > > I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some > suggestions. > > Thanks in advance. > > Randy http://www.linux.com/documentation/03/12/05/0015249.shtml Maybe - maybe not. All depends on the drivers. This is one reason Linux will never become a desktop of the massess. (not saying it should or shouldn't). The fact drivers you have to shoe horn in yourself rather than just getting a nice install like the Mac or Windows users rather sucks. From srcfoo at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 23:20:41 2005 From: srcfoo at gmail.com (Eric Peterson) Date: Sun Dec 11 23:21:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <307a337f0512111515rd6f6659u1314e0121ed016cc@mail.gmail.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> <307a337f0512111515rd6f6659u1314e0121ed016cc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <579c6fd30512112120q64b98800va3569f97c758c317@mail.gmail.com> Have you looked at linuxprinting.org? On 12/11/05, Ryan wrote: > > On 12/10/05, Randy Clarksean wrote: > > > > Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner > > with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed > > scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > > > > I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some > > suggestions. > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > Randy > > http://www.linux.com/documentation/03/12/05/0015249.shtml > > Maybe - maybe not. All depends on the drivers. This is one reason > Linux will never become a desktop of the massess. (not saying it > should or shouldn't). The fact drivers you have to shoe horn in > yourself rather than just getting a nice install like the Mac or > Windows users rather sucks. > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051211/c9eca72e/attachment.htm From lists at turbobit.com Sun Dec 11 19:11:12 2005 From: lists at turbobit.com (Karl Bongers) Date: Sun Dec 11 23:27:40 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Message-ID: <20051212011112.GA10205@dad1> On Sat, Dec 10, 2005 at 07:23:56PM -0600, Brian Hurt wrote: > > Or suggestions as to which one to buy to avoid having problems would be > appreciated. I'm looking to buy one in about a month or so, that will > need to work with linux. I'm happy with my HP 1610, $130.00 inkjet. It's a copier/scanner/printer/ card-reader. Got everything to work without much hassle. It's a fairly basic printer/scanner. It's not the greatest for photo prints, but it's OK. I was just happy that it had driver support for all the functionality. The card reader just worked(better than my Sandisk). HP does a reasonable job supporting Linux, unlike many of the vendors. I've got another HP inkjet a few years old that has been working well. > On Sat, 10 Dec 2005, Randy Clarksean wrote: > > > > >Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner > >with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed > >scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > > > >I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some > >suggestions. > > > >Thanks in advance. > > > >Randy From bgilbertson at stonel.com Mon Dec 12 06:19:13 2005 From: bgilbertson at stonel.com (Bob Gilbertson) Date: Mon Dec 12 06:21:41 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Message-ID: <439D6AC1.4070207@stonel.com> I have an Epson multifunction that worked out of the box. Drivers were included with Mandriva. A nice feature is one button copy without a computer connected. No automatic feed though. Bob Randy Clarksean wrote: >Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner >with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed >scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > >I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some >suggestions. > >Thanks in advance. > >Randy > > From christophermsmith at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 07:45:11 2005 From: christophermsmith at gmail.com (Christopher Smith) Date: Mon Dec 12 07:46:37 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <439D6AC1.4070207@stonel.com> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> <439D6AC1.4070207@stonel.com> Message-ID: <439D7EE7.2030802@gmail.com> At work we have several Ricoh and Canon MFP type printers. If you get one with Postscript support it's printer exposes all the functions. What I've done for scanning is set up a share on a file server (Samba 3.0.14a in this case) and set that as the default "scan to" directory. So a user walks to the copier, places stuff on it, and hits scan, then goes back to his or her desk to retrieve from the share. I've found this to work well enough that I've never tried to directly scan with SANE or anything. I've not tried faxing. Chris Smith Bob Gilbertson wrote: > I have an Epson multifunction that worked out of the box. Drivers were > included with Mandriva. A nice feature is one button copy without a > computer connected. No automatic feed though. > > Bob > > Randy Clarksean wrote: > >> Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner >> with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed >> scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. >> >> I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some >> suggestions. >> >> Thanks in advance. >> >> Randy >> > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From shanson at cruiskeenconsulting.com Mon Dec 12 09:16:13 2005 From: shanson at cruiskeenconsulting.com (Steve Hanson) Date: Mon Dec 12 09:57:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> References: <579c6fd30512090850g37a50b4cx4ecc324c49efbefb@mail.gmail.com> <200512092319.23137.jack@jacku.com> <1134256616.26757.3.camel@iwill> Message-ID: <439D943D.9040509@cruiskeenconsulting.com> Randy Clarksean wrote: > Anyone out there have any luck using a multifunction printer/scanner > with full functionality on Linux? I really need an automatic feed > scanner, copier, fax machine sorta thing. > > I am trying to get it all to work on Linux ... hope someone has some > suggestions. > > Thanks in advance. I don't know about any of the automatic feeders. My experience has been that the HP and Epson multifunctions will pretty much work out of the box, depending on your distribution. Most everything else is likely to not be willing to work. YOu can look most of these up on www.linuxprinting.org, and there's a fairly good overview at http://www.linuxprinting.org/suggested.html From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 12 21:53:32 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Mon Dec 12 21:53:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <307a337f0512111515rd6f6659u1314e0121ed016cc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051213035332.14380.qmail@web35911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> http://www.linux.com/documentation/03/12/05/0015249.shtml Maybe - maybe not. All depends on the drivers. This is one reason Linux will never become a desktop of the massess. (not saying it should or shouldn't). The fact drivers you have to shoe horn in yourself rather than just getting a nice install like the Mac or Windows users rather sucks. _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list You know that your statement of "Linux will never become a desktop of the massess" is very relative, take a look around the world, not just the U.S. where Microsoft has the majority of small businesses. Read some sites like Slashdot and see where Linux is geting implemented in 3rd World countries as well as a large part of Europe. The U.S., although we may think the world revolves around us, it does not. And note, I said small businesses, the majority of large companies, for example SuperValu, run Unix flavored OS's. You obviously come from a Windows world for the simple fact that you think installing a driver on Linux is like using a shoe horn, which ironic to your statement a shoe horn actually is very helpful, which was the intended purpose of a shoe horn, so you don't excatly make a good analogy. I guess I will recommend you just follow the Wizards and click away and let companies like Microsoft just show you how simple things should/can be. I guess if the install process on Linux for certain hardware components "sucks" so bad, think about the compromise of insecurity of an OS vs. security and a bit of "shoe horning" the driver in. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051212/e3453b8c/attachment.htm From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 22:53:46 2005 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan) Date: Mon Dec 12 22:53:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: Multifunction printers/scanners In-Reply-To: <20051213035332.14380.qmail@web35911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <307a337f0512111515rd6f6659u1314e0121ed016cc@mail.gmail.com> <20051213035332.14380.qmail@web35911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <307a337f0512122053t6ec6e630ie7f024ed4fc23b87@mail.gmail.com> On 12/12/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > You know that your statement of "Linux will never become a desktop of the > massess" is very relative, take a look around the world, not just the U.S. > where Microsoft has the majority of small businesses. Read some sites like > Slashdot and see where Linux is geting implemented in 3rd World countries as > well as a large part of Europe. The U.S., although we may think the world > revolves around us, it does not. And note, I said small businesses, the > majority of large companies, for example SuperValu, run Unix flavored OS's. > You obviously come from a Windows world for the simple fact that you think > installing a driver on Linux is like using a shoe horn, which ironic to your > statement a shoe horn actually is very helpful, which was the intended > purpose of a shoe horn, so you don't excatly make a good analogy. I guess I You missed the analogy. > will recommend you just follow the Wizards and click away and let companies > like Microsoft just show you how simple things should/can be. I guess if > the install process on Linux for certain hardware components "sucks" so bad, > think about the compromise of insecurity of an OS vs. security and a bit of > "shoe horning" the driver in. > > I forgot. Linux is perfect:) Actually every OS has good and bad points. I prefer Linux or UNIX servers, just not crazy about it as a desktop. Even ESR thinks printing on Linux rocks for average users. From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Tue Dec 13 09:26:26 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:27:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Thunderbird Questions Message-ID: <439EE822.9080904@trutwins.homeip.net> A little OT - I'm trying to move from Sylpheed as an email client to Thunderbird. I want a client that I can keep consistent between different OS's and Sylpheed's Windows port seems to have died, plus last week it trashed my address book somehow. Great email client, some excellent threading capabilities, but time to move on. I've tried to find answers to these questions on google, but I'm not having any luck. Does anyone know if the following is possible with Thunderbird, maybe with an extention: 1.) I have a lot of IMAP folders, everytime I open a new folder I have to change the sort order (by date DESC) and turn on threading. Is there a way to change the global default sorting / threading behavior so I don't have to do it for every folder? 2.) Sylpheed had a nice log window where you could see the IMAP/POP/SMTP commands that were sent - I don't see anything similar in Thunderbird. Did I miss it? 3.) Is there a way to customize the short list of headers to include the sender's mail client? 4.) In the advanced options, any idea what mail.strict_threading does? It's set to False by default. Thanks, Josh From sraun at fireopal.org Tue Dec 13 10:24:50 2005 From: sraun at fireopal.org (Scott Raun) Date: Tue Dec 13 10:27:42 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Thunderbird Questions In-Reply-To: <439EE822.9080904@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <439EE822.9080904@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <20051213162450.GB11079@fireopal.org> On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 09:26:26AM -0600, Josh Trutwin wrote: > 4.) In the advanced options, any idea what mail.strict_threading does? > It's set to False by default. I'd bet it uses the Message-ID and In-Reply-To headers _only_ for threading if you set it to true. -- Scott Raun sraun@fireopal.org From adam at askewview.net Tue Dec 13 15:20:24 2005 From: adam at askewview.net (Adam) Date: Tue Dec 13 15:21:43 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT FYI: SCALUG Installfest Message-ID: <439F3B18.2050800@askewview.net> For those TCLUGers who might be interested SCALUG is having an Installfest for our Janurary meeting on the 21st from 10am to 6pm. Location: Meeting Grounds: Sartell 1733 Pine Cone RD ste 600/700 (In the strip mall by the new Coborns superstore) Sartell, MN From mbditt at plauditdesign.com Wed Dec 14 12:03:50 2005 From: mbditt at plauditdesign.com (Matt Dittbenner) Date: Wed Dec 14 12:07:26 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Library versions? Message-ID: <43A05E86.60509@plauditdesign.com> Is there a good, reliable way to check a library version in linux? Something that works like using ldd to find the libraries a binary is linked with. I am working on a machine and I want to verify that the libc and the ld-linux versions are what they say they are. lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 Apr 7 2005 /lib/libc.so.6 -> libc-2.2.4.so* lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 11 Apr 7 2005 /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -> ld-2.2.4.so* For some reason this looks funny to me, but I'm not extremely familiar with these libraries...I just know that everything needs em! I understand that these are symbolic links to the real libs, but the libc doesn't look like the correct version. I am getting an error when trying to use a PHP module that says it "Cannot load shared object file", and these are the only 2 libs it's linked with. The module is the PHP module DIO. Any help would be appreciated! -- Matt Dittbenner *EMAIL* matt@plaudit.com *WEB* www.plaudit.com *PHONE* 651.646.0696 *ADDRESS* 2470 University Ave. St. Paul, MN 55114 -------------- next part -------------- Skipped content of type multipart/related From hewhocutsdown at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 13:04:19 2005 From: hewhocutsdown at gmail.com (Jordan Peacock) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:05:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop Message-ID: Been working on my wife's machine, taking off ubuntu so she had enough space for her files on windows. It's a Dell Inspiron laptop, a few years old, had a few complaints but it's worked well until now. I was in windows, reformatted the (used to be Ubuntu) space to NTFS, as a place to store her files, and upon reboot got smacked with an 'Error 17" from GRUB over the missing OS (Ubuntu). The DVD-ROM drive has been acting up and refuses to boot (it just spins aimlessly), and there is no floppy drive, so we're really at a loss. I have all the appropriate discs, and I know how to fix GRUB if I could access it....just can't figure out how to access it... Btw, I'm looking into Dell Support/replacing DVD drive. But in the meanwhile, if anyone thinks of something I missed it'd be greatly appreciated. Thanks -jordan From jkjones at tcq.net Thu Dec 15 13:53:08 2005 From: jkjones at tcq.net (Kraig Jones) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:53:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <43A1C9A4.5020607@tcq.net> Jordan Peacock wrote: >Been working on my wife's machine, taking off ubuntu so she had enough >space for her files on windows. It's a Dell Inspiron laptop, a few >years old, had a few complaints but it's worked well until now. I was >in windows, reformatted the (used to be Ubuntu) space to NTFS, as a >place to store her files, and upon reboot got smacked with an 'Error >17" from GRUB over the missing OS (Ubuntu). The DVD-ROM drive has been >acting up and refuses to boot (it just spins aimlessly), and there is >no floppy drive, so we're really at a loss. I have all the appropriate >discs, and I know how to fix GRUB if I could access it....just can't >figure out how to access it... > >Btw, I'm looking into Dell Support/replacing DVD drive. But in the >meanwhile, if anyone thinks of something I missed it'd be greatly >appreciated. Thanks > > -jordan > > > 1. You're sure the DVD drive is broken, not just a bad CD? Tried another bootable CD, like Knoppix? 2. Could you put the laptop's drive into another machine, using a laptop drive/IDE adapter? Then get to its GRUB menu? BTW, we have had to replace a couple drives on our Inspiron. Kraig From daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 14:17:43 2005 From: daniel.armbrust.list at gmail.com (Dan Armbrust) Date: Thu Dec 15 14:17:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <43A1CF67.70408@gmail.com> Will it boot to USB? I just set up a DSL Linux install on my USB thumb drive, it works slick. Assuming the BIOS supports booting to USB. Dan -- **************************** Daniel Armbrust Biomedical Informatics Mayo Clinic Rochester daniel.armbrust(at)mayo.edu http://informatics.mayo.edu/ From dniesen at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 14:53:26 2005 From: dniesen at gmail.com (Donovan Niesen) Date: Thu Dec 15 14:53:44 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: <43A1CF67.70408@gmail.com> References: <43A1CF67.70408@gmail.com> Message-ID: <47f4d5e70512151253k3620eb0ag8c86c0b11e775dd4@mail.gmail.com> On 12/15/05, Dan Armbrust wrote: > Will it boot to USB? > > I just set up a DSL Linux install on my USB thumb drive, it works slick. > > Assuming the BIOS supports booting to USB. > > Dan > > -- > **************************** > Daniel Armbrust > Biomedical Informatics > Mayo Clinic Rochester > daniel.armbrust(at)mayo.edu > http://informatics.mayo.edu/ > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > I use an external 2.5" hard drive enclosure to work on laptop hard drives. Recovered a lot of systems that way. Picked one up for $25 at a trade show; now that I look at NewEgg you can get them even cheaper than that $10-$20 w/ shipping: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Submit=Go&DEPA=0&type=&description=2.5%22+enclosure&Category=0&minPrice=&maxPrice=&Go.x=0&Go.y=0 At the very worst you can backup her data, wipe the whole thing and start over... once you have a working optical drive. -- Donovan Niesen From john.meier at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 15:17:38 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Thu Dec 15 15:17:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <65293fcc0512151317m6769a34ay422202dcc720d75a@mail.gmail.com> On 12/15/05, Jordan Peacock wrote: > > ..... and there is > no floppy drive, > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list I think I have a floppy drive that fits into one of the battery bays on my inspirion 8000. I'm in bloomington if you'd like to borrow it - assuming I can find it! Let me know. john -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051215/723840bc/attachment.htm From eric at vangyzen.net Thu Dec 15 16:12:32 2005 From: eric at vangyzen.net (Eric van Gyzen) Date: Thu Dec 15 16:13:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0512151317m6769a34ay422202dcc720d75a@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc0512151317m6769a34ay422202dcc720d75a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A1EA50.6080700@vangyzen.net> John Meier wrote: > On 12/15/05, Jordan Peacock wrote: > > ..... and there is > no floppy drive, > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > I think I have a floppy drive that fits into one of the battery bays on > my inspirion 8000. I'm in bloomington if you'd like to borrow it - > assuming I can find it! Likewise, I have removable CD and floppy drives for an Inspiron 4100. I'm in Apple Valley. Eric From lists at turbobit.com Thu Dec 15 17:56:57 2005 From: lists at turbobit.com (Karl Bongers) Date: Thu Dec 15 22:09:45 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Library versions? In-Reply-To: <43A05E86.60509@plauditdesign.com> References: <43A05E86.60509@plauditdesign.com> Message-ID: <20051215235656.GA20955@dad1> On Wed, Dec 14, 2005 at 12:03:50PM -0600, Matt Dittbenner wrote: > Is there a good, reliable way to check a library version in linux? > Something that works like using ldd to find the libraries a binary is > linked with. I am working on a machine and I want to verify that the > libc and the ld-linux versions are what they say they are. > > lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 Apr 7 2005 /lib/libc.so.6 > -> libc-2.2.4.so* > lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 11 Apr 7 2005 > /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -> ld-2.2.4.so* > > For some reason this looks funny to me, but I'm not extremely familiar > with these libraries...I just know that everything needs em! I > understand that these are symbolic links to the real libs, but the libc > doesn't look like the correct version. I am getting an error when trying > to use a PHP module that says it "Cannot load shared object file", and > these are the only 2 libs it's linked with. The module is the PHP module > DIO. Your distro's package management tools. So on my debian system I can find out what package any file belongs to by `dpkg -S libc.so.6`, or `dpkg -S libc-2.3.2.so`. They both show they are from "libc6" package. The packages have MD5's on all files, in debian thats at: /var/lib/dpkg/info/pkgname.md5sums So I could check it against this for changes using md5sum utility. I recall rpm system's having similar features. I have no clue as to why a so.6 points to a 2.2.4 thing, you'd think it would have a .6 in it somewhere, oh well.. About the "Cannot load shared object file", did you compile this stuff yourself or is it installed by your distro packages? What distro do you have? Need to run ldconfig? Add a local/lib dir in /etc/ld.so.conf? Some programs use dynamic linking(man dlopen), which will not show using ldd. You can look at what some of them load into memory as /proc/PID#/maps. From florin at iucha.net Fri Dec 16 07:53:41 2005 From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha) Date: Fri Dec 16 07:53:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Library versions? In-Reply-To: <20051215235656.GA20955@dad1> References: <43A05E86.60509@plauditdesign.com> <20051215235656.GA20955@dad1> Message-ID: <20051216135341.GG25602@iucha.net> On Thu, Dec 15, 2005 at 11:56:57PM +0000, Karl Bongers wrote: > On Wed, Dec 14, 2005 at 12:03:50PM -0600, Matt Dittbenner wrote: > > Is there a good, reliable way to check a library version in linux? > > Something that works like using ldd to find the libraries a binary is > > linked with. I am working on a machine and I want to verify that the > > libc and the ld-linux versions are what they say they are. > > > > lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 Apr 7 2005 /lib/libc.so.6 > > -> libc-2.2.4.so* > > lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 11 Apr 7 2005 > > /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -> ld-2.2.4.so* > > > > For some reason this looks funny to me, but I'm not extremely familiar > > with these libraries...I just know that everything needs em! I > > understand that these are symbolic links to the real libs, but the libc > > doesn't look like the correct version. I am getting an error when trying > > to use a PHP module that says it "Cannot load shared object file", and > > these are the only 2 libs it's linked with. The module is the PHP module > > DIO. > > Your distro's package management tools. So on my debian system I can > find out what package any file belongs to by `dpkg -S libc.so.6`, > or `dpkg -S libc-2.3.2.so`. > They both show they are from "libc6" package. > > The packages have MD5's on all files, in debian thats at: > /var/lib/dpkg/info/pkgname.md5sums > So I could check it against this for changes using md5sum utility. > > I recall rpm system's having similar features. > > I have no clue as to why a so.6 points to a 2.2.4 thing, you'd think it > would have a .6 in it somewhere, oh well.. IIRC the .6 is the "compatible" flag. You change the version when you add features and fix bugs, and you change the so version when it is no longer backward compatible with the previous version. florin -- Don't question authority: they don't know either! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051216/3f234be5/attachment-0001.pgp From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 09:52:47 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Fri Dec 16 09:53:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: <43A1EA50.6080700@vangyzen.net> References: <65293fcc0512151317m6769a34ay422202dcc720d75a@mail.gmail.com> <43A1EA50.6080700@vangyzen.net> Message-ID: If your Dell doesn't support booting off USB, grab the latest BIOS revision. Most of the Dells I've seen in the past few years support USB booting with an up to date BIOS. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0; 0 rows returned From joey.rockhold at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 10:54:16 2005 From: joey.rockhold at gmail.com (Joey Rockhold) Date: Fri Dec 16 10:54:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <439850AE.3030200@tcq.net> References: <200512080254.jB82sAGt027818@delta.twp-llc.com> <46202.192.28.2.52.1134054371.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <439850AE.3030200@tcq.net> Message-ID: <101e49ea0512160854tdbc040avf4f9e6d00ec0564b@mail.gmail.com> I just wanted to thank everyone for their suggestions. I decided to go with Ubuntu to start with (gave up on Fedora for various reasons), and I will give the "Linux From Scratch" a try in the near future. On 12/8/05, Kraig Jones wrote: > > Chris Schumann wrote: > > >>Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2005 17:00:24 -0600 > >>From: Joey Rockhold > >> > >> > > > > > > > >>I am re-learning linux in my spare time (I used to know Unix a long time > >>ago), and would like to set up a machine which starts with just basics > >>of linux. After that point, I would like to install programs as I need > >>them. For example, if I want to learn KDE, then only at that point would > >>I download and install KDE. > >> > >>Right now the best way I have come up to do this is using Redhat Fedora > >>Core 4, do a minimal install, and use yum to add packages as I want > >>them. Does anyone know a better way to do this? I am open to any > >>distribution that anyone thinks would be better at this also. > >> > >>Thanks. > >>- Joey > >> > >> > > > >I think it depends on your goals. If you want to learn to *use* Linux > >(some administration, configuring packages, get work done), then Fedora > is > >a great choice. I've stuck with Red Hat and Fedora for no good reason > >other than I know them, and they take care of a lot of things for me, so > I > >can get to work. (Also, if I have a problem with Fedora, I can use Google > >to find a hundred other people who've had the same problem, and five or > >six who actually bother to write down how they fixed it.) > > > >If you want a deeper understanding, or a more generic approach (not so > >Red-Hat-centric) then you want one of the many other fine distros. > > > >I've installed Gentoo, Debian and Slackware, and each has its own > >strengths... and weaknesses, and it depends on what you want to get out > of > >it and what you want to put into it that will determine your best fit. > > > >Chris > > > > > > > > > Right. How about adding an extra partition, or another disk? One for a > working installation, one for tinkering. > > Kraig > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051216/0ed066a1/attachment.htm From andyzib at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 12:16:58 2005 From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew Zbikowski) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:17:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: Modulated Linux In-Reply-To: <101e49ea0512160854tdbc040avf4f9e6d00ec0564b@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512080254.jB82sAGt027818@delta.twp-llc.com> <46202.192.28.2.52.1134054371.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <439850AE.3030200@tcq.net> <101e49ea0512160854tdbc040avf4f9e6d00ec0564b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: If you're interested in persuing a Red Hat certification, Fedora would be the way to go, though Fedora generally installs alot of packages from the get go. Grabbing the latest Ubuntu release and typing server at the boot prompt will get you a very minimal, but functional, Linux install. I'm assuming that the recently released Ubuntu server is similar, but I haven't had a chance to check it out yet. -- Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue >0; 0 rows returned From dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us Fri Dec 16 14:00:51 2005 From: dmillaway at holdingford.k12.mn.us (Dana Millaway) Date: Fri Dec 16 14:03:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT? WebCams that work with Open Source Chat Message-ID: <43A2C893020000B3000015F1@holdingford.k12.mn.us> Sorry in advance for the cross posting and the somewhat off topic question. I am hoping that you will forgive the fact I am currently looking for something that will work with XP since my ideal solution would also work on most flavors of Linux. My husband and I use GAIM both at work and at home to access our aol and ms chat accounts. We currently use XP but are looking hard at switching to Linux. I want to get him a set of web cams (for Christmas) that will work on both XP and Linux and preferably integrate with GAIM or some other open source chat software. It sounds like GAIM is working towards that integration so I would settle for recommendations of web cams that work Linux. I know there are several that work with aol and ms products but I don't like what those chat clients do to my processor, especially running both at the same time to keep all the family in touch. [NULL] Any suggestions or warnings regarding web cams and their associated software? Thanks very much and hope you all have safe and happy holidays. From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 15:14:01 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Fri Dec 16 15:15:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Mishap with Laptop In-Reply-To: References: <65293fcc0512151317m6769a34ay422202dcc720d75a@mail.gmail.com> <43A1EA50.6080700@vangyzen.net> Message-ID: <9d6c82530512161314j33a028d6ie4fe7cadf09965b1@mail.gmail.com> Do you use the DSL hard drive usb boot option or the split partition option? I've tried both on my Dell Optiplex with an error on the grub side. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051216/8f8698b6/attachment.htm From jack at jacku.com Fri Dec 16 16:03:22 2005 From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider) Date: Fri Dec 16 16:03:48 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT? WebCams that work with Open Source Chat In-Reply-To: <43A2C893020000B3000015F1@holdingford.k12.mn.us> References: <43A2C893020000B3000015F1@holdingford.k12.mn.us> Message-ID: <1196.66.41.169.53.1134770602.squirrel@mail.zoper.com> On Fri, December 16, 2005 2:00 pm, Dana Millaway wrote: > Sorry in advance for the cross posting and the somewhat off topic > question. I am hoping that you will forgive the fact I am currently > looking for something that will work with XP since my ideal solution would > also work on most flavors of Linux. > > My husband and I use GAIM both at work and at home to access our aol and > ms chat accounts. We currently use XP but are looking hard at switching > to Linux. I want to get him a set of web cams (for Christmas) that will > work on both XP and Linux and preferably integrate with GAIM or some other > open source chat software. It sounds like GAIM is working towards that > integration so I would settle for recommendations of web cams that work > Linux. I know there are several that work with aol and ms products but I > don't like what those chat clients do to my processor, especially running > both at the same time to keep all the family in touch. > > [NULL] > Any suggestions or warnings regarding web cams and their associated > software? > > Thanks very much and hope you all have safe and happy holidays. Do a search on Video4Linux or just V4L and webcams and you should find the information you need. The V4L packages usually include some webcam related stuff. You can also test with xawtv among others, once the drivers have loaded. Depending on the Linux distro you choose you may need to hack the hotplug scripts to get the correct module(s) to load. Hope that helps. Jack -- Jack Ungerleider The Ungerleider Group jack@jacku.com http://www.jacku.com From webmaster at mn-linux.org Sun Dec 18 22:19:46 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Sun Dec 18 22:19:49 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512190419.jBJ4Jkx15753@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: Want to Buy Subject: WTB: Ultra2 RAID I'm looking for a SCSI Ultra2 RAID Controller for my dell poweredge 2400. I'd need a card compatible with Fedora Core/Centos Seller Email address: adam at askewview dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Tue Dec 20 17:17:53 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Tue Dec 20 17:19:51 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions Message-ID: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> A while back one of the servers I help out with that a buddy of mine owns had a catastrophic hard drive failure. It wasn't a HUGE deal because we were slowly migrating off to a new server, but there still was some data loss. The newer server we're migrating to which I am more active in managing does not currently have redundant drives. I do a lot of off-site backup of important data, but I'm still very nervous about this situation and trying to push the owner to spend some money on more hardware. There isn't a hardware RAID controller so I am suggesting to the owner of the server to purchase a couple more disks so I can setup a software RAID solution as I've been reading up on here: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Software-RAID-HOWTO.html Questions: 1.) Does anyone have experiences they can share with setting up a s/w RAID on an existing system? (Server is a Dell PowerEdge 1750 running Debian sid with 2.4.32 - I build the kernel myself - it is currently co-located which might make remote setup interesting) 2.) We can have a maximum of 3 drives on the SCSI controller. I am pushing to get two more drives matching the current drive. I was going to use one as a scratch space / archive area and then use the other to setup a software RAID. Sound ok or something better? 3.) RAID-1 seems to be the right solution for this kind of setup (only 2 disks, exact same size) Any other suggestions / war stories are most welcome. Thanks, Josh From aintboeingaintgoing at gmail.com Tue Dec 20 22:26:06 2005 From: aintboeingaintgoing at gmail.com (Steve Swantz) Date: Tue Dec 20 22:27:52 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <17f6da250512202026q1551a86dsb925f7e59740f1f7@mail.gmail.com> On 12/20/05, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > Questions: > > 1.) Does anyone have experiences they can share with setting up a s/w > RAID on an existing system? (Server is a Dell PowerEdge 1750 running > Debian sid with 2.4.32 - I build the kernel myself - it is currently > co-located which might make remote setup interesting) I practiced that on a remote server (well, it was in the basement, and I wasn't) since I was considering doing it to rented dedicated server. After a couple of tries, I could do it reliably, reboots and all. IIRC, the instructions I started with were these: http://www.issociate.de/board/post/25205/How_to_build_bootable_RAID_1_as_a_module_with_Grub_on_Debian_Sarge.html I partitioned differently which caused me a little heartburn (wrong argument to mkinitrd on my first tries.) Practice on a machine you can get to before doing it to a machine that is truly remote. 2.) We can have a maximum of 3 drives on the SCSI controller. I am > pushing to get two more drives matching the current drive. I was > going to use one as a scratch space / archive area and then use the > other to setup a software RAID. Sound ok or something better? I'm not a pro, so my advice may not be worth anything, but I setup a PowerEdge 1550 that way and it worked fine. > 3.) RAID-1 seems to be the right solution for this kind of setup (only > 2 disks, exact same size) I don't think you need identical drives, though that makes it easier. If they're different sizes, size the md device to the smallest drive. Any other suggestions / war stories are most welcome. Keep a cheatsheet of mdadm commands around. Mine have worked and worked with *almost* no problems, but when something goes wrong, you want to minimize how long it takes you to relearn what you need to know to fix it. Steve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051220/d2ece093/attachment.htm From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Wed Dec 21 11:41:40 2005 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Wed Dec 21 11:41:52 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> On Tue, Dec 20, 2005 at 05:17:53PM -0600, Josh Trutwin wrote: > 1.) Does anyone have experiences they can share with setting up a s/w > RAID on an existing system? (Server is a Dell PowerEdge 1750 running > Debian sid with 2.4.32 - I build the kernel myself - it is currently > co-located which might make remote setup interesting) I set up a software RAID system on my home server a couple of years ago (back when two 40GB drives were all my I could afford). I bought a PCI IDE controller and two identical drives, installed and formatted them, took about 45 minutes total. The instructions in the RAID HOWTO were pretty good as I recall. I haven't had any problems with it since I've set it up, so I can't speak to how difficult it is to recover from e.g. a disk failure. It's a RAID-1 setup. > 2.) We can have a maximum of 3 drives on the SCSI controller. I am > pushing to get two more drives matching the current drive. I was > going to use one as a scratch space / archive area and then use the > other to setup a software RAID. Sound ok or something better? Sounds luvverly. > 3.) RAID-1 seems to be the right solution for this kind of setup (only > 2 disks, exact same size) That's worked for me so far. -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota From josh at trutwins.homeip.net Wed Dec 21 13:50:31 2005 From: josh at trutwins.homeip.net (Josh Trutwin) Date: Wed Dec 21 13:51:53 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> Message-ID: <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> John J. Trammell wrote: > On Tue, Dec 20, 2005 at 05:17:53PM -0600, Josh Trutwin wrote: >> 1.) Does anyone have experiences they can share with setting up a s/w >> RAID on an existing system? (Server is a Dell PowerEdge 1750 running >> Debian sid with 2.4.32 - I build the kernel myself - it is currently >> co-located which might make remote setup interesting) > > I set up a software RAID system on my home server a couple of years ago > (back when two 40GB drives were all my I could afford). I bought a PCI > IDE controller and two identical drives, installed and formatted them, > took about 45 minutes total. The instructions in the RAID HOWTO were > pretty good as I recall. Thanks - I had some other off-list replies too which have been helpful. I guess my biggest concern now is how to create a RAID starting with an existing system. Do I have to partition the second drive the same as my current one? I'm still reading up on a lot of this so I'm still weeks (maybe months?) from going forward. > I haven't had any problems with it since I've set it up, so I can't > speak to how difficult it is to recover from e.g. a disk failure. It's > a RAID-1 setup. I guess it doesn't take the place of a good backup strategy, but as I see it with a RAID-1 setup if one of the drives goes bad you should be able to use the other drive while you replace the faulty one. I think that's a bit of an oversimplification though. Thanks, Josh From trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com Wed Dec 21 14:47:22 2005 From: trammell+tclug at el-swifto.com (John J. Trammell) Date: Wed Dec 21 14:47:52 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <20051221204722.GA21375@mail.el-swifto.com> On Wed, Dec 21, 2005 at 01:50:31PM -0600, Josh Trutwin wrote: > Thanks - I had some other off-list replies too which have been > helpful. I guess my biggest concern now is how to create a RAID > starting with an existing system. Do I have to partition the second > drive the same as my current one? I'm still reading up on a lot of > this so I'm still weeks (maybe months?) from going forward. AFAICT RAID-1 partitions don't need to be exactly the same size. The HOWTO says "You have two devices of approximately same size, and you want the two to be mirrors of each other...". One slick thing I just learned is that you can specify "spare" partitions to be swapped in should the primary partitions fail. Neat. > I guess it doesn't take the place of a good backup strategy, but as I > see it with a RAID-1 setup if one of the drives goes bad you should be > able to use the other drive while you replace the faulty one. I think > that's a bit of an oversimplification though. That is my understanding as well. Others with more experience may have learned otherwise. :-) -- trammell@el-swifto.com 9EC7 BC6D E688 A184 9F58 FD4C 2C12 CC14 8ABA 36F5 Twin Cities Linux Users Group (TCLUG) Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota From josh at tcbug.org Thu Dec 22 12:00:19 2005 From: josh at tcbug.org (Josh Paetzel) Date: Thu Dec 22 12:02:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <200512221200.20120.josh@tcbug.org> On Wednesday 21 December 2005 01:50 pm, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > I guess it doesn't take the place of a good backup strategy, but as > I see it with a RAID-1 setup if one of the drives goes bad you > should be able to use the other drive while you replace the faulty > one. I think that's a bit of an oversimplification though. > > Thanks, > > Josh > Just keep in mind that RAID is not the same as archival. -- Thanks, Josh Paetzel From rosander at owbn.org Thu Dec 22 14:49:34 2005 From: rosander at owbn.org (Ross Anderson) Date: Thu Dec 22 14:49:54 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <43AB115E.3020605@owbn.org> Josh Trutwin wrote: > A while back one of the servers I help out with that a buddy of mine > owns had a catastrophic hard drive failure. It wasn't a HUGE deal > because we were slowly migrating off to a new server, but there still > was some data loss. > > The newer server we're migrating to which I am more active in managing > does not currently have redundant drives. I do a lot of off-site > backup of important data, but I'm still very nervous about this > situation and trying to push the owner to spend some money on more > hardware. There isn't a hardware RAID controller so I am suggesting > to the owner of the server to purchase a couple more disks so I can > setup a software RAID solution as I've been reading up on here: > > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Software-RAID-HOWTO.html > > Questions: > > 1.) Does anyone have experiences they can share with setting up a s/w > RAID on an existing system? (Server is a Dell PowerEdge 1750 running > Debian sid with 2.4.32 - I build the kernel myself - it is currently > co-located which might make remote setup interesting) I've this multiple times with good sucess. The remote setup can be a little more touchy and you really need to watch your config process. A few things that you need to answer. How loaded is your backplane/scsi bus? How busy is your CPU? Although mirroring doesn't create much cpu load like a software lvl 5 would, it does create double the traffic on your bus's when writing. What enviroment are you in? What services are you running and what is your uptime demands. Then I can comment more. > > 2.) We can have a maximum of 3 drives on the SCSI controller. I am > pushing to get two more drives matching the current drive. I was > going to use one as a scratch space / archive area and then use the > other to setup a software RAID. Sound ok or something better? > > 3.) RAID-1 seems to be the right solution for this kind of setup (only > 2 disks, exact same size) > > Any other suggestions / war stories are most welcome. > > Thanks, > > Josh > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Dec 22 15:37:32 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Dec 22 15:37:55 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512222137.jBMLbWA00497@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: free laser printers and pc parts For Free: -Nec 870 needs imaging unit and toner -HP 5mp, jams sometimes...prolly just needs cleaned rollers -HP IIIp, jams...prolly just needs cleaned rollers For Sale: -adaptec 3944uwd...$8 -adaptec 2940uw...$5 -matched pair of pIII 667 slot one cpu's w/ heat sink..$20 -celeron 733/66 cpu...$4 -pII350 slot one cpu..$1 -k6-2 300mhz clone, 64mb ram (4 16mb simms), 2gb & 1gb hd, cdrom, floppy, two nics, 2mb pci video...$3 located in st.louis park/eden prairie Seller Email address: jungle at hickorytech dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From john.meier at gmail.com Sun Dec 25 21:38:49 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Sun Dec 25 21:39:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? Message-ID: <65293fcc0512251938j3c2fadb7jdb1d841609cabf3a@mail.gmail.com> Anyone have a Knoppix 3.6 boot cd or the iso? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051225/2078d8f6/attachment.htm From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 26 00:06:16 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Mon Dec 26 00:07:58 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0512251938j3c2fadb7jdb1d841609cabf3a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051226060616.40337.qmail@web35907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> WOW! This was a tough one and yes I did not have the answer AND did not have to go to IRC #linux. After searching Google for a WHOLE 4 minutes I came up with this link. http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 United States 61% FTP University of FloridaISO 1 WOW. And I was actually able to post the ISO link. Wow, and using bittorrent is tough I know, but I guess finding an older version of Knoppix, you MAY actually have to do this. Yes, you may be looking for someone who may drop this version of Knoppix off for you or you pick it up, but start at some point tonight or tomorrow and you will have the thing downloaded. I cannot believe what this list has turned into. Anyone else want their hand held? John Meier wrote: Anyone have a Knoppix 3.6 boot cd or the iso? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051225/5624b27d/attachment.htm From john.meier at gmail.com Mon Dec 26 00:49:51 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Mon Dec 26 00:49:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051226060616.40337.qmail@web35907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <65293fcc0512251938j3c2fadb7jdb1d841609cabf3a@mail.gmail.com> <20051226060616.40337.qmail@web35907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc0512252249t529c8e5cq83cf05f75ea734b0@mail.gmail.com> On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > WOW! This was a tough one and yes I did not have the answer AND did not > have to go to IRC #linux. After searching Google for a WHOLE 4 minutes I > came up with this link. > > http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 > > United States 61% > FTP University of FloridaISO > 1 > Sheeze! I've been to that site - none of the links/torrents are actually there. I've searched on and off for a month to find this version of knoppix and always come up with dead links. Twice I've actually found torrents, downloaded the .torrent, fired it up with btdownloadcurses.py, only to have the torrent rejected by the tracker. I'm very happy that Gerry could point me to a mirror - I did download the iso and WAS able to burn it. I'm sorry that you'll never get those 4 whole minutes back (plus whatever time you wasted writing your "response"), but I'd be willing to send you a burn of the iso and save you the download time. ;) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051226/3a107b98/attachment.htm From auditodd at comcast.net Mon Dec 26 12:47:19 2005 From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd@comcast.net) Date: Mon Dec 26 12:48:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? Message-ID: <122620051847.21736.43B03AB7000C22AC000054E822070032010B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Erick Stohr > WOW! This was a tough one and yes I did not have the answer AND did not have to > go to IRC #linux. After searching Google for a WHOLE 4 minutes I came up with > this link. > > http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 > > United States 61% FTP University of FloridaISO 1 > > WOW. And I was actually able to post the ISO link. Wow, and using bittorrent > is tough I know, but I guess finding an older version of Knoppix, you MAY > actually have to do this. > > Yes, you may be looking for someone who may drop this version of Knoppix off > for you or you pick it up, but start at some point tonight or tomorrow and you > will have the thing downloaded. > > I cannot believe what this list has turned into. Anyone else want their hand > held? > > > John Meier wrote: Anyone have a Knoppix 3.6 boot cd or > the iso? > _______________________________________________ WOW! Looks like someone needs to learn how to post a proper URL! The first URL shown above leads to a URL rating site, NOT to the bittorrent file OR an ISO, and the second URL (to the right) leads NOWHERE. Next time, can the childish sarcasm and just help out or shut up. Just my $0.02 Todd Young -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Erick Stohr Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 06:10:58 +0000 Size: 4450 Url: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051226/c521f0c4/attachment.eml From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 26 17:28:15 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Mon Dec 26 17:30:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <122620051847.21736.43B03AB7000C22AC000054E822070032010B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20051226232815.11687.qmail@web35915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hmm, I really don't know what is wrong with my computer, when I click on that URL that I posted: http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 it keeps bringing me to this stupid site that actually has relevant info, Knoppix 3.6 ISO via torrent. Man am I frustrated, this stupid link came up in the first 10 displayed on Google, so I guess I lied, it really only took me about a minute to find this crappy stupid URL with that stinking Knoppix 3.6 ISO. (Well, let me see, unless you have bittorrent on your system, then yeah, that second link probably will say unsupported protocol, "leads you nowhere" or something to that extent, so yeah, for you auditodd, you probably can't get anything.) Yeah, I guess I probably shouldn't have cut and pasted that HTML, but if I posted an improper URL, how the heck did you get to the actual site if it is improper? If it took me less than a minute to come up with a possible solution, then yes, I am going to give "childish scarcasm". auditodd@comcast.net wrote: -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Erick Stohr > WOW! This was a tough one and yes I did not have the answer AND did not have to > go to IRC #linux. After searching Google for a WHOLE 4 minutes I came up with > this link. > > http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 > > United States 61% FTP University of FloridaISO 1 > > WOW. And I was actually able to post the ISO link. Wow, and using bittorrent > is tough I know, but I guess finding an older version of Knoppix, you MAY > actually have to do this. > > Yes, you may be looking for someone who may drop this version of Knoppix off > for you or you pick it up, but start at some point tonight or tomorrow and you > will have the thing downloaded. > > I cannot believe what this list has turned into. Anyone else want their hand > held? > > > John Meier wrote: Anyone have a Knoppix 3.6 boot cd or > the iso? > _______________________________________________ WOW! Looks like someone needs to learn how to post a proper URL! The first URL shown above leads to a URL rating site, NOT to the bittorrent file OR an ISO, and the second URL (to the right) leads NOWHERE. Next time, can the childish sarcasm and just help out or shut up. Just my $0.02 Todd Young From: Erick Stohr To: John Meier , tclug Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 06:10:58 +0000 WOW! This was a tough one and yes I did not have the answer AND did not have to go to IRC #linux. After searching Google for a WHOLE 4 minutes I came up with this link. http://iso.linuxquestions.org/version.php?version=44 United States 61% FTP University of FloridaISO 1 WOW. And I was actually able to post the ISO link. Wow, and using bittorrent is tough I know, but I guess finding an older version of Knoppix, you MAY actually have to do this. Yes, you may be looking for someone who may drop this version of Knoppix off for you or you pick it up, but start at some point tonight or tomorrow and you will have the thing downloaded. I cannot believe what this list has turned into. Anyone else want their hand held? John Meier wrote: Anyone have a Knoppix 3.6 boot cd or the iso? _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051226/9b5e82ed/attachment.htm From gsker at comcast.net Mon Dec 26 17:51:06 2005 From: gsker at comcast.net (gsker@comcast.net) Date: Mon Dec 26 17:52:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Browser Feature for Book Reading Message-ID: I've been reading a few large HTML files with a web browser and I'm really wishing for a feature that I can't find in any tool after much searching and testing of a multitude of readers and browsers. What I want to do is save, not just the page as a bookmark, but the location in the page. Does anyone know of a browser or reader that does that either natively, or as an extension or plugin? Or failing that, is there a Javascript or Bookmarklet solution that someone has heard of or used? [yes, of COURSE I mean under Linux! :-) ] Gerry From jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com Mon Dec 26 18:03:49 2005 From: jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com (Jonathon Jongsma) Date: Mon Dec 26 18:04:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051226232815.11687.qmail@web35915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <122620051847.21736.43B03AB7000C22AC000054E822070032010B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> <20051226232815.11687.qmail@web35915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > If it took me less than a minute to come up with a possible solution, then yes, I am going to give "childish scarcasm". Very big of you sir. Bravo. It would have been very difficult for you to kindly suggest googling, I suspect. Jonathon From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Mon Dec 26 18:16:24 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Mon Dec 26 18:18:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051226232815.11687.qmail@web35915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051226232815.11687.qmail@web35915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: A better way to do this: If someone asks a question that can be answered with a Google search, then you might either just post a Google link, like this one... http://www.google.com/search?q=Knoppix+3.6+iso ...or you might ignore the question. If you really want to help, you might ask for clarification -- maybe you misunderstood the question or it was not well formed. If you make sarcastic comments about the skills of the person who posed the question, it makes it look like you are showing off -- "look how easy it was for me!" It definitely seems rude. Then it takes up extra time for you, first to compose a sarcastic comment, then to respond to people who are offended by it, etc. Thus, people who write such sarcastic replies to legitimate questions must be either inexperienced with email lists or they just can't find good ways to spend their time. Mike From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 26 18:46:29 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Mon Dec 26 18:47:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Well, I guess I assume too much these days, which is my "fault". And yes, with the amt of information out there and archived information (even my Mother knows how to use Google), I guess I could have politely suggested Google, BUT, with the way, except for a few people, I was treated by others when inquiring about questioins I had, I guess again I feel research and learning on your own is the "best" most (most importantly) "rewarding" way to learn. I am far far from a Linux expert, but have used it for a relatively long time, I am in a Windows world at work and we have one Linux server running and I am the only one to support it and I am not even THE System Admin. That is where the "I" in TEAM does not exist. So, do I treat people on this list as part of a TEAM, or try and help them learn on their own by being an a-hole. I honestly don't know. With companies like the GEEK Squad, who originally were "good", now being saturated by incompetent idiots after being purchased by Best Buy, (and I know this because I work a side business supporting some local MN residents and I have often heard "The Geek Squad said I need a whole new computer, rebuild the OS and there is no way to save any data") I question where IT is going and why people are going down that road, is it $ or is it a passion for something they enjoy, while getting paid. Work is work, but I have been blessed with something I never knew I would enjoy doing and getting paid, my process to get where I am at was not the easiest and don't feel that it should have been any other way. So yes, I could/should have said, please try Google. Jonathon Jongsma wrote: On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > If it took me less than a minute to come up with a possible solution, then yes, I am going to give "childish scarcasm". Very big of you sir. Bravo. It would have been very difficult for you to kindly suggest googling, I suspect. Jonathon _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051226/3306fb54/attachment.htm From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Dec 26 19:17:16 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Dec 26 19:17:59 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512270117.jBR1HG316273@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Sun Microsystems W1100Z Sun W1100Z/Opteron 150/1 GB RAM/with on board SCSI controller. Includes Solaris 9, workstation supplemental and documentation media. No keyboard or mouse. Purchased February 2005. Selling for $2000. Seller Email address: neal dot krasnoff at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Dec 26 19:20:20 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Dec 26 19:21:14 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512270120.jBR1KKf17038@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Sale Subject: Dell Dimension 4700 Dimension 4700/2.8 Ghz P4/1 GB RAM/80 GB SATA drive/keyboard and mouse/XP Home and driver cds. Selling for $500/RO Seller Email address: neal dot krasnoff at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From evisuale007 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 26 19:25:51 2005 From: evisuale007 at yahoo.com (Erick Stohr) Date: Mon Dec 26 19:25:57 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051227012551.90113.qmail@web35903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Are you Brittish? I ask because of the use of "Bravo, sir, suspect". I guess I feel like I am being questioned by Sherlock Holmes. Just curious, because too many people try to act smart by the use of words. Jonathon Jongsma wrote: On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > If it took me less than a minute to come up with a possible solution, then yes, I am going to give "childish scarcasm". Very big of you sir. Bravo. It would have been very difficult for you to kindly suggest googling, I suspect. Jonathon _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051226/b4c53040/attachment.htm From webmaster at mn-linux.org Mon Dec 26 19:27:24 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Mon Dec 26 19:28:13 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512270127.jBR1ROY20049@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: Sun Ultra 1 Enterprise No hard drives or sleds, wiring hacked, but it runs. I think. It used to. It's yours. Seller Email address: neal dot krasnoff at gmail dot com http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From erikerik at gmail.com Mon Dec 26 21:23:38 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Mon Dec 26 21:24:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051227012551.90113.qmail@web35903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051227012551.90113.qmail@web35903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > Are you Brittish? I ask because of the use of "Bravo, sir, suspect". I guess > I feel like I am being questioned by Sherlock Holmes. Just curious, because > too many people try to act smart by the use of words. Seriously - let's grow up kids. The OP asked a simple question which should have been given a simple answer. Let it go. From j_wrocky at comcast.net Tue Dec 27 05:55:38 2005 From: j_wrocky at comcast.net (Jerry Weihrauch) Date: Tue Dec 27 05:56:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? Message-ID: <43B12BBA.1010904@comcast.net> Have a question about Knoppix 3.6 after install. Installed Knoppix 3.6, everything went well and tried various applications like Firefox and Thunderbird, they worked well. So I did apt-get update and then apt-get upgrade, after rebooting and login, the kdm loads to the point and stops at "loading peripherals", screen goes blank for a minute starts over at the login screen. So unable to login. Posted the problem on the Knoppix forum. Got an "smart" answer something like "well knoppix is a live CD system, what do you expect? Knoppix is not meant to be installed to the HDD". Earlier versions of Knoppix installed on the HDD worked fine after doing update and upgrade. Also I stopped at boot before kdm loads and tried "apt-get reinstall kdm" came back that kdm was all ready installed. So now I am stumped. Reinstalled Knoppix version 3.5, now have the same problem. I noticed when doing the updates, it removes kdm and some kde files and does not reinstall them. Just for another check I downloaded Kubuntu 5.04 "Hoary Hedgehog", installed it and did update and upgrade, it works fine. Why I want to use Knoppix? It has all the Amateur Radio programs in Synaptic, where Kubuntu does not and don't feel up to installing them via tar ball method. Wonder if any one else has the same problem with Knoppix 3.6? Jerry - K0HZI From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 06:31:32 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Tue Dec 27 06:32:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <43B12BBA.1010904@comcast.net> References: <43B12BBA.1010904@comcast.net> Message-ID: On 12/27/05, Jerry Weihrauch wrote: > Have a question about Knoppix 3.6 after install. > > Installed Knoppix 3.6, everything went well and tried various > applications like Firefox and Thunderbird, they worked well. So I did > apt-get update and then apt-get upgrade, after rebooting and login, the > kdm loads to the point and stops at "loading peripherals", screen goes > blank for a minute starts over at the login screen. So unable to > login. Posted the problem on the Knoppix forum. Got an "smart" answer > something like "well knoppix is a live CD system, what do you expect? > Knoppix is not meant to be installed to the HDD". Earlier versions of > Knoppix installed on the HDD worked fine after doing update and > upgrade. Also I stopped at boot before kdm loads and tried "apt-get > reinstall kdm" came back that kdm was all ready installed. So now I am > stumped. Reinstalled Knoppix version 3.5, now have the same problem. I > noticed when doing the updates, it removes kdm and some kde files and > does not reinstall them. I've only tried to do a hdd install of knoppix once, and it failed miserably, so I've never tried it again. I'm shooting from the hip here, but my guess is that the knoppix devs spend ~95% of their time making sure that the livecd works and then throw whatever "free" time they have at the hdd install. > Just for another check I downloaded Kubuntu 5.04 "Hoary Hedgehog", > installed it and did update and upgrade, it works fine. Why I want to > use Knoppix? It has all the Amateur Radio programs in Synaptic, where > Kubuntu does not and don't feel up to installing them via tar ball method. > > Wonder if any one else has the same problem with Knoppix 3.6? Unless I'm mistaken, both knoppix and Ubuntu are debian-based. If that is the case, you should be able to start up knoppix, check the /etc/apt.sources file and find the source that the Amateur Radio stuff gets pulled from and then add that line to the apt.sources file in Ubuntu. This should work, right? Please correct me if I'm wrong. In closing, if you're looking for a distro to install to your hard drive, stick to ubuntu, fedora, etc...distros that were designed from the ground up to be installed, not to be livecds. Knoppix is a great project, no doubt, but it's best used as a livecd and nothing else. Oh, and don't be afraid of trying to install apps from their source tarballs - at first glance it looks confusing, but most mature apps come with very good documentation on how to best configure, compile, and install. From whiterabbit1 at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 06:55:49 2005 From: whiterabbit1 at gmail.com (Ryan) Date: Tue Dec 27 06:56:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] RAID questions In-Reply-To: <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> References: <43A89121.2060908@trutwins.homeip.net> <20051221174140.GA6164@mail.el-swifto.com> <43A9B207.8050008@trutwins.homeip.net> Message-ID: <307a337f0512270455k14b7baecu598753acd2d6bc5@mail.gmail.com> On 12/21/05, Josh Trutwin wrote: > > I guess it doesn't take the place of a good backup strategy, but as I > see it with a RAID-1 setup if one of the drives goes bad you should be > able to use the other drive while you replace the faulty one. I think > that's a bit of an oversimplification though. Keep in mind, those drives should also be connected to separate controllers because a controller can go bad and corrupt data. If you have only one controller all you've managed to do with RAID1 is corrupt 2 drives (arrays) at the same time. And you're correct backups are still needed for a variety of reasons. From jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 08:20:27 2005 From: jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com (Jonathon Jongsma) Date: Tue Dec 27 08:22:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <43B12BBA.1010904@comcast.net> Message-ID: On 12/27/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > Unless I'm mistaken, both knoppix and Ubuntu are debian-based. If > that is the case, you should be able to start up knoppix, check the > /etc/apt.sources file and find the source that the Amateur Radio stuff > gets pulled from and then add that line to the apt.sources file in > Ubuntu. This should work, right? Please correct me if I'm wrong. If the platform libraries are compatible between Knoppix3.6 and the Ubuntu version you're going to use *and* the package / dependency names are the same, then it might work, but it would definitely be better to install packages that were designed to go together (Disclaimer: I have no experience with Knoppix installs, so I don't know how compatible their repositories are with stock Debian or Ubuntu). This issue is a big reason why Debian's package management was better than Red Hat's in the past -- All of the Debian packages are in one repository and are designed to work together, whereas Red Hat historically had an official repository with a very limited number of packages and a bunch of independent and scattered repositories that sometimes worked together and sometimes not. Note that Red Hat / Fedora is much better now since the 'extras' repository is now an official part of the project, so most packages go there instead of in independent repositories. (Please don't take this as a RedHat vs. Debian debate -- I think both are excellent distributions). Having said that, are you sure that the amateur radio stuff isn't available in Ubuntu? Have you uncommented the lines for the 'universe' repositories in your /etc/apt/sources.list? Because there appears to be quite a few programs in their 'hamradio' category: see http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/hamradio/ (link to breezy packages but the same appear to exist for Hoary if you really want to install that version). If those packages satisfy your needs, then it's simply a matter of uncommenting one or two lines in your sources.list file and updating your synaptic package list. > Oh, and don't be afraid of trying to install apps from their source > tarballs - at first glance it looks confusing, but most mature apps > come with very good documentation on how to best configure, compile, > and install. Package management does add quite a few benefits, so you should certainly install a package for your distro if it's available, but here's a little tip that might make you feel a little better about installing from source when necessary: checkinstall (http://asic-linux.com.mx/~izto/checkinstall/) is very helpful little program. Basically, instead of doing the ./configure - make - make install routine, do ./configure - make - checkinstall. Checkinstall will build the software into a .deb and install it for you. There's no dependency information or anything like that, so you don't get any of those benefits from it, but it does make it much easier to keep track of software you've manually installed and uninstall it if necessary using the package management tools you are already familiar with (synaptic, apt-get, dpkg, etc). I know that checkinstall is available in the Ubuntu repositories (maybe in unverse again), I don't know about knoppix. Hope that helps, Jonathon From lcojiml at yahoo.com Tue Dec 27 09:44:35 2005 From: lcojiml at yahoo.com (Jim Louis) Date: Tue Dec 27 09:48:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I tend to agree that perhaps more research and trial/error should be put forth before sending an email asking for help. Sometimes taking a step back from the problem for a bit can help in looking at it in a different light. I like to think that part of all this open source is learning how to howto. After doing all the research then the questions seem to be more pertinent and detailed as well. my 0.02. jl Erick Stohr wrote: Well, I guess I assume too much these days, which is my "fault". And yes, with the amt of information out there and archived information (even my Mother knows how to use Google), I guess I could have politely suggested Google, BUT, with the way, except for a few people, I was treated by others when inquiring about questioins I had, I guess again I feel research and learning on your own is the "best" most (most importantly) "rewarding" way to learn. I am far far from a Linux expert, but have used it for a relatively long time, I am in a Windows world at work and we have one Linux server running and I am the only one to support it and I am not even THE System Admin. That is where the "I" in TEAM does not exist. So, do I treat people on this list as part of a TEAM, or try and help them learn on their own by being an a-hole. I honestly don't know. With companies like the GEEK Squad, who originally were "good", now being saturated by incompetent idiots after being purchased by Best Buy, (and I know this because I work a side business supporting some local MN residents and I have often heard "The Geek Squad said I need a whole new computer, rebuild the OS and there is no way to save any data") I question where IT is going and why people are going down that road, is it $ or is it a passion for something they enjoy, while getting paid. Work is work, but I have been blessed with something I never knew I would enjoy doing and getting paid, my process to get where I am at was not the easiest and don't feel that it should have been any other way. So yes, I could/should have said, please try Google. Jonathon Jongsma wrote: On 12/26/05, Erick Stohr wrote: > > If it took me less than a minute to come up with a possible solution, then yes, I am going to give "childish scarcasm". Very big of you sir. Bravo. It would have been very difficult for you to kindly suggest googling, I suspect. Jonathon _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less_______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list ///, //// \ /, / >. \ /, _/ /. James Louis \_ /_/ /. Tech Warrior \__/_ < http://tecnogichida.endoftheinternet.org /<<< \_\_ 612.203.2631 /,)^>>_._ \ lcojiml@yahoo.com (/ \\ /\\\ jglouisjr@gmail.com // ```` ======((`=======[when weather means business]======================= "I am an idealist. I don't know where I'm going but I'm on my way." - Carl Sandburg --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051227/cc1b06bf/attachment.htm From erikerik at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 10:03:08 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Tue Dec 27 10:08:19 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/27/05, Jim Louis wrote: > I tend to agree that perhaps more research and trial/error should be put > forth before sending an email asking for help. Sometimes taking a step back > from the problem for a bit can help in looking at it in a different light. I > like to think that part of all this open source is learning how to howto. > After doing all the research then the questions seem to be more pertinent > and detailed as well. I completely agree with you...however...even if someone *does* ask a seemingly easy-to-answer-with-a-quick-google-search question, it's not okay to lay into him like Mr. Stohr did. I understand what Erick was trying to get at and agree with him, but his delivery was cold and disrespectful at best. We all know that the impersonal nature of email makes it easy to slip into degrading and disrespectful comments. It would do us all good to do our due diligence to not let that happen. We're all intelligent people and should be able to have civilized conversation. /me gets off his soapbox. I'll throw this link into the mix...it's helped me many times throughout the years: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html -Erik From jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 10:07:19 2005 From: jonathon.jongsma at gmail.com (Jonathon Jongsma) Date: Tue Dec 27 10:09:15 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 12/27/05, Jim Louis wrote: > I tend to agree that perhaps more research and trial/error should be put > forth before sending an email asking for help. Sometimes taking a step back > from the problem for a bit can help in looking at it in a different light. I > like to think that part of all this open source is learning how to howto. > After doing all the research then the questions seem to be more pertinent > and detailed as well. > > my 0.02. > > jl > Nobody ever suggested that it would be wrong to point out when somebody should have done more research before asking a question. The only issue is how it's done. It's possible to reprimand somebody without being an asshole to them. That's all I was suggesting. Especially if there's no pattern of egregious behavior, which there doesn't seem to be in this case. (not to mention that the original post asked specifically if somebody on the list had a knoppix cd or iso -- it didn't ask how to find a link to download the ISO. For all anyone knew, he didn't have broadband and wanted to burn a copy from somebody locally so he didn't have to wait a week for the download. But the second poster jumped all over him without bothering to find out). jonathon From lcojiml at yahoo.com Tue Dec 27 10:18:04 2005 From: lcojiml at yahoo.com (Jim Louis) Date: Tue Dec 27 10:20:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051227161804.81914.qmail@web35413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> A valuable resource that, of course, should be listed on mn-linux valuable resource link page ;-) jl Erik Anderson wrote: On 12/27/05, Jim Louis wrote: > I tend to agree that perhaps more research and trial/error should be put > forth before sending an email asking for help. Sometimes taking a step back > from the problem for a bit can help in looking at it in a different light. I > like to think that part of all this open source is learning how to howto. > After doing all the research then the questions seem to be more pertinent > and detailed as well. I completely agree with you...however...even if someone *does* ask a seemingly easy-to-answer-with-a-quick-google-search question, it's not okay to lay into him like Mr. Stohr did. I understand what Erick was trying to get at and agree with him, but his delivery was cold and disrespectful at best. We all know that the impersonal nature of email makes it easy to slip into degrading and disrespectful comments. It would do us all good to do our due diligence to not let that happen. We're all intelligent people and should be able to have civilized conversation. /me gets off his soapbox. I'll throw this link into the mix...it's helped me many times throughout the years: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html -Erik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list ///, //// \ /, / >. \ /, _/ /. James Louis \_ /_/ /. Tech Warrior \__/_ < http://tecnogichida.endoftheinternet.org /<<< \_\_ 612.203.2631 /,)^>>_._ \ lcojiml@yahoo.com (/ \\ /\\\ jglouisjr@gmail.com // ```` ======((`=======[when weather means business]======================= "I am an idealist. I don't know where I'm going but I'm on my way." - Carl Sandburg --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051227/2f2bf338/attachment.htm From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Dec 27 10:39:44 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Tue Dec 27 10:40:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Strange Disk Behavior In-Reply-To: <200512271628.jBRGSPXV031839@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200512271628.jBRGSPXV031839@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <49576.192.28.2.52.1135701584.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Hello all, I've built a few machines in my time, and swapped oodles of hardware, but I think I've outdone myself this time. I had a machine (the Machine In Question) that was running as my server (Cyrus-IMAP, Sendmail, Apache, Gallery, Instiki) just fine... until in anticipation of getting a CPU upgrade, I tweaked some BIOS timing settings, and corrupted the hard disk. Badly. I loaded the "Performace" defaults back, but the damage to the disk was done. I also cooked the new CPU and destroyed the heat sink. I bought a new heat sink and re-installed the old CPU, and the temperature monitors seemed very happy again. Well last night I finally copied off the /etc directory, put it back in the MIQ and attempted to install FC4 cleanly (new partitions). It all seemed to go well until formatting, at which point it locked up hard. Since it's a Seagate drive, I tried to run Seagate's diagnostic software, and that locked up too. Perhaps of interest is that Hitachi's Drive Fitness Test quick and full tests passed AOK. I tried the install once again with the same result. Then I put in a Maxtor drive and got the SAME RESULT. Both drives appear to run fine in an external enclosure on another machine, but I have not done extensive tests. Now I'm beginning to think that the IDE controller, or maybe the entire motherboard is suspect, and that I shouldn't trust my incoming e-mail to such a flaky machine... so I should just replace the motherboard. If it matters, the motherboard is an ABIT KT7-RAID, the CPU is a 900MHz Athlon, it has 512MB PC133 RAM. The hard drives are Seagate and Maxtor 120GB ATA drives. The fan on the bridge chip failed about a year ago, and I recently replaced it. Since the motherboard has a RAID controller on it, I can disable the normal IDE controller, but that might not be trustworthy either. Your experienced opinions and guesses as to what's going on, and suggestions for next steps are welcome. And if you have a KT7 or KT7A with or without RAID you might sell, let me know. From cschumann at twp-llc.com Tue Dec 27 10:59:16 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Tue Dec 27 11:00:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Strange Disk Behavior In-Reply-To: <43B17129.2070509@msoe.edu> References: <200512271628.jBRGSPXV031839@delta.twp-llc.com> <49576.192.28.2.52.1135701584.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> <43B17129.2070509@msoe.edu> Message-ID: <5020.192.28.2.52.1135702756.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> Thanks Jonathan, I should have mentioned that I was not using the internal RAID or software RAID. Just the one drive on the regular IDE channel. But I think I will can this board, even though it worked so well for me for so long. Chris Jonathan Kline said: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > I had similar problems with the KT7A, and I said screw it and went with > an Asus A7V. > > The Kt7A seems to be a fairly flaky board, at least from my experience > and I've seen a lot of mention of others having problems with the board, > specifically the IDE/Raid controllers. Plus if memory serves under Linux > at any rate the raid controller does everything in software anyways. I > would try using the non raid ide connectors and just do software raid, > and while you're at it flash the bios on the board to the latest maybe > they fixed some of the issues with software :-d > > ~J > > Chris Schumann wrote: > | Hello all, > | > | I've built a few machines in my time, and swapped oodles of hardware, > but | I think I've outdone myself this time. > | > | I had a machine (the Machine In Question) that was running as my > server | (Cyrus-IMAP, Sendmail, Apache, Gallery, Instiki) just fine... > until in | anticipation of getting a CPU upgrade, I tweaked some BIOS > timing | settings, and corrupted the hard disk. Badly. I loaded the > "Performace" | defaults back, but the damage to the disk was done. I > also cooked the new | CPU and destroyed the heat sink. I bought a new > heat sink and re-installed | the old CPU, and the temperature monitors > seemed very happy again. | > | Well last night I finally copied off the /etc directory, put it back > in | the MIQ and attempted to install FC4 cleanly (new partitions). It > all | seemed to go well until formatting, at which point it locked up > hard. | > | Since it's a Seagate drive, I tried to run Seagate's diagnostic > software, | and that locked up too. Perhaps of interest is that > Hitachi's Drive | Fitness Test quick and full tests passed AOK. > | > | I tried the install once again with the same result. Then I put in a | > Maxtor drive and got the SAME RESULT. Both drives appear to run fine in > an | external enclosure on another machine, but I have not done > extensive | tests. > | > | Now I'm beginning to think that the IDE controller, or maybe the > entire | motherboard is suspect, and that I shouldn't trust my incoming > e-mail to | such a flaky machine... so I should just replace the > motherboard. | > | If it matters, the motherboard is an ABIT KT7-RAID, the CPU is a > 900MHz | Athlon, it has 512MB PC133 RAM. The hard drives are Seagate and > Maxtor | 120GB ATA drives. The fan on the bridge chip failed about a > year ago, and | I recently replaced it. Since the motherboard has a RAID > controller on it, | I can disable the normal IDE controller, but that > might not be trustworthy | either. > | > | Your experienced opinions and guesses as to what's going on, and | > suggestions for next steps are welcome. And if you have a KT7 or KT7A > with | or without RAID you might sell, let me know. > | > | > | > | _______________________________________________ > | TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > | tclug-list@mn-linux.org > | http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > | > > - -- > Jonathan Kline > Milwaukee School of Engineering > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > > iD8DBQFDsXEpQkF4UQaOvSoRAps9AJ974e41YHRXfr/YeykQTUOUPCIkQQCgzFaE > Fsy/Lgtyh85SAsz+sy9apy8= > =dNh1 > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu Tue Dec 27 11:39:04 2005 From: mbmiller at taxa.epi.umn.edu (Mike Miller) Date: Tue Dec 27 11:40:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 27 Dec 2005, Jonathon Jongsma wrote: > (not to mention that the original post asked specifically if somebody on > the list had a knoppix cd or iso -- it didn't ask how to find a link to > download the ISO. For all anyone knew, he didn't have broadband and > wanted to burn a copy from somebody locally so he didn't have to wait a > week for the download. That's what I thought he wanted. Maybe it is too subtle, but I think sending a google link is a good way to make a point. For example, this... http://www.google.com/search?q=Knoppix+3.6+iso ...says "you could have used google" and it shows how to use it. It's also compact. The original poster could then respond by saying that he has no CD burner, or he doesn't have broadband, or whatever. Everyone gets his point across and there is no in-your-face insult exchange. Mike From aristophrenic at warpmail.net Tue Dec 27 12:14:36 2005 From: aristophrenic at warpmail.net (Isaac Atilano) Date: Tue Dec 27 12:16:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <20051227004629.52992.qmail@web35906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051227154435.89930.qmail@web35412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1135707276.16956.250613630@webmail.messagingengine.com> I would like to say that I don't like having my inbox flooded every time someone flames when someone doesn't know how to "properly" post a question. As has been stated before, a private message will get your point across to them. The reason I'm sending this to the entire list is because of the number of members that have contributed to this annoyance. If you consider me be adding to the problem by writing this message I'm sorry. This is my first and last post on this topic. From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 13:24:33 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Tue Dec 27 13:26:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Browser Feature for Book Reading In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9d6c82530512271124k49338498g3fd8e154047a9600@mail.gmail.com> Take a look at the grease monkey extension for firefox. It is a user scripting environment that allows for easy changing the way pages are displayed. For example, you can use it to always turn http:// text into links. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051227/955d2bed/attachment.htm From jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 13:29:40 2005 From: jeff.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jeff Rasmussen) Date: Tue Dec 27 13:30:00 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Knoppix 3.6 iso anyone? In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0512251938j3c2fadb7jdb1d841609cabf3a@mail.gmail.com> References: <65293fcc0512251938j3c2fadb7jdb1d841609cabf3a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9d6c82530512271129x75fb0306s3758902a9683aaf1@mail.gmail.com> I've got a couple of free Ubuntu CDs. One is a live cd environment. One is the installer. I commute between downtown Minneapolis and Farmington. -- Jeff Rasmussen GPG public key 0x9686C12F -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051227/bd71b899/attachment.htm From slinabery at worldcycling.com Tue Dec 27 15:40:41 2005 From: slinabery at worldcycling.com (Steve Linabery) Date: Tue Dec 27 18:48:47 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' Message-ID: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> Hi all, Sorry in advance if this is common knowledge or in an archive...I'm being lazy. The time has finally come for me to retire Win98se for my gaming platform at home. On my home computer, I have Win98se on win_disk, FC4 on lin_disk. Grub handles booting with MBR on win_disk. What I figured I would do is: -1) buy winXP "pro" 0) boot linux 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk (for eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new windows) 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity disk (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk 3) reconnect disk lin_disk 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens I'm wondering if step 4 will "work". Like, will anaconda recognize that I have an existing linux installation and just install grub for me so I can have a happy dual-OS system again? thanks s -- Steve Linabery B94B C3C7 8A27 FF09 3C9D E992 5A20 2492 D5F5 EE51 This electronic message transmission contains information from the sender's organization that may be proprietary, confidential and/or privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual(s) or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying or distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by replying to the address listed in the "From:" From john.meier at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 19:20:40 2005 From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier) Date: Tue Dec 27 19:22:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> References: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> Message-ID: <65293fcc0512271720t7457cbe8n898faaaecf729ebb@mail.gmail.com> On 12/27/05, Steve Linabery wrote: > > Hi all, > > Sorry in advance if this is common knowledge or in an archive...I'm being > lazy. > > The time has finally come for me to retire Win98se for my gaming platform > at home. > > On my home computer, I have Win98se on win_disk, FC4 on lin_disk. Grub > handles booting with MBR on win_disk. > > What I figured I would do is: > -1) buy winXP "pro" > 0) boot linux > 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk (for > eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new windows) > 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity disk > (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk > 3) reconnect disk lin_disk > 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens I would think you could just buy an xp upgrade and upgrade 98. Windows won't see the linux stuff, but it may srcew with the MBR - in which case you could just repair/reintall grub (maybe from FC install discs? I have no experiecne with fc4 though...) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051227/0490ee82/attachment.htm From auditodd at comcast.net Tue Dec 27 20:50:08 2005 From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd@comcast.net) Date: Tue Dec 27 20:52:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' Message-ID: <122820050250.24188.43B1FD60000B020B00005E7C22007623020B0B019B070B9A0E@comcast.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: John Meier > On 12/27/05, Steve Linabery wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Sorry in advance if this is common knowledge or in an archive...I'm being > > lazy. > > > > The time has finally come for me to retire Win98se for my gaming platform > > at home. > > > > On my home computer, I have Win98se on win_disk, FC4 on lin_disk. Grub > > handles booting with MBR on win_disk. > > > > What I figured I would do is: > > -1) buy winXP "pro" > > 0) boot linux > > 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk (for > > eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new windows) > > 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity disk > > (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk > > 3) reconnect disk lin_disk > > 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens > > > > I would think you could just buy an xp upgrade and upgrade 98. Windows > won't see the linux stuff, but it may srcew with the MBR - in which case you > could just repair/reintall grub (maybe from FC install discs? I have no > experiecne with fc4 though...) > As a Windows "jockey" I have to say that you do NOT want to buy an "upgrade" version of Windows XP. If you want to retain Windows, then do yourself a favor and buy Windows XP Professional (last I checked it was $149 with any hardware purchase at General Nanosys). Also, you will want to run WinXP on an NTFS partition, not FAT32. Everything I've seen has said install Windows first and then install Linux. Personally, I would install Windows on the entire disk, defragment, then use BootIt Next Generation to shrink down the Windows partition to the size you want. Then install Linux on the remaining disk space. If you keep your "/home" directory and install Linux exactly the same as you had it, it should work/look the same as before. Just my $0.02. Todd Young -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: John Meier Subject: Re: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 01:26:21 +0000 Size: 3680 Url: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051228/4158e4f0/attachment-0001.eml From timo at bolverk.net Tue Dec 27 21:19:31 2005 From: timo at bolverk.net (Tim Oudin) Date: Tue Dec 27 21:18:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0512271720t7457cbe8n898faaaecf729ebb@mail.gmail.com> References: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> <65293fcc0512271720t7457cbe8n898faaaecf729ebb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43B20443.8050205@bolverk.net> John Meier wrote: > > > On 12/27/05, *Steve Linabery* > wrote: > > Hi all, > > Sorry in advance if this is common knowledge or in an > archive...I'm being lazy. > > The time has finally come for me to retire Win98se for my gaming > platform at home. > > On my home computer, I have Win98se on win_disk, FC4 on lin_disk. > Grub handles booting with MBR on win_disk. > > What I figured I would do is: > -1) buy winXP "pro" > 0) boot linux > 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk > (for eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new > windows) > 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity > disk (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk > 3) reconnect disk lin_disk > 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens > > > > I would think you could just buy an xp upgrade and upgrade 98. > Windows won't see the linux stuff, but it may srcew with the MBR - in > which case you could just repair/reintall grub (maybe from FC install > discs? I have no experiecne with fc4 though...) I've done a similar procedure (I wouldn't call it an upgrade!) before. I had a similar setup many years ago, copied the linux boot loader info, rewrote boot.ini and used the windows boot loader to boot into linux. There are several howtos out there but this is the first I found tonight that looks vaguely familiar. http://pcquest.ciol.com/content/networking/100080119.asp Just an option... Good luck. Timo From kc0iog at gmail.com Tue Dec 27 21:40:55 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Tue Dec 27 21:42:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <43B20443.8050205@bolverk.net> References: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> <65293fcc0512271720t7457cbe8n898faaaecf729ebb@mail.gmail.com> <43B20443.8050205@bolverk.net> Message-ID: <2c6699da0512271940m7398821bxf8e573705c8fa278@mail.gmail.com> On 12/27/05, Tim Oudin wrote: > John Meier wrote: > > On 12/27/05, *Steve Linabery* > What I figured I would do is: > > -1) buy winXP "pro" > > 0) boot linux > > 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk > > (for eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new > > windows) > > 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity > > disk (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk > > 3) reconnect disk lin_disk > > 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens You'll have to make some grub changes and I'm not fluent in grub. You should just be able to make the needed changes to your grub config then install grub on the MBR of xp_disk. Not sure if you can do that from the rescue mode of the FC4 disks, I'm not an FC4 guru. > I've done a similar procedure (I wouldn't call it an upgrade!) before. > I had a similar setup many years ago, copied the linux boot loader info, > rewrote boot.ini and used the windows boot loader to boot into linux. I've done that before but ran into an issue. When you boot linux from the XP loader, you can't mount xp_disk in linux. This was a minor issue, but it did cause me some problems when I was trying to move data back and forth. Also, when intermixing NT/2K/XP and linux, I like to carve out a nice size (5-10 GB) FAT32 partition as "neutral" space for moving files around. Go ahead and install XP on NTFS, you really should. Since XP can't see the linux partition and linux can't write to NTFS safely, having a FAT32 partition to move files back and forth on is a huge help. -Brian From ewilts at ewilts.org Tue Dec 27 22:04:23 2005 From: ewilts at ewilts.org (Ed Wilts) Date: Tue Dec 27 22:06:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> References: <3436983.1135719691401.JavaMail.root@mail.worldcycling.com> Message-ID: <20051228040423.GA28984@www.ewilts.org> On Tue, Dec 27, 2005 at 03:40:41PM -0600, Steve Linabery wrote: > What I figured I would do is: > -1) buy winXP "pro" > 0) boot linux > 1) mount win_disk as VFAT and tar the entire disk onto lin_disk (for eventually restoring saved games & other data to the new windows) > 2) physically disconnect both drives, install new higher capacity disk (let's call it xp_disk!), install xp to new disk > 3) reconnect disk lin_disk > 4) boot from FC4 install CDs and see what happens > > I'm wondering if step 4 will "work". Like, will anaconda recognize > that I have an existing linux installation and just install grub for > me so I can have a happy dual-OS system again? Boot FC4 into rescue mode, mount your FC4 partition, and run grub-install. Nothing to it. I've wiped out my MBR of a fully functional Linux environment with fdisk /mbr and recovered it this way. This would work if you didn't wipe out the Linux partitions. However, you are wiping them out. You may want to look at something like Mondo Rescue to create ISOs of your original Linux system and recover them that way. There's really no reason you need to re-install FC4 again. .../Ed -- Ed Wilts, RHCE Mounds View, MN, USA mailto:ewilts@ewilts.org Member #1, Red Hat Community Ambassador Program From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 08:30:46 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Wed Dec 28 08:32:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? Message-ID: I'm wondering if it's possible to terminate 4 T-1s in a Cisco 2651 router. Both the WIC slots are open in this router, so my question is more about whether or not the processor of the 2651 will handle it. Thanks- Erik From kc0iog at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 08:52:02 2005 From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall) Date: Wed Dec 28 08:52:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2c6699da0512280652x2c1292ffk377da2be2c3442a3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/28/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > I'm wondering if it's possible to terminate 4 T-1s in a Cisco 2651 > router. Both the WIC slots are open in this router, so my question is > more about whether or not the processor of the 2651 will handle it. That should be able to handle it. 4 T1's isn't a whole lot of data to a Cisco router, even of that size. As long as you have enough interfaces, that should work. -Brian From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 08:59:50 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Wed Dec 28 08:59:46 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? In-Reply-To: <2c6699da0512280652x2c1292ffk377da2be2c3442a3@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da0512280652x2c1292ffk377da2be2c3442a3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/28/05, Brian Wall wrote: > > That should be able to handle it. 4 T1's isn't a whole lot of data to > a Cisco router, even of that size. As long as you have enough > interfaces, that should work. Thanks, Brian. Yah, I do have enough interfaces - both WIC slots are open and you can get WIC cards that terminate 2 T1s each. From cschumann at twp-llc.com Wed Dec 28 09:12:45 2005 From: cschumann at twp-llc.com (Chris Schumann) Date: Wed Dec 28 09:14:01 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <200512280311.jBS3BFkU001543@delta.twp-llc.com> References: <200512280311.jBS3BFkU001543@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <56741.192.28.2.52.1135782765.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> > As a Windows "jockey" I have to say that you do NOT want to buy an > "upgrade" version of Windows XP. If you want to retain Windows, then do > yourself a favor and buy Windows XP Professional (last I checked it was > $149 with any hardware purchase at General Nanosys). Also, you will want > to run WinXP on an NTFS partition, not FAT32. Be aware that would be the OEM version (which is what I usually buy) and will not upgrade an existing OS. That's often OK because clean installs are always better anyway... Windows or Linux. Prices online can be very good: OEM XP Home is $79, OEM XP Pro $121 at compuplus. > Everything I've seen has said install Windows first and then install > Linux. Personally, I would install Windows on the entire disk, > defragment, then use BootIt Next Generation to shrink down the Windows > partition to the size you want. Then install Linux on the remaining disk > space. If you keep your "/home" directory and install Linux exactly the > same as you had it, it should work/look the same as before. I would (and have) partition first, then install Windows, then Linux, avoiding the whole partition resizing issue. Personal preference. You should already know, as a Fedora user, that it will want to make LVM partitions. I would not recommend LVM for dual boot or anything but a dedicated server where uptime is important... unless you want to learn new recovery techniques if the drive gets corrupted. (Hard lesson learned!) Chris Schumann From there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 09:13:37 2005 From: there.can.be.only.two.apparently at gmail.com (Loren H. Burlingame) Date: Wed Dec 28 09:14:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Browser Feature for Book Reading In-Reply-To: <9d6c82530512271124k49338498g3fd8e154047a9600@mail.gmail.com> References: <9d6c82530512271124k49338498g3fd8e154047a9600@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Firefox with the session saver extension will do exactly what you want On 12/27/05, Jeff Rasmussen wrote: > Take a look at the grease monkey extension for firefox. It is a user > scripting environment that allows for easy changing the way pages are > displayed. For example, you can use it to always turn http:// text into > links. > > > -- > Jeff Rasmussen > GPG public key 0x9686C12F > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > -- Loren H. Burlingame GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) From MKroska at kdv.com Wed Dec 28 10:03:43 2005 From: MKroska at kdv.com (Mark J. Kroska) Date: Wed Dec 28 10:06:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? Message-ID: Erik-- As long as you have enough free interfaces to handle the T-1s you should be fine -- conditionally. Generally the issue is the amount of RAM needed to do routing long before CPU power. If you are doing static routing you should be more than fine...you could probably have 8 or more T-1s without running low on CPU resources. If you were doing dynamic routing the CPU still may not be getting hammered, again the RAM would be the limiting factor. (Dynamic routing meaning RIP, OSPF, BGP, etc. The more complex the routing tables, the more CPU power you need) I've successfully run 2 T-1s with a 'light' BGP load with 64MB RAM before (in a staging environment), and it barely scratched the CPU, where the RAM was nearly fully utilized. Out of curiosity, how much RAM does the unit have? What type of interfaces will you be terminating with? Will any of the T-1s be bonded/multiplexed or channelized? Another factor to consider if you don't have the interfaces purchased: not all T-1 interfaces work with all levels of firmware. I ran into an issue with a newer WIC and an older firmware--it wouldn't even detect it! Keep us posted on the project! Mark Mark J. Kroska Director of Web Services KDV Technology and Consulting Services, Inc. Direct 320-258-6412 Main 320-252-7060 Fax 320-252-9627 mkroska@kdv.com "NOTICE: This E-mail (including attachments) is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited, Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, then delete it. Thank you." ________________________________ From: tclug-list-bounces@mn-linux.org on behalf of Erik Anderson Sent: Wed 12/28/2005 8:30 AM To: tclug Subject: [SPAM] - [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? - Email found in subject I'm wondering if it's possible to terminate 4 T-1s in a Cisco 2651 router. Both the WIC slots are open in this router, so my question is more about whether or not the processor of the 2651 will handle it. Thanks- Erik _______________________________________________ TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list@mn-linux.org http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list This disclosure is required by IRS Circular 230. Any tax advice expressed in this communication (including any attachments) is not intended to be used, and cannot be used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties imposed on the taxpayer by any governmental taxing authority or agency. In addition, if any such tax advice is made available to any person or party other than the party to whom the advice was originally directed, then such advice is to be considered as being delivered to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Kern, DeWenter, Viere, Ltd.) of the transaction or matter discussed or referenced. Thus, each taxpayer should seek specific tax advice based on the taxpayer's particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051228/b7b19510/attachment.htm From erikerik at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 10:25:57 2005 From: erikerik at gmail.com (Erik Anderson) Date: Wed Dec 28 10:27:11 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 12/28/05, Mark J. Kroska wrote: > > Erik-- > As long as you have enough free interfaces to handle the T-1s you should be > fine -- conditionally. > Generally the issue is the amount of RAM needed to do routing long before > CPU power. > If you are doing static routing you should be more than fine...you could > probably have 8 or more T-1s without running low on CPU resources. > If you were doing dynamic routing the CPU still may not be getting hammered, > again the RAM would be the limiting factor. (Dynamic routing meaning RIP, > OSPF, BGP, etc. The more complex the routing tables, the more CPU power you > need) > I've successfully run 2 T-1s with a 'light' BGP load with 64MB RAM before > (in a staging environment), and it barely scratched the CPU, where the RAM > was nearly fully utilized. > Out of curiosity, how much RAM does the unit have? What type of interfaces > will you be terminating with? > Will any of the T-1s be bonded/multiplexed or channelized? > > Another factor to consider if you don't have the interfaces purchased: not > all T-1 interfaces work with all levels of firmware. I ran into an issue > with a newer WIC and an older firmware--it wouldn't even detect it! Thanks for the info, Mark. In our case, we'll be using one 2651 to terminate all the T1s, which will then connect to a second 2651 which will do the routing. For the time being, it's all static routing. From ryan.langseth at gmail.com Wed Dec 28 14:29:19 2005 From: ryan.langseth at gmail.com (Ryan Langseth) Date: Wed Dec 28 14:30:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Browser Feature for Book Reading In-Reply-To: References: <9d6c82530512271124k49338498g3fd8e154047a9600@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/28/05, Loren H. Burlingame wrote: > > Firefox with the session saver extension will do exactly what you want > > On 12/27/05, Jeff Rasmussen wrote: > > Take a look at the grease monkey extension for firefox. It is a user > > scripting environment that allows for easy changing the way pages are > > displayed. For example, you can use it to always turn http:// text into > > links. > > > > > > -- > > Jeff Rasmussen > > GPG public key 0x9686C12F > > _______________________________________________ > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > > > > > > -- > Loren H. Burlingame > GPG Key ID: 0x112DCF4F > "Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes." > -William Shatner (a.k.a. Buck Murdock) > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20051228/5e469012/attachment.htm From WhtDruid at Druids-Grove.net Wed Dec 28 23:06:52 2005 From: WhtDruid at Druids-Grove.net (Daniel Rysztak) Date: Wed Dec 28 23:08:02 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] OT: any cisco experts in the house? In-Reply-To: <2c6699da0512280652x2c1292ffk377da2be2c3442a3@mail.gmail.com> References: <2c6699da0512280652x2c1292ffk377da2be2c3442a3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43B36EEC.9070303@Druids-Grove.net> I'd agree. The data's not going to be the killer, routing/load balancing would be more likely to be processor intensive. Using multilink is a pretty easy, low intensive way of sharing the 4 t's. Brian Wall wrote: >On 12/28/05, Erik Anderson wrote: > > >>I'm wondering if it's possible to terminate 4 T-1s in a Cisco 2651 >>router. Both the WIC slots are open in this router, so my question is >>more about whether or not the processor of the 2651 will handle it. >> >> > >That should be able to handle it. 4 T1's isn't a whole lot of data to >a Cisco router, even of that size. As long as you have enough >interfaces, that should work. > >-Brian > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > From webmaster at mn-linux.org Thu Dec 29 09:29:00 2005 From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds) Date: Thu Dec 29 09:30:03 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad Message-ID: <200512291529.jBTFT0c26909@crusader.real-time.com> New TCLUG Classified Ad Category: Computer Type of Ad: For Free Subject: HP IIIP printer and monitor I have an HP LaserJet IIIP printer with manuals that could use some clean rollers and a 15" compaq monitor. They're both sitting outside my garage for anyone that wants them. 117 West Eagle Lake Drive Maple Grove, MN 55369 Seller Email address: jpschewe at mtu dot net http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi From admin at lctn.org Thu Dec 29 17:15:21 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Thu Dec 29 17:16:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup Message-ID: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> I am setting up webgui, and get the following error in my browser when opening the site. Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package "Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 347. I found a forum that discussed the problem and added the following to httpd.conf, per their suggestion. PerlPostReadRequestHandler 'sub { Apache->request(shift) }' Now, error_log produces the following error: [Thu Dec 29 18:01:25 2005] [error] [client 192.168.0.24] Global $r object is not available. Set:\n\tPerlOptions +GlobalRequest\nin httpd.conf at (eval 187) line 1.\n What would be the fix on this? From bhartm at visi.com Fri Dec 30 04:17:10 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Fri Dec 30 04:18:04 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> Ooh. This is very interesting to me. I have no fix to offer, but I might add to the question. My first thought is that you may be using Apache2 and modPerl, knowingly or not. If I'm way off, I apologize. I've been through that wringer while trying TWiki in that manner. SuSE Pro since 9.1 installs Apache2 without consent. http://twiki.org might have some help. They are Apache/Perl experts. Raymond Norton wrote: >I am setting up webgui, and get the following error in my browser when >opening the site. > >Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package >"Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 347. > >I found a forum that discussed the problem and added the following to >httpd.conf, per their suggestion. > >PerlPostReadRequestHandler 'sub { Apache->request(shift) }' > >Now, error_log produces the following error: > >[Thu Dec 29 18:01:25 2005] [error] [client 192.168.0.24] Global $r object >is not available. Set:\n\tPerlOptions +GlobalRequest\nin httpd.conf at >(eval 187) line 1.\n > > >What would be the fix on this? > >_______________________________________________ >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tclug-list@mn-linux.org >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > From bhartm at visi.com Fri Dec 30 04:36:59 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Fri Dec 30 04:36:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> Message-ID: <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> I looked up webGUI. (pronounced web-gooey)! Check out the grammar on their home-page: "It was designed to allow the people who create the content, to manage it online, rather than content management taking up the time of the busy IT Staff." This is their _home_page_. If I wasn't so, busy, I'd use more, commas. Raymond, everyone, try TWiki instead. Bob Hartmann wrote: > Ooh. This is very interesting to me. I have no fix to offer, but I > might add to the question. > My first thought is that you may be using Apache2 and modPerl, > knowingly or not. If I'm way off, I apologize. > I've been through that wringer while trying TWiki in that manner. > SuSE Pro since 9.1 installs Apache2 without consent. http://twiki.org > might have some help. They are Apache/Perl experts. > > Raymond Norton wrote: > >> I am setting up webgui, and get the following error in my browser when >> opening the site. >> >> Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package >> "Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 347. >> >> I found a forum that discussed the problem and added the following to >> httpd.conf, per their suggestion. >> >> PerlPostReadRequestHandler 'sub { Apache->request(shift) }' >> >> Now, error_log produces the following error: >> >> [Thu Dec 29 18:01:25 2005] [error] [client 192.168.0.24] Global $r >> object >> is not available. Set:\n\tPerlOptions +GlobalRequest\nin httpd.conf at >> (eval 187) line 1.\n >> >> >> What would be the fix on this? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list@mn-linux.org >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > From ewilts at ewilts.org Fri Dec 30 08:49:09 2005 From: ewilts at ewilts.org (Ed Wilts) Date: Fri Dec 30 08:50:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> Message-ID: <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> On Fri, Dec 30, 2005 at 04:36:59AM -0600, Bob Hartmann wrote: > I looked up webGUI. (pronounced web-gooey)! > > If I wasn't so, busy, I'd use more, commas. Raymond, everyone, try > TWiki instead. TWiki and webgui solve different problems. TWiki is designed for everybody to make changes, whereas webgui is designed for the content administrators to make changes without knowing html. >From the FAQ: Can I use WebGUI on my $5.95 hoster? Probably not. WebGUI is designed to be an enterprise application. Therefore it is usually installed to be the only thing running on a server. Instead of TWiki, run something like Drupal - you can run this on low-cost hosting providers. I've run it on vizaweb (a lousy company to deal with but really cheap) and phpwebhosting (a bit more money but really good at under $10/month). If you want to see Drupal in action, check out our non-profit site at http://www.bundlesoflove.org. This is running at vizaweb. I've also had it running on my home server and at phpwebhosting. .../Ed > Bob Hartmann wrote: > > >Ooh. This is very interesting to me. I have no fix to offer, but I > >might add to the question. > >My first thought is that you may be using Apache2 and modPerl, > >knowingly or not. If I'm way off, I apologize. > >I've been through that wringer while trying TWiki in that manner. > >SuSE Pro since 9.1 installs Apache2 without consent. http://twiki.org > >might have some help. They are Apache/Perl experts. > > > >Raymond Norton wrote: > > > >>I am setting up webgui, and get the following error in my browser when > >>opening the site. > >> > >>Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package > >>"Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 347. > >> > >>I found a forum that discussed the problem and added the following to > >>httpd.conf, per their suggestion. > >> > >>PerlPostReadRequestHandler 'sub { Apache->request(shift) }' > >> > >>Now, error_log produces the following error: > >> > >>[Thu Dec 29 18:01:25 2005] [error] [client 192.168.0.24] Global $r > >>object > >>is not available. Set:\n\tPerlOptions +GlobalRequest\nin httpd.conf at > >>(eval 187) line 1.\n > >> > >> > >>What would be the fix on this? > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > >>tclug-list@mn-linux.org > >>http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > >> > >> > >> > > > >_______________________________________________ > >TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > >tclug-list@mn-linux.org > >http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list@mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list -- Ed Wilts, RHCE Mounds View, MN, USA mailto:ewilts@ewilts.org Member #1, Red Hat Community Ambassador Program From bhartm at visi.com Sat Dec 31 00:59:45 2005 From: bhartm at visi.com (Bob Hartmann) Date: Sat Dec 31 01:00:05 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> Message-ID: <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> Thanks for the tip. drupal looks very cool. I may use it instead of TWiki for my current project. The Onion uses it, so.. Apologies to Raymond for changing the subject. It was an accident! I still can't answer your question. Ed Wilts wrote: >TWiki and webgui solve different problems. TWiki is designed for >everybody to make changes, whereas webgui is designed for the content >administrators to make changes without knowing html. > >>From the FAQ: >Can I use WebGUI on my $5.95 hoster? >Probably not. WebGUI is designed to be an enterprise application. >Therefore it is usually installed to be the only thing running on a >server. > >Instead of TWiki, run something like Drupal - you can run this on >low-cost hosting providers. I've run it on vizaweb (a lousy company to >deal with but really cheap) and phpwebhosting (a bit more money but >really good at under $10/month). > >If you want to see Drupal in action, check out our non-profit site at >http://www.bundlesoflove.org. This is running at vizaweb. I've also >had it running on my home server and at phpwebhosting. > > .../Ed > > > >>>Raymond Norton wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>>I am setting up webgui, and get the following error in my browser when >>>>opening the site. >>>> >>>>Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package >>>>"Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 347. >>>> >>>>I found a forum that discussed the problem and added the following to >>>>httpd.conf, per their suggestion. >>>> >>>>PerlPostReadRequestHandler 'sub { Apache->request(shift) }' >>>> >>>>Now, error_log produces the following error: >>>> >>>>[Thu Dec 29 18:01:25 2005] [error] [client 192.168.0.24] Global $r >>>>object >>>>is not available. Set:\n\tPerlOptions +GlobalRequest\nin httpd.conf at >>>>(eval 187) line 1.\n >>>> >>>> >>>>What would be the fix on this? >>>> >>>> >>>> From drue at therub.org Sat Dec 31 11:20:52 2005 From: drue at therub.org (Dan Rue) Date: Sat Dec 31 11:22:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> Message-ID: <20051231172052.GI29291@therub.org> On Sat, Dec 31, 2005 at 12:59:45AM -0600, Bob Hartmann wrote: > > Thanks for the tip. drupal looks very cool. I may use it instead of > TWiki for my current project. The Onion uses it, so.. Apologies to > Raymond for changing the subject. It was an accident! I still can't > answer your question. > I just have to respond when twiki is mentioned. I think someone recommended it a few messages ago (deleted already). As a user and admin who is stuck on twiki, I have a few criticisms. The way I see it is thus: twiki was one of if not the first wiki implimentation. That's great, way to be a leader. However, strike one, it's perl. Strike two, it's complicated to install, set up, and use compared to modern wikis. Strike three, it's syntax is horrid. Wiki's have come a long way. Don't make the mistake of going wiht twiki if you're doing a fresh wiki install today. I'm glad you found drupal and like it. drupal and wiki's solve different problems (we run both at work internally *sigh*). For wikis, i recommend mediawiki (think: wikipedia) and dokuwiki (not much experience but I hear good things). Dan From kaze0010 at umn.edu Sat Dec 31 16:23:42 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Sat Dec 31 16:24:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] Re: windows 'upgrade' In-Reply-To: <56741.192.28.2.52.1135782765.squirrel@alpha.twp-llc.com> References: <200512280311.jBS3BFkU001543@delta.twp-llc.com> <200512280311.jBS3BFkU001543@delta.twp-llc.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20051231162342.05ee1a30@127.0.0.1> At 09:12 AM 12/28/2005 -0600, Chris Schumann wrote: >> As a Windows "jockey" I have to say that you do NOT want to buy an >> "upgrade" version of Windows XP. If you want to retain Windows, then do >> yourself a favor and buy Windows XP Professional (last I checked it was >> $149 with any hardware purchase at General Nanosys). Also, you will want >> to run WinXP on an NTFS partition, not FAT32. > >Be aware that would be the OEM version (which is what I usually buy) and >will not upgrade an existing OS. That's often OK because clean installs >are always better anyway... Windows or Linux. Prices online can be very >good: OEM XP Home is $79, OEM XP Pro $121 at compuplus. It is usually possible to do a 'clean install' using the upgrade version of a Windows CD. For WinXP: http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/windowsxp_sg_clean.asp "4b. Insert qualifying media If you are attempting to clean install with a Windows XP Home or Pro Upgrade CD, you will see this screen, which requires you to insert your previous Windows CD in order to verify that you qualify for the Upgrade version. Curiously, it says that you can use CDs from Windows NT 3.51 and Windows 95 in addition to those from 98, 98 SE, Millennium, or 2000, though these products cannot be upgraded to XP. Once you've proven that you qualify, hit ENTER to continue." This way, you can buy a lower cost upgrade CD and still do a clean install. From admin at lctn.org Sat Dec 31 17:47:27 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Sat Dec 31 17:48:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> Message-ID: <40258.204.212.34.10.1136072847.squirrel@lctn.org> > Apologies to > Raymond for changing the subject. It was an accident! I still can't > answer your question. Yeah Bob, what's the deal:) Actually, I have combed many forums, but have not found an answer yet. Here is a more detailed description of the problem that may help someone help me: ( By the way, we have used webgui for years, and love it!) I am trying to install webgui on a new centos install, Apache is httpd-2.0.52-19.ent.centos4, and mod_perl is mod_perl-1.99_16-4.centos4 Apache starts fine, without errors, until I edit perl.conf, by adding the following: SetHandler perl-script PerlHandler ModPerl::Registry PerlOptions +ParseHeaders PerlRequire /data/WebGUI/sbin/preload.perl This causes the following error from CGI.pm: Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package "Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 356. Apache::Request looks to come from libapreq-1.33. When I attempt to install it I get the following: perl Makefile.PL && make && make test && make install mod_perl 1.x ( < 1.99) is required at Makefile.PL line 34. BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at Makefile.PL line 36 Another forum recomended using Apache::Cookie, but It complains about the same thing. Any ideas how to fix this? From klinej at msoe.edu Sat Dec 31 18:25:31 2005 From: klinej at msoe.edu (Jonathan Kline) Date: Sat Dec 31 18:26:07 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <40258.204.212.34.10.1136072847.squirrel@lctn.org> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> <40258.204.212.34.10.1136072847.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: <43B7217B.4010004@msoe.edu> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I've never used CentOS or WebGUI, so take this with a grain of salt... Looks like your makefile for Apache::Request is borked somehow, so you have a couple of options... if You don't mind using source, download a clean copy of the source for Apache::Request, and build/install it w/o the use of rpms... or alternatively use CPAN... perl -e -MCPAN "install Apache::Request" You could also install Apache::Cookie using CPAN... Either way it looks like the rpms are a bit broke maybe? ~J Raymond Norton wrote: |> Apologies to |>Raymond for changing the subject. It was an accident! I still can't |>answer your question. | | | Yeah Bob, what's the deal:) | | Actually, I have combed many forums, but have not found an answer yet. | Here is a more detailed description of the problem that may help someone | help me: ( By the way, we have used webgui for years, and love it!) | | I am trying to install webgui on a new centos install, Apache is | httpd-2.0.52-19.ent.centos4, and mod_perl is | mod_perl-1.99_16-4.centos4 | Apache starts fine, without errors, until I edit perl.conf, by adding the | following: | | | SetHandler perl-script | PerlHandler ModPerl::Registry | PerlOptions +ParseHeaders | | PerlRequire /data/WebGUI/sbin/preload.perl | | | This causes the following error from CGI.pm: | | Can't locate object method "register_cleanup" via package | "Apache::RequestRec" at /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/CGI.pm line 356. | | Apache::Request looks to come from libapreq-1.33. When I attempt to | install it I get the following: | | perl Makefile.PL && make && make test && make install | mod_perl 1.x ( < 1.99) is required at Makefile.PL line 34. | BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at Makefile.PL line 36 | | Another forum recomended using Apache::Cookie, but It complains about the | same thing. | | Any ideas how to fix this? | | _______________________________________________ | TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota | tclug-list@mn-linux.org | http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list | - -- Jonathan Kline Milwaukee School of Engineering -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDtyF7QkF4UQaOvSoRAnTlAKCfaOvbqiYjMmVBuixjeK9Jd05MswCgnYcq jl6vORtGeJOlkmq+ap83ecY= =VIrM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From admin at lctn.org Sat Dec 31 18:51:59 2005 From: admin at lctn.org (Raymond Norton) Date: Sat Dec 31 18:52:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <43B7217B.4010004@msoe.edu> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> <40258.204.212.34.10.1136072847.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B7217B.4010004@msoe.edu> Message-ID: <50845.204.212.34.10.1136076719.squirrel@lctn.org> > You could also install Apache::Cookie using CPAN... > > Either way it looks like the rpms are a bit broke maybe? I used cpan, and it failed, so I went to .cpan in root,and attempted the install through MakeFile.pm, but it errors out. What rpm would you recommend for Apache::Cookie From ewilts at ewilts.org Sat Dec 31 19:21:52 2005 From: ewilts at ewilts.org (Ed Wilts) Date: Sat Dec 31 19:22:06 2005 Subject: [tclug-list] apache error / register_cleanup In-Reply-To: <50845.204.212.34.10.1136076719.squirrel@lctn.org> References: <40956.204.212.34.10.1135898121.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B50926.5020400@visi.com> <43B50DCB.5050308@visi.com> <20051230144909.GC10099@www.ewilts.org> <43B62C61.8000705@visi.com> <40258.204.212.34.10.1136072847.squirrel@lctn.org> <43B7217B.4010004@msoe.edu> <50845.204.212.34.10.1136076719.squirrel@lctn.org> Message-ID: <20060101012152.GC5144@www.ewilts.org> On Sat, Dec 31, 2005 at 06:51:59PM -0600, Raymond Norton wrote: > > You could also install Apache::Cookie using CPAN... > > > > Either way it looks like the rpms are a bit broke maybe? > > I used cpan, and it failed, so I went to .cpan in root,and attempted the > install through MakeFile.pm, but it errors out. > > > What rpm would you recommend for Apache::Cookie I haven't used this, but Dag has packages for both RHEL 3 and RHEL 4 which should work on CentOS (I use his packages for my Tao Linux distro which is a RHEL 4 rebuild). http://dag.wieers.com/packages/perl-Apache-AuthCookie/ .../Ed -- Ed Wilts, RHCE Mounds View, MN, USA mailto:ewilts@ewilts.org Member #1, Red Hat Community Ambassador Program