From adam.morris at redstargaming.net  Sun Nov  1 16:38:39 2009
From: adam.morris at redstargaming.net (Adam Morris)
Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 17:38:39 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Xorg.conf and widescreen LCDs
In-Reply-To: <51d20ae60910312048x6a2df600od7a0021faf2b5766@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2c6699da0910311448k369fe4c8y8ae31974e3d25abd@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0910312231180.15827@dragon.yaron.org>
	<51d20ae60910312048x6a2df600od7a0021faf2b5766@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20091101223839.GA6793@weegee.ath.cx>

I'm gonna give a thumbs up for Scott's suggestion as well, but it really depends on
the driver you're using.

Rather than using the vesa driver, try using the "nv" driver or
the proprietary nvidia driver
<http://www.nvidia.com/object/linux_display_amd64_190.42.html> (link is
for AMD64).  There are a lot of arguments about using the proprietary
driver but in all honesty the driver works very well for any users of
later nvidia cards, where the vesa and nv drivers can get be a serious
pain in the butt to configure.

Since you're in Debian, you can get an
older version than the 190.42 driver by getting the "nvidia-glx" package
in apt.  Right now the official stable repository has 173.14 and the unstable
repository has 185.18.  Either should be fine.  The nvidia-glx package
usually will take you through some configuration steps when you install
it, since the official nVidia drivers use some interesting configuration
methods in your xorg.conf file... don't be surprised if you don't see
your resolutions declared anywhere.

Hope this helps.

-Adam

On Sat, Oct 31, 2009 at 10:48:16PM -0500, Scott Dier wrote:
> I've gone one step further and tried removing the file completely and
> I think its actually worked on some setups (!).
> 
> On Sat, Oct 31, 2009 at 10:38 PM, Yaron <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
> > Hi there,
> >
> > On Sat, 31 Oct 2009, Brian Wall wrote:
> >
> >> Ok, I'll admit I'm not much of a genius when it comes to modifying
> >> xorg.conf. ?Every time I get a newish piece of hardware I am reminded
> >> of this.
> >
> > And I'll admit that my main desktop/s xorg.conf is an INSANE mess due to
> > an INSANELY over-complicated setup (two video cards and three monitors
> > with different resolutions/aspects) and the fact that it's technically the
> > same xorg.conf that started life as xfree86.conf and has just been taken
> > apart and put together with chewing gum and toothpicks as I've upgraded my
> > system over the past DECADE. No "auto config" has really ever been able to
> > figure it out EXACTLY right.
> >
> >
> > That said, I've found that on simple, single-monitor setups with just a
> > plain ol' USB mouse/keyboard, all you REALLY need in anything even
> > resembling a modern Linux distro is this:
> >
> > ### BEGIN xorg.conf ####################
> >
> > Section "Device"
> > ? ? ? ?Identifier ? ? ?"Configured Video Device"
> > EndSection
> >
> > Section "Monitor"
> > ? ? ? ?Identifier ? ? ?"Configured Monitor"
> > EndSection
> >
> > Section "Screen"
> > ? ? ? ?Identifier ? ? ?"Default Screen"
> > ? ? ? ?Monitor ? ? ? ? "Configured Monitor"
> > ? ? ? ?Device ? ? ? ? ?"Configured Video Device"
> > EndSection
> >
> > ### END xorg.conf #################
> >
> > It scares me a lot, but I've had that just WORK on machines with regular
> > aspects (1280x1024 and 1600x1200) and widescreen (1400x1050 and 1920x1080)
> > and whatever the heck aspect 1366x768 is.
> >
> > So my advice is try the super super super simple setup and see if that
> > works. (:
> >
> >
> >
> > -Yaron
> >
> > --
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Scott Dier <scott at dier.name>
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From scott at dier.name  Mon Nov  2 13:03:09 2009
From: scott at dier.name (Scott Dier)
Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 13:03:09 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare/virtualbox/esxi/xen/kvm
In-Reply-To: <4AEB3937.8030002@umn.edu>
References: <429c5ec20910301054u187cf1b2s7a33adf7a2b88b99@mail.gmail.com> 
	<4AEB3937.8030002@umn.edu>
Message-ID: <51d20ae60911021103yb383ceib9d0ed454bbc8cd9@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 1:06 PM, Elvedin Trnjanin <trnja001 at umn.edu> wrote:

> Resource overcommitting is really useful as it will allow you to give a VM

Both Xen and KVM can do this. (overcommit memory, cpu, and disk)

> The features ESX(i) and XenServer share are things like live VM migration,
> which means a VM running on one physical host can be migrated to run on a

Also available for xen and kvm:
http://code.google.com/p/ganeti/

Unlike xenserver, ganeti is free.  I'd focus on kvm+ganeti+drbd for
new installs, though.

Thanks,
-- 
Scott Dier <scott at dier.name>


From a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com  Mon Nov  2 13:07:27 2009
From: a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com (Andrew Kuriger)
Date: Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:07:27 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
In-Reply-To: <AB99974582884AF08229DC0815355051@dualasus>
References: <230489.86631.qm@web53802.mail.re2.yahoo.com><63874609a6067385a9a63159f3c31ad9.squirrel@flyballdogs.com>
	<4AEB1532.4070304@umn.edu>
	<AB99974582884AF08229DC0815355051@dualasus>
Message-ID: <e028fa088f6b0e68719f07c4a18a7fe7@mail.liquidphlux.com>


I am a bit leery of VMware at this point even though that is what I have
been using mainly. My huge problem being no vSphere client for Windows 7 or
Linux. I am probably going to look more into the Xen side of things since I
have heard good things.

~Andrew

On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 12:23:21 -0500, "Randy Clarksean"
<rclarksean at arvig.net> wrote:
> I echo the comments below on ESXi.  I am only running the 32bit version
at
> present, but I run an old Windows 2000 OS and Fedora Core 5 on it
without
> any problems ? all very seamless.  I would assume the same is true with
the
> 64 bit versions.
> 
>  
> 
> Performance is very good.  At present, I am running it on a dual
processor
> Xeon box from Dell.  Looking at a quad Xeon processor 64 bit system as
my
> next upgrade.
> 
>  
> 
> Randy
> 
>  
> 
>   _____  
> 
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Elvedin Trnjanin
> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 11:33 AM
> To: Kathryn Hogg
> Cc: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
> 
>  
> 
> Kathryn Hogg wrote: 
> 
> Wayne Johnson wrote:
>   
> 
> Anyone tried VMWare Server 2.0.2?  I???ve tried it on my new AMD64 quad
> core and had lots of problems. Just wondering if it's me or the
software.
>     
> 
>  
> I unfortunately have to do the bulk of my development work in Windows
even
> though its all J2EE.  So I keep linux as my host OS and run XP in
virtual
> machine for the coding/testing.
>  
> I used to use vmware server but it seemed like their drivers would
always
> fail to compile and I would get some strange kernel panics.  I've
switched
> over to virtualbox.  It runs smoother, I've yet to have a problem with a
> kernel upgrade, and the seamless mode is great.
>  
>   
> 
> Have you considered running ESXi and all of the operating systems you
need
> on top of it? Compatibility (apart from hardware) should not be an issue
in
> such a setup and performance would be better if you require multiple
> virtual machines running at the same time. If you intermittently need a
few
> virtual machines, then Virtualbox is certainly a great solution as I use
it
> too.

-- 
()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail 
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments


From bbaptist at iexposure.com  Mon Nov  2 13:36:10 2009
From: bbaptist at iexposure.com (Bret Baptist)
Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 13:36:10 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
In-Reply-To: <e028fa088f6b0e68719f07c4a18a7fe7@mail.liquidphlux.com>
References: <230489.86631.qm@web53802.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<AB99974582884AF08229DC0815355051@dualasus>
	<e028fa088f6b0e68719f07c4a18a7fe7@mail.liquidphlux.com>
Message-ID: <200911021336.10424.bbaptist@iexposure.com>

Seriously, look at Proxmox before you go with Xen.

http://pve.proxmox.com/wiki/Main_Page



Bret.

On Monday 02 November 2009 01:07:27 pm Andrew Kuriger wrote:
> I am a bit leery of VMware at this point even though that is what I have
> been using mainly. My huge problem being no vSphere client for Windows 7 or
> Linux. I am probably going to look more into the Xen side of things since I
> have heard good things.
> 
> ~Andrew
> 
> On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 12:23:21 -0500, "Randy Clarksean"
> 
> <rclarksean at arvig.net> wrote:
> > I echo the comments below on ESXi.  I am only running the 32bit version
> 
> at
> 
> > present, but I run an old Windows 2000 OS and Fedora Core 5 on it
> 
> without
> 
> > any problems ? all very seamless.  I would assume the same is true with
> 
> the
> 
> > 64 bit versions.
> >
> >
> >
> > Performance is very good.  At present, I am running it on a dual
> 
> processor
> 
> > Xeon box from Dell.  Looking at a quad Xeon processor 64 bit system as
> 
> my
> 
> > next upgrade.
> >
> >
> >
> > Randy
> >
> >
> >
> >   _____
> >
> > From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Elvedin Trnjanin
> > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 11:33 AM
> > To: Kathryn Hogg
> > Cc: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
> >
> >
> >
> > Kathryn Hogg wrote:
> >
> > Wayne Johnson wrote:
> >
> >
> > Anyone tried VMWare Server 2.0.2?  I???ve tried it on my new AMD64 quad
> > core and had lots of problems. Just wondering if it's me or the
> 
> software.
> 
> > I unfortunately have to do the bulk of my development work in Windows
> 
> even
> 
> > though its all J2EE.  So I keep linux as my host OS and run XP in
> 
> virtual
> 
> > machine for the coding/testing.
> >
> > I used to use vmware server but it seemed like their drivers would
> 
> always
> 
> > fail to compile and I would get some strange kernel panics.  I've
> 
> switched
> 
> > over to virtualbox.  It runs smoother, I've yet to have a problem with a
> > kernel upgrade, and the seamless mode is great.
> >
> >
> >
> > Have you considered running ESXi and all of the operating systems you
> 
> need
> 
> > on top of it? Compatibility (apart from hardware) should not be an issue
> 
> in
> 
> > such a setup and performance would be better if you require multiple
> > virtual machines running at the same time. If you intermittently need a
> 
> few
> 
> > virtual machines, then Virtualbox is certainly a great solution as I use
> 
> it
> 
> > too.
> 

-- 
Bret Baptist
Senior Network Administrator
bbaptist at iexposure.com
Internet Exposure, Inc.
http://www.iexposure.com
(612) 676-1946 x117

Providing Internet Services since 1995
Web Development ~ Search Engine Marketing ~ Web Analytics
Network Security ~ On Demand Tech Support ~ E-Mail Marketing


From a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com  Mon Nov  2 14:04:57 2009
From: a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com (Andrew Kuriger)
Date: Mon, 02 Nov 2009 14:04:57 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
In-Reply-To: <200911021336.10424.bbaptist@iexposure.com>
References: <230489.86631.qm@web53802.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<AB99974582884AF08229DC0815355051@dualasus>
	<e028fa088f6b0e68719f07c4a18a7fe7@mail.liquidphlux.com>
	<200911021336.10424.bbaptist@iexposure.com>
Message-ID: <2da2e0e11aa043c47e02fbe266603263@mail.liquidphlux.com>


That looks purty. I will throw it on one of my boxes tonight, I have been
meaning to get rid of ESXi anyways for awhile. Sorry for Hijacking this
thread (and top posting ;-) ). Have a great evening!

~A

On Mon, 2 Nov 2009 13:36:10 -0600, Bret Baptist <bbaptist at iexposure.com>
wrote:
> Seriously, look at Proxmox before you go with Xen.
> 
> http://pve.proxmox.com/wiki/Main_Page
> 
> 
> 
> Bret.
> 
> On Monday 02 November 2009 01:07:27 pm Andrew Kuriger wrote:
>> I am a bit leery of VMware at this point even though that is what I
have
>> been using mainly. My huge problem being no vSphere client for Windows
7
>> or
>> Linux. I am probably going to look more into the Xen side of things
>> since I
>> have heard good things.
>> 
>> ~Andrew
>> 
>> On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 12:23:21 -0500, "Randy Clarksean"
>> 
>> <rclarksean at arvig.net> wrote:
>> > I echo the comments below on ESXi.  I am only running the 32bit
version
>> 
>> at
>> 
>> > present, but I run an old Windows 2000 OS and Fedora Core 5 on it
>> 
>> without
>> 
>> > any problems ? all very seamless.  I would assume the same is true
>> > with
>> 
>> the
>> 
>> > 64 bit versions.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Performance is very good.  At present, I am running it on a dual
>> 
>> processor
>> 
>> > Xeon box from Dell.  Looking at a quad Xeon processor 64 bit system
as
>> 
>> my
>> 
>> > next upgrade.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Randy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >   _____
>> >
>> > From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
>> > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Elvedin
Trnjanin
>> > Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 11:33 AM
>> > To: Kathryn Hogg
>> > Cc: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] VMWare 2.0.2 on Linux
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Kathryn Hogg wrote:
>> >
>> > Wayne Johnson wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Anyone tried VMWare Server 2.0.2?  I???ve tried it on my new AMD64
>> > quad
>> > core and had lots of problems. Just wondering if it's me or the
>> 
>> software.
>> 
>> > I unfortunately have to do the bulk of my development work in Windows
>> 
>> even
>> 
>> > though its all J2EE.  So I keep linux as my host OS and run XP in
>> 
>> virtual
>> 
>> > machine for the coding/testing.
>> >
>> > I used to use vmware server but it seemed like their drivers would
>> 
>> always
>> 
>> > fail to compile and I would get some strange kernel panics.  I've
>> 
>> switched
>> 
>> > over to virtualbox.  It runs smoother, I've yet to have a problem
with
>> > a
>> > kernel upgrade, and the seamless mode is great.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Have you considered running ESXi and all of the operating systems you
>> 
>> need
>> 
>> > on top of it? Compatibility (apart from hardware) should not be an
>> > issue
>> 
>> in
>> 
>> > such a setup and performance would be better if you require multiple
>> > virtual machines running at the same time. If you intermittently need
a
>> 
>> few
>> 
>> > virtual machines, then Virtualbox is certainly a great solution as I
>> > use
>> 
>> it
>> 
>> > too.
>>

-- 
()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail 
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments


From kelly.black at penguinpackets.com  Mon Nov  2 22:22:44 2009
From: kelly.black at penguinpackets.com (Kelly Black)
Date: Mon, 02 Nov 2009 22:22:44 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare/virtualbox/esxi/xen/kvm
References: <429c5ec20910301054u187cf1b2s7a33adf7a2b88b99@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AEB3937.8030002@umn.edu>
	<51d20ae60911021103yb383ceib9d0ed454bbc8cd9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20091103042244.GA31302@testhost.hutman.net>

On Mon, Nov 02, 2009 at 01:03:09PM -0600, Scott Dier wrote:
> Also available for xen and kvm:
> http://code.google.com/p/ganeti/
> 
> Unlike xenserver, ganeti is free.  I'd focus on kvm+ganeti+drbd for
> new installs, though.

Ganeti looks interesting.  I have been enjoying KVM with Libvirt:
http://libvirt.org/

The virsh shell is handy as heck, and the Python bindings are fun.

Kelly


From scott at dier.name  Mon Nov  2 22:42:39 2009
From: scott at dier.name (Scott Dier)
Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 22:42:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare/virtualbox/esxi/xen/kvm
In-Reply-To: <20091103042244.GA31302@testhost.hutman.net>
References: <429c5ec20910301054u187cf1b2s7a33adf7a2b88b99@mail.gmail.com> 
	<4AEB3937.8030002@umn.edu>
	<51d20ae60911021103yb383ceib9d0ed454bbc8cd9@mail.gmail.com> 
	<20091103042244.GA31302@testhost.hutman.net>
Message-ID: <51d20ae60911022042v1ef4d3afg9aeab9f670466ed9@mail.gmail.com>

yeah, I really like libvirt too.  I couldn't get it to do everything I
wanted just right with xen on opensuse, but it helped a lot.  (have a
machine I'm using without VT, so all paravirt for me.)

On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:22 PM, Kelly Black
<kelly.black at penguinpackets.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 02, 2009 at 01:03:09PM -0600, Scott Dier wrote:
>> Also available for xen and kvm:
>> http://code.google.com/p/ganeti/
>>
>> Unlike xenserver, ganeti is free. ?I'd focus on kvm+ganeti+drbd for
>> new installs, though.
>
> Ganeti looks interesting. ?I have been enjoying KVM with Libvirt:
> http://libvirt.org/
>
> The virsh shell is handy as heck, and the Python bindings are fun.
>
> Kelly
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 
Scott Dier <scott at dier.name>


From tclugl at whitleymott.net  Tue Nov  3 01:25:37 2009
From: tclugl at whitleymott.net (greg wm)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:25:37 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] rtl8180 working in hardy, not in intrepid or centos5.4
Message-ID: <429c5ec20911022325q7de1834csb3a7c9f7eecf9d5e@mail.gmail.com>

my rtl8180 wireless pcmcia in my thinkpad works great in hardy.  my
/etc/network/interfaces contains

> auto  wlan0
> iface wlan0 inet dhcp
>          wireless-essid wm
>          wireless-key foobar
>
and it comes right up on bootup.  i dropped the same /etc/network/interfaces
into intrepid (2.6.27-15-generic), but no luck.  might there be something
else i need to do?  the rtl8180 modules load, but no route nor ipaddress
gets set.  similarly in centos5.4 (2.6.18-164.2.1.el5) the rtl8180 modules
load, but here i *do* get a route and ipaddress, it completes DHCP but then
can't ping the gateway or anything except itself, and tho the 'Act' light on
the card is flashing, the 'Link' light is dark.  the lights are the same for
intrepid.  in hardy, where it works, the 'Link' light is lit.

the only relevant /var/log/messages line, in intrepid:
kernel: [  681.206785] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): wlan0: link is not ready

in centos5.4:
avahi-daemon[2610]: Registering new address record for 192.168.0.71 on
wlan0.

i suspect the hardy driver is good and the others deficient, but i dunno.
where would i look to compare driver versions?  any other ideas?
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From tclugl at whitleymott.net  Tue Nov  3 01:38:47 2009
From: tclugl at whitleymott.net (greg wm)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:38:47 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] cohabitating inside ntfs?
Message-ID: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>

>
> Brian, Thanks for all of the work you did to create the very successful
> install fest.

rah!

and thanks to the folks who helped me try to install into my thinkpad.

unfortunately ntfsresize wouldn't complete.  i'll try again after the defrag
completes.

meanwhile perhaps i might take an interest in suggestions i've heard about
somehow installing linux within the existing ntfs.  i believe i have heard
mention of (a) creating a contiguous file that works like a partition, and
(b) linux files cohabitating in the windows filesystem.  pointers anyone?

ty,
g
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From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Tue Nov  3 02:30:01 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 02:30:01 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] cohabitating inside ntfs?
In-Reply-To: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911030030q6e8a4398kecae0a0cf24b8821@mail.gmail.com>

The tool to do this is called Wubi, and it works at a minimum with
Ubuntu.  That's all I know.

Tony Yarusso
http://tonyyarusso.com/


From josh at joshwelch.com  Tue Nov  3 07:37:06 2009
From: josh at joshwelch.com (Josh Welch)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 07:37:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] VMWare/virtualbox/esxi/xen/kvm
In-Reply-To: <20091103042244.GA31302@testhost.hutman.net>
References: <429c5ec20910301054u187cf1b2s7a33adf7a2b88b99@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AEB3937.8030002@umn.edu>
	<51d20ae60911021103yb383ceib9d0ed454bbc8cd9@mail.gmail.com>
	<20091103042244.GA31302@testhost.hutman.net>
Message-ID: <cb8bd0d60911030537l1eeca7ecneb841fd2d1dbae87@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:22 PM, Kelly Black
<kelly.black at penguinpackets.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 02, 2009 at 01:03:09PM -0600, Scott Dier wrote:
>> Also available for xen and kvm:
>> http://code.google.com/p/ganeti/
>>
>> Unlike xenserver, ganeti is free. ?I'd focus on kvm+ganeti+drbd for
>> new installs, though.
>

Note that XenServer is currently free as in beer and they've recently
announced that they're going to be open sourcing the entire XenServer
platform (though not including the client GUI that they currently
have).

http://networkedblogs.com/p16512649

Josh


From austad at signal15.com  Tue Nov  3 10:34:09 2009
From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 10:34:09 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
Message-ID: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>

Looking for a good full featured LDAP server.  This is for home/ 
personal use, so it doesn't have to service a billion queries per  
second.

I'm looking for the following features:
- Kerberos
- Easy integration with RADIUS or built in radius
- Easy integration with two-factor auth (like WikiD or TripleSec)

I'm looking at OpenLDAP, OpenDS, and ApacheDS.  ApacheDS seems to do  
everything I want, but the documentation for it is horrid.

Are there any good resource for setting up an LDAP schema?

--
jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com






From bbaptist at iexposure.com  Tue Nov  3 11:33:50 2009
From: bbaptist at iexposure.com (Bret Baptist)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 11:33:50 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
References: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <200911031133.50927.bbaptist@iexposure.com>

On Tuesday 03 November 2009 10:34:09 am Jay Austad wrote:
> Looking for a good full featured LDAP server.  This is for home/
> personal use, so it doesn't have to service a billion queries per
> second.
> 
> I'm looking for the following features:
> - Kerberos
> - Easy integration with RADIUS or built in radius
> - Easy integration with two-factor auth (like WikiD or TripleSec)
> 
> I'm looking at OpenLDAP, OpenDS, and ApacheDS.  ApacheDS seems to do
> everything I want, but the documentation for it is horrid.
> 
> Are there any good resource for setting up an LDAP schema?

This might be what you are looking for:
http://freeipa.org/page/Main_Page


-- 
Bret Baptist
Senior Network Administrator
bbaptist at iexposure.com
Internet Exposure, Inc.
http://www.iexposure.com
(612) 676-1946 x117

Providing Internet Services since 1995
Web Development ~ Search Engine Marketing ~ Web Analytics
Network Security ~ On Demand Tech Support ~ E-Mail Marketing


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Tue Nov  3 11:38:25 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kristopher Browne)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 11:38:25 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <4af06a9b.0d1abc0a.53a5.11f4@mx.google.com>

I have used OpenLDAP in various forms for years, as a standalone and as part of Apple and Novell's offerings. It seems to be the most flexible option.

ApacheDS seems like a good fit if you already have a tomcat friendly DB setup and are comfortable tuning Java apps.

For doing schema work, Apache has a mozilla based ldap browser/editor which is really powerful.

-- Sent from my Palm Pr?
Jay Austad wrote:

Looking for a good full featured LDAP server.  This is for home/ 

personal use, so it doesn't have to service a billion queries per  

second.



I'm looking for the following features:

- Kerberos

- Easy integration with RADIUS or built in radius

- Easy integration with two-factor auth (like WikiD or TripleSec)



I'm looking at OpenLDAP, OpenDS, and ApacheDS.  ApacheDS seems to do  

everything I want, but the documentation for it is horrid.



Are there any good resource for setting up an LDAP schema?



--

jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com











_______________________________________________

TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota

tclug-list at mn-linux.org

http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


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From andyzib at gmail.com  Tue Nov  3 11:54:35 2009
From: andyzib at gmail.com (Andrew S. Zbikowski)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 11:54:35 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <4af06a9b.0d1abc0a.53a5.11f4@mx.google.com>
References: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
	<4af06a9b.0d1abc0a.53a5.11f4@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <cac45c240911030954h6cdd63c2s3537965c5fc99200@mail.gmail.com>

Not Linux nor no-cost, but For $999 there's the Mac Mini w/ Leopard
Server option:
http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MC408LL/A?mco=MTMzNzU5Nzc

Out of the box LDAP, Kerberos, RADIUS.

Two-factor auth should be possible but I haven't looked into it myself.

-- 
Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us
IT Outhouse Blog Thing | http://www.itouthouse.com


From cdf123 at cdf123.net  Tue Nov  3 12:12:33 2009
From: cdf123 at cdf123.net (Chris Frederick)
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:12:33 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
References: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <4AF07291.90206@cdf123.net>

Jay Austad wrote, On 11/03/09 10:34:
> Looking for a good full featured LDAP server.  This is for home/ 
> personal use, so it doesn't have to service a billion queries per  
> second.
> 
> I'm looking for the following features:
> - Kerberos
> - Easy integration with RADIUS or built in radius
> - Easy integration with two-factor auth (like WikiD or TripleSec)
> 
> I'm looking at OpenLDAP, OpenDS, and ApacheDS.  ApacheDS seems to do  
> everything I want, but the documentation for it is horrid.
> 
> Are there any good resource for setting up an LDAP schema?
> --

I've been using OpenLdap for a while and it's worked very well here.
Unfortunately most of my guides that I used to set everything up died in
the Gentoo Wiki backups, but a few are still around.

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/ldap-howto.xml

As far a schema editing, I used google for most of it, but I've found
the guides on zytrax to be very helpful.

LDAP for Rocket Scientists - http://www.zytrax.com/books/ldap/

Most of my ldap work is done in phpldapadmin.  It's simple and has some
nice options for displaying/editing entries.  I use it a lot for
maintaining records and doing minor changes.  For major changes, I just
use the built in ldapsearch and ldapmodify commands.  If I add a new
field to the schema and need to default it for a few hundred records, I
find it easier to run ldapsearch to grab the records I need and dump
them to a file.  Open in vim, and a few regular expression replaces
later and I can pull the file back in with all the changes done in a few
minutes.

I haven't found a good schema editing tool yet.  I keep my schema file
in a cvs repo so I can track all the changes, and make sure I run slapd
-tT before restarting the ldap server.  I've found out the hard way that
pam/nss don't like their user/group database disappearing.  On that
note, if you plan on doing any ssl/tls for the ldap connection, I would
recommend having a mirrored server with different certs that expire on
different days (or preferably years).  Since you're doing this for
home/personal use, you can just make your own CA rather than paying for one.

Hope all that helps.

Chris


From dan at dburkland.com  Tue Nov  3 12:13:11 2009
From: dan at dburkland.com (Dan Burkland)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 12:13:11 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <mailman.5215.1257270967.2412.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
References: <mailman.5215.1257270967.2412.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
Message-ID: <90781C52-87DB-478B-9734-770DFC16AA56@dburkland.com>

I recently created an LDAP directory with openldap and then integrated  
it with Kerberos using MITs kerberos implementation. It was a bit  
tricky but I was finally able to get Kerberos to store all of it's  
principals inside the LDAP Directory. I'm more of a fan of command  
line management however free IPA would be a lot easier to manage. If  
you choose to go the same route I did, look here:  https://help.ubuntu.com/9.04/serverguide/C/kerberos-ldap.html

Regards,

Dan

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 3, 2009, at 11:56 AM, tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org wrote:

> [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
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From mkebob1134 at netscape.net  Tue Nov  3 12:43:17 2009
From: mkebob1134 at netscape.net (Mr. B-o-B)
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 2009 12:43:17 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <cac45c240911030954h6cdd63c2s3537965c5fc99200@mail.gmail.com>
References: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com>	<4af06a9b.0d1abc0a.53a5.11f4@mx.google.com>
	<cac45c240911030954h6cdd63c2s3537965c5fc99200@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AF079C5.2080202@netscape.net>

Andrew S. Zbikowski wrote:
> Not Linux nor no-cost, but For $999 there's the Mac Mini w/ Leopard
> Server option:
> http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MC408LL/A?mco=MTMzNzU5Nzc
> 
> Out of the box LDAP, Kerberos, RADIUS.
> 
> Two-factor auth should be possible but I haven't looked into it myself.
> 

What!  The Horror!!!!

Mr. B-o-B
-- 
We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
You have our gratitude.
Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Tue Nov  3 13:28:10 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kristopher Browne)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 13:28:10 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <4AF079C5.2080202@netscape.net>
Message-ID: <4af08447.25c0100a.0b94.6e20@mx.google.com>

That would have been my first mention had it been re: a commercial use... They use openldap and mit kerberos just make it really easy to manage/configure.

-- Sent from my Palm Pr?
Mr. B-o-B wrote:

Andrew S. Zbikowski wrote:

> Not Linux nor no-cost, but For $999 there's the Mac Mini w/ Leopard

> Server option:

> http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MC408LL/A?mco=MTMzNzU5Nzc

> 

> Out of the box LDAP, Kerberos, RADIUS.

> 

> Two-factor auth should be possible but I haven't looked into it myself.

> 



What!  The Horror!!!!



Mr. B-o-B

-- 

We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.

We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.

You have our gratitude.

Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.



_______________________________________________

TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota

tclug-list at mn-linux.org

http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


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From mkebob1134 at netscape.net  Tue Nov  3 16:22:57 2009
From: mkebob1134 at netscape.net (Mr. B-o-B)
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:22:57 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <4af08447.25c0100a.0b94.6e20@mx.google.com>
References: <4af08447.25c0100a.0b94.6e20@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <4AF0AD41.8040101@netscape.net>

Kristopher Browne wrote:
> That would have been my first mention had it been re: a commercial 
> use... They use openldap and mit kerberos just make it really easy to 
> manage/configure.
> 

Sorry!  That's my default answer for everything & anything Apple!

Mr. B-o-B

-- 
We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
You have our gratitude.
Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.


From scott at dier.name  Tue Nov  3 16:32:04 2009
From: scott at dier.name (Scott Dier)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 16:32:04 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDAP recommendations
In-Reply-To: <cac45c240911030954h6cdd63c2s3537965c5fc99200@mail.gmail.com>
References: <C01F7919-F62A-4105-935E-DA844F8AB190@signal15.com> 
	<4af06a9b.0d1abc0a.53a5.11f4@mx.google.com>
	<cac45c240911030954h6cdd63c2s3537965c5fc99200@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <51d20ae60911031432g64c0cf3ev64d5749569f15a8d@mail.gmail.com>

Many two factor systems will interface with radius.  Alternatively
running Radiator on the same system you could deal with OATH HOTP.  I
don't know if they have the binary lib for vasco digipass on that
platform, though.

OATH HOTP keys at scale sound like $8/each from what I've heard, perhaps less.

On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 11:54 AM, Andrew S. Zbikowski <andyzib at gmail.com> wrote:
> Not Linux nor no-cost, but For $999 there's the Mac Mini w/ Leopard
> Server option:
> http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MC408LL/A?mco=MTMzNzU5Nzc
>
> Out of the box LDAP, Kerberos, RADIUS.
>
> Two-factor auth should be possible but I haven't looked into it myself.
>
> --
> Andrew S. Zbikowski | http://andy.zibnet.us
> IT Outhouse Blog Thing | http://www.itouthouse.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 
Scott Dier <scott at dier.name>


From tclugl at whitleymott.net  Tue Nov  3 20:00:50 2009
From: tclugl at whitleymott.net (greg wm)
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 20:00:50 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] cohabitating inside ntfs?
In-Reply-To: <7c055dc50911031552n6ec8f315v9b119f302b649806@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com> 
	<7c055dc50911031552n6ec8f315v9b119f302b649806@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <429c5ec20911031800v4c98f673o82a2fffbe85be084@mail.gmail.com>

iiuc qtparted still calls ntfsresize to do the job.  though there could be
different results with different releases of ntfsresize.

On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 5:52 PM, Chris G. <thoth.serath at gmail.com> wrote:

> i use qtparted inside of knoppix or kanotix to resize.  seems to work the
> best.
>
> On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 1:38 AM, greg wm <tclugl at whitleymott.net> wrote:
>
>> Brian, Thanks for all of the work you did to create the very successful
>>> install fest.
>>
>> rah!
>>
>> and thanks to the folks who helped me try to install into my thinkpad.
>>
>> unfortunately ntfsresize wouldn't complete.  i'll try again after the
>> defrag completes.
>>
>> meanwhile perhaps i might take an interest in suggestions i've heard about
>> somehow installing linux within the existing ntfs.  i believe i have heard
>> mention of (a) creating a contiguous file that works like a partition, and
>> (b) linux files cohabitating in the windows filesystem.  pointers anyone?
>>
>> ty,
>> g
>>
>
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From kc0iog at gmail.com  Wed Nov  4 08:44:11 2009
From: kc0iog at gmail.com (Brian Wall)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 08:44:11 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] cohabitating inside ntfs?
In-Reply-To: <429c5ec20911031800v4c98f673o82a2fffbe85be084@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c055dc50911031552n6ec8f315v9b119f302b649806@mail.gmail.com>
	<429c5ec20911031800v4c98f673o82a2fffbe85be084@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2c6699da0911040644x3fd3c336p7db2a9e7df9614a8@mail.gmail.com>

>> On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 1:38 AM, greg wm <tclugl at whitleymott.net> wrote:

>>> unfortunately ntfsresize wouldn't complete.? i'll try again after the
>>> defrag completes.
>>>
>>> meanwhile perhaps i might take an interest in suggestions i've heard
>>> about somehow installing linux within the existing ntfs.? i believe i have
>>> heard mention of (a) creating a contiguous file that works like a partition,
>>> and (b) linux files cohabitating in the windows filesystem.? pointers
>>> anyone?

When the linux NTFS tools don't quite do the job, I whip out a Windows
7/Windows 2008 install disk.  The installer has a handy NTFS resizer
gadget (now supports shrinking!) that seems to work well.  Of course,
always make sure you run chkdsk before and after any partition
resizing activities, regardless of the tool.

As far as cohabitating, I've played with coLinux a bit, which uses a
single contiguous file.  It creates a file (or multiple files) then
starts the kernel in a usermode-type scenario. This is the only time
I'd consider cohabitating, because in this scenario the Windows kernel
is handling the NTFS file locks, and the user mode linux kernel is
free to do what it wants to inside its file.  You can boot linux
natively as well, however you'll be using the linux NTFS driver to
handle the file locks on the linux files which could present some
interesting results.

Brian


From austad at signal15.com  Wed Nov  4 16:41:44 2009
From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 16:41:44 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
Message-ID: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>

I have a problem.  It's MS Word.  It sucks.  It's the most horrible  
tool ever devised for writing documentation, especially when dealing  
with reusable content and multiple authors.  The theory behind LaTeX  
is that you can create a stylesheet that dictates the formatting of  
the final document, and authors can focus on the content rather than  
the layout.  I can spend hours formatting a document and fighting with  
MS Word to get things looking just right, it sucks.  Plus, it produces  
horrendous looking output.

Here's what I'm looking for in a documentation solution:
- Version control for multiple authors, maybe even on a per section  
basis so multiple people can work on a document at one time.  A single  
LaTeX document can be split up into multiple files, so it has that  
going for it
- The ability to create a standard outline for different types of  
documents that is dynamically prepopulated with reusable content from  
a version control system or database
- The ability to *FORCE* styles for different parts of the document  
(e.g. Text in a paragraph is ALWAYS a certain font and size and cannot  
be changed unless the author changes the stylesheet)
- The author focuses on his content that he needs to add to the  
prepopulated document, saves it, and generates a final PDF which  
applies all of the styles/headers/footers from the stylesheet
- Offline editing.  I can check out a document or section of a  
document, edit it, and then check it back in once I get connected back  
to the net.

DITAWorks seems to do this.  But it's $800 a seat.  That's fine, but I  
don't know if I have enough time to complete a demo of it by the time  
they'll want a decision.  Can I do all of this with LaTeX and LyX?   
Are there any good DocBook or DITA editors/suites out there that are  
free and can do this?

I don't want people to have to edit raw LaTeX or XML.  The editor must  
hide this stuff.  And it should also be cross platform.  I thought  
about using Eclipse with OrangeVolt, the DITA schema, and the version  
control plugins, but I'm not sure where to start with it.

--
jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com






From tclugl at whitleymott.net  Wed Nov  4 18:40:02 2009
From: tclugl at whitleymott.net (greg wm)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 18:40:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] rtl8180 working in hardy,
	not in intrepid or centos5.4
In-Reply-To: <429c5ec20911022325q7de1834csb3a7c9f7eecf9d5e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022325q7de1834csb3a7c9f7eecf9d5e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <429c5ec20911041640yab31a9etafa9c80384f0e9c8@mail.gmail.com>

perhaps in my early moments of running hardy i ran some gnome or xfce
desktop tool which configured my wireless somehow, and perhaps simply
copying the /etc/network/interfaces to intrepid is skipping some pertinent
step?  i just looked in xfce4 and couldn't find any tool for configuring
wireless.  is there one?  what is the name (package) for either the xfce or
the gnome tool?
tia,
-g

On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 1:25 AM, greg wm <tclugl at whitleymott.net> wrote:

> my rtl8180 wireless pcmcia in my thinkpad works great in hardy.  my
> /etc/network/interfaces contains
>
>> auto  wlan0
>> iface wlan0 inet dhcp
>>          wireless-essid wm
>>          wireless-key foobar
>>
> and it comes right up on bootup.  i dropped the same
> /etc/network/interfaces into intrepid (2.6.27-15-generic), but no luck.
> might there be something else i need to do?  the rtl8180 modules load, but
> no route nor ipaddress gets set.  similarly in centos5.4
> (2.6.18-164.2.1.el5) the rtl8180 modules load, but here i *do* get a route
> and ipaddress, it completes DHCP but then can't ping the gateway or anything
> except itself, and tho the 'Act' light on the card is flashing, the 'Link'
> light is dark.  the lights are the same for intrepid.  in hardy, where it
> works, the 'Link' light is lit.
>
> the only relevant /var/log/messages line, in intrepid:
> kernel: [  681.206785] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): wlan0: link is not ready
>
> in centos5.4:
> avahi-daemon[2610]: Registering new address record for 192.168.0.71 on
> wlan0.
>
> i suspect the hardy driver is good and the others deficient, but i dunno.
> where would i look to compare driver versions?  any other ideas?
>
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From r_a_wilkinson at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  4 19:30:21 2009
From: r_a_wilkinson at yahoo.com (Robert)
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:30:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] cohabitating inside ntfs?
In-Reply-To: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022338y41196752oac728a3686ddc917@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1257384621.2427.19.camel@robert>

I hope you can use something here...


Hiren's Boot CD has several HDD utilities and you can create and run a
boot floppy too. Use it to create/delete partitions.Google "Hiren's Boot
CD" to download it.

SmartBootManager will allow you to boot from floppy. Then install any OS
from CD drive. It is included on Ubuntu installation CD's and
instructions are at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SmartBootManager

Use the instructions at
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/LowMemorySystems to
install anything from a minimal command line version, to a full blown
Ubuntu installation. 

Good luck,

Robert



  On Tue, 2009-11-03 at 01:38 -0600, greg wm wrote:
>         Brian, Thanks for all of the work you did to create the very
>         successful install fest.
> rah!
> 
> and thanks to the folks who helped me try to install into my thinkpad.
> 
> unfortunately ntfsresize wouldn't complete.  i'll try again after the
> defrag completes.
> 
> meanwhile perhaps i might take an interest in suggestions i've heard
> about somehow installing linux within the existing ntfs.  i believe i
> have heard mention of (a) creating a contiguous file that works like a
> partition, and (b) linux files cohabitating in the windows filesystem.
> pointers anyone?
> 
> ty,
> g
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list




From florin at iucha.net  Wed Nov  4 19:47:40 2009
From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 19:47:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] rtl8180 working in hardy,
	not in intrepid or	centos5.4
In-Reply-To: <429c5ec20911041640yab31a9etafa9c80384f0e9c8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <429c5ec20911022325q7de1834csb3a7c9f7eecf9d5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<429c5ec20911041640yab31a9etafa9c80384f0e9c8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20091105014740.GJ27599@iris.iucha.org>

On Wed, Nov 04, 2009 at 06:40:02PM -0600, greg wm wrote:
> perhaps in my early moments of running hardy i ran some gnome or xfce
> desktop tool which configured my wireless somehow, and perhaps simply
> copying the /etc/network/interfaces to intrepid is skipping some pertinent
> step?  i just looked in xfce4 and couldn't find any tool for configuring
> wireless.  is there one?  what is the name (package) for either the xfce or
> the gnome tool?

NetworkManager.

Cheers,
florin

-- 
Bruce Schneier expects the Spanish Inquisition.
      http://geekz.co.uk/schneierfacts/fact/163
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From jjensen at apache.org  Wed Nov  4 19:53:24 2009
From: jjensen at apache.org (Jeff Jensen)
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2009 19:53:24 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <003801ca5dba$c68e5f80$53ab1e80$@org>

Could OpenOffice Writer with Docbook work?  Then you could setup a build to
transform it...
I remember some years ago Writer directly supported Docbook; not sure if/how
it has changed.


-----Original Message-----
From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
[mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of Jay Austad
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2009 4:42 PM
To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?

I have a problem.  It's MS Word.  It sucks.  It's the most horrible  
tool ever devised for writing documentation, especially when dealing  
with reusable content and multiple authors.  The theory behind LaTeX  
is that you can create a stylesheet that dictates the formatting of  
the final document, and authors can focus on the content rather than  
the layout.  I can spend hours formatting a document and fighting with  
MS Word to get things looking just right, it sucks.  Plus, it produces  
horrendous looking output.

Here's what I'm looking for in a documentation solution:
- Version control for multiple authors, maybe even on a per section  
basis so multiple people can work on a document at one time.  A single  
LaTeX document can be split up into multiple files, so it has that  
going for it
- The ability to create a standard outline for different types of  
documents that is dynamically prepopulated with reusable content from  
a version control system or database
- The ability to *FORCE* styles for different parts of the document  
(e.g. Text in a paragraph is ALWAYS a certain font and size and cannot  
be changed unless the author changes the stylesheet)
- The author focuses on his content that he needs to add to the  
prepopulated document, saves it, and generates a final PDF which  
applies all of the styles/headers/footers from the stylesheet
- Offline editing.  I can check out a document or section of a  
document, edit it, and then check it back in once I get connected back  
to the net.

DITAWorks seems to do this.  But it's $800 a seat.  That's fine, but I  
don't know if I have enough time to complete a demo of it by the time  
they'll want a decision.  Can I do all of this with LaTeX and LyX?   
Are there any good DocBook or DITA editors/suites out there that are  
free and can do this?

I don't want people to have to edit raw LaTeX or XML.  The editor must  
hide this stuff.  And it should also be cross platform.  I thought  
about using Eclipse with OrangeVolt, the DITA schema, and the version  
control plugins, but I'm not sure where to start with it.

--
jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com





_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list



From bhurt at spnz.org  Thu Nov  5 07:26:09 2009
From: bhurt at spnz.org (Brian Hurt)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 08:26:09 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar>


When I was writing my book (didn't get published, long story), I started 
life in DocBook.  About halfway through I switched it over to latex.  The 
main reason was speed: latex could format ~200 pages of text in 
approximately 1/10th the time that docbook could format ~30 pages of text. 
Also, latex was easier for me to write- on the other hand, I'm a greybeard 
who was writing raw docbook and latex in vi, so take that with a grain of 
salt.

For the record, it's not that effin hard to learn latex.  If you can learn 
HTML, you can learn latex.  OK, some of the deep magic is hard, but you 
hardly ever even want to do the deep magic, and never need to (and really, 
is figuring out all the different ways javascript is broken on different 
browsers that easy?).

On Wed, 4 Nov 2009, Jay Austad wrote:

> Here's what I'm looking for in a documentation solution:
> - Version control for multiple authors, maybe even on a per section
> basis so multiple people can work on a document at one time.  A single
> LaTeX document can be split up into multiple files, so it has that
> going for it
> - Offline editing.  I can check out a document or section of a
> document, edit it, and then check it back in once I get connected back
> to the net.

These two requirements are both requirements of the version control 
system- it sounds like you want a distributed version control system, like 
mercurial or git.

> - The ability to create a standard outline for different types of
> documents that is dynamically prepopulated with reusable content from
> a version control system or database
> - The ability to *FORCE* styles for different parts of the document
> (e.g. Text in a paragraph is ALWAYS a certain font and size and cannot
> be changed unless the author changes the stylesheet)

Not sure this is possible, with either docbook or latex.  Especially if 
you're dealing with a greybeard like me, who is quite willing to dig into 
the internals of the system, write his own macros, and do everything in 
vi.  You could write a program that parses the document looking for "dicey 
constructs" and issue a warning.

Brian



From tompoe at fngi.net  Thu Nov  5 08:59:35 2009
From: tompoe at fngi.net (Tom Poe)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:59:35 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
Message-ID: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>

Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether 
Linux can be put on it?
Tom


From ryan.coleman at cwis.biz  Thu Nov  5 09:12:40 2009
From: ryan.coleman at cwis.biz (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 09:12:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
In-Reply-To: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
References: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
Message-ID: <4AF2EB68.30209@cwis.biz>

It looks like it:
http://www.walmart.com/Acer-Aspire-One-10.1-Netbook/ip/11081785
($288 online)


Tom Poe wrote:
> Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether 
> Linux can be put on it?
> Tom
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>   



From a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com  Thu Nov  5 09:24:34 2009
From: a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com (Andrew Kuriger)
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 09:24:34 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
In-Reply-To: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
References: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
Message-ID: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>

Hello Tom,

On 11/5/2009 8:59 AM, Tom Poe wrote:
> Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
> Linux can be put on it?
> Tom
>
>    
I believe Wal-mart has a 30 day return policy so you could always buy 
one and return it if it does not work as expected. Or, my personal 
favorite would be to throw a Live distro on a pen drive and play around 
with a display model.

Have a great day!


From dutchman_mn at charter.net  Thu Nov  5 09:35:08 2009
From: dutchman_mn at charter.net (dutchman_mn at charter.net)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:35:08 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
In-Reply-To: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>
Message-ID: <20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>

The big issue is battery life.  The Acer has a 3-cell/2.5 hours with the ASUS Eee 1005HA-MU17-BU which has 8.5 Hours of battery life.  The difference in price is $45.00

Perry Hoekstra

---- Andrew Kuriger <a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com> wrote: 
> Hello Tom,
> 
> On 11/5/2009 8:59 AM, Tom Poe wrote:
> > Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
> > Linux can be put on it?
> > Tom
> >
> >    
> I believe Wal-mart has a 30 day return policy so you could always buy 
> one and return it if it does not work as expected. Or, my personal 
> favorite would be to throw a Live distro on a pen drive and play around 
> with a display model.
> 
> Have a great day!
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list



From tlunde at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 11:04:02 2009
From: tlunde at gmail.com (Thomas Lunde)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 11:04:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
In-Reply-To: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
References: <4AF2E857.1000406@fngi.net>
Message-ID: <CFA46193-D219-40D3-BEFC-1E5FBA8B5522@gmail.com>

I think Tom means this one:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/04/walmarts-300-hp-g60-laptop-gets-real-detailed/

Thomas



On Nov 5, 2009, at 8:59 AM, Tom Poe <tompoe at fngi.net> wrote:

> Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
> Linux can be put on it?
> Tom
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 12:10:05 2009
From: ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com (r j)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 12:10:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] tclug-list Digest, Vol 59, Issue 7
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1257444002.30178.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
References: <mailman.1.1257444002.30178.tclug-list@mn-linux.org>
Message-ID: <25f02f40911051010u4f93a38dl858fcc6781f52bd@mail.gmail.com>

 Do you need help making a bootable flash drive ? To test it in the store.
,Ron

On 11/5/09, tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org
<tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org> wrote:
> Send tclug-list mailing list submissions to
> 	tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	tclug-list-owner at mn-linux.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of tclug-list digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
>       (dutchman_mn at charter.net)
>    2. Re: does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux? (Thomas Lunde)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:35:08 -0500
> From: <dutchman_mn at charter.net>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
> To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Message-ID: <20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root at mp05>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> The big issue is battery life.  The Acer has a 3-cell/2.5 hours with the
> ASUS Eee 1005HA-MU17-BU which has 8.5 Hours of battery life.  The difference
> in price is $45.00
>
> Perry Hoekstra
>
> ---- Andrew Kuriger <a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com> wrote:
>> Hello Tom,
>>
>> On 11/5/2009 8:59 AM, Tom Poe wrote:
>> > Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
>> > Linux can be put on it?
>> > Tom
>> >
>> >
>> I believe Wal-mart has a 30 day return policy so you could always buy
>> one and return it if it does not work as expected. Or, my personal
>> favorite would be to throw a Live distro on a pen drive and play around
>> with a display model.
>>
>> Have a great day!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 11:04:02 -0600
> From: Thomas Lunde <tlunde at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
> To: Tom Poe <tompoe at fngi.net>
> Cc: TCLUG List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <CFA46193-D219-40D3-BEFC-1E5FBA8B5522 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=us-ascii;	format=flowed
>
> I think Tom means this one:
>
> http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/04/walmarts-300-hp-g60-laptop-gets-real-detailed/
>
> Thomas
>
>
>
> On Nov 5, 2009, at 8:59 AM, Tom Poe <tompoe at fngi.net> wrote:
>
>> Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
>> Linux can be put on it?
>> Tom
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> End of tclug-list Digest, Vol 59, Issue 7
> *****************************************
>


From diablomarcus at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 11:05:16 2009
From: diablomarcus at gmail.com (Mark Katerberg)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 11:05:16 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop support linux?
In-Reply-To: <20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>
References: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>
	<20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>
Message-ID: <26897bbd0911050905v3a791e6bv8b6e1866df7a4634@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such as
side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but happy
with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is supported
out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros (I have tried
CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple others)

On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 9:35 AM, <dutchman_mn at charter.net> wrote:

> The big issue is battery life.  The Acer has a 3-cell/2.5 hours with the
> ASUS Eee 1005HA-MU17-BU which has 8.5 Hours of battery life.  The difference
> in price is $45.00
>
> Perry Hoekstra
>
> ---- Andrew Kuriger <a.kuriger at liquidphlux.com> wrote:
> > Hello Tom,
> >
> > On 11/5/2009 8:59 AM, Tom Poe wrote:
> > > Heard Wal-Mart's offering laptops as low as $300.  Anyone know whether
> > > Linux can be put on it?
> > > Tom
> > >
> > >
> > I believe Wal-mart has a 30 day return policy so you could always buy
> > one and return it if it does not work as expected. Or, my personal
> > favorite would be to throw a Live distro on a pen drive and play around
> > with a display model.
> >
> > Have a great day!
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 13:22:12 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 13:22:12 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
 support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <26897bbd0911050905v3a791e6bv8b6e1866df7a4634@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>
	<20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>
	<26897bbd0911050905v3a791e6bv8b6e1866df7a4634@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:

> I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such 
> as side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but 
> happy with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is 
> supported out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros 
> (I have tried CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple 
> others)


At the installfest on Saturday a guy was running CrunchBang on an Asus Eee 
1000HE (or rough equivalent).  It looked pretty sweet.  What have the rest 
of you discovered about the Eee machines and Linux distros?  Is there a 
favorite of most users?  Comparative reviews?  I think I'm going to get 
one (maybe 1005HA) and see how it goes.

Mike


From sfertch at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 14:03:41 2009
From: sfertch at gmail.com (Shawn Fertch)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:03:41 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
	support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0911051203k7fa83065g9c468db7c569bfee@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>
	<20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>
	<26897bbd0911050905v3a791e6bv8b6e1866df7a4634@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<67f3084a0911051203k7fa83065g9c468db7c569bfee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <67f3084a0911051203j731326o41008efbceeb6353@mail.gmail.com>

I am running Debian lenny on my 900.  Works great.  Even though I upgraded
memory and Sdd

On Nov 5, 2009 1:27 PM, "Mike Miller"
<mbmiller+l at gmail.com<mbmiller%2Bl at gmail.com>>
wrote:

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:

> I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such
> as side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but
> happy with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is
> supported out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros
> (I have tried CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple
> others)


At the installfest on Saturday a guy was running CrunchBang on an Asus Eee
1000HE (or rough equivalent).  It looked pretty sweet.  What have the rest
of you discovered about the Eee machines and Linux distros?  Is there a
favorite of most users?  Comparative reviews?  I think I'm going to get
one (maybe 1005HA) and see how it goes.

Mike

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
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From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 14:50:31 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 14:50:31 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
	support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <67f3084a0911051203j731326o41008efbceeb6353@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4AF2EE32.50900@liquidphlux.com>
	<20091105103508.UI4DZ.2948492.root@mp05>
	<26897bbd0911050905v3a791e6bv8b6e1866df7a4634@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<67f3084a0911051203k7fa83065g9c468db7c569bfee@mail.gmail.com>
	<67f3084a0911051203j731326o41008efbceeb6353@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911051250j1d09dd92k7e7ed1583d844071@mail.gmail.com>

I use stock Ubuntu on mine.  I would guess that that, Ubuntu Netbook
Remix, Crunchbang, and Moblin are the most popular choices.

Tony Yarusso
http://tonyyarusso.com/


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 16:38:26 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kristopher Browne)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 16:38:26 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
 support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>

I use Ubuntu Netbook Remix on my Surf 4G... Works well enough. If I had an atom machine I'd be doing moblin though, the interface design seems well thought out.

Kris Browne

-- Sent from my Palm Pr?
Mike Miller wrote:

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:



> I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such 

> as side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but 

> happy with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is 

> supported out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros 

> (I have tried CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple 

> others)





At the installfest on Saturday a guy was running CrunchBang on an Asus Eee 

1000HE (or rough equivalent).  It looked pretty sweet.  What have the rest 

of you discovered about the Eee machines and Linux distros?  Is there a 

favorite of most users?  Comparative reviews?  I think I'm going to get 

one (maybe 1005HA) and see how it goes.



Mike



_______________________________________________

TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota

tclug-list at mn-linux.org

http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


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From j at packetgod.com  Thu Nov  5 17:57:35 2009
From: j at packetgod.com (J Cruit)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 17:57:35 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
	support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>

I run Ubuntu Netbook Remix as well on my 1000HE and just did a flawless
upgrade to the Koala.  Its great!  I also run Backtrack3 and Backtrack4 on
it and they both work fine.

--j

On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 4:38 PM, Kristopher Browne <kris.browne at gmail.com>wrote:

> I use Ubuntu Netbook Remix on my Surf 4G... Works well enough. If I had an
> atom machine I'd be doing moblin though, the interface design seems well
> thought out.
>
> Kris Browne
>
> -- Sent from my Palm Pr?
>
> ------------------------------
> Mike Miller wrote:
>
> On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:
>
> > I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such
> > as side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but
> > happy with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is
> > supported out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros
> > (I have tried CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple
> > others)
>
>
> At the installfest on Saturday a guy was running CrunchBang on an Asus Eee
> 1000HE (or rough equivalent). It looked pretty sweet. What have the rest
> of you discovered about the Eee machines and Linux distros? Is there a
> favorite of most users? Comparative reviews? I think I'm going to get
> one (maybe 1005HA) and see how it goes.
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From thoth.serath at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 19:14:37 2009
From: thoth.serath at gmail.com (Chris G.)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 19:14:37 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] sorcerer linux
Message-ID: <7c055dc50911051714t211f4e47v4549a609a2732722@mail.gmail.com>

does anyone have any experience installing sorcerer linux?
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 23:55:25 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 23:55:25 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
 support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <26897bbd0911051758l69a46e10y28820087f4defb1c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
	<38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<26897bbd0911051758l69a46e10y28820087f4defb1c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911052347530.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:

> Mike, I was that guy, I'm liking CrunchBang, but I'm about to run Moblin 
> since the new release just come out.


Great.  Let us know what you think.

I thought maybe you were the guy based on what you were writing earlier. 
It's great that there are people like you who want to try different things 
and tell us how they compare.

Right now the message I'm getting is that these Asus Eee machines are 
great and a bunch of Linux distros run really well on them.  There are so 
many distro options to choose from that I'm bound to pick the wrong one! 
;-)  But seriously, here's a very interesting talk on this topic (the 
problem of having too many options) from a noteworthy psychologist:

http://www.ted.com/talks/barry_schwartz_on_the_paradox_of_choice.html

I'm like the guy in the doctor's office saying "just tell me what to do!"

Mike


From chewie at wookimus.net  Fri Nov  6 00:05:04 2009
From: chewie at wookimus.net (Chad Walstrom)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 00:05:04 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar> 
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar>
Message-ID: <29922.1257487504@skuld.wookimus.net>

I'm in with the LaTeX crowd. You only need to know some basic markup,
and you can have a very presentable document, letter, article, slide
presentation, CD labels, business cards...  If you're in need of a
WYSIWYM (What You See Is What You Mean) editor, try LyX. LaTeX has been
getting plenty of development effort in the form of TeXLive
distribution.

I'm also in agreement about the DVCS, though I tend to use Monotone.  I
would place git in second place and Mercurial in third for preference.
Subversion is O.K, but it's not really intended for disconnected
operation.  You can't "check in" your changes incrementally if you can't
connect to your central server.  All in all, any revision control is
helpful.

Good luck!

Chad


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Fri Nov  6 02:12:34 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 02:12:34 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
 support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911052347530.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
	<38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<26897bbd0911051758l69a46e10y28820087f4defb1c@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911052347530.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911060155150.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:

> Right now the message I'm getting is that these Asus Eee machines are 
> great and a bunch of Linux distros run really well on them.


And so I just ordered these items from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/ASUS-1005HA-PU1X-BU-10-1-Inch-Blue-Netbook/dp/tech-data/B002DYIXMS/
http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-CT25664AC667-200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop/dp/B000F7QRTG

There were a lot of options:

http://event.asus.com/eeepc/comparison/eeepc_comparison.htm

Even within a category like "Eee PC 1005HA" there were at least the PU1X 
model (which I ordered) and the MU17 model, and then a choice of BK 
(black) or BU (blue) after that.

With free S/H and the 2GB RAM it was slightly less than $400.

I think I'm going to enjoy using this little netbook on planes.  It has 
10.5 hours of normal-use battery life (they say) and it's small, so it 
will fit between me and the guy in front of me -- that was a problem with 
the big Dell laptop I last owned.  With 160 GB of HDD I can load a lot of 
cool software on there, DVD ISOs, MP3 files, etc.

Mike


From adam.morris at redstargaming.net  Fri Nov  6 10:13:25 2009
From: adam.morris at redstargaming.net (Adam Morris)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 11:13:25 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <29922.1257487504@skuld.wookimus.net>
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar>
	<29922.1257487504@skuld.wookimus.net>
Message-ID: <20091106161325.GA28491@weegee.ath.cx>

+1 for LyX.  Its easily the best LaTeX specific editor out there for
Linux.  If you want something a bit lower level, I recommend Kile, which
is intended for KDE but works fine in GNOME.  Honestly though, a combo 
of LyX and gvim (if I needed to get at the LaTeX markup) got me through
college adv. math courses so they'd be the choice I'd recommend first.

On Fri, Nov 06, 2009 at 12:05:04AM -0600, Chad Walstrom wrote:
> I'm in with the LaTeX crowd. You only need to know some basic markup,
> and you can have a very presentable document, letter, article, slide
> presentation, CD labels, business cards...  If you're in need of a
> WYSIWYM (What You See Is What You Mean) editor, try LyX. LaTeX has been
> getting plenty of development effort in the form of TeXLive
> distribution.
> 
> I'm also in agreement about the DVCS, though I tend to use Monotone.  I
> would place git in second place and Mercurial in third for preference.
> Subversion is O.K, but it's not really intended for disconnected
> operation.  You can't "check in" your changes incrementally if you can't
> connect to your central server.  All in all, any revision control is
> helpful.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> Chad
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From austad at signal15.com  Fri Nov  6 13:47:42 2009
From: austad at signal15.com (Jay Austad)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 13:47:42 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <20091106161325.GA28491@weegee.ath.cx>
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar>
	<29922.1257487504@skuld.wookimus.net>
	<20091106161325.GA28491@weegee.ath.cx>
Message-ID: <797FBF8F-475F-4090-BD6B-294FC6A9635B@signal15.com>

Part of the issue is whatever software and workflow are decided upon,  
it has to just work.  A little bit of markup might be OK, as these are  
going to be relatively smart people using it.  But if the markup gets  
too insane, it's not gonna fly.

Is there any way to pull dynamic content by putting tags in a LaTeX  
document?

--
jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com




On Nov 6, 2009, at 10:13 AM, Adam Morris wrote:

> +1 for LyX.  Its easily the best LaTeX specific editor out there for
> Linux.  If you want something a bit lower level, I recommend Kile,  
> which
> is intended for KDE but works fine in GNOME.  Honestly though, a combo
> of LyX and gvim (if I needed to get at the LaTeX markup) got me  
> through
> college adv. math courses so they'd be the choice I'd recommend first.
>
> On Fri, Nov 06, 2009 at 12:05:04AM -0600, Chad Walstrom wrote:
>> I'm in with the LaTeX crowd. You only need to know some basic markup,
>> and you can have a very presentable document, letter, article, slide
>> presentation, CD labels, business cards...  If you're in need of a
>> WYSIWYM (What You See Is What You Mean) editor, try LyX. LaTeX has  
>> been
>> getting plenty of development effort in the form of TeXLive
>> distribution.
>>
>> I'm also in agreement about the DVCS, though I tend to use  
>> Monotone.  I
>> would place git in second place and Mercurial in third for  
>> preference.
>> Subversion is O.K, but it's not really intended for disconnected
>> operation.  You can't "check in" your changes incrementally if you  
>> can't
>> connect to your central server.  All in all, any revision control is
>> helpful.
>>
>> Good luck!
>>
>> Chad
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list



From diablomarcus at gmail.com  Thu Nov  5 19:58:05 2009
From: diablomarcus at gmail.com (Mark Katerberg)
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 19:58:05 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
	support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
	<38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26897bbd0911051758l69a46e10y28820087f4defb1c@mail.gmail.com>

Mike, I was that guy, I'm liking CrunchBang, but I'm about to run Moblin
since the new release just come out.

On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 5:57 PM, J Cruit <j at packetgod.com> wrote:

> I run Ubuntu Netbook Remix as well on my 1000HE and just did a flawless
> upgrade to the Koala.  Its great!  I also run Backtrack3 and Backtrack4 on
> it and they both work fine.
>
> --j
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 4:38 PM, Kristopher Browne <kris.browne at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I use Ubuntu Netbook Remix on my Surf 4G... Works well enough. If I had an
>> atom machine I'd be doing moblin though, the interface design seems well
>> thought out.
>>
>> Kris Browne
>>
>> -- Sent from my Palm Pr?
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> Mike Miller wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mark Katerberg wrote:
>>
>> > I agree with Perry. I have found other issues with the Aspire One such
>> > as side-touchpad buttons and a finicky touchpad. I have been nothing but
>>
>> > happy with my Asus. Also, Asus is very Linux friendly and everything is
>> > supported out of the box on Ubuntu Karmic and most other major distros
>> > (I have tried CrunchBang, Fedora, Mandriva, xPud, gOS and a couple
>> > others)
>>
>>
>> At the installfest on Saturday a guy was running CrunchBang on an Asus Eee
>>
>> 1000HE (or rough equivalent). It looked pretty sweet. What have the rest
>> of you discovered about the Eee machines and Linux distros? Is there a
>> favorite of most users? Comparative reviews? I think I'm going to get
>> one (maybe 1005HA) and see how it goes.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
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From tclug-announce-bounces at mn-linux.org  Fri Nov  6 15:29:30 2009
From: tclug-announce-bounces at mn-linux.org (tclug-announce-bounces at mn-linux.org)
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:29:30 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Forward of moderated message
Message-ID: <mailman.0.1257542970.3768.tclug-announce@mn-linux.org>

An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: Ross Yates <rossagree at gmail.com>
Subject: Is there a meetup in Duluth/Superior today?
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 15:22:24 -0600
Size: 2666
Url: http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20091106/af1cf28e/attachment.eml 

From adam.morris at redstargaming.net  Fri Nov  6 15:57:02 2009
From: adam.morris at redstargaming.net (Adam Morris)
Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 16:57:02 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] LaTeX, DocBook, or DITA experts?
In-Reply-To: <797FBF8F-475F-4090-BD6B-294FC6A9635B@signal15.com>
References: <69F11BF2-7680-4D29-B6CF-FBA81CA4A112@signal15.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911050814460.31905@sergyar>
	<29922.1257487504@skuld.wookimus.net>
	<20091106161325.GA28491@weegee.ath.cx>
	<797FBF8F-475F-4090-BD6B-294FC6A9635B@signal15.com>
Message-ID: <20091106215701.GA31054@weegee.ath.cx>

I think LyX should do fine for you then.

As for dynamic content, are we talking content that gets loaded during
compile, or content that gets loaded when you're reading the output
file?

On Fri, Nov 06, 2009 at 01:47:42PM -0600, Jay Austad wrote:
> Part of the issue is whatever software and workflow are decided upon, it 
> has to just work.  A little bit of markup might be OK, as these are  
> going to be relatively smart people using it.  But if the markup gets  
> too insane, it's not gonna fly.
>
> Is there any way to pull dynamic content by putting tags in a LaTeX  
> document?
>
> --
> jay austad  |  612.423.1433  |  austad at signal15.com
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 6, 2009, at 10:13 AM, Adam Morris wrote:
>
>> +1 for LyX.  Its easily the best LaTeX specific editor out there for
>> Linux.  If you want something a bit lower level, I recommend Kile,  
>> which
>> is intended for KDE but works fine in GNOME.  Honestly though, a combo
>> of LyX and gvim (if I needed to get at the LaTeX markup) got me  
>> through
>> college adv. math courses so they'd be the choice I'd recommend first.
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 06, 2009 at 12:05:04AM -0600, Chad Walstrom wrote:
>>> I'm in with the LaTeX crowd. You only need to know some basic markup,
>>> and you can have a very presentable document, letter, article, slide
>>> presentation, CD labels, business cards...  If you're in need of a
>>> WYSIWYM (What You See Is What You Mean) editor, try LyX. LaTeX has  
>>> been
>>> getting plenty of development effort in the form of TeXLive
>>> distribution.
>>>
>>> I'm also in agreement about the DVCS, though I tend to use Monotone.  
>>> I
>>> would place git in second place and Mercurial in third for  
>>> preference.
>>> Subversion is O.K, but it's not really intended for disconnected
>>> operation.  You can't "check in" your changes incrementally if you  
>>> can't
>>> connect to your central server.  All in all, any revision control is
>>> helpful.
>>>
>>> Good luck!
>>>
>>> Chad
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>


From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Sat Nov  7 08:35:24 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2009 08:35:24 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911071435.nA7EZOn27367@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: c2d mobo/cpu/ram combo for sale

I'm selling a mobo/cpu/ram package.  Specs are as follows:

Core2Duo e6400 processor w/ stock heatsink and fan
2GB DDR800 memory
Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3 motherboard

All parts are in 100% working condition and run flawlessly with linux.  The reason I am selling is I recently upgraded my system with a new motherboard, cpu and ram.

Asking $100.  Location: Minneapolis metro area.  Can pick up or will drop off somewhere within a reasonable distance.

Product links for more description (remove spaces, mods - please allow for longer 'words' than 45 char):
http://www.newegg.com/ Product/ Product.aspx? Item=N82E16820231098
http://www.newegg.com/ Product/ Product.aspx? Item=N82E16819115004
http://www.newegg.com/ Product/ Product.aspx? Item=N82E16813128012

Thanks,
andyschmid -at- gmail.com

Seller Email address: andyschmid at gmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Sat Nov  7 09:12:48 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2009 09:12:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911071512.nA7FCms30172@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: micro atx case with psu

I have a slightly used microATX pc case with 300W power supply for sale.  In great condition - only a couple scratches on the side which are not too noticeable (from sitting on the floor vertically).

The case is built well and would be great for a small desktop system or media center pc.  

Asking $30 OBO

Product info:
http://www.newegg.com/ Product/ Product.aspx? Item=N82E16811108060

Thanks,
andyschmid -at- gmail.com

Seller Email address: andyschmid at gmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com  Sat Nov  7 11:44:44 2009
From: goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com (Brian Dolan-Goecke)
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:44:44 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday Nov
	14th.
Message-ID: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>


This months PenguinsUnbound.com meeting will be
Saturday November 14th at TIES,
1667 Snelling Ave. N., St. Paul, MN 55108
from 10:00am to 12:00pm
(See the web site http://www.penguinsunbound.com for directions and more
info.)

          GNOME 3.0

This month Paul Cutler is kind enough to come and talk with us about
GNOME 3.0 (An Introduction to GNOME 3.0) introducing Linux (and
especially GNOME) users to the changes GNOME 3.0 will be bringing in
next March's GNOME 3.0 release.


We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage) and the
maintainace at TIES location.


Hope to see you there.



From cncole at earthlink.net  Sun Nov  8 05:47:41 2009
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2009 05:47:41 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
	Nov14th.
In-Reply-To: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIELICPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Brian Dolan-Goecke
> Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 11:45 AM
> To: tclug-list
> Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
> Nov14th.
> 
> 
> We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
> Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
> you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage) 

Is there any content at these links?


Chuck


From pcutler at gnome.org  Sun Nov  8 07:54:45 2009
From: pcutler at gnome.org (Paul Cutler)
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2009 07:54:45 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
	Nov14th.
In-Reply-To: <KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIELICPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>
References: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIELICPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <39428b2a0911080554s79265d5ar36bbb41b6f8869aa@mail.gmail.com>

Yes - also check out the home page:  http://minnestar.org/minnebar/

Paul

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 5:47 AM, Chuck Cole <cncole at earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Brian Dolan-Goecke
> > Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 11:45 AM
> > To: tclug-list
> > Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
> > Nov14th.
> >
> >
> > We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
> > Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
> > you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage)
>
> Is there any content at these links?
>
>
> Chuck
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From cncole at earthlink.net  Sun Nov  8 08:52:40 2009
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2009 08:52:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
	Nov14th.
In-Reply-To: <39428b2a0911080554s79265d5ar36bbb41b6f8869aa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <DIEPJAHDNINGELBLJLJCIEAIPKAA.cncole@earthlink.net>

FYI, does not show for me when using IE6, but does with Firefox.
  -----Original Message-----
  From: paul.r.cutler at gmail.com [mailto:paul.r.cutler at gmail.com]On Behalf Of Paul Cutler
  Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2009 7:55 AM
  To: Chuck Cole
  Cc: Brian Dolan-Goecke; tclug-list
  Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday Nov14th.


  Yes - also check out the home page:  http://minnestar.org/minnebar/

  Paul


  On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 5:47 AM, Chuck Cole <cncole at earthlink.net> wrote:



    > -----Original Message-----
    > From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
    > [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Brian Dolan-Goecke
    > Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 11:45 AM
    > To: tclug-list
    > Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
    > Nov14th.
    >
    >
    > We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
    > Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
    > you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage)

    Is there any content at these links?


    Chuck

    _______________________________________________
    TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
    tclug-list at mn-linux.org
    http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


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From jhsu802701 at jasonhsu.com  Sat Nov  7 21:14:53 2009
From: jhsu802701 at jasonhsu.com (Jason Hsu)
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2009 11:14:53 +0800
Subject: [tclug-list] iwlist/iwconfig show networks, wifi-radar does not
Message-ID: <20091108111453.8b76d300.jhsu802701@jasonhsu.com>

I'm using a Linksys WPC54GS version 1.1 wireless card. I think I finally got it to work, but I'm not sure.  My distro is Ubuntu Hardy Heron with a minimal GNOME installation.

The link light and commands like iwlist and iwconfig show that my wireless card is working. However, WiFi Radar and the NM Applet show no evidence that it is.

Unfortunately, I live in a small town with no WiFi venue open, so I can't tell you at this time if I can actually connect to an open network. With another WiFi card (that has always worked right out-of-the-box), I can see the presence of networks in WiFi Radar and NM Applet.

With my Linksys WPC54GS version 1.1 wireless card plugged into my laptop, I get the following lspci output:
00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 440BX/ZX/DX - 82443BX/ZX/DX Host bridge (rev 03)
00:01.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation 440BX/ZX/DX - 82443BX/ZX/DX AGP bridge (rev 03)
00:03.0 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1225 (rev 01)
00:03.1 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1225 (rev 01)
00:07.0 Bridge: Intel Corporation 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 ISA (rev 02)
00:07.1 IDE interface: Intel Corporation 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 IDE (rev 01)
00:07.2 USB Controller: Intel Corporation 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 USB (rev 01)
00:07.3 Bridge: Intel Corporation 82371AB/EB/MB PIIX4 ACPI (rev 03)
01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Neomagic Corporation NM2360 [MagicMedia 256ZX]
01:00.1 Multimedia audio controller: Neomagic Corporation NM2360 [MagicMedia 256ZX Audio]
06:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4306 802.11b/g Wireless LAN Controller (rev 03)

BCM4306 is the driver I need, and bcm43xx-fwcutter is the package that has it, so I used Synaptic to download and install the program.

When I enter the command "sudo modprobe -r bcm43xx && sudo modprobe bcm43xx", the link light on the wireless card suddenly comes on. However, I have no idea what this command means or how it activates the wireless card. Can anyone explain?

I get the following "iwlist scan" output:
lo Interface doesn't support scanning.

eth1 Scan completed :
Cell 01 - Address: 00:15:6D:10:0C:92
ESSID:"XTI-11"
Protocol:IEEE 802.11b
Mode:Master
Frequency:2.437 GHz (Channel 6)
Encryption keyff
Bit Rates:1 Mb/s; 2 Mb/s; 5.5 Mb/s; 11 Mb/s
Quality=82/100 Signal level=-74 dBm Noise level=-68 dBm
Extra: Last beacon: 52ms ago
Cell 02 - Address: 00:16:B6E:BF:64
ESSID:"mort"
Protocol:IEEE 802.11bg
Mode:Master
Frequency:2.437 GHz (Channel 6)
Encryption keyn
Bit Rates:1 Mb/s; 2 Mb/s; 5.5 Mb/s; 6 Mb/s; 9 Mb/s
11 Mb/s; 12 Mb/s; 18 Mb/s; 24 Mb/s; 36 Mb/s
48 Mb/s; 54 Mb/s
Quality=78/100 Signal level=-80 dBm Noise level=-68 dBm
Extra: Last beacon: 116ms ago
Cell 03 - Address: 00:15:6D:54:AC:AB
ESSID:"XTI-Dassel-S"
Protocol:IEEE 802.11b
Mode:Master
Frequency:2.462 GHz (Channel 11)
Encryption keyff
Bit Rates:1 Mb/s; 2 Mb/s; 5.5 Mb/s; 11 Mb/s
Quality=82/100 Signal level=-74 dBm Noise level=-68 dBm
Extra: Last beacon: 3240ms ago

I get the following iwconfig output:
lo no wireless extensions.

eth1 IEEE 802.11b/g ESSIDff/any Nickname:"Broadcom 4306"
Mode:Managed Frequency=2.437 GHz Access Point: Invalid
Bit Rate=1 Mb/s Tx-Power=15 dBm
RTS thrff Fragment thrff
Link Quality=0/100 Signal level=0 dBm Noise level=0 dBm
Rx invalid nwid:0 Rx invalid crypt:0 Rx invalid frag:0
Tx excessive retries:0 Invalid misc:0 Missed beacon:0

I get the following "lshw -C network" output:
WARNING: you should run this program as super-user.
*-network
description: Wireless interface
product: BCM4306 802.11b/g Wireless LAN Controller
vendor: Broadcom Corporation
physical id: 0
bus info: pci at 0000:06:00.0
logical name: eth1
version: 03
serial: 00:13:10:47:e7:93
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: bus_master cap_list ethernet physical wireless
configuration: broadcast=yes driver=bcm43xx driverversion=2.6.24-19-generic latency=64 module=bcm43xx multicast=yes wireless=IEEE 802.11b/g

In other words, the lit link LED on the wireless card and the outputs of all these commands indicate that my wireless card is working.

However, WiFi Radar does NOT show these networks - it's completely blank. The is true when I go to NM applet and click on "edit wireless networks".

My questions:
1. Why don't WiFi Radar or NM Applet 0.6.6 show any evidence that my wireless card is working even though commands like "iwlist scan", iwconfig, and "lshw -C network" and the link LED on the wireless card show the presence of networks in my area?
2. If WiFi Radar or NM Applet are somehow incompatible with this wireless card, is there another wireless network GUI I should use instead?


From jack at jacku.com  Tue Nov 10 07:26:19 2009
From: jack at jacku.com (Jack Ungerleider)
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 07:26:19 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
	Nov 14th.
In-Reply-To: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>
References: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <1fef78e80911100526r6c41b78eme96b2e4fd76e7b@mail.gmail.com>

For any TCPC Linux on Saturday regulars who watch this list we're
going to cancel LoS in favor of Penguins Unbound this month. See you
there on Saturday.

Jack

On 11/7/09, Brian Dolan-Goecke <goeko at goecke-dolan.com> wrote:
>
> This months PenguinsUnbound.com meeting will be
> Saturday November 14th at TIES,
> 1667 Snelling Ave. N., St. Paul, MN 55108
> from 10:00am to 12:00pm
> (See the web site http://www.penguinsunbound.com for directions and more
> info.)
>
>           GNOME 3.0
>
> This month Paul Cutler is kind enough to come and talk with us about
> GNOME 3.0 (An Introduction to GNOME 3.0) introducing Linux (and
> especially GNOME) users to the changes GNOME 3.0 will be bringing in
> next March's GNOME 3.0 release.
>
>
> We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
> Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
> you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage) and the
> maintainace at TIES location.
>
>
> Hope to see you there.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device


From diablomarcus at gmail.com  Tue Nov 10 12:00:26 2009
From: diablomarcus at gmail.com (Mark Katerberg)
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:00:26 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting Saturday
	Nov 14th.
In-Reply-To: <1fef78e80911100526r6c41b78eme96b2e4fd76e7b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4AF5B20C.703@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<1fef78e80911100526r6c41b78eme96b2e4fd76e7b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26897bbd0911101000m60187874v21542975b5f86588@mail.gmail.com>

I won't be able to make it, but I will hopefully make them in the future. I
need to watch penguinsunbound.com  more closely so I can see these updates
sooner.

On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 7:26 AM, Jack Ungerleider <jack at jacku.com> wrote:

> For any TCPC Linux on Saturday regulars who watch this list we're
> going to cancel LoS in favor of Penguins Unbound this month. See you
> there on Saturday.
>
> Jack
>
> On 11/7/09, Brian Dolan-Goecke <goeko at goecke-dolan.com> wrote:
> >
> > This months PenguinsUnbound.com meeting will be
> > Saturday November 14th at TIES,
> > 1667 Snelling Ave. N., St. Paul, MN 55108
> > from 10:00am to 12:00pm
> > (See the web site http://www.penguinsunbound.com for directions and more
> > info.)
> >
> >           GNOME 3.0
> >
> > This month Paul Cutler is kind enough to come and talk with us about
> > GNOME 3.0 (An Introduction to GNOME 3.0) introducing Linux (and
> > especially GNOME) users to the changes GNOME 3.0 will be bringing in
> > next March's GNOME 3.0 release.
> >
> >
> > We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
> > Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
> > you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage) and the
> > maintainace at TIES location.
> >
> >
> > Hope to see you there.
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
>
> --
> Sent from my mobile device
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From diablomarcus at gmail.com  Tue Nov 10 12:03:19 2009
From: diablomarcus at gmail.com (Mark Katerberg)
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:03:19 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus Eee distros (was "does Wal-Mart's $300 laptop
	support linux?")
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911060155150.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911051319140.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4af353f4.4902be0a.6a6a.7d2b@mx.google.com>
	<38aa5b6a0911051557t1b68e2d2wd9b7913921cced5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<26897bbd0911051758l69a46e10y28820087f4defb1c@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911052347530.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911060155150.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <26897bbd0911101003x777df7bbs373b6afc38e3f0ff@mail.gmail.com>

I would expect something like 9 hours from that thing (they estimate it
under ideal conditions with most things turned off) but yeah, I have found
mine great for traveling.

On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:12 AM, Mike Miller
<mbmiller+l at gmail.com<mbmiller%2Bl at gmail.com>
> wrote:

> On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:
>
> > Right now the message I'm getting is that these Asus Eee machines are
> > great and a bunch of Linux distros run really well on them.
>
>
> And so I just ordered these items from Amazon.com:
>
>
> http://www.amazon.com/ASUS-1005HA-PU1X-BU-10-1-Inch-Blue-Netbook/dp/tech-data/B002DYIXMS/
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-CT25664AC667-200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop/dp/B000F7QRTG
>
> There were a lot of options:
>
> http://event.asus.com/eeepc/comparison/eeepc_comparison.htm
>
> Even within a category like "Eee PC 1005HA" there were at least the PU1X
> model (which I ordered) and the MU17 model, and then a choice of BK
> (black) or BU (blue) after that.
>
> With free S/H and the 2GB RAM it was slightly less than $400.
>
> I think I'm going to enjoy using this little netbook on planes.  It has
> 10.5 hours of normal-use battery life (they say) and it's small, so it
> will fit between me and the guy in front of me -- that was a problem with
> the big Dell laptop I last owned.  With 160 GB of HDD I can load a lot of
> cool software on there, DVD ISOs, MP3 files, etc.
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com  Fri Nov 13 04:22:17 2009
From: goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com (Brian Dolan-Goecke)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2009 04:22:17 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] * Saturday * Gnome 3.0 @PenguinsUnbound Linux Meeting
 Saturday Nov 14th.
Message-ID: <4AFD3359.10906@Goecke-Dolan.com>



This months PenguinsUnbound.com meeting will be
Saturday November 14th at TIES,
1667 Snelling Ave. N., St. Paul, MN 55108
from 10:00am to 12:00pm
(See the web site http://www.penguinsunbound.com for directions and more
info.)

          GNOME 3.0

This month Paul Cutler is kind enough to come and talk with us about
GNOME 3.0 (An Introduction to GNOME 3.0) introducing Linux (and
especially GNOME) users to the changes GNOME 3.0 will be bringing in
next March's GNOME 3.0 release.


We are having an extra early Meeting because of Thanks Giving, the
Minnebar (If you aren't familiar with MinneBar I would highly suggest
you check it out. http://wiki.minnestar.org/HomePage) and the
maintenance at TIES location.


Hope to see you there.


==>brian.


From woodbrian77 at gmail.com  Fri Nov 13 14:43:52 2009
From: woodbrian77 at gmail.com (Brian Wood)
Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2009 14:43:52 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Access to big endian machine with C++ compiler
In-Reply-To: <ddf6f4ca0911131242mf5b8dd4jd1b54a0de27b1a9c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ddf6f4ca0911131218u244672a8v4050ef19ae5bcb15@mail.gmail.com>
	<ddf6f4ca0911131221g19e423batacd882db35fe122d@mail.gmail.com>
	<ddf6f4ca0911131233w4fa0a52enc706a31fcdecb38e@mail.gmail.com>
	<ddf6f4ca0911131242mf5b8dd4jd1b54a0de27b1a9c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ddf6f4ca0911131243ie29c952scda98ba86d9e49b8@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom

Would anyone be interested in working out a deal with me to
allow me to login to a big endian computer and build/run some
tests?   My offer will consist of giving you an investment in
Ebenezer Enterprises.  I don't need to have 24/7 access to
it.


Regards,
Brian Wood
Ebenezer Enterprises
http://www.webEbenezer.net
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From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Sat Nov 14 10:51:48 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 10:51:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911141651.nAEGpmD22707@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: 

Subject: Sharp Zaurus SL C-3000

Very gently used Sharp Zaurus SL C-3000 White Clam Shell Style PDA type computer. Haven't used it for a while and it may need new battery, I will include a compact flash wireless card. I don't remember the exact specs on this device, but you can research it for yourself quite easily. I can let it go for $250.00.

Seller Email address: joebe at charter dot net

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 11:35:30 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 11:35:30 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911140935t237fce90vae2d0b535771e5b3@mail.gmail.com>

Hardware question...

All right, here's my irritating issue:  My setup is Keyboard -> 16'
active USB extension cable -> KVM switch -> computer.  A cheap
keyboard I have (Asus ultra-thin) works fine, but my nice one (Das
Keyboard) does not.  The nice keyboard does work if connected directly
to the computer, connected directly to the KVM switch, connected to
the computer through the extension cable by bypassing the KVM switch,
connected to the computer through other (shorter) extension cables.
There are three LEDs on the nice keyboard (numlock, capslock,
scrolllock).  When in a working configuration, just numlock is lit.
When in the non-working config, all three are lit.  Non-working means
typing results in no output on the screen.  I should note that the
nice keyboard has a USB hub built in, but I don't need that to
actually work - just typing.  If I connect the nice keyboard to the
computer (without the KVM switch) through four short (about 3') USB
extension cables, it works fine, but if I add a fifth one I get the
same all-lights, no-output behavior as with the 16' plus the KVM
switch.  What would you suggest I do to make it work from 16' away
through the KVM switch?  I have tried putting powered USB hubs in at
various places without success.

 - Tony Yarusso


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 12:31:42 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 12:31:42 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <4afef246.9553f10a.7388.0681@mx.google.com>
References: <254fef0f0911140935t237fce90vae2d0b535771e5b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<4afef246.9553f10a.7388.0681@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911141031m47d166fcv53099d66ec5ed295@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Kristopher Browne
<kris.browne at gmail.com> wrote:
> Clarifcation question: nice keyboard is usb 1 or 2, and does kvm handle usb
> 2?

The keyboard is USB 2, but I'm not sure about the KVM.

For reference, the parts are:
KVM switch:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817402029
/ http://www.linkskey.com/detail.php?Productid=1015
Keyboard: http://daskeyboard.com/
USB Cable: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812339009

I suppose I could probably test the KVM by hooking the keyboard up
directly, plugging a flash drive into its hub, and measuring
throughput if that would be helpful.


From tlunde at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 13:14:36 2009
From: tlunde at gmail.com (Thomas Lunde)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 13:14:36 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <254fef0f0911140935t237fce90vae2d0b535771e5b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <254fef0f0911140935t237fce90vae2d0b535771e5b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <74D143E3-87F1-4971-B5F6-79F2EAD43384@gmail.com>

Isn't there a 3m limit on USB cables?  How about 8' of dumb cabling, a  
powered hub, then 8' of dumb cabling?

I've always been wary of "smart" cables.

Just my $0.02.

Thomas



On Nov 14, 2009, at 11:35 AM, Tony Yarusso <tonyyarusso at gmail.com>  
wrote:

> Hardware question...
>
> All right, here's my irritating issue:  My setup is Keyboard -> 16'
> active USB extension cable -> KVM switch -> computer.  A cheap
> keyboard I have (Asus ultra-thin) works fine, but my nice one (Das
> Keyboard) does not.  The nice keyboard does work if connected directly
> to the computer, connected directly to the KVM switch, connected to
> the computer through the extension cable by bypassing the KVM switch,
> connected to the computer through other (shorter) extension cables.
> There are three LEDs on the nice keyboard (numlock, capslock,
> scrolllock).  When in a working configuration, just numlock is lit.
> When in the non-working config, all three are lit.  Non-working means
> typing results in no output on the screen.  I should note that the
> nice keyboard has a USB hub built in, but I don't need that to
> actually work - just typing.  If I connect the nice keyboard to the
> computer (without the KVM switch) through four short (about 3') USB
> extension cables, it works fine, but if I add a fifth one I get the
> same all-lights, no-output behavior as with the 16' plus the KVM
> switch.  What would you suggest I do to make it work from 16' away
> through the KVM switch?  I have tried putting powered USB hubs in at
> various places without success.
>
> - Tony Yarusso
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From cncole at earthlink.net  Sat Nov 14 16:05:34 2009
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 16:05:34 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <254fef0f0911141031m47d166fcv53099d66ec5ed295@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIEMHCPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Tony Yarusso
> Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 12:32 PM
> To: tclug-list
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Kristopher Browne
> <kris.browne at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Clarifcation question: nice keyboard is usb 1 or 2, and does kvm handle usb
> > 2?
>
> The keyboard is USB 2, but I'm not sure about the KVM.

FYI..     Just saying it's a USB 2 spec is not always adequate data to know speed, etc: there are three levels of service, and two
define backward compatibility under USB 2.0.  The termination resistor or lack thereof determines basic difference between USB 1.1
and 2.0  Many new production runs of products which are truly nothing other than USB 1.1 are called USB 2.0 (and are) for marketing
reasons.

Hard to imagine a keyboard or mouse using any but the very lowest spec, however.


> I suppose I could probably test the KVM by hooking the keyboard up
> directly, plugging a flash drive into its hub, and measuring
> throughput if that would be helpful.

Probably an not adequate test setup for definitive data without some extra work or checking.


Chuck



From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 17:10:48 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 17:10:48 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
In-Reply-To: <200911141651.nAEGpmD22707@crusader.real-time.com>
References: <200911141651.nAEGpmD22707@crusader.real-time.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911141659440.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sat, 14 Nov 2009, TCLUG Classifieds wrote:

> New TCLUG Classified Ad
>
> Category: Computer
>
> Type of Ad:
>
> Subject: Sharp Zaurus SL C-3000
>
> Very gently used Sharp Zaurus SL C-3000 White Clam Shell Style PDA type 
> computer. Haven't used it for a while and it may need new battery, I 
> will include a compact flash wireless card. I don't remember the exact 
> specs on this device, but you can research it for yourself quite easily. 
> I can let it go for $250.00.


Compare specs here:

http://www.brighthand.com/default.asp?newsID=2379

With what I just bought from Amazon.com for $398 including S/H:

http://www.amazon.com/ASUS-1005HA-PU1X-BU-10-1-Inch-Blue-Netbook/dp/tech-data/B002DYIXMS/
http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-CT25664AC667-200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop/dp/B000F7QRTG

Drop the extra gig of RAM and you're down to $357.

The Zaurus doesn't have WiFi or Bluetooth and the Asus has both.  The Asus 
also has a camera and microphone and the Zaurus has neither.  The Asus has 
a 160 GB HDD and the Zaurus has only 4 GB, the Asus screen is 1024x600 
while the Zaurus is 640x480.  And so on.  The Zaurus is almost 5 years old 
and used, and the Asus is new.

So should the Zaurus really sell for $250?

Mike


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 17:42:47 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 17:42:47 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIEMHCPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>
References: <254fef0f0911141031m47d166fcv53099d66ec5ed295@mail.gmail.com>
	<KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLIEMHCPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911141542k1be8452cs2ce6b89742c63ffa@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Chuck Cole <cncole at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> The keyboard is USB 2, but I'm not sure about the KVM.
>
> FYI.. ? ? Just saying it's a USB 2 spec is not always adequate data to know speed, etc: there are three levels of service, and two
> define backward compatibility under USB 2.0. ?The termination resistor or lack thereof determines basic difference between USB 1.1
> and 2.0 ?Many new production runs of products which are truly nothing other than USB 1.1 are called USB 2.0 (and are) for marketing
> reasons.
>
> Hard to imagine a keyboard or mouse using any but the very lowest spec, however.

Given that they keyboard is advertised as having a USB 2.0 hub built
in along with its price and overall quality and modernity (is that a
word?), I feel pretty comfortable thinking it uses USB 2 for real.
The KVM much less so.  I have access to multimeters and such if you
have suggestions for finding out, or anything else I can try.  (I'm
not yet sure why this question was asked frankly, but I'm hoping this
leads to my stuff working eventually!)


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 18:29:02 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kristopher Browne)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 18:29:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <254fef0f0911141542k1be8452cs2ce6b89742c63ffa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4aff4b54.9753f10a.2e4d.ffffb3b6@mx.google.com>

If the kvm isn't USB2, or if it was off-spec, it might not be fully compatible with the keyboard.

Generally if the 3 lights are on solid, it means its getting some juice, if not plenty, but its not initializing right.

Kris Browne
kris dot browne at gmail dot com

-- Sent from my Palm Pr?
Tony Yarusso wrote:

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Chuck Cole &lt;cncole at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> The keyboard is USB 2, but I'm not sure about the KVM.
>
> FYI.. ? ? Just saying it's a USB 2 spec is not always adequate data to know speed, etc: there are three levels of service, and two
> define backward compatibility under USB 2.0. ?The termination resistor or lack thereof determines basic difference between USB 1.1
> and 2.0 ?Many new production runs of products which are truly nothing other than USB 1.1 are called USB 2.0 (and are) for marketing
> reasons.
>
> Hard to imagine a keyboard or mouse using any but the very lowest spec, however.

Given that they keyboard is advertised as having a USB 2.0 hub built
in along with its price and overall quality and modernity (is that a
word?), I feel pretty comfortable thinking it uses USB 2 for real.
The KVM much less so.  I have access to multimeters and such if you
have suggestions for finding out, or anything else I can try.  (I'm
not yet sure why this question was asked frankly, but I'm hoping this
leads to my stuff working eventually!)

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

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From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Sat Nov 14 18:55:24 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 18:55:24 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <4aff4b54.9753f10a.2e4d.ffffb3b6@mx.google.com>
References: <254fef0f0911141542k1be8452cs2ce6b89742c63ffa@mail.gmail.com>
	<4aff4b54.9753f10a.2e4d.ffffb3b6@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911141655o42464962ue677bf5b584693d1@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 6:29 PM, Kristopher Browne
<kris.browne at gmail.com> wrote:
> If the kvm isn't USB2, or if it was off-spec, it might not be fully
> compatible with the keyboard.
>
> Generally if the 3 lights are on solid, it means its getting some juice, if
> not plenty, but its not initializing right.

Remember that I said the keyboard does work if plugged directly into
the KVM, so it's compatible on that level at least; just not paired
with the extension cable as well.
One thing I'm pondering is that maybe it gets enough power, but too
much lag.  The USB spec mentions a maximum round-trip delay, which
would be consistent with getting the three-lights behavior when I
string five or more small extensions together.  Quoth Wikipedia,

"The maximum length of a standard USB cable (for USB 2.0 or earlier)
is 5.0 metres (16.4 ft). The primary reason for this limit is the
maximum allowed round-trip delay of about 1,500 ns. If USB host
commands are unanswered by the USB device within the allowed time, the
host considers the command lost. When adding USB device response time,
delays from the maximum number of hubs added to the delays from
connecting cables, the maximum acceptable delay per cable amounts to
be 26 ns."

If the KVM is slightly off or just not as smart as other things, that
could exacerbate the problem so it appears sooner, and that answer
would also match with adding powered hubs not helping.  I did also
just find out that there's such a thing as a "USB over Cat5 extender",
which basically consists of two devices (one for each end) converting
a USB type A connector to RJ-45, then lets you use Cat5 cable for the
distance, allowing much longer distances.  Do you think that might
help?  They run from $50-$120, which would be worth it to me if it
actually works, but I don't want to go placing Newegg orders without
having any idea if it's related to my problem.


From cncole at earthlink.net  Sat Nov 14 20:34:32 2009
From: cncole at earthlink.net (Chuck Cole)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 20:34:32 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
In-Reply-To: <254fef0f0911141542k1be8452cs2ce6b89742c63ffa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <KBELLBDJKGDCAHIDFNLLOEMICPAA.cncole@earthlink.net>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org]On Behalf Of Tony Yarusso
> Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 5:43 PM
> To: tclug-list
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] USB KVM switch woes
> 
> 
> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Chuck Cole <cncole at earthlink.net> wrote:
> >> The keyboard is USB 2, but I'm not sure about the KVM.
> >
> > FYI..     Just saying it's a USB 2 spec is not always adequate data to know speed, etc: there are three levels of 
> service, and two
> > define backward compatibility under USB 2.0.  The termination resistor or lack thereof determines basic difference 
> between USB 1.1
> > and 2.0  Many new production runs of products which are truly nothing other than USB 1.1 are called USB 2.0 (and are) 
> for marketing
> > reasons.
> >
> > Hard to imagine a keyboard or mouse using any but the very lowest spec, however.
> 
> Given that they keyboard is advertised as having a USB 2.0 hub built
> in along with its price and overall quality and modernity (is that a
> word?), I feel pretty comfortable thinking it uses USB 2 for real.

Look up what "using USB 2.0" really means: it is an adaptive rate spec, where either of three connection states are defined.  It is not a case of all USB 2.0 connections running at the same speed, etc.  Unless the right termination resistor is present, USB 2.0 runs at the same speeds as USB 1.1.  I think the presence and connection to a shield is also part of the connection sensing.  Don't have perfect recall of the spec: it's over 200 pages long.  Some Canon scanners are products that use this ambiguity where an 11mbps rate is called USB 1.1 in one year and USB 2.0 in the next model year but the physical interface, data rate, and chip capabilities are exactly the same.

I'm just clarifying that spec isn't what you assumed.  Not sure what your problem may be.  Probably cable related.

> The KVM much less so.  I have access to multimeters and such if you
> have suggestions for finding out, or anything else I can try.  (I'm
> not yet sure why this question was asked frankly, but I'm hoping this
> leads to my stuff working eventually!)

If you really need/want to test, either find somebody who has a USB-specific tester or buy a microchip kit that implements the tests in a documented way.  


Chuck 



From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Sat Nov 14 22:24:12 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Sat, 14 Nov 2009 22:24:12 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911150424.nAF4OCG32347@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Free

Subject: RAM chip 1 GB for Asus

I just bought one of these (system forced me to break URL into pieces!)...

http://www.amazon.com/
Crucial-CT25664AC667-
200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop
/dp/B000F7QRTG

...and I'm keeping it, but I bought it to replace the 1 GB version that came with the machine, and I now want to give that away.  I don't know if there are 500 MB machines, perhaps, that this could be used to upgrade.  If no one here wants it, I'll throw it out.

Seller Email address: mbmiller+l at gmail dot com

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From tlunde at gmail.com  Sun Nov 15 02:02:38 2009
From: tlunde at gmail.com (Thomas Lunde)
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 2009 02:02:38 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
In-Reply-To: <200911150424.nAF4OCG32347@crusader.real-time.com>
References: <200911150424.nAF4OCG32347@crusader.real-time.com>
Message-ID: <F6FC1DBE-146B-4B70-9487-FE6CBE493189@gmail.com>

I'd love to have it. My netbook has only 512 of RAM and it shows.

Thanks!
Thomas



On Nov 14, 2009, at 10:24 PM, TCLUG Classifieds <webmaster at mn- 
linux.org> wrote:

> New TCLUG Classified Ad
>
> Category: Computer
>
> Type of Ad: For Free
>
> Subject: RAM chip 1 GB for Asus
>
> I just bought one of these (system forced me to break URL into  
> pieces!)...
>
> http://www.amazon.com/
> Crucial-CT25664AC667-
> 200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop
> /dp/B000F7QRTG
>
> ...and I'm keeping it, but I bought it to replace the 1 GB version  
> that came with the machine, and I now want to give that away.  I  
> don't know if there are 500 MB machines, perhaps, that this could be  
> used to upgrade.  If no one here wants it, I'll throw it out.
>
> Seller Email address: mbmiller+l at gmail dot com
>
> http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 15 02:23:12 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 2009 02:23:12 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
In-Reply-To: <F6FC1DBE-146B-4B70-9487-FE6CBE493189@gmail.com>
References: <200911150424.nAF4OCG32347@crusader.real-time.com>
	<F6FC1DBE-146B-4B70-9487-FE6CBE493189@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911150219570.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sun, 15 Nov 2009, Thomas Lunde wrote:

> I'd love to have it. My netbook has only 512 of RAM and it shows.

Great.  But are you sure it will work in your machine?  It can take this 
exact kind of RAM chip?

http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-CT25664AC667-200-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop/dp/B000F7QRTG

That's the 2GB, mine is the 1GB.  If that's for you, write again off list 
and I'll tell you where you can pick it up (e.g., I live in Minneapolis by 
E Lake and 41st Ave S).

Mike


From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Mon Nov 16 10:18:02 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:18:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911161618.nAGGI2928094@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: Want for Free

Subject: contract headhunter

any headhunters you like well enough to refer?  tia, greg

Seller Email address: tclug at nvpf dot org

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Mon Nov 16 10:47:53 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:47:53 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911161647.nAGGlrx02263@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: Want for Free

Subject: contract headhunter

any headhunters you like well enough to refer?  tia, greg

sorry previous post was from dead email address, this one should work better.

Seller Email address: tclugad at whitleymott dot net

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com  Mon Nov 16 13:18:18 2009
From: ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com (r j)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 13:18:18 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Re Good head hunter.
Message-ID: <25f02f40911161118s578224d4nfa8d09cca6102a0b@mail.gmail.com>

HeadHunter Rick Miller  He is a pro and will match you with a great company
!
He has been in the business for a long time and has placed Lots of people.
Here is his email. Enjoy your new job. ,Ron

rickmiller21 at hotmail.com

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 12:00 PM, <tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org> wrote:

> Send tclug-list mailing list submissions to
>        tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>        http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>        tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>        tclug-list-owner at mn-linux.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of tclug-list digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. New TCLUG Classified Ad (TCLUG Classifieds)
>   2. New TCLUG Classified Ad (TCLUG Classifieds)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:18:02 -0600
> From: TCLUG Classifieds <webmaster at mn-linux.org>
> Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
> To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Message-ID: <200911161618.nAGGI2928094 at crusader.real-time.com>
>
> New TCLUG Classified Ad
>
> Category: Computer
>
> Type of Ad: Want for Free
>
> Subject: contract headhunter
>
> any headhunters you like well enough to refer?  tia, greg
>
> Seller Email address: tclug at nvpf dot org
>
> http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:47:53 -0600
> From: TCLUG Classifieds <webmaster at mn-linux.org>
> Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
> To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Message-ID: <200911161647.nAGGlrx02263 at crusader.real-time.com>
>
> New TCLUG Classified Ad
>
> Category: Computer
>
> Type of Ad: Want for Free
>
> Subject: contract headhunter
>
> any headhunters you like well enough to refer?  tia, greg
>
> sorry previous post was from dead email address, this one should work
> better.
>
> Seller Email address: tclugad at whitleymott dot net
>
> http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> End of tclug-list Digest, Vol 59, Issue 18
> ******************************************
>
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From webmaster at mn-linux.org  Mon Nov 16 19:28:19 2009
From: webmaster at mn-linux.org (TCLUG Classifieds)
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 19:28:19 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] New TCLUG Classified Ad
Message-ID: <200911170128.nAH1SJx14561@crusader.real-time.com>

New TCLUG Classified Ad

Category: Computer

Type of Ad: For Sale

Subject: pci 10/100 nics

I probabally have a dozen or so intel/3com/linksys pci 10/100mbps network cards. $0.25 each or trade for good beer/caffine/energy drink

I live in st. louis park & work in plymouth

Seller Email address: jungle at hickorytech dot net

http://www.mn-linux.org/cgi-bin/classifieds/index.cgi



From john.meier at gmail.com  Tue Nov 17 13:42:16 2009
From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 13:42:16 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mobo+CPU+Power - LinHES
Message-ID: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy-

Hoping there's a few Mythtv users lurking about....

I dropped the Directtv recently switched to OTA with an HD homerun sitting
on my network.  My old Knoppmyth box can't keep up with the HD content.  Was
wondering if anyone has any recommendations for a good solid mobo where all
features work with linux.  I'll be putting in a video card - probably a fx
5200 I have laying around here - unless there's something better.

 I'd like to be able to record and watch at the same time and will probably
just use the stereo jack to patch into the TV speakers - but it'd be nice to
use a spdif connection to my old home theater setup.

CPU fan/heatsink is another concern - any recommendations there?



Thanks!
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From sloncho at gmail.com  Tue Nov 17 14:05:18 2009
From: sloncho at gmail.com (Sunny)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:05:18 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mobo+CPU+Power - LinHES
In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
References: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e7eeb230911171205n5223de07ge7fc0df59e9856ef@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 1:42 PM, John Meier <john.meier at gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy-
>
> Hoping there's a few Mythtv users lurking about....
>
> I dropped the Directtv recently switched to OTA with an HD homerun sitting
> on my network.? My old Knoppmyth box can't keep up with the HD content.? Was
> wondering if anyone has any recommendations for a good solid mobo where all
> features work with linux.? I'll be putting in a video card - probably a fx
> 5200 I have laying around here - unless there's something better.
>
> ?I'd like to be able to record and watch at the same time and will probably
> just use the stereo jack to patch into the TV speakers - but it'd be nice to
> use a spdif connection to my old home theater setup.
>
> CPU fan/heatsink is another concern - any recommendations there?
>

You might first try with newer version of mythtv + nvidia card + XvMC
extensions enabled.

XvMC (http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/XvMC) will offload your main CPU of
the decoding of the MPEG2 video to the GPU.

So, you might not need to upgrade the computer itself.

Cheers


-- 
Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny)

Artificial Intelligence is no match for natural stupidity.


From nmarkon at gmail.com  Tue Nov 17 14:05:02 2009
From: nmarkon at gmail.com (Noah Markon)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:05:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Mobo+CPU+Power - LinHES
In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
References: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f45d0cb0911171205n1b163308m1c25e5bc46961cfa@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 1:42 PM, John Meier <john.meier at gmail.com> wrote:

> Howdy-
>
> Hoping there's a few Mythtv users lurking about....
>
> I dropped the Directtv recently switched to OTA with an HD homerun sitting
> on my network.  My old Knoppmyth box can't keep up with the HD content.  Was
> wondering if anyone has any recommendations for a good solid mobo where all
> features work with linux.  I'll be putting in a video card - probably a fx
> 5200 I have laying around here - unless there's something better.
>
>  I'd like to be able to record and watch at the same time and will probably
> just use the stereo jack to patch into the TV speakers - but it'd be nice to
> use a spdif connection to my old home theater setup.
>
> CPU fan/heatsink is another concern - any recommendations there?
>
>
Sorry I didn't reply to the list...

I use this as a frontend:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500027

I hear it also works well as a combined frontend/backend.

I don't have a fan on it, the power supply is a brick,  and no hard drive so
it's completely silent.  It also uses very little power so I don't mind it
running all day/night.
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Tue Nov 17 14:16:23 2009
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron)
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:16:23 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Mobo+CPU+Power - LinHES
In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
References: <65293fcc0911171142v6f622f4sa64dc108468a2f82@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911171412140.2415@localhost.localdomain>


> Hoping there's a few Mythtv users lurking about....

I'm using a pretty old Mac Mini as a frontend. It's running Ubuntu. Has no 
problem keeping up with hidef which is streaming off NFS from the 
basement. Outputs to the AV receiver with a DVI->HDMI cable and 
optical audio. Sure, it's 1080i and not 1080p, but you know.


-Yaron

--


From john.meier at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 00:29:44 2009
From: john.meier at gmail.com (John Meier)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 00:29:44 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] init level 3,
	only one tty running custom script = no login/shell 	access?
Message-ID: <65293fcc0911172229g3d865aa0j47321554cada6417@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all -

Here's the situation:


I have a small script to grab or set some network parameters, test the
connection to the outside world and then quit.

I remastered Knoppix 6.01 to boot into init level 3 and have one tty (tty1)
run the script "once".  All other getty invocations are commented
out/removed in the inittab.   When the script is done, any key press drops
the init level to 0 and the system shuts down.  I also allow shutdown at
anytime with the 3 finger salute.

Is there a way for a evil doer to drop into a shell in the setup?  :)  Or a
better way to limit access to the system other than the running of the
script?  From my tests any crtl-c or ctrl-d or any of the other normal ways
for interrupting  a script don't drop me into a shell.

Maybe I missed something...

thanks!
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 01:59:09 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 01:59:09 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

I got that Asus EeePC 1005HA and installed Netbook Remix on it.  It would 
be easy to do it a second time, but if you have never done it, there are a 
few things to learn, so it took me awhile.

Here are a couple of cool things about it:  It can read SD cards, so I 
pulled the card from my camera, popped it in there and I could instantly 
see my photos.  Couldn't have been easier.  The built-in camera worked 
instantly using a program called "Cheese".

It has a VGA out, of course, so I hooked it up to my HDTV (1920x1080). 
Then I opened "Display" from the Systems menu and it was already 
configured just the way I'd want.  Brilliant.

So I used sshfs to connect via WiFi to a machine in the home that has some 
DVD ISOs on it and I used VLC to play them onto the HDTV from the Asus 
netbook.  It worked and it looked amazingly good.  The audio was going 
into the stereo system and that also worked great.  One trick:  If you use 
VLC for video, you have to have only one monitor on.  If both are on, it 
shows only black.  So to play the DVD ISOs on the HDTV I had to turn off 
the laptop display.

For some DVD ISOs the video would hang for a second every minute or so, 
but I don't thinkt that was really a problem with the Asus, though it 
might have been, I think it was the WiFi connection in the basement to the 
router upstairs that caused that.  More research is needed.

I'm going to be hooking up a desktop machine DVD out to the HDMI in on the 
HDTV, so I won't be using the laptop much for DVDs in the house.

Mike


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 08:52:28 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 08:52:28 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:

> I got that Asus EeePC 1005HA and installed Netbook Remix on it.


Somehow, inexplicably, the charger stopped working.  There's a little 
light on the box that won't go on.  I only have about 1.5 hours, 
supposedly, of battery left until I can get a new charger.  Very 
disappointing and annoying.  I've never had a charger die on me, at least 
not until it was maybe 8 years old and been through who-knows-what.

Mike


From justin.kremer at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 09:19:00 2009
From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 09:19:00 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu> 
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <27e6356a0911180719y42b1a8d0w5a1109552a4f5ec3@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 8:52 AM, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:
>
>> I got that Asus EeePC 1005HA and installed Netbook Remix on it.
>
>
> Somehow, inexplicably, the charger stopped working. ?There's a little
> light on the box that won't go on. ?I only have about 1.5 hours,
> supposedly, of battery left until I can get a new charger. ?Very
> disappointing and annoying. ?I've never had a charger die on me, at least
> not until it was maybe 8 years old and been through who-knows-what.

I know this goes somewhat off topic, but with devices like these, you
do get what you pay for.
Studies in long term reliability are showing that some companies are
better than others, but as a whole, the more expensive laptops also
tend to yield a longer life without malfunction.  Not something that
surprises me after owning a couple rather cheap, and a couple rather
expensive notebooks.
Then again, Apple (who despite barely being mentioned in the article,
gets their name in the URL) has had plenty of issues with their power
cords after remarkably short periods of time, despite the fact that
most, if not all of their notebooks being grouped in the "premium"
price group.
http://www.electronista.com/articles/09/11/17/reliability.study.has.apple.4th.place/
On the other hand, I've never had a positive experience running Linux
on Apple hardware, and the el-cheapo notebooks have provided very good
compatibility and functionality for me there.  Probably due, in part,
to using very common parts, and very little bleeding edge technology
to keep cost down.
- Justin


From j at packetgod.com  Wed Nov 18 09:27:34 2009
From: j at packetgod.com (J Cruit)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 09:27:34 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <38aa5b6a0911180727h733f3362g1f139a1d21306810@mail.gmail.com>

I've got the 1000HE and I love it, works great and does everything I need.
But my question is: when did Linux become better with drivers and video than
everything else?

So I've got an HP all in one printer I wanted to print and scan from, plug
it into windows: game over, go get the >100MB driver from HP that fills your
system up with CRAP and makes it unstable.  1000HE running Ubuntu NBR: I've
setup your printer sir and you are fully ready to print.  Same thing keeps
happening to me so now I always use it to connect/scan/print anytime I run
into a new printer.  Same thing with monitors/peripherals/etc...

Whats the deal?  I kind of miss the old linux of having to go find obscure
apt sources or downloading random source code to compile and hope it works.
Kept it real, you know?

--j

On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 1:59 AM, Mike Miller
<mbmiller+l at gmail.com<mbmiller%2Bl at gmail.com>
> wrote:

> I got that Asus EeePC 1005HA and installed Netbook Remix on it.  It would
> be easy to do it a second time, but if you have never done it, there are a
> few things to learn, so it took me awhile.
>
> Here are a couple of cool things about it:  It can read SD cards, so I
> pulled the card from my camera, popped it in there and I could instantly
> see my photos.  Couldn't have been easier.  The built-in camera worked
> instantly using a program called "Cheese".
>
> It has a VGA out, of course, so I hooked it up to my HDTV (1920x1080).
> Then I opened "Display" from the Systems menu and it was already
> configured just the way I'd want.  Brilliant.
>
> So I used sshfs to connect via WiFi to a machine in the home that has some
> DVD ISOs on it and I used VLC to play them onto the HDTV from the Asus
> netbook.  It worked and it looked amazingly good.  The audio was going
> into the stereo system and that also worked great.  One trick:  If you use
> VLC for video, you have to have only one monitor on.  If both are on, it
> shows only black.  So to play the DVD ISOs on the HDTV I had to turn off
> the laptop display.
>
> For some DVD ISOs the video would hang for a second every minute or so,
> but I don't thinkt that was really a problem with the Asus, though it
> might have been, I think it was the WiFi connection in the basement to the
> router upstairs that caused that.  More research is needed.
>
> I'm going to be hooking up a desktop machine DVD out to the HDMI in on the
> HDTV, so I won't be using the laptop much for DVDs in the house.
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 09:54:04 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 09:54:04 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:
>
>> I got that Asus EeePC 1005HA and installed Netbook Remix on it.
>
>
> Somehow, inexplicably, the charger stopped working.  There's a little 
> light on the box that won't go on.  I only have about 1.5 hours, 
> supposedly, of battery left until I can get a new charger.  Very 
> disappointing and annoying. I've never had a charger die on me, at least 
> not until it was maybe 8 years old and been through who-knows-what.


I was amazed that everyone seems to be having problems with this adapter 
(model no. EXA0901XH).  Check this out:

http://vip.asus.com/forum/view.aspx?board_id=20&model=Eee+PC+1005HA&id=20090805075651484&page=1&SLanguage=en-us
http://forum.eeeuser.com/viewtopic.php?pid=640515

One guy tried smacking his on a hard surface.  I bumped it against the 
side of a table-top, but not too hard.  Now it works.

The problem definitely was not the connection to the wire that plugs into 
the wall.  I tested that multiple times.

I don't like not knowing if my power adapter is going to work.  When I'm 
traveling, will it work, or will I be smashing it against things all the 
time?  Will I need to buy another one and bring two with me wherever I go 
because they are so unreliable?  It's not good!

Mike


From justin.kremer at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 10:23:42 2009
From: justin.kremer at gmail.com (Justin Kremer)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 10:23:42 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu> 
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>

-- On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't like not knowing if my power adapter is going to work. ?When I'm
> traveling, will it work, or will I be smashing it against things all the
> time? ?Will I need to buy another one and bring two with me wherever I go
> because they are so unreliable? ?It's not good!

One other thing you might consider is purchasing a universal power
adapter.  I've had very good luck with my iGo brand adapter, and they
have one specifically designed for netbooks, which has a tip for your
model, as well as a few others included.
The one that I have is also designed to take AC/DC input, so it works
from a wall outlet, car, or airplane.
I find it is handy to have an adapter that stays at your desk at home,
and another that travels with you anyway.
- Justin


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 11:02:42 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 11:02:42 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181059300.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Justin Kremer wrote:

> -- On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I don't like not knowing if my power adapter is going to work. ?When 
>> I'm traveling, will it work, or will I be smashing it against things 
>> all the time? ?Will I need to buy another one and bring two with me 
>> wherever I go because they are so unreliable? ?It's not good!
>
> One other thing you might consider is purchasing a universal power 
> adapter.  I've had very good luck with my iGo brand adapter, and they 
> have one specifically designed for netbooks, which has a tip for your 
> model, as well as a few others included. The one that I have is also 
> designed to take AC/DC input, so it works from a wall outlet, car, or 
> airplane. I find it is handy to have an adapter that stays at your desk 
> at home, and another that travels with you anyway. - Justin


I looked for an iGo replacement but the closest I got was one that said it 
worked for Asus EeePCs and had tips for all "excluding models: Eee PC 
1005HA...", but that's the one I have.

I was just reading more on Amazon.com about the adapter I have.  One guy 
bought his at Best Buy, returned it when it stopped working, then the next 
one failed too, and a third one.  What a huge hassle!

So far I have no complaint about the netbook though.  It's an amazing 
little thing and it has great battery life.

Mike

From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 12:22:16 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:22:16 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181059300.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181059300.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181220190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On another list we were discussing features like the ability to close the 
netbook and have it continue to run.  Someone found an interesting script 
and I commented on that:


On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Russell Horn wrote:

> Looks like this is scriptable to the extent that you can even turn off 
> the LCD but keep the machine running if you're playing music.
>
> http://forum.eeeuser.com/viewtopic.php?id=38393


Wow.  That is worth studying a bit.  There are lots of neat little tricks 
worked into that script.  I do a lot of scripting but I wouldn't have 
known how to detect all the different states of the machine (plugged in, 
etc.), so this part is awesome:

LID_STATE=`cat /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state | awk '{print $2 }'`
AC0_STATE=`cat /proc/acpi/ac_adapter/AC0/state | awk '{print $2 }'`
VGA_STATE=`xrandr --prop -display :0.0 | grep "VGA connected [0-9]" | wc -l`
LVDS_STATE=`xrandr --prop -display :0.0 | grep "LVDS connected [0-9]" | wc -l`

I guess the guy doesn't know that the backtick is being deprecated in 
sh/bash, so we are supposed to do it like this using "$()":

LID_STATE=$(cat /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state | awk '{print $2 }')

That dollar-sign trick is pretty great because it works with nesting while 
the backtick cannot.  His code is also an example of a bad use of "cat" 
because this works:

LID_STATE=$(awk '{print $2}' /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state)

So that's how I'll do it.  It looks like there is a world of interesting 
data in /proc/acpi


Different topic -- by the way, the other deprecation thing I have been 
trying to force myself to remember is to use "grep -E" instead of "egrep".

Mike


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 12:41:36 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:41:36 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181220190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181059300.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181220190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181227580.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

I think this helps a lot in understanding what the other script was up to:

http://wiki.eeeuser.com/close_lid_shutdown

But on my 9.10 netbook remix install, this very short script...

/etc/acpi/events/lidbtn

...calls this much longer one:

/etc/acpi/lid.sh

Apparently, "btn" is short for "button" and there are a lot of scripts 
that manage the responses to all of the buttons on the netbook.

Mike


On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Mike Miller wrote:

> On another list we were discussing features like the ability to close the 
> netbook and have it continue to run.  Someone found an interesting script and 
> I commented on that:
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Russell Horn wrote:
>
>> Looks like this is scriptable to the extent that you can even turn off the 
>> LCD but keep the machine running if you're playing music.
>> 
>> http://forum.eeeuser.com/viewtopic.php?id=38393
>
>
> Wow.  That is worth studying a bit.  There are lots of neat little tricks 
> worked into that script.  I do a lot of scripting but I wouldn't have known 
> how to detect all the different states of the machine (plugged in, etc.), so 
> this part is awesome:
>
> LID_STATE=`cat /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state | awk '{print $2 }'`
> AC0_STATE=`cat /proc/acpi/ac_adapter/AC0/state | awk '{print $2 }'`
> VGA_STATE=`xrandr --prop -display :0.0 | grep "VGA connected [0-9]" | wc -l`
> LVDS_STATE=`xrandr --prop -display :0.0 | grep "LVDS connected [0-9]" | wc 
> -l`
>
> I guess the guy doesn't know that the backtick is being deprecated in 
> sh/bash, so we are supposed to do it like this using "$()":
>
> LID_STATE=$(cat /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state | awk '{print $2 }')
>
> That dollar-sign trick is pretty great because it works with nesting while 
> the backtick cannot.  His code is also an example of a bad use of "cat" 
> because this works:
>
> LID_STATE=$(awk '{print $2}' /proc/acpi/button/lid/LID/state)
>
> So that's how I'll do it.  It looks like there is a world of interesting data 
> in /proc/acpi
>
>
> Different topic -- by the way, the other deprecation thing I have been trying 
> to force myself to remember is to use "grep -E" instead of "egrep".
>
> Mike
>

Please note that I am using a new email address.
My old email address @taxa.epi.umn.edu, will stop working
because that old computer is being retired.


From chrome at real-time.com  Wed Nov 18 12:42:21 2009
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 12:42:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC successes
In-Reply-To: <27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>;
	from justin.kremer@gmail.com on Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 10:23:42AM
	-0600
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20091118124221.C7612@real-time.com>

On 11/18 10:23 , Justin Kremer wrote:
> The one that I have is also designed to take AC/DC input, 

<humor>
<music="AC/DC-For Those About to Rock">
"For those about to hack...
we salute you!"
</music>
</humor>

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 17:45:08 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 17:45:08 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Asus EeePC netbook -- a server class machine?
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181227580.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180156310.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180843510.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911180953190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<27e6356a0911180823k2a23c6n635bad8a1d3b9843@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181059300.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181220190.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181227580.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911181740050.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

As a computer, my Asus 1005HA is a bit small in screen and keyboard, but I 
just found a neat way to work with it very easily:  I installed an ssh 
server.  I connected to it with "ssh -X" and did a few things that used X 
(emacs, viewing a photo with eog).  It was very responsive.  No trouble.

I recently tossed out an old Sun computer that was purchased about 12 
years ago for about $12,000.  I hear that everyone was drooling over that 
thing when it first came in (I inherited it in 2001).  Now it's about 
worthless.  It had 640 MB of RAM and dual 167 MHz processors.  My new 
netbook has 2000 MB of RAM and a single 1660 MHz processor, so it's 
definitely a server class machine!  ;-)

Mike


From stutterstutt at comcast.net  Wed Nov 18 23:16:07 2009
From: stutterstutt at comcast.net (Jeff Nelson)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:16:07 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] init level 3,
 only one tty running custom script = no login/shell 	access?
In-Reply-To: <65293fcc0911172229g3d865aa0j47321554cada6417@mail.gmail.com>
References: <65293fcc0911172229g3d865aa0j47321554cada6417@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4B04D497.9000603@comcast.net>

John Meier wrote:
> Is there a way for a evil doer to drop into a shell in the setup?  :)  
> Or a better way to limit access to the system other than the running of 
> the script?  From my tests any crtl-c or ctrl-d or any of the other 
> normal ways for interrupting  a script don't drop me into a shell.

Anything can be hacked if the user has physical access to the machine. 
Two easy examples:
1. Boot device order; adding a usb or cdrom boot device
2. Boot options, e.g., changing the boot line to boot into single-user mode.

If an entry in /etc/fstab can't be mounted, some systems present a shell 
prompt. Other systems ask for a root password then drop into a shell. 
Think about what would happen if a script (other than your own) 
encounters a failure.

-Jeff


From goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com  Wed Nov 18 23:31:07 2009
From: goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com (Brian Dolan-Goecke)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:07 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
	$119.00
Message-ID: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>

Not here to advertise for Menards, but I found this while looking at 
Black Friday add rumors,

Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook	$119.00
(got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)

And was wondering if anyone had heard of this ? ( My little big of 
googling didn't turn up much ? )

And I would have to guess it is running Linux of some sort ? For that 
price you can't even get a OEM copy of Windows of any kind !

Just wondering if someone knows soemthing or can turn up more info ?

THanks.

==>brian.


From tclug at freakzilla.com  Wed Nov 18 23:42:17 2009
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:42:17 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:

> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook	$119.00
> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)

Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely 
usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not understand 
the fascination of getting a computer that would've been underpowered 
three years ago...

-Yaron

--


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Wed Nov 18 23:50:01 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:50:01 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
	$119.00
In-Reply-To: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911182150n61fe59efl3a1275f348fc094f@mail.gmail.com>

Looks like it's the "E-Go", which sadly, runs Windows CE.

 - Tony Yarusso


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Thu Nov 19 01:28:05 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 2009 01:28:05 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Yaron wrote:

> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
>
>> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook	$119.00
>> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
>
> Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely 
> usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not 
> understand the fascination of getting a computer that would've been 
> underpowered three years ago...


Maybe it's about the price.

I am finding the Asus EeePC 1005HA with the 10.1" screen to be very easy 
to type on.  The keyboard is 92% of normal size, so it is not hard to get 
used to.  It runs GNU/Linux beautifully and does amazing things.  I'm very 
satisfied (except for that problem with the AC adapter).

I'm sure the 7" netbook is harder to get used to, but maybe it would make 
a great gift for, say, a 10-year-old kid who wants to learn about 
computers.

It is strange that I can find *nothing* about the Augen except on two web 
sites that sell it for $300 and list a few specs in a very informal kind 
of way.  Are we sure the 2 GB is RAM and not storage space?  I couldn't 
find a web site for the manufacturer.  Very odd.

Mike


From adam.morris at redstargaming.net  Thu Nov 19 08:16:13 2009
From: adam.morris at redstargaming.net (Adam Morris)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 2009 09:16:13 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi
	Netbook	$119.00
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>

I found a little more about the company.  Its located in Hollywood, FL,
and it looks like it only employs 4 people publically.

<http://www.corporationwiki.com/Florida/Hollywood/augen-electronics-corp-6210999.aspx>

The four also run another unheard of company "Amway Distributors Corp."
(not to be confused with the _real_ Amway Corp.)  Sounds kind of fishy
to me.

I did also find their website.

<http://www.augenus.com/>

When you go there, it redirects you to:

<http://k5b4b.dj67y.servertrust.com/default.asp?Redirected=Y>

Again, fishy if you ask me.

-Adam

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 01:28:05AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Yaron wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
> >
> >> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook	$119.00
> >> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
> >
> > Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely 
> > usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not 
> > understand the fascination of getting a computer that would've been 
> > underpowered three years ago...
> 
> 
> Maybe it's about the price.
> 
> I am finding the Asus EeePC 1005HA with the 10.1" screen to be very easy 
> to type on.  The keyboard is 92% of normal size, so it is not hard to get 
> used to.  It runs GNU/Linux beautifully and does amazing things.  I'm very 
> satisfied (except for that problem with the AC adapter).
> 
> I'm sure the 7" netbook is harder to get used to, but maybe it would make 
> a great gift for, say, a 10-year-old kid who wants to learn about 
> computers.
> 
> It is strange that I can find *nothing* about the Augen except on two web 
> sites that sell it for $300 and list a few specs in a very informal kind 
> of way.  Are we sure the 2 GB is RAM and not storage space?  I couldn't 
> find a web site for the manufacturer.  Very odd.
> 
> Mike
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From scott at dier.name  Thu Nov 19 08:27:03 2009
From: scott at dier.name (Scott Dier)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 2009 08:27:03 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
	$119.00
In-Reply-To: <20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain> 
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>
Message-ID: <51d20ae60911190627ibe24f98xcd60cc460909651f@mail.gmail.com>

My guess is they just import from some ODM, so i wouldn't discount
them completely because of this.  However, I'd hold off until one of
these gets hacked up enough to load Android on. :)

Thanks,

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 8:16 AM, Adam Morris
<adam.morris at redstargaming.net> wrote:
> I found a little more about the company. ?Its located in Hollywood, FL,
> and it looks like it only employs 4 people publically.
>
> <http://www.corporationwiki.com/Florida/Hollywood/augen-electronics-corp-6210999.aspx>
>
> The four also run another unheard of company "Amway Distributors Corp."
> (not to be confused with the _real_ Amway Corp.) ?Sounds kind of fishy
> to me.
>
> I did also find their website.
>
> <http://www.augenus.com/>
>
> When you go there, it redirects you to:
>
> <http://k5b4b.dj67y.servertrust.com/default.asp?Redirected=Y>
>
> Again, fishy if you ask me.
>
> -Adam
>
> On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 01:28:05AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
>> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Yaron wrote:
>>
>> > On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
>> >
>> >> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook ? ? ? $119.00
>> >> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
>> >
>> > Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely
>> > usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not
>> > understand the fascination of getting a computer that would've been
>> > underpowered three years ago...
>>
>>
>> Maybe it's about the price.
>>
>> I am finding the Asus EeePC 1005HA with the 10.1" screen to be very easy
>> to type on. ?The keyboard is 92% of normal size, so it is not hard to get
>> used to. ?It runs GNU/Linux beautifully and does amazing things. ?I'm very
>> satisfied (except for that problem with the AC adapter).
>>
>> I'm sure the 7" netbook is harder to get used to, but maybe it would make
>> a great gift for, say, a 10-year-old kid who wants to learn about
>> computers.
>>
>> It is strange that I can find *nothing* about the Augen except on two web
>> sites that sell it for $300 and list a few specs in a very informal kind
>> of way. ?Are we sure the 2 GB is RAM and not storage space? ?I couldn't
>> find a web site for the manufacturer. ?Very odd.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>



-- 
Scott Dier <scott at dier.name>


From mkebob1134 at netscape.net  Thu Nov 19 09:55:06 2009
From: mkebob1134 at netscape.net (Mr. B-o-B)
Date: Thu, 19 Nov 2009 09:55:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <4B056A5A.3070006@netscape.net>

Yaron wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
> 
>> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook  $119.00
>> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
> 
> Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely 
> usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not understand 
> the fascination of getting a computer that would've been underpowered 
> three years ago...
> 
> -Yaron

Thanks for that!  I have often wondered this myself.   Nice to know I'm 
not alone anymore....

Bob


-- 
We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
You have our gratitude.
Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.


From goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com  Fri Nov 20 13:25:40 2009
From: goeko at Goecke-Dolan.com (Brian Dolan-Goecke)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 13:25:40 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <51d20ae60911190627ibe24f98xcd60cc460909651f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>	<20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>
	<51d20ae60911190627ibe24f98xcd60cc460909651f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4B06ED34.9050805@Goecke-Dolan.com>

Looks like it may be the same one from this company,

http://delstar.net/multi-function-devices/ds700-netbook.html

Which is running windows CE, and the 2GB wasn't ram it was "disk space".

Still looks kind interesting, wonder how well it would run linux ? maybe 
it would be a good place for chrome... ?  or android ?

==>brian.

Scott Dier wrote:
> My guess is they just import from some ODM, so i wouldn't discount
> them completely because of this.  However, I'd hold off until one of
> these gets hacked up enough to load Android on. :)
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 8:16 AM, Adam Morris
> <adam.morris at redstargaming.net> wrote:
>> I found a little more about the company.  Its located in Hollywood, FL,
>> and it looks like it only employs 4 people publically.
>>
>> <http://www.corporationwiki.com/Florida/Hollywood/augen-electronics-corp-6210999.aspx>
>>
>> The four also run another unheard of company "Amway Distributors Corp."
>> (not to be confused with the _real_ Amway Corp.)  Sounds kind of fishy
>> to me.
>>
>> I did also find their website.
>>
>> <http://www.augenus.com/>
>>
>> When you go there, it redirects you to:
>>
>> <http://k5b4b.dj67y.servertrust.com/default.asp?Redirected=Y>
>>
>> Again, fishy if you ask me.
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 01:28:05AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
>>> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Yaron wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook       $119.00
>>>>> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
>>>> Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely
>>>> usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not
>>>> understand the fascination of getting a computer that would've been
>>>> underpowered three years ago...
>>>
>>> Maybe it's about the price.
>>>
>>> I am finding the Asus EeePC 1005HA with the 10.1" screen to be very easy
>>> to type on.  The keyboard is 92% of normal size, so it is not hard to get
>>> used to.  It runs GNU/Linux beautifully and does amazing things.  I'm very
>>> satisfied (except for that problem with the AC adapter).
>>>
>>> I'm sure the 7" netbook is harder to get used to, but maybe it would make
>>> a great gift for, say, a 10-year-old kid who wants to learn about
>>> computers.
>>>
>>> It is strange that I can find *nothing* about the Augen except on two web
>>> sites that sell it for $300 and list a few specs in a very informal kind
>>> of way.  Are we sure the 2 GB is RAM and not storage space?  I couldn't
>>> find a web site for the manufacturer.  Very odd.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>
> 
> 
> 



From ryan.coleman at cwis.biz  Fri Nov 20 13:32:39 2009
From: ryan.coleman at cwis.biz (Ryan Coleman)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 13:32:39 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <4B06ED34.9050805@Goecke-Dolan.com>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>	<20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>	<51d20ae60911190627ibe24f98xcd60cc460909651f@mail.gmail.com>
	<4B06ED34.9050805@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <4B06EED7.3020904@cwis.biz>

Except that niether 'droid nor Chrome will be available for download and 
install.

Definitely could run a stripped down version of a Linux derivative on 
2GB but I think that's easily a typo unless it's really NVRAM.

My two bits.
--
Ryan

Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
> Looks like it may be the same one from this company,
>
> http://delstar.net/multi-function-devices/ds700-netbook.html
>
> Which is running windows CE, and the 2GB wasn't ram it was "disk space".
>
> Still looks kind interesting, wonder how well it would run linux ? maybe 
> it would be a good place for chrome... ?  or android ?
>
> ==>brian.
>
> Scott Dier wrote:
>   
>> My guess is they just import from some ODM, so i wouldn't discount
>> them completely because of this.  However, I'd hold off until one of
>> these gets hacked up enough to load Android on. :)
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 8:16 AM, Adam Morris
>> <adam.morris at redstargaming.net> wrote:
>>     
>>> I found a little more about the company.  Its located in Hollywood, FL,
>>> and it looks like it only employs 4 people publically.
>>>
>>> <http://www.corporationwiki.com/Florida/Hollywood/augen-electronics-corp-6210999.aspx>
>>>
>>> The four also run another unheard of company "Amway Distributors Corp."
>>> (not to be confused with the _real_ Amway Corp.)  Sounds kind of fishy
>>> to me.
>>>
>>> I did also find their website.
>>>
>>> <http://www.augenus.com/>
>>>
>>> When you go there, it redirects you to:
>>>
>>> <http://k5b4b.dj67y.servertrust.com/default.asp?Redirected=Y>
>>>
>>> Again, fishy if you ask me.
>>>
>>> -Adam
>>>
>>> On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 01:28:05AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
>>>       
>>>> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Yaron wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         
>>>>> On Wed, 18 Nov 2009, Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>           
>>>>>> Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook       $119.00
>>>>>> (got this from http://www.fatwallet.com/black-friday/menards/)
>>>>>>             
>>>>> Looks like a tiny, underpowered, really crappy computer with a barely
>>>>> usable keybard at bet. Like every other netbook. I just do not
>>>>> understand the fascination of getting a computer that would've been
>>>>> underpowered three years ago...
>>>>>           
>>>> Maybe it's about the price.
>>>>
>>>> I am finding the Asus EeePC 1005HA with the 10.1" screen to be very easy
>>>> to type on.  The keyboard is 92% of normal size, so it is not hard to get
>>>> used to.  It runs GNU/Linux beautifully and does amazing things.  I'm very
>>>> satisfied (except for that problem with the AC adapter).
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure the 7" netbook is harder to get used to, but maybe it would make
>>>> a great gift for, say, a 10-year-old kid who wants to learn about
>>>> computers.
>>>>
>>>> It is strange that I can find *nothing* about the Augen except on two web
>>>> sites that sell it for $300 and list a few specs in a very informal kind
>>>> of way.  Are we sure the 2 GB is RAM and not storage space?  I couldn't
>>>> find a web site for the manufacturer.  Very odd.
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>>         
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>>>
>>>       
>>
>>     
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>   



From jwo at umn.edu  Fri Nov 20 14:52:44 2009
From: jwo at umn.edu (Jonathan Osborne)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:52:44 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Black Friday Augen 7" 533Mhz 2GB RAM WiFi Netbook
 $119.00
In-Reply-To: <4B06ED34.9050805@Goecke-Dolan.com>
References: <4B04D81B.7060205@Goecke-Dolan.com>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911182339440.16075@localhost.localdomain>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911190035450.17313@taxa.psych.umn.edu>	<20091119141612.GA8455@weegee.ath.cx>	<51d20ae60911190627ibe24f98xcd60cc460909651f@mail.gmail.com>
	<4B06ED34.9050805@Goecke-Dolan.com>
Message-ID: <4B07019C.1020107@umn.edu>

"Delstar" as in

del *.*

?

It's Friday, sorry, couldn't resist.


Jonathan Osborne


Brian Dolan-Goecke wrote on 11/20/2009 13.25
> Looks like it may be the same one from this company,
> 
> http://delstar.net/multi-function-devices/ds700-netbook.html
> 
> Which is running windows CE, and the 2GB wasn't ram it was "disk space".
> 
> Still looks kind interesting, wonder how well it would run linux ? maybe 
> it would be a good place for chrome... ?  or android ?


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Fri Nov 20 21:50:06 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2009 21:50:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] LDC, Week 4: What is Ubuntu Minnesota?
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911201950h76b187berd9da91277e3d5a83@mail.gmail.com>

One of the things that became apparent in our recent survey is that
there are a significant number of people who aren't really sure what
"Ubuntu Minnesota" or a "LoCo" actually are, so this week I will
attempt to clarify those points and a few others.  Since this also
involves our relationships with the greater Linux community locally,
I'm copying the Minnesota LUGs I'm aware of on this mailing as well.

First, what is Ubuntu Minnesota?
In short, it is the LoCo for the state of Minnesota, which leads to:

What the heck is a LoCo?
LoCo is short for Local Community, a geographically-based team of
Ubuntu users, developers, and enthusiasts for mutual support,
collaboration, socializing, and advocacy.  Worldwide these groups work
together for things like throwing events (whether they be social
meet-and-greets, installfests, bug jams, conferences, talks, or
whatever), working on localization of Ubuntu for their area (language
translation, theming, topical wallpaper, etc.), coordinating local
advocacy and awareness and providing a point of contact for new users
in the area looking for people who share their interest, providing
support when the purely online global channels aren't as effective,
and whatever other cool projects they come up with.

How is a LoCo different from a LUG?
First, I must stress that they are not mutually exclusive - it is
highly encouraged to be a member of both and for the two groups to
work together where appropriate.  That said, there are two main
differences.  First, an Ubuntu LoCo is focused on a particular Linux
distribution, Ubuntu, while a LUG is usually much broader in scope.
This means that our members can also act as "representatives" of sorts
for the distribution when working with a LUG - perhaps there's an
Ubuntu expert at the LUG meeting to help with support, or someone with
an understanding of the community who can help someone get involved.
We're not here to "convert" anyone whose already using Linux just
because they use a different distro, but we are here to answer
questions and help them try Ubuntu if they're interested, and in turn
the LUG can provide broader exposure to other things for our members,
etc.  Second, a LUG is normally organized on a city-wide basis, or
perhaps a metropolitan area, while LoCos are broader in geographical
scope.  In most of the world LoCos are organized at the national
level, while in the US they're on the state level.  While we of course
will be doing some things on smaller scales (in-person events for
instance), communication and collaboration happens all-together for
the state.  Thus one LoCo will find itself working with multiple LUGs
(I know of four, with varying activity levels).  Ideally, each LUG
would also be working with multiple things like a LoCo, for different
distributions, but I'm not yet aware of such a thing for other distros
within Minnesota - please let me know if you are.

What does it mean to be a "member" of Ubuntu Minnesota?
Essentially, just that you are a person who uses or is interested in
Ubuntu residing in (or near) Minnesota.  There is no formal
requirements or approval process (not to be confused with Ubuntu
"Membership", which is a recognition of contributions).  All that is
needed to be part of our team is to say you want to.  That said, in
order to do so effectively you will want to be "in the loop" with what
we're doing, and the two steps for that are to a) add yourself to the
Launchpad group, found at https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-minnesota
(remember to set your location so you can show up on the map and
assist local planning!), and subscribe to the mailing list (which is
where this is going - for LUG people, the info is at
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-us-mn).  From there,
just start participating in whatever way you find interesting!  I hope
in future e-mails to make more clear what channels and opportunities
are available for those who don't know, but if there's something
specific you want to know about, just ask!

Another thing to keep in mind is that everyone is an equal part of
this team.  My title is "Team Contact", and on Launchpad and such,
"administrator", but that is explicitly not "dictator" or anything
like that.  My role is to serve as a central contact point and to
provide direction and such for the team, but YOU are the team.  If you
think there should be a social event in Northfield, organize and
announce it!  If you want an installfest in Bemidji, make it happen!
If you want to distribute Ubuntu CDs at a local school, go ahead!  You
don't need to "ask permission" or anything to do something in this
team - the only rules are to abide by the Ubuntu Code of Conduct
(http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/), which basically means
things should be appropriate, legal, and respectful.  On the other
hand, by all means do communicate with others on the team about what
you want to do, get others involved in your project, and ask for
advice if you need it, etc.

Hopefully that answers a few questions about what this group is all
about, but I'm sure there are more, so bring 'em on!

 - Tony Yarusso


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 00:00:15 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 00:00:15 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] a really, really bad price
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911212357320.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

Just for fun...

These guys are selling an Asus EeePC battery for $390 before S/H (which 
adds about $10):

http://www.memory4less.com/m4l_itemdetail.asp?rid=fd_10&itemid=1444325172

But you can buy the entire netbook computer with the new battery for less 
than $360 with S/H included.  Maybe they haven't updated that web page for 
a few years!

Mike


From jherrick at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 15:53:35 2009
From: jherrick at gmail.com (Jim Herrick)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 16:53:35 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] a really, really bad price
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911212357320.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911212357320.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <4B09B2DF.5020708@gmail.com>

Without even looking it up, I can wholeheartedly recommend a website I 
know for upgrades like this (batteries, memory, power supplies and 
replacement drives).  The web site is:

   http://www.kahlon.com

No affiliation; just a very satisfied customer for several years and 
*many* devices.

Jim



On 11/22/2009 1:00 AM, Mike Miller wrote:
> Just for fun...
>
> These guys are selling an Asus EeePC battery for $390 before S/H (which
> adds about $10):
>
> http://www.memory4less.com/m4l_itemdetail.asp?rid=fd_10&itemid=1444325172
>
> But you can buy the entire netbook computer with the new battery for less
> than $360 with S/H included.  Maybe they haven't updated that web page for
> a few years!
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>    



From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 19:32:58 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 19:32:58 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] a really, really bad price
In-Reply-To: <4B09B2DF.5020708@gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911212357320.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<4B09B2DF.5020708@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911221932310.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sun, 22 Nov 2009, Jim Herrick wrote:

> Without even looking it up, I can wholeheartedly recommend a website I 
> know for upgrades like this (batteries, memory, power supplies and 
> replacement drives).  The web site is:
>
>   http://www.kahlon.com
>
> No affiliation; just a very satisfied customer for several years and 
> *many* devices.


Thanks for the tip, but it doesn't look like they have this battery.

Mike


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 21:59:06 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 21:59:06 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost power to 
my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X 
session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the password, a 
few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues 
iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to 
Alt-F1 console, I see this...

[drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* lockup
[drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* space 65520 wanted 65528

...but then I can login from console and do whatever I want.  What do you 
recommend?  I went to my home directory to look for new files and found 
the file below called .xsession-errors.  That might help so it is 
displayed below.

This guy has a similar situation to me (old dell, xubuntu 9.10) but he had 
an xorg.conf file and I don't have one:

http://ohioloco.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1311912

So I can't try his fix.

Mike


----begin ~/.xsession-errors on next line---------------
/etc/gdm/Xsession: Beginning session setup...
Setting IM through im-switch for locale=en_US.
Start IM through /etc/X11/xinit/xinput.d/all_ALL linked to /etc/X11/xinit/xinput.d/default.
/usr/bin/startxfce4: X server already running on display :0

** (gnome-screensaver:1486): WARNING **: Failed to get session presence proxy: Could not get owner of name 'org.gnome.SessionManager': no such name
xfdesktop[1508]: starting up
gnome-screensaver: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfce4-session: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfsettingsd: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfwm4: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
Thunar: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfce4-panel: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfce4-settings-helper: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.0.
xfce4-menu-plugin: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
xfce4-places-plugin: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.0.
The application 'xfdesktop' lost its connection to the display :0.0;
most likely the X server was shut down or you killed/destroyed
the application.


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Sun Nov 22 22:18:33 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kris Browne)
Date: Sun, 22 Nov 2009 22:18:33 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <0421FDB0-9D88-418C-BF10-896A9AAEBDAA@gmail.com>

What kind of video card and which drivers for it?

I'm wondering if the driver permissions got hosed.

Sent from my iPod
Kris

On Nov 22, 2009, at 21:59, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost  
> power to
> my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X
> session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the  
> password, a
> few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues
> iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to
> Alt-F1 console, I see this...
>
> [drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* lockup
> [drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* space 65520 wanted 65528
>
> ...but then I can login from console and do whatever I want.  What  
> do you
> recommend?  I went to my home directory to look for new files and  
> found
> the file below called .xsession-errors.  That might help so it is
> displayed below.
>
> This guy has a similar situation to me (old dell, xubuntu 9.10) but  
> he had
> an xorg.conf file and I don't have one:
>
> http://ohioloco.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1311912
>
> So I can't try his fix.
>
> Mike
>
>
> ----begin ~/.xsession-errors on next line---------------
> /etc/gdm/Xsession: Beginning session setup...
> Setting IM through im-switch for locale=en_US.
> Start IM through /etc/X11/xinit/xinput.d/all_ALL linked to /etc/X11/ 
> xinit/xinput.d/default.
> /usr/bin/startxfce4: X server already running on display :0
>
> ** (gnome-screensaver:1486): WARNING **: Failed to get session  
> presence proxy: Could not get owner of name  
> 'org.gnome.SessionManager': no such name
> xfdesktop[1508]: starting up
> gnome-screensaver: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on  
> X server :0.0.
> xfce4-session: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X  
> server :0.0.
> xfsettingsd: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X  
> server :0.0.
> xfwm4: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.0.
> Thunar: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server : 
> 0.0.
> xfce4-panel: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X  
> server :0.0.
> xfce4-settings-helper: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily  
> unavailable) on X server :0.0.
> xfce4-menu-plugin: Fatal IO error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on  
> X server :0.0.
> xfce4-places-plugin: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily  
> unavailable) on X server :0.0.
> The application 'xfdesktop' lost its connection to the display :0.0;
> most likely the X server was shut down or you killed/destroyed
> the application.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From chrome at real-time.com  Mon Nov 23 08:04:59 2009
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 08:04:59 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>;
	from mbmiller+l@gmail.com on Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 09:59:06PM -0600
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091123080459.C4473@real-time.com>

On 11/22 09:59 , Mike Miller wrote:
> I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost power to 
> my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X 
> session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the password, a 
> few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues 
> iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to 
> Alt-F1 console, I see this...

This is why I hate GDM/KDM/XDM and other graphical login mechanisms, but I'm a
greybeard curmudgeon... ;)

Check your /etc/hosts file; one of the problems I had with GDM was that if
it couldn't resolve the local machine's name, it would keep dying and being restarted.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 09:02:08 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:02:08 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <20091123080459.C4473@real-time.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091123080459.C4473@real-time.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230900460.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Mon, 23 Nov 2009, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:

> On 11/22 09:59 , Mike Miller wrote:
>
>> I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost power 
>> to my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X 
>> session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the password, a 
>> few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues 
>> iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to 
>> Alt-F1 console, I see this...
>
> This is why I hate GDM/KDM/XDM and other graphical login mechanisms, but 
> I'm a greybeard curmudgeon... ;)
>
> Check your /etc/hosts file; one of the problems I had with GDM was that 
> if it couldn't resolve the local machine's name, it would keep dying and 
> being restarted.


It seems to be getting the name because it shows it on the login screen.

Mike


From chrome at real-time.com  Mon Nov 23 09:06:20 2009
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:06:20 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230900460.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>;
	from mbmiller+l@gmail.com on Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 09:02:08AM -0600
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091123080459.C4473@real-time.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230900460.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091123090620.D4473@real-time.com>

On 11/23 09:02 , Mike Miller wrote:
> It seems to be getting the name because it shows it on the login screen.

It needs to resolve the name to an IP address. Therein is the sticking
point. 

Perhaps this has been cured in the years since I was bitten by it; so
someone correct me if I'm wrong now.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 09:05:19 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:05:19 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <0421FDB0-9D88-418C-BF10-896A9AAEBDAA@gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<0421FDB0-9D88-418C-BF10-896A9AAEBDAA@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230902150.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sun, 22 Nov 2009, Kris Browne wrote:

> What kind of video card and which drivers for it?
>
> I'm wondering if the driver permissions got hosed.


I'm not sure of how to answer those questions.  Is there a command I can 
type to get that info?

Mike


From nesius at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 09:41:33 2009
From: nesius at gmail.com (Robert Nesius)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:41:33 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <cac10ddc0911230741l9228679gd8ff8bc5474662a6@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:59 PM, Mike Miller
<mbmiller+l at gmail.com<mbmiller%2Bl at gmail.com>
> wrote:

> I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost power to
> my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X
> session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the password, a
> few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues
> iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to
> Alt-F1 console, I see this...
>
>
I did some google searching and ran across this thread....

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5841400&postcount=6

It struck me there were some similarities here that might apply... or
perhaps not.  Worth a shot...

I've run out of time so I can't chase this any further - good luck!

-Rob
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 23 10:03:31 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 10:03:31 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <cac10ddc0911230741l9228679gd8ff8bc5474662a6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<cac10ddc0911230741l9228679gd8ff8bc5474662a6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230958330.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Mon, 23 Nov 2009, Robert Nesius wrote:

> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:59 PM, Mike Miller
> <mbmiller+l at gmail.com<mbmiller%2Bl at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>> I'm hoping someone here has run into a similar problem.  I lost power to
>> my computer and when I restarted it I couldn't get back into the X
>> session.  I'm running Xubuntu 9.10.  Basically, I enter the password, a
>> few things happen and it asks for the password again.  This continues
>> iteratively until I'm too angry and tired to continue.  When I go to
>> Alt-F1 console, I see this...
>>
>>
> I did some google searching and ran across this thread....
>
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5841400&postcount=6
>
> It struck me there were some similarities here that might apply... or
> perhaps not.  Worth a shot...
>
> I've run out of time so I can't chase this any further - good luck!


Well, that was close enough!  Good tip, but not quite the right answer. 
After seeing your message I remembered that I had run into this kind of 
thing before and the key has to do with some ~/.g* files.  This fixed it:

rm -rf ~/.gconfd

The only thing in that folder is a text file called "saved_state". 
Apparently that was messing me up, probably because gdm thought it was 
already running.

The ~/.profile file is for bash, so I'm not sure how that would solve my 
problems with gdm, unless there was something seriously wrong with it, and 
in my case it was fine.

Mike


From florin at iucha.net  Mon Nov 23 10:32:58 2009
From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha)
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 10:32:58 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] X now failing, was working
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230902150.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911222158100.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<0421FDB0-9D88-418C-BF10-896A9AAEBDAA@gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911230902150.28665@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091123163258.GT13264@iris.iucha.org>

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 09:05:19AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
> On Sun, 22 Nov 2009, Kris Browne wrote:
> 
> > What kind of video card and which drivers for it?
> >
> > I'm wondering if the driver permissions got hosed.
> 
> 
> I'm not sure of how to answer those questions.  Is there a command I can 
> type to get that info?

Log in on the console (Ctrl-Alt-F2) as root and then check the
/var/log/Xorg.0.log.

florin

-- 
Bruce Schneier expects the Spanish Inquisition.
      http://geekz.co.uk/schneierfacts/fact/163
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From thoth.serath at gmail.com  Tue Nov 24 21:58:53 2009
From: thoth.serath at gmail.com (Chris G.)
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:58:53 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] memory chips
Message-ID: <7c055dc50911241958o24b49257v66a84aa048694237@mail.gmail.com>

i am looking for 2 pci 100 memory chips for a friends computer.  i may have
the pci part messed up.  it is for a hp pavillion 7845.  she has 2 128's  in
there now  i was hoping for 2 256's.  i have a bunch of ram  just not what
she needs.
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From pjcrump at bitstream.net  Wed Nov 25 10:32:02 2009
From: pjcrump at bitstream.net (PJ Crump)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:32:02 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
Message-ID: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>

I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through 
options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an 
suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone, 
PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.


From tclug at freakzilla.com  Wed Nov 25 10:40:45 2009
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:40:45 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144@localhost.localdomain>


On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, PJ Crump wrote:

> Any one have an suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have 
> looked at HDClone, PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.


Well the super-simple way is dd. But that only really works on very 
similar sized drives. I copy drives like that all the time.


-Yaron

--


From blawrence at qwest.net  Wed Nov 25 10:49:48 2009
From: blawrence at qwest.net (Brian Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:49:48 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <69B21B6CC1B142629C283E631583E6F9@dcm.int>

I use G4L and G4U to clone Linux server drives but I prefer G4L because of
the driver support.

http://freshmeat.net/projects/g4l/

-----Original Message-----
From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
[mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of PJ Crump
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 10:32 AM
To: TCLUG List
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning

I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list





From aristophrenic at warpmail.net  Wed Nov 25 11:04:54 2009
From: aristophrenic at warpmail.net (Isaac Atilano)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:04:54 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <1259168594.6838.1347026819@webmail.messagingengine.com>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net><alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144@localhost.localdomain>
	<1259168594.6838.1347026819@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <1259168694.7066.1347029463@webmail.messagingengine.com>

On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:40 -0600, "Yaron" <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, PJ Crump wrote:
> > Any one have an suggestions for open source Cloning tools?

> Well the super-simple way is dd. But that only really works on very 
> similar sized drives. I copy drives like that all the time.

Using standard Unix utilities:

dd works great for backing up on the device level.
This means that if you back up a 2Gb partition using the device file,
e.g. /dev/sdb3, then the restore will write back a 2Gb partition image
to the location you specify, so most likely you'll be writing back to
the device file of a new partition.
This also works at the disk level, so you can back up the entire disk
with all partitions by referencing the device file, e.g. /dev/sdb.

For backing up at the file system level, you can still use dd but it
makes more sense to use a utility that reads the file system such as
tar. This allows you to limit your backup to specific files and
directories.



From mkebob1134 at netscape.net  Wed Nov 25 11:07:28 2009
From: mkebob1134 at netscape.net (Mr. B-o-B)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:07:28 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <4B0D6450.7000203@netscape.net>

PJ Crump wrote:
> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through 
> options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an 
> suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone, 
> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

I like clonezilla.

http://www.clonezilla.org

I use the hell out of it @ work, and only have nice things to say about 
it.  There are some good how-to's on using this as well.

Check it out.

Good Luck!

Bob

-- 
We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
You have our gratitude.
Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.


From smcgrath23 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 25 11:06:55 2009
From: smcgrath23 at gmail.com (Steve McGrath)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:06:55 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <b84c57930911250906o24aa9tecbfc296a453c755@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:32 AM, PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net> wrote:

> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>

I haven't personally used it, but I hear good things about Clonezilla. I
believe it supports resizing partitions to clone to a larger drive if
needed.

-- 
Steve McGrath <smcgrath23 at gmail.com
If it ain't broke, you're not using a new enough version
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From adam.morris at redstargaming.net  Wed Nov 25 11:27:25 2009
From: adam.morris at redstargaming.net (Adam Morris)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:27:25 -0500
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D6450.7000203@netscape.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net> <4B0D6450.7000203@netscape.net>
Message-ID: <20091125172725.GA20969@weegee.ath.cx>

+1 for Clonezilla, -1 for HDClone.

HDClone tends to modify your partition data.  I have no idea why, but
its flipping a coin as to whether or not your partition will be intact
after the clone, unless the drives are identical make and model as far
as I can tell.

Clonezilla is just great.  I have no complaints, the best part is that
its free.

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:07:28AM -0600, Mr. B-o-B wrote:
> PJ Crump wrote:
> > I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through 
> > options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an 
> > suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone, 
> > PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> 
> I like clonezilla.
> 
> http://www.clonezilla.org
> 
> I use the hell out of it @ work, and only have nice things to say about 
> it.  There are some good how-to's on using this as well.
> 
> Check it out.
> 
> Good Luck!
> 
> Bob
> 
> -- 
> We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
> We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
> You have our gratitude.
> Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From troythetechguy at gmail.com  Wed Nov 25 11:49:47 2009
From: troythetechguy at gmail.com (Troy)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:49:47 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <34de7f3d0911250949l250938tcac611d7b83c470d@mail.gmail.com>

I use clonezilla for both personal and business, and it works great!

Troy

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:32 AM, PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net> wrote:

> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
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From rbrown at rawmindz.com  Wed Nov 25 11:23:09 2009
From: rbrown at rawmindz.com (Robert Brown)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:23:09 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <b84c57930911250906o24aa9tecbfc296a453c755@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
	<b84c57930911250906o24aa9tecbfc296a453c755@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <916e208f0911250923i218fca83sf93d5e500de7249b@mail.gmail.com>

Anyone have any experience with FOG?  I'm curious what people think
about this project.

http://www.fogproject.org/

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Steve McGrath <smcgrath23 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:32 AM, PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net> wrote:
>>
>> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
>> options to clone the current drive to a new one.. ?Any one have an
>> suggestions for open source Cloning tools? ?I have looked at HDClone,
>> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
>> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> I haven't personally used it, but I hear good things about Clonezilla. I
> believe it supports resizing partitions to clone to a larger drive if
> needed.
>
> --
> Steve McGrath <smcgrath23 at gmail.com
> If it ain't broke, you're not using a new enough version
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>


From ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 25 12:37:45 2009
From: ronsmailbox5 at gmail.com (r j)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:37:45 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] Clone Wars
Message-ID: <25f02f40911251037ie802937tfb7e3a2348b41484@mail.gmail.com>

You can clone one partition at a time or the whole disc with dd also you
will need to put grub on your cloned disc. The best open source tool is the
command line. and command dd is the way to go. here is the ubuntu way.

We?ll be using the terminal (*Applications-> Accessories-> Terminal*) and
the dd command to do this. You?ll also need to have your second disk up and
running when we get going. You can either have it installed and mounted
internally or use an external disk enclosure and USB or Firewire. (Note:
Doing this via USB 1 will be excruciatingly slow!)

You?ll also want to either be cloning your hard drive to one of the exact
same size, or if you have a larger disk, make a partition of the same size
on it and clone to that. Then, use an Ubuntu liveCD to change the partition
size (*System-> Administration-> Partition Editor*). Lastly, you?ll need a
LiveCD <http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu>.


On to the good stuff. Got both disks plugged in? Good! Now you?ll need to
figure out which disk you are copying from and which disk you are copying
too. In your terminal, type:

df -h

Look first for the partition that?s mounted at root, or ?/?. Here?s what my
root partition looks like.

Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on

/dev/sda1 71G 46G 22G 68% /

If you?re using a SATA drive it will appear like that. IDE should be
/dev/hda1. See that slash below the Mounted on? That?s the root drive.

Now you?ve got to locate the drive you?re copying too. The same *df
-h*command will do the trick. Look for another disk mounted on
* /dev/*****. If you?re not sure what you?re looking for, first run the df
-h command without your second disk mounted. Then plug the 2nd disk in (be
sure to shut down if you?re doing this inside your machine and not via USB
or FireWire) and run the *df -h* command again. The newest partition that
appears is what you?re looking for!

So if your current root partition is* /dev/sda1* and the partition you?re
going to copy to is */dev/sdb1 *(a USB mounted drive) here?s the command
you?ll need to type in your terminal:

sudo dd if=/dev/sda1 of=/dev/sdb1

Replace with the correct paths for your drives if they differ. It?s going to
take a while, so grab a book or start up a movie. Maybe go to bed.

Once it?s complete, you?ve got yourself a brand new copy of your current
Ubuntu install. You?re not quite done yet though. Now you?ve got to install
Grub on your new disk so you can boot from it. Make sure your new disk is
attached to your machine and your old disk is unplugged and boot into the
Ubuntu LiveCD.

Once your machine boots up, open up a terminal session and type:

sudo grub

Grub will launch and give you the *grub>* prompt. Here, type:

find /boot/grub/stage1

You should see something come back that looks like *hd(0,0)*. Jot that down,
you?ll need it in a second.

Now, still in the *grub>* prompt, type:

root hd(0,0)

You?ll put in whatever result you go above - it may be different than *
hd(0,0)*.

Once that completes, type:

setup (hd0)

Even if you got a result that differs from* hd(0,0) *above.

Type:

quit

And you?re out of grub. Restart your machine, removing the LiveCD and you
should be up and running on your new hard drive. You may also encounter a
problem on your first boot where the system will try to scan your hard drive
for bad sectors. If that fails, you?ll find yourself in a root terminal
session. Just type:

fsck

Let the disk check finish and you should be good to go !


On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 12:00 PM, <tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org> wrote:

> Send tclug-list mailing list submissions to
>        tclug-list at mn-linux.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>        http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>        tclug-list-request at mn-linux.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>        tclug-list-owner at mn-linux.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of tclug-list digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. memory chips (Chris G.)
>   2. HD Cloning (PJ Crump)
>   3. Re: HD Cloning (Yaron)
>   4. Re: HD Cloning (Brian Lawrence)
>   5. Re: HD Cloning (Isaac Atilano)
>   6. Re: HD Cloning (Mr. B-o-B)
>   7. Re: HD Cloning (Steve McGrath)
>   8. Re: HD Cloning (Adam Morris)
>   9. Re: HD Cloning (Troy)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:58:53 -0600
> From: "Chris G." <thoth.serath at gmail.com>
> Subject: [tclug-list] memory chips
> To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Message-ID:
>        <7c055dc50911241958o24b49257v66a84aa048694237 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> i am looking for 2 pci 100 memory chips for a friends computer.  i may have
> the pci part messed up.  it is for a hp pavillion 7845.  she has 2 128's
>  in
> there now  i was hoping for 2 256's.  i have a bunch of ram  just not what
> she needs.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20091124/26c3b4ad/attachment.html
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:32:02 -0600
> From: PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net>
> Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: TCLUG List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <4B0D5C02.7020402 at bitstream.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:40:45 -0600 (CST)
> From: Yaron <tclug at freakzilla.com>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: TCLUG <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID:
>        <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144 at localhost.localdomain>
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
>
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, PJ Crump wrote:
>
> > Any one have an suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have
> > looked at HDClone, PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>
>
> Well the super-simple way is dd. But that only really works on very
> similar sized drives. I copy drives like that all the time.
>
>
> -Yaron
>
> --
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:49:48 -0600
> From: "Brian Lawrence" <blawrence at qwest.net>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: <pjcrump at bitstream.net>,    "'TCLUG List'" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <69B21B6CC1B142629C283E631583E6F9 at dcm.int>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> I use G4L and G4U to clone Linux server drives but I prefer G4L because of
> the driver support.
>
> http://freshmeat.net/projects/g4l/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org
> [mailto:tclug-list-bounces at mn-linux.org] On Behalf Of PJ Crump
> Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 10:32 AM
> To: TCLUG List
> Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
>
> I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:04:54 -0600
> From: "Isaac Atilano" <aristophrenic at warpmail.net>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: "Yaron" <tclug at freakzilla.com>, "TCLUG" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <1259168694.7066.1347029463 at webmail.messagingengine.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:40 -0600, "Yaron" <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 25 Nov 2009, PJ Crump wrote:
> > > Any one have an suggestions for open source Cloning tools?
>
> > Well the super-simple way is dd. But that only really works on very
> > similar sized drives. I copy drives like that all the time.
>
> Using standard Unix utilities:
>
> dd works great for backing up on the device level.
> This means that if you back up a 2Gb partition using the device file,
> e.g. /dev/sdb3, then the restore will write back a 2Gb partition image
> to the location you specify, so most likely you'll be writing back to
> the device file of a new partition.
> This also works at the disk level, so you can back up the entire disk
> with all partitions by referencing the device file, e.g. /dev/sdb.
>
> For backing up at the file system level, you can still use dd but it
> makes more sense to use a utility that reads the file system such as
> tar. This allows you to limit your backup to specific files and
> directories.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:07:28 -0600
> From: "Mr. B-o-B" <mkebob1134 at netscape.net>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: pjcrump at bitstream.net
> Cc: TCLUG List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <4B0D6450.7000203 at netscape.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> PJ Crump wrote:
> > I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> > options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> > suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> > PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> I like clonezilla.
>
> http://www.clonezilla.org
>
> I use the hell out of it @ work, and only have nice things to say about
> it.  There are some good how-to's on using this as well.
>
> Check it out.
>
> Good Luck!
>
> Bob
>
> --
> We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
> We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
> You have our gratitude.
> Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:06:55 -0600
> From: Steve McGrath <smcgrath23 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: TCLUG List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID: <b84c57930911250906o24aa9tecbfc296a453c755 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:32 AM, PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> > I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> > options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> > suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> > PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
>
> I haven't personally used it, but I hear good things about Clonezilla. I
> believe it supports resizing partitions to clone to a larger drive if
> needed.
>
> --
> Steve McGrath <smcgrath23 at gmail.com
> If it ain't broke, you're not using a new enough version
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20091125/fea64ed3/attachment-0001.htm
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:27:25 -0500
> From: Adam Morris <adam.morris at redstargaming.net>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> Message-ID: <20091125172725.GA20969 at weegee.ath.cx>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> +1 for Clonezilla, -1 for HDClone.
>
> HDClone tends to modify your partition data.  I have no idea why, but
> its flipping a coin as to whether or not your partition will be intact
> after the clone, unless the drives are identical make and model as far
> as I can tell.
>
> Clonezilla is just great.  I have no complaints, the best part is that
> its free.
>
> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:07:28AM -0600, Mr. B-o-B wrote:
> > PJ Crump wrote:
> > > I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> > > options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> > > suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> > > PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
> > I like clonezilla.
> >
> > http://www.clonezilla.org
> >
> > I use the hell out of it @ work, and only have nice things to say about
> > it.  There are some good how-to's on using this as well.
> >
> > Check it out.
> >
> > Good Luck!
> >
> > Bob
> >
> > --
> > We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
> > We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
> > You have our gratitude.
> > Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:49:47 -0600
> From: Troy <troythetechguy at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
> To: pjcrump at bitstream.net
> Cc: TCLUG List <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
> Message-ID:
>        <34de7f3d0911250949l250938tcac611d7b83c470d at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I use clonezilla for both personal and business, and it works great!
>
> Troy
>
> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 10:32 AM, PJ Crump <pjcrump at bitstream.net> wrote:
>
> > I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through
> > options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an
> > suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone,
> > PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
> >
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
> tclug-list at mn-linux.org
> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list
>
> End of tclug-list Digest, Vol 59, Issue 28
> ******************************************
>



-- 
You do not know the power of the dark side
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From chrome at real-time.com  Wed Nov 25 12:46:21 2009
From: chrome at real-time.com (Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:46:21 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <1259168694.7066.1347029463@webmail.messagingengine.com>;
	from aristophrenic@warpmail.net on Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at
	11:04:54AM -0600
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net><alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144@localhost.localdomain>
	<1259168594.6838.1347026819@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<1259168694.7066.1347029463@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <20091125124620.C27162@real-time.com>

dd will work; you can use netcat to send the traffic across the wire if the
drives are not in the same machine.

With many Linux filesystems, there is a mechanism for resizing the
filesystem. So if you put a 2GB partition image on a 10GB partition; it's a
trivial matter to expand it to use the full 10GB.

-- 
Carl Soderstrom
Systems Administrator
Real-Time Enterprises
www.real-time.com


From tonyyarusso at gmail.com  Wed Nov 25 13:59:06 2009
From: tonyyarusso at gmail.com (Tony Yarusso)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:59:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <20091125124620.C27162@real-time.com>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144@localhost.localdomain>
	<1259168594.6838.1347026819@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<1259168694.7066.1347029463@webmail.messagingengine.com>
	<20091125124620.C27162@real-time.com>
Message-ID: <254fef0f0911251159m7f94674dr8dc9ddfc45ab5f94@mail.gmail.com>

I also have been very pleased with CloneZilla, although it's really
more intended for mass / repeated deployments, so sounds like overkill
for your current task.

My recommendation for this time would be just to use partimage
directly.  Clonezilla actually uses partimage "under the hood", along
with its various other tasks, so you get the same benefits of usual
usage types of both, just simplified.

Now if you ever find yourself trying to image a room of 40 identical
computers or whatever, then Clonzilla is the ticket, hands-down.

 - Tony Yarusso


From auditodd at comcast.net  Wed Nov 25 17:13:26 2009
From: auditodd at comcast.net (auditodd at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 23:13:26 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>
Message-ID: <1233854884.6534341259190806648.JavaMail.root@sz0147a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I have been using Self-Image off of an Ultimate Boot CD.
For both Windows and Linux partitions.

Hasn't failed me yet.

----------
Todd Young

----- Original Message -----
From: "PJ Crump" <pjcrump at bitstream.net>
To: "TCLUG List" <tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 10:32:02 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning

I have a laptop (Ubuntu/Win) dual boot and I have been wading through 
options to clone the current drive to a new one..  Any one have an 
suggestions for open source Cloning tools?  I have looked at HDClone, 
PartImage, g4u but cant come to a decision.

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


From mkebob1134 at netscape.net  Wed Nov 25 17:12:38 2009
From: mkebob1134 at netscape.net (Mr. B-o-B)
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2009 17:12:38 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] HD Cloning
In-Reply-To: <254fef0f0911251159m7f94674dr8dc9ddfc45ab5f94@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4B0D5C02.7020402@bitstream.net>	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911251038490.23144@localhost.localdomain>	<1259168594.6838.1347026819@webmail.messagingengine.com>	<1259168694.7066.1347029463@webmail.messagingengine.com>	<20091125124620.C27162@real-time.com>
	<254fef0f0911251159m7f94674dr8dc9ddfc45ab5f94@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4B0DB9E6.2070902@netscape.net>

Tony Yarusso wrote:
> I also have been very pleased with CloneZilla, although it's really
> more intended for mass / repeated deployments, so sounds like overkill
> for your current task.
> 
> My recommendation for this time would be just to use partimage
> directly.  Clonezilla actually uses partimage "under the hood", along
> with its various other tasks, so you get the same benefits of usual
> usage types of both, just simplified.
> 
> Now if you ever find yourself trying to image a room of 40 identical
> computers or whatever, then Clonzilla is the ticket, hands-down.
> 
>  - Tony Yarusso
> 

I disagree with this.  Grab the clonezilla live cd, and your done.  Easy.

True, it can be setup to do mass rollouts, but at the same time it's 
just a few settings and your off to the races for a one drive situation.

Why settle for just the engine, when you can get the whole car?

Bob

-- 
We are building a fighting force of extraordinary magnitude.
We forge our tradition in the spirit of our ancestors.
You have our gratitude.
Those who oppose us will be sent to Detroit.


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sat Nov 28 20:26:55 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 20:26:55 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and xorg.conf and
	Nvidia
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

I'm using Ubuntu 9.10 on AMD64 with Nvidia driver and GeForce 7600 card.

I was using two 1680x1050 monitors, but I dropped the first one and 
replaced it with a DVI-to-HDMI cable to my 1920x1080 HDTV.  I'm having a 
problem configuring this properly.  I want two separate X screens.  I can 
only get it to work with both at 1680x1050.  In fact, if I change the HDTV 
setting to be 1920x1080, it reverts to 1680x1050.  If I disable the second 
monitor and use only the HDTV and tell it to use 1920x1080, if I get it to 
do that (or get both X/Nvidia and the HDTV to say that's what they are 
doing), a lot of the desktop is off the edges of the screen and not 
visible.

There is something called Xinerama.  If I enable Xinerama, nothing works 
(I think I was getting no X) and it tells me that RANDR is not available.

I would greatly appreciate any tips you can share.  Thanks.

Mike


From kris.browne at gmail.com  Sat Nov 28 20:57:06 2009
From: kris.browne at gmail.com (Kristopher Browne)
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 20:57:06 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and xorg.conf a
 nd Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <4b11e2de.100bca0a.2517.1449@mx.google.com>

I'm not sure the name of the setting elsewhere, but when I was running a Mac Mini to my tv there was an option called "Overscan" which fit the description of your symptoms.. If it was on, the edges of the desktop were beyond the bounds of the screen.


Kris Browne
kris dot browne at gmail dot com

-- Sent from my Palm Pr?
Mike Miller wrote:

I'm using Ubuntu 9.10 on AMD64 with Nvidia driver and GeForce 7600 card.



I was using two 1680x1050 monitors, but I dropped the first one and 

replaced it with a DVI-to-HDMI cable to my 1920x1080 HDTV.  I'm having a 

problem configuring this properly.  I want two separate X screens.  I can 

only get it to work with both at 1680x1050.  In fact, if I change the HDTV 

setting to be 1920x1080, it reverts to 1680x1050.  If I disable the second 

monitor and use only the HDTV and tell it to use 1920x1080, if I get it to 

do that (or get both X/Nvidia and the HDTV to say that's what they are 

doing), a lot of the desktop is off the edges of the screen and not 

visible.



There is something called Xinerama.  If I enable Xinerama, nothing works 

(I think I was getting no X) and it tells me that RANDR is not available.



I would greatly appreciate any tips you can share.  Thanks.



Mike



_______________________________________________

TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota

tclug-list at mn-linux.org

http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list


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From florin at iucha.net  Sat Nov 28 21:01:34 2009
From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha)
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 21:01:34 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and
	xorg.conf	and Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>

On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 08:26:55PM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
> I'm using Ubuntu 9.10 on AMD64 with Nvidia driver and GeForce 7600 card.

Are you using the free driver or the binary nvidia driver?

> I was using two 1680x1050 monitors, but I dropped the first one and 
> replaced it with a DVI-to-HDMI cable to my 1920x1080 HDTV.  I'm having a 
> problem configuring this properly.  I want two separate X screens.  I can 
> only get it to work with both at 1680x1050.  In fact, if I change the HDTV 
> setting to be 1920x1080, it reverts to 1680x1050.  If I disable the second 
> monitor and use only the HDTV and tell it to use 1920x1080, if I get it to 
> do that (or get both X/Nvidia and the HDTV to say that's what they are 
> doing), a lot of the desktop is off the edges of the screen and not 
> visible.

Is this with the nvidia control panel utilities, or with Ubuntu/X.org
ones?

> There is something called Xinerama.  If I enable Xinerama, nothing works 
> (I think I was getting no X) and it tells me that RANDR is not available.

Xinerama is obsolete, RANDR is the new way forward, but I'm not sure
if nvidia proprietary driver supports it.

Cheers,
florin

-- 
Bruce Schneier expects the Spanish Inquisition.
      http://geekz.co.uk/schneierfacts/fact/163
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From tclug at freakzilla.com  Sat Nov 28 23:52:30 2009
From: tclug at freakzilla.com (Yaron)
Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 23:52:30 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and xorg.conf
 and Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282351380.9815@localhost.localdomain>

On Sat, 28 Nov 2009, Florin Iucha wrote:

> Xinerama is obsolete, RANDR is the new way forward, but I'm not sure
> if nvidia proprietary driver supports it.

It is? either way, nVidia's proprietary driver does NOT support RANDR with 
multiple monitors.


-Yaron

--


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 29 01:17:38 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2009 01:17:38 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and xorg.conf a
 nd Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <4b11e2de.100bca0a.2517.1449@mx.google.com>
References: <4b11e2de.100bca0a.2517.1449@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911290101070.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sat, 28 Nov 2009, Kristopher Browne wrote:

> I'm not sure the name of the setting elsewhere, but when I was running a 
> Mac Mini to my tv there was an option called "Overscan" which fit the 
> description of your symptoms.. If it was on, the edges of the desktop 
> were beyond the bounds of the screen.

Wow -- you totally nailed it.  I had no idea, but apparently this 
"overscan" thing is a perennial annoyance when using HDTVs with computers. 
For my TV, overscan was "on" by default.  I had to set the video out on 
the computer to 1920x1080 and then (only then and not before) go to the 
"advanced video" settings on the TV and set overscan to "off."  It looks 
like I'll only have to do that one time.

Now when I use 1920x1080 it all fits on the HDTV screen and it looks just 
right -- I have achieved the coveted "1:1 pixel mapping."  The only 
problem is that if I restart the computer it comes up with 1680x1050 for 
that monitor every time.  It's as if the /etc/X11/xorg.conf isn't enough 
to convince it to change to 1920x1080.  One of my current guesses is that 
the TV is, for some reason, reporting itself as 1680x1050, maybe because 
it was in that mode earlier.  I don't know.  Another good possibility is 
that the configuration is stored in places other than /etc/X11/xorg.conf 
-- is it?  This is a relatively small problem because I leave the computer 
on most of the time.

In case others have similar problems - My TV is one of the 42" Insignia 
sets from Best Buy and I found this page to be pretty helpful:

http://community.insigniaproducts.com/insignia/board/message?board.id=discussions-televisions-en&message.id=132

Mike


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Sun Nov 29 01:28:39 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2009 01:28:39 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and xorg.conf
 and Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911290122550.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Sat, 28 Nov 2009, Florin Iucha wrote:

> On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 08:26:55PM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
>
>> I'm using Ubuntu 9.10 on AMD64 with Nvidia driver and GeForce 7600 
>> card.
>
> Are you using the free driver or the binary nvidia driver?

When I tried to do something with "Display" in Ubuntu's system panel, it 
told me that it was unable to make changes and I should try the 
proprietary controls.  So I looked on the same list of apps and found the 
Nvidia panel.


>> I was using two 1680x1050 monitors, but I dropped the first one and 
>> replaced it with a DVI-to-HDMI cable to my 1920x1080 HDTV.  I'm having 
>> a problem configuring this properly.  I want two separate X screens. 
>> I can only get it to work with both at 1680x1050.  In fact, if I change 
>> the HDTV setting to be 1920x1080, it reverts to 1680x1050.  If I 
>> disable the second monitor and use only the HDTV and tell it to use 
>> 1920x1080, if I get it to do that (or get both X/Nvidia and the HDTV to 
>> say that's what they are doing), a lot of the desktop is off the edges 
>> of the screen and not visible.
>
> Is this with the nvidia control panel utilities, or with Ubuntu/X.org 
> ones?

Nvidia.  What I've been doing is telling Nvidia to write to xorg.conf, 
then I restart and see how it looks.  This has almost worked!


>> There is something called Xinerama.  If I enable Xinerama, nothing 
>> works (I think I was getting no X) and it tells me that RANDR is not 
>> available.
>
> Xinerama is obsolete, RANDR is the new way forward, but I'm not sure if 
> nvidia proprietary driver supports it.

Well, do I need to be using Nvidia's proprietary driver?  I'd rather use 
all free software, definitely, but I'll do what I have to do to make the 
hardware work.  If I can use RANDR with a different driver, I guess that's 
what I'd prefer to do.

Mike


From florin at iucha.net  Sun Nov 29 10:06:59 2009
From: florin at iucha.net (Florin Iucha)
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2009 10:06:59 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with DVI to HDMI 1920x1080 and
	xorg.conf	and Nvidia
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911290122550.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911282026210.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<20091129030134.GC13264@iris.iucha.org>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911290122550.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <20091129160659.GD13264@iris.iucha.org>

On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 01:28:39AM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
>>> There is something called Xinerama.  If I enable Xinerama, nothing works 
>>> (I think I was getting no X) and it tells me that RANDR is not available.
>>
>> Xinerama is obsolete, RANDR is the new way forward, but I'm not sure if 
>> nvidia proprietary driver supports it.
>
> Well, do I need to be using Nvidia's proprietary driver?  I'd rather use 
> all free software, definitely, but I'll do what I have to do to make the 
> hardware work.  If I can use RANDR with a different driver, I guess that's 
> what I'd prefer to do.

The 'nouveau' driver is slowly getting there, but it's still half a
year away or so.

Cheers,
florin

-- 
Bruce Schneier expects the Spanish Inquisition.
      http://geekz.co.uk/schneierfacts/fact/163
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From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 01:09:50 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 01:09:50 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

I upgraded from Ubuntu 9.04 to 9.10 on my office desktop machine.  I 
started it in the office and continued remotely from home via ssh with X 
port forwarding and such (e.g., x0vnc4server).  In the end, it reboots one 
last time, so I don't think the way I completed the upgrade is relevant.

After it finished upgrading and rebooting, I used ssh to start Xvnc with 
icewm then I connected via vnc and started using it.

When I went to my office earlier today, the Gnome login screen had only 
the machine name in a rectangle in the middle and no login prompt.  I 
tried a few different keystrokes to make something happen, but nothing 
happened.  It seemed to be frozen.  I tried ctrl-alt-F1 and that let me 
log in to a console -- I can look at processes and such but how can I log 
into Gnome?  I know I can reboot but I prefer not to kill the working VNC 
session.  I don't know that rebooting will work, though.

I have to say that I also had some weirdness on a second machine where I 
upgraded to 9.10.  After reboot it used to know my username and it would 
prompt with it, but now lists "other..." several times instead of 
remembering me.  It seems that I have to choose the last "other..." for it 
to let me log in.  When I lock the screen it comes back with a big, bold 
"%R" in the top center of the box, which means what?  There seems to be 
something wrong there.

These might not be big problems but I'm not sure yet.  Otherwise Ubuntu 
has been going great for me.  The other day I had to reboot for the first 
time in 6 months (since the last upgrade), but it turned out that the 
problem was with Windows inside of VirtualBox taking my system down!  I 
should have known better than to keep any Windows around.

Mike


From brian at ropers-huilman.net  Mon Nov 30 07:37:46 2009
From: brian at ropers-huilman.net (Brian D. Ropers-Huilman)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 07:37:46 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>

Mike, go to one of the TTYs (CTRL-ALT-F6), login, and try restarting the GDM:

sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop

then

sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start

Then switch back to the GUI console (CTRL-ALT-F7) and see if the GDM
will accept an ID after restarting. It might automatically take you to
the GDM after it restarts, I can't remember.

-- 
Brian D. Ropers-Huilman
612.234.7778
Sent from Lancaster, Wisconsin, United States


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 10:01:50 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 10:01:50 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009, Brian D. Ropers-Huilman wrote:

> Mike, go to one of the TTYs (CTRL-ALT-F6), login, and try restarting the GDM:
>
> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
>
> then
>
> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start
>
> Then switch back to the GUI console (CTRL-ALT-F7) and see if the GDM 
> will accept an ID after restarting. It might automatically take you to 
> the GDM after it restarts, I can't remember.


Thanks for trying, but that did not go well!  There definitely is 
something quite abnormal here, so your idea might usually work, but not 
this time.  Stopping gdm went OK, but when I entered the start command, 
the screen went black, and that was it -- I could find no way to get 
anything back.  The machine was still on but I couldn't ping it or connect 
in any way.  The ctrl-alt-F? combinations did nothing.  It was totally 
unresponsive, so I rebooted it.  One funny thing was that the black screen 
did not mean that there was no video -- the monitor never went into 
power-saving mode.

Rebooting did not solve my problem.  When Gnome comes up to the login 
screen there is something very pathological going on.  The login box in 
the middle of the screen is flashing on and off very rapidly (3-4 times 
per second).  It always shows the name of the computer and and about once 
per second it flashes "unable to authenticate user" at the bottom of the 
box.  I tried hitting ctrl-c and a couple of other things, but it did 
nothing.  I can return to ctrl-alt-F7 and enter commands there.  I also 
can start vnc and I'm using that now from my netbook, but I don't know how 
to make the vnc client work on the desktop when Gnome is down.

At least now I don't have to worry about losing any work so I'll just 
reboot repeatedly, changing various things, and I'll see what happens. 
Any suggestions?

Mike


From jus at krytosvirus.com  Mon Nov 30 10:18:24 2009
From: jus at krytosvirus.com (jus at krytosvirus.com)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 16:18:24 +0000
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu><f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com><alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <1995546114-1259597965-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1522171320-@bda594.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Reinstall gdm?
I'm not a big gnome person as I typically have used kde mostly in the past though the gnome desktop has come a long way in recent years but then so has kde

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 10:01:50 
To: Brian D. Ropers-Huilman<brian at ropers-huilman.net>
Cc: TCLUG List<tclug-list at mn-linux.org>
Subject: Re: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009, Brian D. Ropers-Huilman wrote:

> Mike, go to one of the TTYs (CTRL-ALT-F6), login, and try restarting the GDM:
>
> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
>
> then
>
> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start
>
> Then switch back to the GUI console (CTRL-ALT-F7) and see if the GDM 
> will accept an ID after restarting. It might automatically take you to 
> the GDM after it restarts, I can't remember.


Thanks for trying, but that did not go well!  There definitely is 
something quite abnormal here, so your idea might usually work, but not 
this time.  Stopping gdm went OK, but when I entered the start command, 
the screen went black, and that was it -- I could find no way to get 
anything back.  The machine was still on but I couldn't ping it or connect 
in any way.  The ctrl-alt-F? combinations did nothing.  It was totally 
unresponsive, so I rebooted it.  One funny thing was that the black screen 
did not mean that there was no video -- the monitor never went into 
power-saving mode.

Rebooting did not solve my problem.  When Gnome comes up to the login 
screen there is something very pathological going on.  The login box in 
the middle of the screen is flashing on and off very rapidly (3-4 times 
per second).  It always shows the name of the computer and and about once 
per second it flashes "unable to authenticate user" at the bottom of the 
box.  I tried hitting ctrl-c and a couple of other things, but it did 
nothing.  I can return to ctrl-alt-F7 and enter commands there.  I also 
can start vnc and I'm using that now from my netbook, but I don't know how 
to make the vnc client work on the desktop when Gnome is down.

At least now I don't have to worry about losing any work so I'll just 
reboot repeatedly, changing various things, and I'll see what happens. 
Any suggestions?

Mike

_______________________________________________
TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota
tclug-list at mn-linux.org
http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list

From brian at ropers-huilman.net  Mon Nov 30 10:46:59 2009
From: brian at ropers-huilman.net (Brian D. Ropers-Huilman)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 10:46:59 -0600
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <f0e11c480911300846s94ae94dmde8bddb4829e5025@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:01, Mike Miller <mbmiller+l at gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks for trying, but that did not go well! ?There definitely is something
> quite abnormal here, so your idea might usually work, but not this time.
> ?Stopping gdm went OK, but when I entered the start command, the screen went
> black, and that was it -- I could find no way to get anything back. 8<
>
> Rebooting did not solve my problem. ?When Gnome comes up to the login screen
> there is something very pathological going on. ?The login box in the middle
> of the screen is flashing on and off very rapidly (3-4 times per second). 8<
>
> At least now I don't have to worry about losing any work so I'll just reboot
> repeatedly, changing various things, and I'll see what happens. Any
> suggestions?

This sounds like an X driver issue. Reboot the machine in "recovery
mode" and then, as root:

# dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg

You might also want to make sure you're system is fully up-to-date
before doing this. I haven't seen any major updates come out in the
past couple of days, but you might have a new X driver or something.

-- 
Brian D. Ropers-Huilman
612.234.7778


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 11:55:03 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 11:55:03 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <f0e11c480911300846s94ae94dmde8bddb4829e5025@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300846s94ae94dmde8bddb4829e5025@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911301150490.22583@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009, Brian D. Ropers-Huilman wrote:

> This sounds like an X driver issue. Reboot the machine in "recovery 
> mode" and then, as root:
>
> # dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg

That ran very quickly and had no discernible effect on the system.


> You might also want to make sure you're system is fully up-to-date 
> before doing this. I haven't seen any major updates come out in the past 
> couple of days, but you might have a new X driver or something.

Before running the command above, I ran the update-manager and there was a 
gdm update.  I was sure that would help but it had no discernible effect.

If I could just get the vncviewer working on the machine, that would be 
good enough for now.  I'm stuck using the netbook even while sitting in 
front of the computer I'm connecting to.  Kinda crazy.

Thanks for the attempts, Brian.  I can't be the only one having this 
problem, so there ought to be something on the web.  I'll try to do some 
more searching.

Mike


From mbmiller+l at gmail.com  Mon Nov 30 21:52:38 2009
From: mbmiller+l at gmail.com (Mike Miller)
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2009 21:52:38 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [tclug-list] problem with Ubuntu/Gnome login screen
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911301150490.22583@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
References: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300109170.21037@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300537l6fe5352ch34baabd8e88d3039@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911300946550.28619@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
	<f0e11c480911300846s94ae94dmde8bddb4829e5025@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.00.0911301150490.22583@taxa.psych.umn.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0911302133510.8917@taxa.psych.umn.edu>

After about 10 hours of working on this and basically getting nowhere, I'm 
prepared to take more radical steps.  I still can't get to Gnome desktop, 
but I don't need to use it.  In fact, I usually do not use it.  I usually 
use icewm in vnc.

What I need is a way to get to my VNC session on the local machine without 
running gdm.  Is that hard to do?

By the way, I find that these log files...

/var/log/gdm/:0-greeter.log

...grow at a rate of about 100 MB every hour or so when I'm trying to get 
gdm working.  Almost all of the output consists of repetitions of sections 
that look like this but with the process number increasing:

** (process:1888): DEBUG: Greeter session pid=1888 display=:0.0 xauthority=/var/run/gdm/auth-for-gdm-VjBW5d/database
gdm[1893]: ******************* START **********************************
gdm[1893]: [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled]
[snip]
gdm[1893]: No symbol table info available.
gdm[1893]: A debugging session is active.
gdm[1893]:
gdm[1893]:      Inferior 1 [process 1888] will be detached.
gdm[1893]:
gdm[1893]: Quit anyway? (y or n) [answered Y; input not from terminal]

Where "[snip]" represents about 132 lines of information - I didn't want 
to clutter the list, but I'm happy to share it.  The log file contains 
many lines that have been chopped off on the right side, for example, 
sometimes instead of "Quit anyway?" it says "t anyway?"

Apparently it is trying many times to run the greeter (several times per 
second, I'd say) and it is failing.

Mike