My remark was not directed at you, Robert. Just continuing on the end of the thread. On Sunday, February 10, 2013, Robert Nesius wrote: > > > > On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 12:41 AM, Erik Mitchell <erik.mitchell at gmail.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'erik.mitchell at gmail.com');> > > wrote: > >> In my career, I've had the good fortune of working with people from >> all over the world. India, China, Romania, Hungary, Ukraine, Canada, >> Latvia, Jamaica, as well as other countries I'm sure I'm forgetting. I >> consider my life richer for the friends I've made, and I've always >> felt bad when my friends have to deal with extra hassles to deal with >> immigration issues, just so they can live and work where they'd like >> to on this planet. I've felt ashamed when I see fellow Americans treat >> them badly, just because they were born elsewhere on the planet. >> >> I hope in my lifetime I'll have the chance to travel to other >> countries to live and work, and I hope to find people who are >> welcoming, rather than the type of people to bitch and moan about >> their lot in life, like I'm seeing on this thread. I think it's >> bigoted and pathetic, and I'm glad I don't work with you. >> >> That is all. >> >> -Erik >> > > How nice of you to make assumptions and pronouncements about what a bad > person I seem to be. If your comments aren't directed at me despite > responding to my post, my apologies. But with that said... > > I too have worked with people all over the world. I used to manage a > service across 50+ sites world-wide and worked with people on every > continent except Antartica. Without fail the people I worked with were > good people, and I enjoyed all of my interactions with them. My comments > were not intended to be mass indictments. However, that said, cheap > over-seas talent is not a magic bullet for lowering costs. I've met > multiple managers who've tried to move software development activities > overseas, and they could not attain high quality results until they > relocated people over there to supervise and manage and once they did that > the value proposition evaporated. However, cheap labor in manufacturing > sectors has in fact yielded some big returns, as evidenced by trying to buy > something Made in the USA in Walmart. > > However, that same quality risk exists for manufacturing processes > overseas. The company I work with now uses heavy-lifting devices to lift > heavy pre-cast concrete panels. We had one fail, which dropped a 20-ton > panel onto a crane (destroyed the crane, but the operator escaped > unscathed). When we tested the lifting devices we discovered a non-trivial > percentage of them were failing. When we engaged the supplier and asked > why, we learned he'd stopped sourcing his steel from American mills and was > bringing in steel from China that was certified by the supplier to be of > the same quality (but clearly wasn't). > > Switching back to labor as a resource though, before condemning anyone > with protectionist tendencies as bigoted and pathetic, I would suggest you > try to find a job with your technical skills in Canada, Australia, and most > European countries. What you'll find is that the governments of those > countries protect their labor markets, and the companies supposedly > burdened by the higher labor costs are still very successful. > > Regardless, this is an issue of public policy, not bigotry. > > Kind regards. > > -Rob > > > >> >> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 12:30 AM, Robert Nesius <nesius at gmail.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'nesius at gmail.com');>> >> wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 1:36 PM, Andrew Dahl <droidjd at gmail.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'droidjd at gmail.com');>> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Interesting note regarding companies hiring overseas. My >> brother-in-law's >> >> employer has started to shift from hiring people in India to hiring >> people >> >> here, citing the ROI as the reason. >> > >> > >> > A lot of companies have found the increased overhead/supervision to make >> > sure the low-rent overseas talent produces offsets the savings by going >> > overseas. >> > >> > -Rob >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', >> 'tclug-list at mn-linux.org');> >> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Erik K. Mitchell >> erik.mitchell at gmail.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', >> 'erik.mitchell at gmail.com');> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list at mn-linux.org <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', >> 'tclug-list at mn-linux.org');> >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > > -- Erik K. Mitchell erik.mitchell at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20130210/6faaf955/attachment.html>