I'll continue to disagree. If someone wants to learn how to administer a unix system well, the best thing to do is to remove all the user-space cruft and let them learn how to administer a bare bones system from the ground up. I use Mint -- so I'm not against user friendliness. But anyone who wants to learn how to do this stuff well really should stay away from the distros aimed at users and focus on the one's aimed at sys-admins. And doing it in a VM at first is a very good idea if one doesn't have a junk computer laying around to play with. Basically it's equivilant of saying "hey, you want to learn how to fix your own car, then buy an old car that is entirely user-serviceable and fix it." Sure it's a lot of work, but when you finish, you will know how every piece fits together and that knowledge is transferable to the more user-friendly distros. On Fri, Feb 21, 2014 at 9:12 PM, <tclug at freakzilla.com> wrote: > Sorry, no. That's like me saying "I'm a new driver maybe I should try > driving stick" and you suggesting I build an F-18 from scratch and then > drop off a cliff with it. > > I've been using Linux since before there were distributions, and there's a > reason I use Ubuntu. I can get it to do what I want WITHOUT wanting to > shoot myself. > > I've always thought Arch was interesting, and a bit ago decided to give it > a try. So I set up a VM, pointed it at the Arch installaiton medium and > watched it not even be able to get past it's own setup. > > You can be an extremely skilled Linux user (and UNIX admin) without ever > touching anything like Arch. It helps to know how to build your own stuff, > of course, and knowing the internals, but, again, that's like asking a > mechanic to manufacture parts themselves. > > > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2014, David Wagle wrote: > > Alternately, if you want to put in the work to not be a noob any longer, >> you >> could take the plunge into an Arch distribution. It's actually not as hard >> as it might seem at first, and you will be guaranteed to end up with the >> most efficient system you can build on that box :) >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2014 at 9:01 PM, David Wagle <david.wagle at gmail.com> >> wrote: >> The issue with performance in Ubuntu is almost entirely due to >> the window manager and has really nothing to do with the other >> software versions. You can keep the core "ubuntu" elements the >> same and upgrade the rest of the software quite easily. >> Alternately, you can try something more lightweight -- Mint 16 with >> Xfce is basically Ubunutu with a a lightweight desktop. That's what I >> run on my daughter's very ancient Macbook and it's actually quite >> zippy >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2014 at 8:46 PM, paul g <pj.world at hotmail.com> wrote: >> You know I dabbled a bit with OpenSUSE. I just don't have >> the experience with windows managers. I even set-up a >> sli-taz machine. I really need nothing off the computer >> but I like the fact that the 10.04 is so well documented , >> yes I know it's old I guess it gives me a noober a sense >> of comfort somehow that I do just not get with the latest >> releases. The 'dd' command works fine for me. I even >> recently learned that in order to install Debian Wheezy >> 7.0 or whatnot I needed to partition the thumb drive for >> MS-Dos 16 not Fat32 to copy the image. Any reccomendations >> for a noob like me as far as a newer operating system on >> my laptop would be wonderful. Thank you for your time I >> wish I knew more. >> >> Thank You. >> >> > Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 20:38:26 -0600 >> > From: tclug at freakzilla.com >> > To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org >> > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Will Firefox 20.0 become >> obselete for basic use? >> > >> > I don't know that they'd remove a printer driver... >> > >> > I've been using Ubuntu for many years, but I've never >> used Gnome, Unity or >> > KDE (I use Window Maker, as I have since 1996!). I'm >> lead to believe you >> > can get the "Classic" Gnome on the newer Ubuntus. It was >> announced very >> > recently that they're turning back from that stupid >> integrated menubar >> > thing, too. >> > >> > If you have the resources to make a bit-by-bit copy of >> your harddrive, you >> > can always try upgrading and then downgrade back if you >> don't like it. I'd >> > say try a live install on a USB thumbdrive, but that >> will for SURE be >> > slow. >> > >> > On Fri, 21 Feb 2014, paul g wrote: >> > >> > > Yes, and thank you for asking. I am running this older >> version of Ubuntu on >> > > a Centrino Duo Laptop. I guess because I was so >> unimpressed with the 12.04 >> > > performance on my old p4 tower. Also I have an older >> Lexmark x5070 printer >> > > that has a driver for the 10.04 Ubuntu. I don't like >> Gnome 3 maybe i'm just >> > > slow and I am not really used to KDE. Any suggestions >> would be wonderful. >> > > >> > > Thank You. >> > > >> > > > Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 20:24:28 -0600 >> > > > From: tclug at freakzilla.com >> > > > To: tclug-list at mn-linux.org >> > > > Subject: Re: [tclug-list] Will Firefox 20.0 become >> obselete for basic use? >> > > > >> > > > Might be some small things that won't work, but in >> general you should be >> > > > fine. >> > > > >> > > > Of course, as time goes on, those small things will >> get bigger and bigger. >> > > > Still, basic HTML with basic javascript should be >> fine for a long time. It >> > > > all depends on what kind of content you want. >> > > > >> > > > May I ask why you're running such an old version of >> Ubuntu? >> > > > >> > > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2014, paul g wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > For a basic home/office computer user running an >> older FireFox version >> > > say >> > > > > '20.0' under Ubuntu 10.04 etc '2.6.-- kernel' will >> new web pages and >> > > webpage >> > > > > design soon require the need for a later version >> of FireFox or Opera to >> > > > > 'surf' the web? Just a curious question I am a >> noob. >> > > > > >> > > > > Thank You. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> > > > tclug-list at mn-linux.org >> > > > >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> > tclug-list at mn-linux.org >> > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >> tclug-list at mn-linux.org >> http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list >> >> >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > TCLUG Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota > tclug-list at mn-linux.org > http://mailman.mn-linux.org/mailman/listinfo/tclug-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://mailman.mn-linux.org/pipermail/tclug-list/attachments/20140222/0845f60c/attachment.html>